Please allow me to flog this equine beast for a moment...
IF being born again depends upon Romans 10:9.10... then have you REALLY believed (action?), made, accepted Jesus as Lord in your life IF YOUR LIFE IS STILL (in reality) RULED BY THE 'LUST OF THE FLESH'???
Just wondering...
...and afterwards, what if you change your mind and hit the delete button??
From the heart, I don't know if he was a heartbreakingly flawed Billy Graham or a twisted, evil P.T. Barnum.
Yeah.. the sad thing, is how someone can so blatantly violate basic principles and deceny in life, and actually get people to debate how far over the line person went, in christian terms.. for decades.
I think evil is, evil does.
at fifty years old.. I wouldn't even dream of drugging or taking advantage of anybody.
Caldwell wrote that little play about one of these hucksters in the depression days.. he is so descriptive, it has to be based on a true story or two..
the economy isn't SO bad right now.. now they don't travel around, they start a little home church, then some kind of outreach complex.. and people have enough money and resources to come to THEM. Not the other way around..
I think if the economy really sours, we'll see the hucksters roaming the land for sustenance, like in the days of Judges, once again..
Yeah.. the sad thing, is how someone can so blatantly violate basic principles and deceny in life, and actually get people to debate how far over the line person went, in christian terms.. for decades.
I think evil is, evil does.
at fifty years old.. I wouldn't even dream of drugging or taking advantage of anybody.
Caldwell wrote that little play about one of these hucksters in the depression days.. he is so descriptive, it has to be based on a true story or two..
the economy isn't SO bad right now.. now they don't travel around, they start a little home church, then some kind of outreach complex..
Yeah......on NBC's Dateline last night, they detailed this Dallas woman's life and her dark side.
Long story short......husband went missing, later found dead in OKC, detectives couldn't pin the murder on her, she gets insurance money, remarries, divorces the guy, more money...moves and stays on the prowl to find rich men in California, buys another home.....keeps staying one step ahead of justice
At age 62, she starts up a scam as a Christian woman waiting to go on a mission trip, has plenty of pictures of African kids, gives detailed examples of "healings and miracles", moves in with an older lady, redirects her SS checks to her own account, and is siphoning off her other accounts, etc. etc.
Those in her local church in North Carolina were totally fooled.
Yeah.. I was just thinking. I'm not laying blame to the leader of that church, primarily because I'm not acquainted with the whole story. But what is the real purpose of a pastor? At least a REAL one?
For one, I'd expect him to watch my back.. not give in to every religious scam this side of the Mississippi.. off chasing prophecies, other kinds of nonsense.
The problem is, most tend to leave that up to someone else. The reason people love inspecting the "fruit" in someone else's life is because it keeps the focus off of them having to inspect the fruit in their own - otherwise somebody would take a club to them. I prefer to club my own wolves, thank you.
In the context of our conversation, Hamm and I were posting on the Dateline scenario....where the Dallas woman had a dark side and kept moving from place to place. Years later, she moved into a North Carolina community and was siphoning off finances from a little old lady and others in the church.
Hamm commented on the pastor's duties; his purpose to protect the flock.
The following is the context:
Yeah.. I was just thinking. I'm not laying blame to the leader of that church, primarily because I'm not acquainted with the whole story. But what is the real purpose of a pastor? At least a REAL one?
For one, I'd expect him to watch my back.. not give in to every religious scam this side of the Mississippi.. off chasing prophecies, other kinds of nonsense.
Somebody has to figuratively club the wolves.
After a couple of sarcastic remarks, you state......."I prefer to club my own wolves, thank you."
Context, wth......these church people in North Carolina might NEED a pastor (a shepherd) who helps them and protects the the people. Obviously, you o' wise one....don't.
<_<
PS ......just another arrogant answer by mr. pfal enthusiast.
Can't even read it IN THE CONTEXT......yeah, you learned alot in pfal.
Ok, I confess to being not in flow with the current wave this thread is taking, but I've been thinking about the topic because others have sparked my fading memory of events long passed. So here goes, and please pardon me for my total left turn....
But now I see, early on in this thread mentioned something about Geer being in the running for the top spot in TWI during Advanced Class '79. Without spending alot of time explaining alot about myself and the how and why of how I ended up backstage at that event, which probably is a total sidetrack involving way too much about ME, hear are my musings.....mostly about Geer.
I don't remember Geer being present at all backstage. But that could be my faulty memory. He and his wife didn't graduate from the corps til later that same summer. As Skyrider, I think mentioned, he (Geer) and his wife were all about sucking up (pardon my french, it's the best way I know how to put it) to VP. But they were in-rez corps up until July 1979.
In March of 1980, during my first year in-rez in the way corps, (just a few months after Adv. Class '79) VP was not happy about the way things were getting done, or not getting done, in Gunnison. So he sent Geer to Gunnison to straighten things out. It was a test of sorts. VP wanted to see if Geer could "handle" the Way Corps and the work involved in getting the place ready to be inhabited by in-rez corps, as well as, believers who wanted to visit. (Remember here VP's "vision" for the place.) VP figured the in-rez Corps would be the slave labor to keep the place going. That was part of his plan. (I heard this from someone who was in the know, I didn't make it uo. I know it's hearsay, Lord forgive me.)
Anyway, to make a long story short, Geer somehow managed to pass the test. Then he got promoted to being bus driver extraordinaire and most favored sidekick of VP. Yet, VP STILL chose craighead to replace him.
Other "top leaders" of the era, felt threatened by Geer. He seemed to have an "in" with VP, that others who had been around for ages didn't have. My own personal opinion is that Geer used his closeness with VP, to full advantage. He wasn't in a top position as far as leadership, making decisions, having to work with people went, but he had VP's ear. Geer had no "research or teaching" skills whatsoever, that were publicly evident. (VP was always impressed by those who could "work the word," and had academic credentials.) Somehow Geer snaked his way into becoming VP's companion in crime, and confidant. And when VP wanted someone who he felt could "get the job done, and whom he could trust implicitely, he called on Geer. Hence, Geer's assignment to Gartmore. I'm sure VP thought that he was someone who "shared the vision."
Ok, my brain hurts. Can anybody else fill in some dots here?
Yeah well, sisex, I wish I'd kept a better way corps diary than I did. Shame on me for not being the best corpsbot I could. Then I woulda written all this stuff down better. :B)
I didn't mean to infer that Chris Geer was backstage at Adv class '79, just that he was in the running for "top positon" status, what I was meaning was more that he was in the group of men vying for the job, tht they all were very competetive about it. The person I heard it from was backstage at that event, and remarked how competitive it really was. Of course not being in contention myself, I was oblivious to the rivalry that apparently existed, and pretty amazed that it boiled down to a competition, pretty carnal.
Tonto, I seem to recall that Robert Duv*l took the foundational class back in the day, maybe that's where he got his inspiration to write the screenplay for "The Apostle" and to star in the role. I wouldn't be suprised.
(2) Victor Paul Wierwille was in fellowship with God for more than a passing moment.
(one wouldn't know it by some posters' opinions but he did manage to do some good works too, over the years.)
1) I don't know that I can agree with "then salvation would be of works"... because (using that logic) you'd be "working" to confess and believe...
2) I don't know that you can honestly say that either, you can say that you believe that, but then I'd tell you that there's just as much a chance that my thoughts on that are just as valid (yes, I'm "some posters")
Danny, I hear ya brother. I was on staff the year the 7th were on their interim year. I don't remember CG being there. But then again, it was the year of t"Uncle Harry's" death, the faith seminar in Gunnison, as well as some kind of class? the Advanced class maybe? in Bristol. And the first year of "International Summer School." Lotza stuff happened, and he coulda been there? but I don't remember him. If he was there, he didn't hang out with us non-important persons. And I worked back room at the BRC among other things. He wasn't there.
The 3rd corps were "back in-rez." I babysat alot.
Yeah, I know about Chuck and his married girlfriend. I worked with her. Oi vey. I guess I should add, I kept a jounal. Some dates and stuff I am absolutely positive of. Other, stuff, not so sure.
Recommended Posts
Top Posters In This Topic
39
28
46
60
Popular Days
Aug 6
89
Aug 5
64
Aug 7
52
Sep 5
42
Top Posters In This Topic
rascal 39 posts
ex10 28 posts
Ham 46 posts
Larry N Moore 60 posts
Popular Days
Aug 6 2007
89 posts
Aug 5 2007
64 posts
Aug 7 2007
52 posts
Sep 5 2007
42 posts
Popular Posts
mamouda
Quote Teach. Apt to teach, he must be able to teach. Apt to teaching. I so believe that I’m apt to teach that when I finish tonight, I don’t expect any questions left over the
mamouda
I had to put up with one for 6 years after I divorced. I understand how Mrs W became another woman after he died! I wrote a blog about them while I was in this relationship and I learned so much doing
mamouda
Rocky I also can tell you I'm very frustrated because I have to unlearn the things I learned and I'm very bad at studying God's Word. So when I have a question I ask God to show me and He leads me to
Tom Strange
I'm not certain, but I think LORDSHIP requires more than a passing moment... but that just me (too) :)
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Bumpy
...and afterwards, what if you change your mind and hit the delete button??
Link to comment
Share on other sites
ex10
Hey, Tommy, we could discuss it over a Shiner at the BBQ if you want.
Seriously, can't wait to see your smiling face in real time.
Edited by ex10Link to comment
Share on other sites
Ham
Yeah.. the sad thing, is how someone can so blatantly violate basic principles and deceny in life, and actually get people to debate how far over the line person went, in christian terms.. for decades.
I think evil is, evil does.
at fifty years old.. I wouldn't even dream of drugging or taking advantage of anybody.
Caldwell wrote that little play about one of these hucksters in the depression days.. he is so descriptive, it has to be based on a true story or two..
the economy isn't SO bad right now.. now they don't travel around, they start a little home church, then some kind of outreach complex.. and people have enough money and resources to come to THEM. Not the other way around..
I think if the economy really sours, we'll see the hucksters roaming the land for sustenance, like in the days of Judges, once again..
God have mercy on America..
Link to comment
Share on other sites
oldiesman
(1) Then salvation would be of works; and
(2) Victor Paul Wierwille was in fellowship with God for more than a passing moment.
(one wouldn't know it by some posters' opinions but he did manage to do some good works too, over the years.)
Link to comment
Share on other sites
skyrider
Yeah......on NBC's Dateline last night, they detailed this Dallas woman's life and her dark side.
Long story short......husband went missing, later found dead in OKC, detectives couldn't pin the murder on her, she gets insurance money, remarries, divorces the guy, more money...moves and stays on the prowl to find rich men in California, buys another home.....keeps staying one step ahead of justice
At age 62, she starts up a scam as a Christian woman waiting to go on a mission trip, has plenty of pictures of African kids, gives detailed examples of "healings and miracles", moves in with an older lady, redirects her SS checks to her own account, and is siphoning off her other accounts, etc. etc.
Those in her local church in North Carolina were totally fooled.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Ham
Yeah.. I was just thinking. I'm not laying blame to the leader of that church, primarily because I'm not acquainted with the whole story. But what is the real purpose of a pastor? At least a REAL one?
For one, I'd expect him to watch my back.. not give in to every religious scam this side of the Mississippi.. off chasing prophecies, other kinds of nonsense.
Somebody has to figuratively club the wolves.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Ham
Lest I offend our favorite Mr. Word Wolf.. maybe I should modify it.. they aren't wolves.. they are more like werewolves..
Link to comment
Share on other sites
What The Hey
The problem is, most tend to leave that up to someone else. The reason people love inspecting the "fruit" in someone else's life is because it keeps the focus off of them having to inspect the fruit in their own - otherwise somebody would take a club to them. I prefer to club my own wolves, thank you.
Edited by What The HeyLink to comment
Share on other sites
skyrider
What The Hey,
In the context of our conversation, Hamm and I were posting on the Dateline scenario....where the Dallas woman had a dark side and kept moving from place to place. Years later, she moved into a North Carolina community and was siphoning off finances from a little old lady and others in the church.
Hamm commented on the pastor's duties; his purpose to protect the flock.
The following is the context:
After a couple of sarcastic remarks, you state......."I prefer to club my own wolves, thank you."
Context, wth......these church people in North Carolina might NEED a pastor (a shepherd) who helps them and protects the the people. Obviously, you o' wise one....don't.
<_<
PS ......just another arrogant answer by mr. pfal enthusiast.
Can't even read it IN THE CONTEXT......yeah, you learned alot in pfal.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
waysider
Hmmmm.
Let's see now.
You put pickles in a can that says peaches but the contents fail to morph into what the label declares.
Now where did I hear that before?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
ex10
Ok, I confess to being not in flow with the current wave this thread is taking, but I've been thinking about the topic because others have sparked my fading memory of events long passed. So here goes, and please pardon me for my total left turn....
But now I see, early on in this thread mentioned something about Geer being in the running for the top spot in TWI during Advanced Class '79. Without spending alot of time explaining alot about myself and the how and why of how I ended up backstage at that event, which probably is a total sidetrack involving way too much about ME, hear are my musings.....mostly about Geer.
I don't remember Geer being present at all backstage. But that could be my faulty memory. He and his wife didn't graduate from the corps til later that same summer. As Skyrider, I think mentioned, he (Geer) and his wife were all about sucking up (pardon my french, it's the best way I know how to put it) to VP. But they were in-rez corps up until July 1979.
In March of 1980, during my first year in-rez in the way corps, (just a few months after Adv. Class '79) VP was not happy about the way things were getting done, or not getting done, in Gunnison. So he sent Geer to Gunnison to straighten things out. It was a test of sorts. VP wanted to see if Geer could "handle" the Way Corps and the work involved in getting the place ready to be inhabited by in-rez corps, as well as, believers who wanted to visit. (Remember here VP's "vision" for the place.) VP figured the in-rez Corps would be the slave labor to keep the place going. That was part of his plan. (I heard this from someone who was in the know, I didn't make it uo. I know it's hearsay, Lord forgive me.)
Anyway, to make a long story short, Geer somehow managed to pass the test. Then he got promoted to being bus driver extraordinaire and most favored sidekick of VP. Yet, VP STILL chose craighead to replace him.
Other "top leaders" of the era, felt threatened by Geer. He seemed to have an "in" with VP, that others who had been around for ages didn't have. My own personal opinion is that Geer used his closeness with VP, to full advantage. He wasn't in a top position as far as leadership, making decisions, having to work with people went, but he had VP's ear. Geer had no "research or teaching" skills whatsoever, that were publicly evident. (VP was always impressed by those who could "work the word," and had academic credentials.) Somehow Geer snaked his way into becoming VP's companion in crime, and confidant. And when VP wanted someone who he felt could "get the job done, and whom he could trust implicitely, he called on Geer. Hence, Geer's assignment to Gartmore. I'm sure VP thought that he was someone who "shared the vision."
Ok, my brain hurts. Can anybody else fill in some dots here?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
excathedra
well i can't right now sis, i'm lo shanta malakeseto, lo shantai
Link to comment
Share on other sites
ex10
Yeah well, sisex, I wish I'd kept a better way corps diary than I did. Shame on me for not being the best corpsbot I could. Then I woulda written all this stuff down better. :B)
Edited by ex10Link to comment
Share on other sites
Ham
Ex 10, technically, I think the word is "slithered", not "snaked".
But I'm not exactly a stickler for "accuracy" or anything..
Edited by Mr. HammeroniLink to comment
Share on other sites
now I see
Hey Ex10,
I didn't mean to infer that Chris Geer was backstage at Adv class '79, just that he was in the running for "top positon" status, what I was meaning was more that he was in the group of men vying for the job, tht they all were very competetive about it. The person I heard it from was backstage at that event, and remarked how competitive it really was. Of course not being in contention myself, I was oblivious to the rivalry that apparently existed, and pretty amazed that it boiled down to a competition, pretty carnal.
Tonto, I seem to recall that Robert Duv*l took the foundational class back in the day, maybe that's where he got his inspiration to write the screenplay for "The Apostle" and to star in the role. I wouldn't be suprised.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Tom Strange
I don't know Bump... do you have to go back to square one?
me too... I'll bring the Shiner... I know where the store is!
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Tom Strange
1) I don't know that I can agree with "then salvation would be of works"... because (using that logic) you'd be "working" to confess and believe...
2) I don't know that you can honestly say that either, you can say that you believe that, but then I'd tell you that there's just as much a chance that my thoughts on that are just as valid (yes, I'm "some posters")
Link to comment
Share on other sites
doojable
I wanna come! ;)
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Danny
ex10
The time line missing pieces.
Whoever was running Gunny sack got canned in the middle
of 78. A F3 couple was chosen to run the place. they weren't the
bowing type. C greer was at Hq for his intrim year 77-78.
That's how he got close to vp. Geer was 7th C.
After his C G graduation vp's bus driver ran off with one of the flock.
He was non-corpse. So vp wanted a corpse kind of guy (suck-up) for
the job.
Being he already had started proving himself and knew how to drive he got the shoe.
I was at hq at the time and knew most of the players.
Very stab you back kind of stuff.
Just say the other person had something to do with the devil and if you didn't bow
to vp it was the death nail.
If you wanted to rise to the top just be there to fill the void. and be able to keep secrets.
Many a story was told in the sugar shack.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
now I see
Danny, was the bus driver Chuck?
Edited by but now I seeLink to comment
Share on other sites
ex10
Danny, I hear ya brother. I was on staff the year the 7th were on their interim year. I don't remember CG being there. But then again, it was the year of t"Uncle Harry's" death, the faith seminar in Gunnison, as well as some kind of class? the Advanced class maybe? in Bristol. And the first year of "International Summer School." Lotza stuff happened, and he coulda been there? but I don't remember him. If he was there, he didn't hang out with us non-important persons. And I worked back room at the BRC among other things. He wasn't there.
The 3rd corps were "back in-rez." I babysat alot.
Yeah, I know about Chuck and his married girlfriend. I worked with her. Oi vey. I guess I should add, I kept a jounal. Some dates and stuff I am absolutely positive of. Other, stuff, not so sure.
Edited by ex10Link to comment
Share on other sites
ex10
but now I see,
Yeah, it was Chuck.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
T-Bone
If you have to plagiarize another man's fruit to get people to pick from your branches – you might be a bad tree.
If you think the Way Tree takes the place of the absent Christ – you might be a bad tree.
If your root is in the 45871 Zip Code – you might be a bad tree.
If you think the way to prune a tree is to mark and avoid – you might be a bad tree.
If you're rotten to the Corps and anyone else that supports your system – you might be a bad tree.
If you find you spook the flock when you forget to put on your sheep's clothing – you might be a bad tree.
If you prefer fleecing the sheep over helping the sheep – you might be a bad tree.
If you think women's fellowship is a target-rich environment – you might be a bad tree.
If you drug the females of the flock to have your way with them – you might be a very bad tree.
Brother Foxworthy
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.