and it generates fear in people. we were young and he had the authority in our life , people wanted that they wanted a taste of that kind of power a bully must have those who want to live off his power and say so to survive .
...I know there is a "spectrum" of experiences had by all in here.
This is a topic that just always "frosted" me as it seemed to me to be a "measuring stick" of a persons "worth" as a believer.
Just some thoughts
The "Law" of Believing as practiced by TWI was circular reasoning.
Believing = Receiving
"But I believed and didn't receive!"
"Then you didn't really believe!"
Sure most of us can point to bible verses that say (or seem to say) believing = receiving, and many of us can dredge from our memory situations where we "believed" for something and received it, but the "Law" put us at the center of the universe, everything that happened to us was caused by our thoughts, so of course we had to be "reproved" when the bad things happened because, after all, we had caused them to occur!
Think about the pressure that we were under: every single thing that affected outr lives was under our control :o
You're darn right!!!!!!!!!! I've been on both sides of this believing game with TWI. Here's my take on how the game works. A believer tells a TWI leader they're having a hard time believing for something – and not seeing results, maybe there's even a hint of something is not working right. This is actually a serious challenge to the validity of PFAL – however, a sharp TWI leader recasts their challenge as one of questioning God's Word - and thereby knock the ball back in the believer's court. The assumption being there's nothing wrong with PFAL.
For the believer it's a game of utter frustration. Like playing Battleship with an opponent who constantly cheats by moving the pieces…TWI's law of believing was always an effective manipulative tool – for there will always be some aspect of a person's life that can be called in question – and this can be exploited.
t's really the universal laws of god that give me the headache, jonny, not you
Well, at least we have procreation, which got us on the planet where we can see and be part of His Wonders. Without that I guess we wouldn't have anything to worry about, because we wouldn't BE.
Really.. what difference is it.. "believing" or gambling..
Both ways, people have worked out some kind of "system" to "beat" the house.. I remember putting my last twenty dollars in the horn, and "believing" for all to turn out for the best..
Sounds good Groucho, looks real nice on a stained glass window, but you can't know God without the bible and you can't please God without believing (Heb 11:6). There IS power in believing...GOD!
Ya know, Johniam is right. One must believe, to KNOW God...
Yes.....one must believe GOD'S PROMISES to be pleasing to God.
No.......twi's form of "the law of believing" where one "believes" for red drapes, close-to-store parking places, green lights, unrealistic gas mileage, etc. is NOT based on scripture. At times, when God is taking care of His children, He intervenes with blessings (or miracles) that are beyond His written Word.
A lot of you guys who are touting "believing", or quoting bible verses that talk about believing aren't for the most part talking about what was taught in PFAL.
Saw this a lot even while still in. Wierwille very clearly taught some things about "The Law of Believing", some folks modified what he taught either to line it up with reality or with the bible. There were even "official" teachings that altered Wierwille's dogma. But no one ever came out and said that Wierwille was wrong in his initial teachings, nor did the attitude of blame ever really change.
A couple of you guys are emphasizing that one had to believe God to get any kind of results, yet that's not really what Wierwille taught.
Excellent point, Oak! VPW's version of the law of believing were marked by a shift in the focus of believing and assuming a commanding role in the process.
I remember from the Blue Book, the chapter Release from Your Prisons, get clear on what you want in your mind…focus on that! The object of our faith was not God but what we wanted. Reorienting what we put our faith in - dissolved any connection with the God of the Bible. After all, the law of believing worked for saint and sinner alike. Assuming a commanding role eliminates the need for God altogether! I even remember a phrase being circulated, "believe in your believing."
A few things to note from Jesus' teaching on faith in Mark: To Peter who was awestruck by the fig tree dying over night – Jesus said have "faith in God." He didn't say "have faith in yourself" or "believe in your believing." When He spoke of throwing a mountain into the sea – He didn't specify how it would be done – but He did state "it will be done for him." And in reference to prayer and believing He indicated we're to ask – implying we acknowledge a higher authority – in other words, the one we're praying to:
Mark 11:20-24 NIV
20In the morning, as they went along, they saw the fig tree withered from the roots. 21Peter remembered and said to Jesus, "Rabbi, look! The fig tree you cursed has withered!"
22"Have[f]faith in God," Jesus answered. 23"I tell you the truth, if anyone says to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and does not doubt in his heart but believes that what he says will happen,it will be done for him. 24Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours.
The passage of the two blind men coming to Jesus for healing, clarifies where they placed their faith. They responded to Jesus' question by saying they believed He was able to heal them.
Matthew 9:27-30 NIV
27As Jesus went on from there, two blind men followed him, calling out, "Have mercy on us, Son of David!"
28When he had gone indoors, the blind men came to him, and he asked them, "Do you believe that I am able to do this?"
"Yes, Lord," they replied.
29Then he touched their eyes and said, "According to your faith will it be done to you"; 30and their sight was restored. Jesus warned them sternly, "See that no one knows about this." 31But they went out and spread the news about him all over that region.
VPW's version of the law of believing gave rise to a bunch of positive affirmation braggarts that assumed a commanding role in the make-believe-world of TWI. Better talk a good game when around these folks – or they'll be all over your case! Of course, that's a little out of line with the humble attitude shown in James – but hey – when did that ever stop them before?
James 4:13-17 NIV
13Now listen, you who say, "Today or tomorrow we will go to this or that city, spend a year there, carry on business and make money." 14Why, you do not even know what will happen tomorrow. What is your life? You are a mist that appears for a little while and then vanishes. 15Instead, you ought to say, "If it is the Lord's will, we will live and do this or that." 16As it is, you boast and brag. All such boasting is evil. 17Anyone, then, who knows the good he ought to do and doesn't do it, sins.
VP put faith into 5 categories: natural believing, which everybody can do, and the faith of Jesus Christ, which only those born again can do. The other three are also only for those born again (household faith, fruit of the spirit faith, and the manifestation of faith).
For example, in Matthew 6 Jesus calls his disciples "oh ye of little faith" and then in Matthew 8 he says of the Roman centurian, "I have not seen so great faith in all Israel. Those are both natural believing, which can vary from person to person.
But in Romans 12, it says that God has dealt to every man THE measure of faith. This is the faith of Jesus Christ; one size fits all. Being born again doesn't make anyone "better" morally than those not born again, but it gives that person a tool to use that they didn't have before.
Remember the movie 'Stripes"? The scene where Bill Murray and Harold Ramis took that souped up military vehicle out for a joy ride? Harold Ramis was reading the manual for the thing and kept saying how you wouldn't believe what this thing can do on and on and on. That military vehicle had tools that other similar vehicles didn't have. That's like the faith of Jesus Christ. But if believers don't realize what they got, they'll never use it.
If you pray (believe) for something that has God behind it, it will come to pass. If you just pray for stuff like you're on the 'believer shopping channel', then maybe it won't come to pass, but believing works.
Sounds good Groucho, looks real nice on a stained glass window, but you can't know God without the bible and you can't please God without believing (Heb 11:6). There IS power in believing...GOD!
Not to negate the bible AT ALL........................BUT......................
Adam and Eve never had a bible
Moses never had a bible
Joseph never had a bible
why, Jesus himself didn't have ''a bible''....
and they knew GOD very well.
Must be something more to getting to know God than just reading about HIM.
I remember worshipping the bible while in TWI. I also ''believed'' God for everything.
All it did was make me view God as the preverbial Genie in a bottle.
Funny, I actually know HIM better now that I stopped commanding things from HIM
and just started worshipping HIM.
What I ''believe'' now, is that He will give me/do for me, the things HE wants for me.
Sometimes it is exactly what I wanted (prayed for),
and sometimes it is what He thinks is best. (not what I prayed for).
Bliss: Moses WROTE in the bible. Adam and Eve had direct communication with God. Has God ever told you what job to do like He did Adam? Has he ever told you to walk through a sea like He did Moses? What Moses wrote is still with us and referred to all the time in the OT.
The things that were at stake when Moses was alive are not at stake now; same for Adam and Eve. What is at stake for you? You don't think God cares about you? You don't think the bible could help? You don't think God expects you to know that?
In other words there's no God...believing is all vanity...there's no power behind believing. Might as well play the lotto. Not buying it.
Not exactly what I said.
The "system", all the keys, all the stuff.. how much of it actually WORKED? How many times did people carefully frame their "believing" and "details" to carefully fit the keys, and.. nada?
How many times did you get the pony, the steamship, the mansion, the 24 carat gold bullion?
I think it was a "system" to try to milk the creator of the heavens and the earth.. isn't that what a gambling "system" is? Some way to improve the odds, such that the house HAS to PAY? Abraham tried that with Sodom.. "well, what if there a hundred righteous, what if there are fifty righteous.."
sorry, He's smarter than us.
Oh yes, I think all prayers are answered. Most of them the answer is "when pigs sprout wings and fly.."
Bliss: Moses WROTE in the bible. Adam and Eve had direct communication with God. Has God ever told you what job to do like He did Adam? Has he ever told you to walk through a sea like He did Moses? What Moses wrote is still with us and referred to all the time in the OT.
The things that were at stake when Moses was alive are not at stake now; same for Adam and Eve. What is at stake for you? You don't think God cares about you? You don't think the bible could help? You don't think God expects you to know that?
My point, again, is not to negate the power and purpose of the bible. I love the bible. I love God.
What is at stake for me? My relationship with Him.
Of course God cares about me.
Of course the bible can/does help me.
If God is making His word available to me, then, yes, He expects me to ''try'' to know it.
The point I was trying to get at is that God makes a way for himself to be revealed. It isn't ONLY through His word. You said..........
"but you can't know God without the bible "
I only believe that is partly true.
*hence my last post.
While in TWI I knew a lot of the bible and THOUGHT I knew GOD.
But it wasn't until I let go of my ''head knowledge bible worship and my elite pharaseeism (sp?)"
and allowed the Holy Spirit to be my teacher................
did I really get to know HIM.
The Pharisee's knew the law too. Memorized it even more than many of us have. Yet, we know what Jesus said about them.
It's not about what or how much you know.
It's what you do with what you know.
If I can't even do the basics of what God commands...................love my neighbor, than what is the point of ''learning more of His word''?
I study His word everyday. But, I don't like the hyposcrisy in me.
God almighty ruler of the heavens and the universe HAS to bend to my will because I am preforming the formula juuust right.
Wierwille was wrong the way he interpreted that verse and taught it...as he found out himself when it was his time to operate the principle...he died...
Believing isn`t a state of mind that we conjure up when we want something, a quarter that we put in the vending machine when we want a blessing dispensed....
It is hard to reduce it to some catch phrase...but in short the best that I can describe it....it is an attitude of humble trust that God will be there period. That is when the details fall into place, the blessings are spontaneous in ways that are far better than the original plan that I might have thought of.
What was corps objective #4 ..... and didn't wierwille tell us that this was revelation from God?
Practice believing to bring material abundance to you and the ministry
Practice believing.........to WALK in God's power? No
Practice believing.........to HEAL the broken-hearted? No
Practice believing.........to UNBURDEN the oppressed? No
Practice believing.........to SET CAPTIVES FREE? No
Practice believing.........to bring GLORY TO GOD? No
Practice believing to bring SHOW ME THE MATERIAL ABUNDANCE.......
Wierwille's corps program had MAJOR FLAWS in its foundational approach.
The APPLICATION OF ERROR in twi was being taught to the corps/leadership.....and permeated twi for over a decade before wierwille's death. And, some wonder why there is such diverse viewpoints here at GS?
Woah Skyrider, THAT is pretty damned twisted. The corpes principles....the most important thing that were to be manifest...funny...
Jesus seemed to have a whole other set of priorities.....Love God and love your neighbor...on these two commandments/principles rest ALL the law....In addition to the one you pointed out,I don`t remember that in any of the principles of being corpes.
OK, all you folks with better memories than mine...what were the other corpes principles?
"Acquire and in depth spiritual perception and awareness."
"Physical training making your physical body the vehicle of the Word as vital as possible."
"Go forth as leaders and workers to areas of concern interest and need". (or is that some WOW thing?)
And I forget that other one besides the "material abundance to you and the ministry"...
And, that is "corps, not "corpEs", for the record. I knew a guy who got kicked out of the 12th Corps for not being able to spell "corps" and "receive". So, get it right!
I dunno about "building your believing" and that kind of thing.
The few times that something really happened.. I knew what the outcome would be, before "checking it with da word".. or praying.. or trying to build "believing images of victory".
Maybe it sounds "unfair" and all, but I really think God gives you that kind of "faith". I've never been able to build a big enough fire under it by my own initiative.
Made me look like some kinda macho huper believer or something though.. looked like muscle, but just wait for me to exhale..
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pond
sounds like a bully to me.
and it generates fear in people. we were young and he had the authority in our life , people wanted that they wanted a taste of that kind of power a bully must have those who want to live off his power and say so to survive .
ever see a high school crowd?
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T-Bone
You're darn right!!!!!!!!!! I've been on both sides of this believing game with TWI. Here's my take on how the game works. A believer tells a TWI leader they're having a hard time believing for something – and not seeing results, maybe there's even a hint of something is not working right. This is actually a serious challenge to the validity of PFAL – however, a sharp TWI leader recasts their challenge as one of questioning God's Word - and thereby knock the ball back in the believer's court. The assumption being there's nothing wrong with PFAL.
TWI leaders used the law of believing as a measuring stick – and through an endless set of variables maintain their advantage in the game. There could be a million reasons why they're not seeing the desired results: they weren't believing for the best in the situation, haven't been abundant sharing, have been out of fellowship awhile, they have worldly music in their home which gave devil spirits entrée to their lives, should have gone W.O.W. or Corps by now – they're just coasting, haven't mastered PFAL, haven't spent much time in the Word, the unbelief of their spouse or the community is the problem, etc.
For the believer it's a game of utter frustration. Like playing Battleship with an opponent who constantly cheats by moving the pieces…TWI's law of believing was always an effective manipulative tool – for there will always be some aspect of a person's life that can be called in question – and this can be exploited.
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Ham
This is the reason gambling has such appeal, and often a dead end career..
some refuse to admit it was a mistake.. will gamble their whole retirement and fortune to try to get the glory of old days back again.
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J0nny Ling0
i
Well, at least we have procreation, which got us on the planet where we can see and be part of His Wonders. Without that I guess we wouldn't have anything to worry about, because we wouldn't BE.
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Ham
Really.. what difference is it.. "believing" or gambling..
Both ways, people have worked out some kind of "system" to "beat" the house.. I remember putting my last twenty dollars in the horn, and "believing" for all to turn out for the best..
the odds always favor the house in the long run..
:)
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johniam
quote: Really.. what difference is it.. "believing" or gambling..
In other words there's no God...believing is all vanity...there's no power behind believing. Might as well play the lotto. Not buying it.
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GrouchoMarxJr
Oh...there's a God alright...and He wants us to believe what He tells us...
...but I suspect that there's a lot of whackos, conmen, religious nuts, and well doers who want to interfer in that process...
God requires faith of us...to trust Him...not the "power of believing".
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johniam
Sounds good Groucho, looks real nice on a stained glass window, but you can't know God without the bible and you can't please God without believing (Heb 11:6). There IS power in believing...GOD!
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J0nny Ling0
Ya know, Johniam is right. One must believe, to KNOW God...
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skyrider
Yes.....one must believe GOD'S PROMISES to be pleasing to God.
No.......twi's form of "the law of believing" where one "believes" for red drapes, close-to-store parking places, green lights, unrealistic gas mileage, etc. is NOT based on scripture. At times, when God is taking care of His children, He intervenes with blessings (or miracles) that are beyond His written Word.
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Oakspear
A lot of you guys who are touting "believing", or quoting bible verses that talk about believing aren't for the most part talking about what was taught in PFAL.
Saw this a lot even while still in. Wierwille very clearly taught some things about "The Law of Believing", some folks modified what he taught either to line it up with reality or with the bible. There were even "official" teachings that altered Wierwille's dogma. But no one ever came out and said that Wierwille was wrong in his initial teachings, nor did the attitude of blame ever really change.
A couple of you guys are emphasizing that one had to believe God to get any kind of results, yet that's not really what Wierwille taught.
Saint & sinner alike!
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T-Bone
Excellent point, Oak! VPW's version of the law of believing were marked by a shift in the focus of believing and assuming a commanding role in the process.
I remember from the Blue Book, the chapter Release from Your Prisons, get clear on what you want in your mind…focus on that! The object of our faith was not God but what we wanted. Reorienting what we put our faith in - dissolved any connection with the God of the Bible. After all, the law of believing worked for saint and sinner alike. Assuming a commanding role eliminates the need for God altogether! I even remember a phrase being circulated, "believe in your believing."
A few things to note from Jesus' teaching on faith in Mark: To Peter who was awestruck by the fig tree dying over night – Jesus said have "faith in God." He didn't say "have faith in yourself" or "believe in your believing." When He spoke of throwing a mountain into the sea – He didn't specify how it would be done – but He did state "it will be done for him." And in reference to prayer and believing He indicated we're to ask – implying we acknowledge a higher authority – in other words, the one we're praying to:
Mark 11:20-24 NIV
20In the morning, as they went along, they saw the fig tree withered from the roots. 21Peter remembered and said to Jesus, "Rabbi, look! The fig tree you cursed has withered!"
22"Have[f] faith in God," Jesus answered. 23"I tell you the truth, if anyone says to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and does not doubt in his heart but believes that what he says will happen, it will be done for him. 24Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours.
The passage of the two blind men coming to Jesus for healing, clarifies where they placed their faith. They responded to Jesus' question by saying they believed He was able to heal them.
Matthew 9:27-30 NIV
27As Jesus went on from there, two blind men followed him, calling out, "Have mercy on us, Son of David!"
28When he had gone indoors, the blind men came to him, and he asked them, "Do you believe that I am able to do this?"
"Yes, Lord," they replied.
29Then he touched their eyes and said, "According to your faith will it be done to you"; 30and their sight was restored. Jesus warned them sternly, "See that no one knows about this." 31But they went out and spread the news about him all over that region.
VPW's version of the law of believing gave rise to a bunch of positive affirmation braggarts that assumed a commanding role in the make-believe-world of TWI. Better talk a good game when around these folks – or they'll be all over your case! Of course, that's a little out of line with the humble attitude shown in James – but hey – when did that ever stop them before?
James 4:13-17 NIV
13Now listen, you who say, "Today or tomorrow we will go to this or that city, spend a year there, carry on business and make money." 14Why, you do not even know what will happen tomorrow. What is your life? You are a mist that appears for a little while and then vanishes. 15Instead, you ought to say, "If it is the Lord's will, we will live and do this or that." 16As it is, you boast and brag. All such boasting is evil. 17Anyone, then, who knows the good he ought to do and doesn't do it, sins.
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johniam
VP put faith into 5 categories: natural believing, which everybody can do, and the faith of Jesus Christ, which only those born again can do. The other three are also only for those born again (household faith, fruit of the spirit faith, and the manifestation of faith).
For example, in Matthew 6 Jesus calls his disciples "oh ye of little faith" and then in Matthew 8 he says of the Roman centurian, "I have not seen so great faith in all Israel. Those are both natural believing, which can vary from person to person.
But in Romans 12, it says that God has dealt to every man THE measure of faith. This is the faith of Jesus Christ; one size fits all. Being born again doesn't make anyone "better" morally than those not born again, but it gives that person a tool to use that they didn't have before.
Remember the movie 'Stripes"? The scene where Bill Murray and Harold Ramis took that souped up military vehicle out for a joy ride? Harold Ramis was reading the manual for the thing and kept saying how you wouldn't believe what this thing can do on and on and on. That military vehicle had tools that other similar vehicles didn't have. That's like the faith of Jesus Christ. But if believers don't realize what they got, they'll never use it.
If you pray (believe) for something that has God behind it, it will come to pass. If you just pray for stuff like you're on the 'believer shopping channel', then maybe it won't come to pass, but believing works.
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bliss
Not to negate the bible AT ALL........................BUT......................
Adam and Eve never had a bible
Moses never had a bible
Joseph never had a bible
why, Jesus himself didn't have ''a bible''....
and they knew GOD very well.
Must be something more to getting to know God than just reading about HIM.
I remember worshipping the bible while in TWI. I also ''believed'' God for everything.
All it did was make me view God as the preverbial Genie in a bottle.
Funny, I actually know HIM better now that I stopped commanding things from HIM
and just started worshipping HIM.
What I ''believe'' now, is that He will give me/do for me, the things HE wants for me.
Sometimes it is exactly what I wanted (prayed for),
and sometimes it is what He thinks is best. (not what I prayed for).
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johniam
Bliss: Moses WROTE in the bible. Adam and Eve had direct communication with God. Has God ever told you what job to do like He did Adam? Has he ever told you to walk through a sea like He did Moses? What Moses wrote is still with us and referred to all the time in the OT.
The things that were at stake when Moses was alive are not at stake now; same for Adam and Eve. What is at stake for you? You don't think God cares about you? You don't think the bible could help? You don't think God expects you to know that?
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Ham
Not exactly what I said.
The "system", all the keys, all the stuff.. how much of it actually WORKED? How many times did people carefully frame their "believing" and "details" to carefully fit the keys, and.. nada?
How many times did you get the pony, the steamship, the mansion, the 24 carat gold bullion?
I think it was a "system" to try to milk the creator of the heavens and the earth.. isn't that what a gambling "system" is? Some way to improve the odds, such that the house HAS to PAY? Abraham tried that with Sodom.. "well, what if there a hundred righteous, what if there are fifty righteous.."
sorry, He's smarter than us.
Oh yes, I think all prayers are answered. Most of them the answer is "when pigs sprout wings and fly.."
:)
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bliss
My point, again, is not to negate the power and purpose of the bible. I love the bible. I love God.
What is at stake for me? My relationship with Him.
Of course God cares about me.
Of course the bible can/does help me.
If God is making His word available to me, then, yes, He expects me to ''try'' to know it.
The point I was trying to get at is that God makes a way for himself to be revealed. It isn't ONLY through His word. You said..........
"but you can't know God without the bible "
I only believe that is partly true.
*hence my last post.
While in TWI I knew a lot of the bible and THOUGHT I knew GOD.
But it wasn't until I let go of my ''head knowledge bible worship and my elite pharaseeism (sp?)"
and allowed the Holy Spirit to be my teacher................
did I really get to know HIM.
The Pharisee's knew the law too. Memorized it even more than many of us have. Yet, we know what Jesus said about them.
It's not about what or how much you know.
It's what you do with what you know.
If I can't even do the basics of what God commands...................love my neighbor, than what is the point of ''learning more of His word''?
I study His word everyday. But, I don't like the hyposcrisy in me.
Faithful in least. That is the goal.
sorry for the derail............................
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rascal
Bliss it makes perfect sense.
God almighty ruler of the heavens and the universe HAS to bend to my will because I am preforming the formula juuust right.
Wierwille was wrong the way he interpreted that verse and taught it...as he found out himself when it was his time to operate the principle...he died...
Believing isn`t a state of mind that we conjure up when we want something, a quarter that we put in the vending machine when we want a blessing dispensed....
It is hard to reduce it to some catch phrase...but in short the best that I can describe it....it is an attitude of humble trust that God will be there period. That is when the details fall into place, the blessings are spontaneous in ways that are far better than the original plan that I might have thought of.
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skyrider
What was corps objective #4 ..... and didn't wierwille tell us that this was revelation from God?
Practice believing to bring material abundance to you and the ministry
Practice believing.........to WALK in God's power? No
Practice believing.........to HEAL the broken-hearted? No
Practice believing.........to UNBURDEN the oppressed? No
Practice believing.........to SET CAPTIVES FREE? No
Practice believing.........to bring GLORY TO GOD? No
Practice believing to bring SHOW ME THE MATERIAL ABUNDANCE.......
Wierwille's corps program had MAJOR FLAWS in its foundational approach.
The APPLICATION OF ERROR in twi was being taught to the corps/leadership.....and permeated twi for over a decade before wierwille's death. And, some wonder why there is such diverse viewpoints here at GS?
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rascal
Woah Skyrider, THAT is pretty damned twisted. The corpes principles....the most important thing that were to be manifest...funny...
Jesus seemed to have a whole other set of priorities.....Love God and love your neighbor...on these two commandments/principles rest ALL the law....In addition to the one you pointed out,I don`t remember that in any of the principles of being corpes.
OK, all you folks with better memories than mine...what were the other corpes principles?
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J0nny Ling0
"Acquire and in depth spiritual perception and awareness."
"Physical training making your physical body the vehicle of the Word as vital as possible."
"Go forth as leaders and workers to areas of concern interest and need". (or is that some WOW thing?)
And I forget that other one besides the "material abundance to you and the ministry"...
And, that is "corps, not "corpEs", for the record. I knew a guy who got kicked out of the 12th Corps for not being able to spell "corps" and "receive". So, get it right!
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Ham
I dunno about "building your believing" and that kind of thing.
The few times that something really happened.. I knew what the outcome would be, before "checking it with da word".. or praying.. or trying to build "believing images of victory".
Maybe it sounds "unfair" and all, but I really think God gives you that kind of "faith". I've never been able to build a big enough fire under it by my own initiative.
Made me look like some kinda macho huper believer or something though.. looked like muscle, but just wait for me to exhale..
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skyrider
Haven't looked at those corps objectives (later termed principles) for a long time, but I'll take a stab at it.
#1 Acquire an in-depth spiritual perception and awareness.
#2 Receive training in the whole Word so as to be able to teach others also.
#3 Physical training making your physical body the vehicle of communication of the Word as vital as possible.
#4 Practice believing to bring material abundance to you and the ministry.
#5 Go forth as leaders and workers in areas of concern, interest and need.
Martindale might have changed them abit, but that's how I remember the corps principles.
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Ham
That's why I'm not filthy rich! I never went CORPS!
**ham retreats, kicking himself for missing the "golden" opportunity..**
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