An innie recently handed me that book. Looks like a good book. But that a wayfer handed me that book made me a little, I dunno, bitter? :)
Bolshevik,
Interesting that an innie handed you that book. You should go out and get either Rescued (fiction book) or Driven by Eternity (nonfiction-Christian living)for them by the same author. Both talk about things that would challenge their twi beliefs! (Both rocked my world so to speak and I have been gone almost 2 years!)
developmentally retarded with no where to fit in...I can relate..lol
This world is not my home, I have been held captive
btw, did I mention I am loving the Beth Moore studies I am taking?
Awesome Imagine! I read Breaking Free by Beth Moore when I first left twi--it helped so much. I still refer back to it. Which other ones have you read or studied?
Great there are more GSC here than the membership! How are we going to celebrate? I am here for a lot of reasons. To get the truth. listening to other peoples point of views ,writeing a book. Even thought I was never part of the way I really admire how all of you ex-wayers came through all the BS, abuse and the mean things that were done to all of you! I have disgreed with some of you here. But in all in all you are a great bunch of guys! I will drop one hint when my avatar changes I will tell my story! It is also a sign things are getting better for me.
I notice that x-Catholics don't have a site where they go frequently to talk about the old days in the Catholic church.
Or the x- Methodists don't get together to talk about the good and the bad times of their former lives as Methodists.
Or the x-Presbyterians, imagine them getting online to find other former Presbyterians to discuss how their world has changed since they left the Presbyterian church.
What about those x-Baptists, do they meet and party with other former Baptists?
I used to be a Calvinist, but I don't go online and try to bond with former Calvinists.
What draws me back here again and again?
Have we really left if our thoughts are tied up with our old group?
Explain yourself I don't get what you are trying to say
Great there are more GSC here than the membership! How are we going to celebrate? I am here for a lot of reasons. To get the truth. listening to other peoples point of views ,writeing a book. Even thought I was never part of the way I really admire how all of you ex-wayers came through all the BS, abuse and the mean things that were done to all of you! I have disgreed with some of you here. But in all in all you are a great bunch of guys! I will drop one hint when my avatar changes I will tell my story! It is also a sign things are getting better for me.
I shall wait with baited breath.
( That's when you eat a carrott and then breathe down a rabbit hole.)
Or was that parfaits? (Talkin' about the layers...)
Donkey: You know what else everybody likes? Parfaits. Have you ever met a person, you say, "Let's get some parfait," they say, "Hell no, I don't like no parfait"? Parfaits are delicious.
Shrek: No! You dense, irritating, miniature beast of burden! Ogres are like onions! End of story. Bye-bye. See ya later.
(psst - but I think Lord Farquaad and Lady Farquaad have returned...)
quote: Gosh, I might have gone on to college to further my education but was told that THAT was *worldly knowledge*...that *God needed me on the front lines spiritually* that *I needed the spiritual education that I could recieve on the wow field and in the way corpes more than I needed worldly wisdom*.
I guess they were wrong, and education IS an important thing.....sigh just one more thing I missed out on when trying to follow God`s orders per twi`s instruction.
Spelling and grammatical errors do not prevent me from having a point of view or expressing it.
Hmm. No errors in this post. BTW the puntuation errors Jean referred to are generally learned in elementary school, not college.
quote: I notice that x-Catholics don't have a site where they go frequently to talk about the old days in the Catholic church.
Or the x- Methodists don't get together to talk about the good and the bad times of their former lives as Methodists.
Or the x-Presbyterians, imagine them getting online to find other former Presbyterians to discuss how their world has changed since they left the Presbyterian church.
What about those x-Baptists, do they meet and party with other former Baptists?
I used to be a Calvinist, but I don't go online and try to bond with former Calvinists.
What draws me back here again and again?
Have we really left if our thoughts are tied up with our old group?
Something occurs to me. When in TWI, we all KNEW what we believed. Not necessarily so those other groups. Back in the late 70s I would hear people selling TWI by saying, "If you ask 10 way believers any specific question about faith and practice, all 10 would say the same thing, but if you asked 10 people from a Christian denomination the same question, then you might get 10 different answers". The flip side is that 10 robots can't be wrong, but that's a different can of worms.
Perhaps the people who are ex Catholic, ex Baptist, etc. have just as much to get off their chests and out of their systems as we do, but because those groups are so much larger than TWI, there isn't as much common ground to focus on as there is in TWI. For us, EVERYBODY sat through pfal, EVERYBODY at one time or another had corps leadership, EVERYBODY went to at least 1 ROA, and on down the line. Did these other groups have things that EVERYBODY did? If not, would that make it more difficult to organize ex followers?
Websites or no, I'm guessing that ex Catholics, Baptists, whatever have done what many of us have done: either abandoned Christianity altogether, or moved on to another group.
Or was that parfaits? (Talkin' about the layers...)
Donkey: You know what else everybody likes? Parfaits. Have you ever met a person, you say, "Let's get some parfait," they say, "Hell no, I don't like no parfait"? Parfaits are delicious.
Shrek: No! You dense, irritating, miniature beast of burden! Ogres are like onions! End of story. Bye-bye. See ya later.
(psst - but I think Lord Farquaad and Lady Farquaad have returned...)
Hhmmm...could be a parfaits. Not sure what it is, but I am pretty certain that Rascal is correct. It is like layers. Everytime I think that I have gotten to the chewie center of my tootsie pop, there pops up some other thing.
For example. I dropped my gallon jug of sun tea on the floor the other day. Of course the bloody thing broke and sent tea spilling and flying everywhere. My immediate thought wasnt "Oh SH!T!!" it was "Now what did I do to deserve that?" it was immediately followed by "Where have I erred and stepped out of fellowship?" As soon as those thoughts burst into my brain I snatched them out again. But they had been there, first thing.
Of course it was just an accident. It wasn't any "punshment", it wasn't me not paying attention to the "details" it was an accident pure and simple. Oh sure the bottle was wet from sweating and perhaps I shouldn't have been dividing my attention to the several other things that were going on at the same time. But dropping a bottle is not an indication that I have gone out of "fellowship" or am being punished for some sin that I have committed.
The bottom line to this story is that we as people have been so conditioned to respond both physically and mentally to any given situation that it may take many many years before we even recognize that our response was a conditioned response incorrectly supplied by TWI. I haven't even been near a "fellowship" since 1990 and yet this little layer has just recently come to the surface for me to recognize. Makes me wonder, "What's next?"
P.S. Rascal-I love you dear heart! I dont care how you spell. Your heart is as gentle as a spring rain and I for one am both pleased and honored that you share parts of it with us here at GS.
Hmmm...come to think of it after having broken my jar, I had to resort to boiling the water and making two seperate 2quart containers of tea. Maybe it was a blessing. (Not so) funny that I would have not thougt of that.
You could use distilled water.. it's pretty sterile to begin with. Shouldn't have the common bacteria in it that the article suggested about tap water.
Thank you Eyes, that means a lot. You nailed the point that I was trying to make. JUST when we think that we have our ducks in a row....we find yet another area or facet of our understanding that needs examination and possible correcting. It took decades of conditioning ourselves to think and react the way that we do....I think that it takes a lot of honesty and hard work to recover a healthy thought and decision making process after what we have been through.
Chas...lol :) You could be correct.
Excathedra, I don`t get it either, but thank you for your encouragement and support.
Belle... Thanks, I don`t want to be intimidated into silence ever again.
Asking a pest not to pester you, asking a predator not to regard you as prey, asking an insecure person not to cling are all useless endeavors. Why??? Because in each case the offender does not care that you are offended or annoyed by their behavior their only concern is that you acknowledge their existence.
The validity of your opinions is irrelevant as is the accuracy of same because the center of the continual offenders world is themself. Any "string" they can pull no matter how irrelevant or nitpicking just once more gives them the opportunity to jump to the forefront of the discusssion others are having.
As to discussion, they really have nothing to contribute once they have formed and issued a statement that is outrageous or offensive enough to grab the attention of several people. Discussing and the learning that comes from that activity is not their primary focus.
You found that in the highest echelons in TWI. You find it in the business setting, whether it is the co-worker who spends her time moaning to the boss about how worthless her office mates are, or the warehouse person whose carelessness continually makes work for everyone else. You find it in families where the "black sheep" wrecks havoc by their behaviors.
ATTENTION-specifically ATTENTION ON THEM--is the goal, if anything, besides said attention garnering, is achieved it is a purely accidental by-product of the continuing quest to be the center of the universe.
A really sad situation, because they never realize that if they stopped their self destructive behavior and actually engaged others in meaningful conversation, with the give and take involved, they would become a valued member of any discussion no matter their position and thereby gain all the attention they could want. They never realize that graciousness and continual efforts to be kind to others garner attention and make people want to include you in activities. Good, positive attention is worth its weight in gold. Just my opinion.
I'd like to add, that those who are engaging in the personal attacks, which have been noted on other threads besides this one, never bother to try to iron out communication differences but rather seem more content to begin personal attacks. I hate to think the impression it leaves on those who are lurking here but don't dare post because the Grammar Nazis...
Why is there an x-way site?
Because wonderful people like Pawtucket and his army of Moderators (the KISS Army - LOL!) all take good care of this place so we have it...
quote: A really sad situation, because they never realize that if they stopped their self destructive behavior and actually engaged others in meaningful conversation, with the give and take involved, they would become a valued member of any discussion no matter their position and thereby gain all the attention they could want.
Nice sermon, TL. But you contradicted your own point. My last post (#62) addressed the very first post on this thread without mention of any poster's names. Did it get your attention? Apparently not.
Thanks Temple Lady, I think you made some valid observations, and excellent points. I really appreciate the insight, as I have been at a loss as to how to address this ongoing problem.
quote: A really sad situation, because they never realize that if they stopped their self destructive behavior and actually engaged others in meaningful conversation, with the give and take involved, they would become a valued member of any discussion no matter their position and thereby gain all the attention they could want.
Nice sermon, TL. But you contradicted your own point. My last post (#62) addressed the very first post on this thread without mention of any poster's names. Did it get your attention? Apparently not.
Really?!?!
I did not in anyway address the content of post #62. I have gone back and reread it--just what exactly was supposed to leap to my attention?
Oh, I get it!!
By not addressing your post #62 I was remiss, because how could I have ever dreamed of posting anything that was not in direct response to a post of YOURS!!!!
Sorry, but my post was for the benefit of a poster, GASP!, not you or jeaniam!!!!
What I posted were my general observations, picked up over 57 years of life on this orbiting third planet from the star we call the Sun, about certain personality types.
Wait a minute!! Are you saying that you and jeaniam could possibly fit my generalized profile???? How clever of you to recognize a potential character flaw in yourself! Bravo!
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rascal
John you continue to mischaracterize me, my points and my motives. Please stop. Please leave me alone.
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penguin
Bolshevik,
Interesting that an innie handed you that book. You should go out and get either Rescued (fiction book) or Driven by Eternity (nonfiction-Christian living)for them by the same author. Both talk about things that would challenge their twi beliefs! (Both rocked my world so to speak and I have been gone almost 2 years!)
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penguin
Awesome Imagine! I read Breaking Free by Beth Moore when I first left twi--it helped so much. I still refer back to it. Which other ones have you read or studied?
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excathedra
of course not !!!!!
and you are not invalidated as a worthwhile human being
as much as what jean tried to do that with THAT low blow which makes no sense
???????????
i don't get it
personal attack going in my opinion
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nyunknown
Great there are more GSC here than the membership! How are we going to celebrate? I am here for a lot of reasons. To get the truth. listening to other peoples point of views ,writeing a book. Even thought I was never part of the way I really admire how all of you ex-wayers came through all the BS, abuse and the mean things that were done to all of you! I have disgreed with some of you here. But in all in all you are a great bunch of guys! I will drop one hint when my avatar changes I will tell my story! It is also a sign things are getting better for me.
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Captain Spiritural
Explain yourself I don't get what you are trying to say
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Bolshevik
(please)
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waysider
I shall wait with baited breath.
( That's when you eat a carrott and then breathe down a rabbit hole.)
:)
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ChasUFarley
Or was that parfaits? (Talkin' about the layers...)
Donkey: You know what else everybody likes? Parfaits. Have you ever met a person, you say, "Let's get some parfait," they say, "Hell no, I don't like no parfait"? Parfaits are delicious.
Shrek: No! You dense, irritating, miniature beast of burden! Ogres are like onions! End of story. Bye-bye. See ya later.
(psst - but I think Lord Farquaad and Lady Farquaad have returned...)
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johniam
quote: Gosh, I might have gone on to college to further my education but was told that THAT was *worldly knowledge*...that *God needed me on the front lines spiritually* that *I needed the spiritual education that I could recieve on the wow field and in the way corpes more than I needed worldly wisdom*.
I guess they were wrong, and education IS an important thing.....sigh just one more thing I missed out on when trying to follow God`s orders per twi`s instruction.
Spelling and grammatical errors do not prevent me from having a point of view or expressing it.
Hmm. No errors in this post. BTW the puntuation errors Jean referred to are generally learned in elementary school, not college.
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johniam
quote: I notice that x-Catholics don't have a site where they go frequently to talk about the old days in the Catholic church.
Or the x- Methodists don't get together to talk about the good and the bad times of their former lives as Methodists.
Or the x-Presbyterians, imagine them getting online to find other former Presbyterians to discuss how their world has changed since they left the Presbyterian church.
What about those x-Baptists, do they meet and party with other former Baptists?
I used to be a Calvinist, but I don't go online and try to bond with former Calvinists.
What draws me back here again and again?
Have we really left if our thoughts are tied up with our old group?
Something occurs to me. When in TWI, we all KNEW what we believed. Not necessarily so those other groups. Back in the late 70s I would hear people selling TWI by saying, "If you ask 10 way believers any specific question about faith and practice, all 10 would say the same thing, but if you asked 10 people from a Christian denomination the same question, then you might get 10 different answers". The flip side is that 10 robots can't be wrong, but that's a different can of worms.
Perhaps the people who are ex Catholic, ex Baptist, etc. have just as much to get off their chests and out of their systems as we do, but because those groups are so much larger than TWI, there isn't as much common ground to focus on as there is in TWI. For us, EVERYBODY sat through pfal, EVERYBODY at one time or another had corps leadership, EVERYBODY went to at least 1 ROA, and on down the line. Did these other groups have things that EVERYBODY did? If not, would that make it more difficult to organize ex followers?
Websites or no, I'm guessing that ex Catholics, Baptists, whatever have done what many of us have done: either abandoned Christianity altogether, or moved on to another group.
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Eyesopen
Hhmmm...could be a parfaits. Not sure what it is, but I am pretty certain that Rascal is correct. It is like layers. Everytime I think that I have gotten to the chewie center of my tootsie pop, there pops up some other thing.
For example. I dropped my gallon jug of sun tea on the floor the other day. Of course the bloody thing broke and sent tea spilling and flying everywhere. My immediate thought wasnt "Oh SH!T!!" it was "Now what did I do to deserve that?" it was immediately followed by "Where have I erred and stepped out of fellowship?" As soon as those thoughts burst into my brain I snatched them out again. But they had been there, first thing.
Of course it was just an accident. It wasn't any "punshment", it wasn't me not paying attention to the "details" it was an accident pure and simple. Oh sure the bottle was wet from sweating and perhaps I shouldn't have been dividing my attention to the several other things that were going on at the same time. But dropping a bottle is not an indication that I have gone out of "fellowship" or am being punished for some sin that I have committed.
The bottom line to this story is that we as people have been so conditioned to respond both physically and mentally to any given situation that it may take many many years before we even recognize that our response was a conditioned response incorrectly supplied by TWI. I haven't even been near a "fellowship" since 1990 and yet this little layer has just recently come to the surface for me to recognize. Makes me wonder, "What's next?"
P.S. Rascal-I love you dear heart! I dont care how you spell. Your heart is as gentle as a spring rain and I for one am both pleased and honored that you share parts of it with us here at GS.
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WordWolf
Maybe you were spared from the sun tea as a blessing....
http://www.snopes.com/food/prepare/suntea.asp
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Eyesopen
Hmmm...come to think of it after having broken my jar, I had to resort to boiling the water and making two seperate 2quart containers of tea. Maybe it was a blessing. (Not so) funny that I would have not thougt of that.
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Ham
You could use distilled water.. it's pretty sterile to begin with. Shouldn't have the common bacteria in it that the article suggested about tap water.
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rascal
Thank you Eyes, that means a lot. You nailed the point that I was trying to make. JUST when we think that we have our ducks in a row....we find yet another area or facet of our understanding that needs examination and possible correcting. It took decades of conditioning ourselves to think and react the way that we do....I think that it takes a lot of honesty and hard work to recover a healthy thought and decision making process after what we have been through.
Chas...lol :) You could be correct.
Excathedra, I don`t get it either, but thank you for your encouragement and support.
Belle... Thanks, I don`t want to be intimidated into silence ever again.
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templelady
Asking a pest not to pester you, asking a predator not to regard you as prey, asking an insecure person not to cling are all useless endeavors. Why??? Because in each case the offender does not care that you are offended or annoyed by their behavior their only concern is that you acknowledge their existence.
The validity of your opinions is irrelevant as is the accuracy of same because the center of the continual offenders world is themself. Any "string" they can pull no matter how irrelevant or nitpicking just once more gives them the opportunity to jump to the forefront of the discusssion others are having.
As to discussion, they really have nothing to contribute once they have formed and issued a statement that is outrageous or offensive enough to grab the attention of several people. Discussing and the learning that comes from that activity is not their primary focus.
You found that in the highest echelons in TWI. You find it in the business setting, whether it is the co-worker who spends her time moaning to the boss about how worthless her office mates are, or the warehouse person whose carelessness continually makes work for everyone else. You find it in families where the "black sheep" wrecks havoc by their behaviors.
ATTENTION-specifically ATTENTION ON THEM--is the goal, if anything, besides said attention garnering, is achieved it is a purely accidental by-product of the continuing quest to be the center of the universe.
A really sad situation, because they never realize that if they stopped their self destructive behavior and actually engaged others in meaningful conversation, with the give and take involved, they would become a valued member of any discussion no matter their position and thereby gain all the attention they could want. They never realize that graciousness and continual efforts to be kind to others garner attention and make people want to include you in activities. Good, positive attention is worth its weight in gold. Just my opinion.
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ChasUFarley
Well said, Mo
I'd like to add, that those who are engaging in the personal attacks, which have been noted on other threads besides this one, never bother to try to iron out communication differences but rather seem more content to begin personal attacks. I hate to think the impression it leaves on those who are lurking here but don't dare post because the Grammar Nazis...
Why is there an x-way site?
Because wonderful people like Pawtucket and his army of Moderators (the KISS Army - LOL!) all take good care of this place so we have it...
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rascal
And damned thankfull I AM for them and this haven :)
Thanks guys!
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johniam
quote: A really sad situation, because they never realize that if they stopped their self destructive behavior and actually engaged others in meaningful conversation, with the give and take involved, they would become a valued member of any discussion no matter their position and thereby gain all the attention they could want.
Nice sermon, TL. But you contradicted your own point. My last post (#62) addressed the very first post on this thread without mention of any poster's names. Did it get your attention? Apparently not.
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rascal
Thanks Temple Lady, I think you made some valid observations, and excellent points. I really appreciate the insight, as I have been at a loss as to how to address this ongoing problem.
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excathedra
i don't remember the problem, except for how some people here can be so "petty"
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waysider
As long as people need love, understanding and a sympathetic shoulder to cry on, there will need to be an ex-Way site.
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templelady
Really?!?!
I did not in anyway address the content of post #62. I have gone back and reread it--just what exactly was supposed to leap to my attention?
Oh, I get it!!
By not addressing your post #62 I was remiss, because how could I have ever dreamed of posting anything that was not in direct response to a post of YOURS!!!!
Sorry, but my post was for the benefit of a poster, GASP!, not you or jeaniam!!!!
What I posted were my general observations, picked up over 57 years of life on this orbiting third planet from the star we call the Sun, about certain personality types.
Wait a minute!! Are you saying that you and jeaniam could possibly fit my generalized profile???? How clever of you to recognize a potential character flaw in yourself! Bravo!
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