I was reading through some interesting quotes and found these: (hope they are not too corny)
You have to leave the city of your comfort and go into the wilderness of your intuition. What you'll discover will be wonderful. What you'll discover is yourself.
--Alan Alda
There can be no happiness if the things we believe in are different from the things we do.
-Freya Stark
We can re-choose. Our past is not our potential. -author unknown
The truly silent, who keeps apart,
he is like a tree grown in a meadow.
It greens, it doubles its yield,
it stands in front of its lord.
Its fruit is sweet, its shade is
delightful, its end comes in the garden.
-- The Instructions of Amenemope, Chapter 4
The people who say you are not facing reality actually mean that you are not facing their idea of reality.
-Margaret Halsey
Being unwanted, unloved, uncared for, forgotten by everybody - I think that is a much greater hunger, a much greater poverty than the person who has nothing to eat. We must find each other.
-Mother Theresa
It's a good thing to have all the props pulled out from under us occasionally. It gives us some sense of what is rock under our feet, and what is sand.
-Madeleine L'Engle
Lord, where we are wrong, make us willing to change; where we are right,
make us easy to live with.
- Rev. Peter Marshall (former chaplain of the Senate)
Happiness is the absence of the striving for happiness. -Chuang-tzu (B.C. 350)
People travel to wonder at the height of the mountains, at the huge waves of the seas, at the long course of the rivers, at the vast compass of the ocean, at the circular motion of the stars, and yet they pass by themselves without wondering.
I was reading through some interesting quotes and found these: (hope they are not too corny)
You have to leave the city of your comfort and go into the wilderness of your intuition. What you'll discover will be wonderful. What you'll discover is yourself.
--Alan Alda
There can be no happiness if the things we believe in are different from the things we do.
-Freya Stark
We can re-choose. Our past is not our potential. -author unknown
...Being unwanted, unloved, uncared for, forgotten by everybody - I think that is a much greater hunger, a much greater poverty than the person who has nothing to eat. We must find each other.
-Mother Theresa...
...Happiness is the absence of the striving for happiness. -Chuang-tzu (B.C. 350)
People travel to wonder at the height of the mountains, at the huge waves of the seas, at the long course of the rivers, at the vast compass of the ocean, at the circular motion of the stars, and yet they pass by themselves without wondering.
--St. Augustine of Hippo
Great, Java Jane ! I don't think they're corny. I really like these!
A few days ago I came across a couple of pictures of me before the heartache, before twi. I hung them up on the wall to remind me that there was a life before (and again).
Nice to see and be reminded of the life I had before.
I tried a lot of things to rediscover myself after TWI. A lot of it didn't work; for example going to church didn't work, and attempting to organize other ex-way folks into a fellowship didn't work either.
Here are some things that actually DID help me, although I'm still working on it:
1. Throw away the Bible you used in TWI. Get a different translation, and definitely do not copy your old notes into your new Bible.
2. Get rid of those old TWI books. E-bay is a good way to do this, and make money at the same time. Dump the Way Mags, the name tags, the jargon, and maybe even the dental floss.
3. Change the way you pray. Stop "thanking" God for everything you want. Instead just ask Him, including asking Him for help in recovering from the cult. In other words, don't say, "Thank you Father for giving me enough money to pay my bills". Just say, "God help me get my bills paid please". It's amazing how when you talk to God in a normal genuine way, it somehow makes you normal and genuine in the process.
4. Quite by accident, I began investigating my Family Tree. Oh how wonderful !! This was fun, and at the same time gave me a fresh and deep sense of who I am, and where I came from.
5. Try to remember what made you happy, really happy, before the days of TWI. Then do this thing.
6. Get professional help. This is not an insult. Before you select a therapist, ask them on the phone if they have ever worked with ex-cult members. If not, they might be able to make a good referral. Be sure to get someone who has this experience. At this point in my life, I am not at all embarrassed to reveal that I see a therapist regularly. In fact, I'm proud of it.
1. Throw away the Bible you used in TWI. Get a different translation, and definitely do not copy your old notes into your new Bible.
...because the TWI lingo is one of the greatest ways they keep hold of people.
I still have the Bible I used in TWI, but I use a different one on a daily basis. I think that after one is free, looking back at the old Bible and the notes, etc. confirms just how controlled you were.
Using a different translation helps SOO much in scraping TWI lingo from one's life.
I think that one of the last steps in becoming really free is to know in detail how one was controlled and what it was that made me personally suceptable.
Fool me once - shame on you - - fool me twice... its MY fault.
2. Get rid of those old TWI books. E-bay is a good way to do this, and make money at the same time. Dump the Way Mags, the name tags, the jargon, and maybe even the dental floss.
I dropped EVERYTHING from my life that had anything to do w/TWI for several years I even limited time spent w/very good friends from TWI. Even friends who also left TWI, my friendship w/them was a direct tie between me & TWI. Even when I did see friends it was NEVER at a Bible study meeting. I stripped TWI from those relationships too. If I couldn't hang w/them around non-TWI stuff, I'd not hang w/them at all. I even stopped going to church, reading & studying my Bible all together.
I figured that God was either real, or He isn't, IF HE did, in fact, live in me, then he WOULD live in me and that He would guide my steps. There are SOOO many psychological triggers in all of that TWI stuff.
I used to think that TWI was a good thing gone bad. No more, now I see it as a bad thing that had some good people associated w/it. All of the good was what good people brought TO TWI, not something that emanated FROM w/in TWI.
"A good tree yields good fruit, a bad tree yields bad fruit."
"By their fruit, you shall know them."
3. Change the way you pray. Stop "thanking" God for everything you want. Instead just ask Him, including asking Him for help in recovering from the cult. In other words, don't say, "Thank you Father for giving me enough money to pay my bills". Just say, "God help me get my bills paid please". It's amazing how when you talk to God in a normal genuine way, it somehow makes you normal and genuine in the process.
The "Thank you father..." stuff is a big part of the lingo - the control. If one still prays that way, you choose to align yourself w/TWI and are still under their control in that respect.
"Normal & genuine" is the goal, feels great to be "normal" doesn't it. The TWI mindset - at best - is passive aggressive. At worst - - well, we've seen the worst, right?
4. Quite by accident, I began investigating my Family Tree. Oh how wonderful !! This was fun, and at the same time gave me a fresh and deep sense of who I am, and where I came from.
None of us "are" TWI or came from TWI, even those of us who were born into it. I have a daughter (now 20yrs old) who was born into TWI. She is as normal, as one can be, even though she grew up in NK and went through school, k-12 @ NK school. She maintained(s) relationships w/her family (non wafers), as I do.
No one in their right mind talks and acts the way that TWI people do. Yes, I AM saying that people who act as wafers are out of their minds. Truthfully, looking back, I was out of my mind back then, even though I thought I wasn't and functioned normally and excelled in many areas of my life. I was insane in every area that I let them control me.
I worked really hard while in TWI not to use a lot of the jargon, but still used some - - IT is crazy. Were it a normal part of Godly Christianity, why is it that basically NOBODY else in the Christian world uses it?
Hmmmm.......
5. Try to remember what made you happy, really happy, before the days of TWI. Then do this thing.
Even if you don't know or can't remember... you know what makes you happy NOW. DO some of it.
Just within the last year or so, I've totally let go of the "God first, others second, myself third" concept that TWI pushes. Doing some non-TWI influenced Bible study, I discovered that a BIG part of tithing is a tithe to YOURSELF!!!
True Christian service REQUIRES that the one serving others serve himself enough so that he has enough available to give to others. "...but rather let him labor, doing good profitable work so that he has enough to give to others...." is what Romans 5:28 is really saying. Jesus said that they way we treat people is how we serve him.
Treating YOURSELF right is the FIRST responsibility we have in treating "PEOPLE." We ARE people, friends.
Go ahead, treat yourself to a movie & let the untility co. wait a couple of weeks to get the rest of "their" money. I went through a period where my $$$ was REALLY tight. I stopped suffering by giving companies "all" my money, gave them SOME, & gave me some.
The little things I gave myself w/the SOME $$$ make me a much happier guy. Then I realized that I was giving them $$$ "of necessity." I've become a "cheerful giver" in paying my bills, use some of the tithe I pay to myself & "have some to give to him that has needs" (which makes me feel GREAT, cause I get a real kick out of helping people).
AND. Blessings have been dropping out of the sky.
Hmmm..... maybe I'm becoming an actually Godly fellow??? Eventually, as time went on I found that having a desire to know God was a part of ME. I had a growing desire to study the Bible and now do it as I feel like doing it and no longer feel GUILTY if a day or two or more goes by and I don't open the book.
He loves me anyway.
6. Get professional help. This is not an insult. Before you select a therapist, ask them on the phone if they have ever worked with ex-cult members. If not, they might be able to make a good referral. Be sure to get someone who has this experience. At this point in my life, I am not at all embarrassed to reveal that I see a therapist regularly. In fact, I'm proud of it.
Don't see a therapist regularly anymore (maybe I should :blink: ) but I did. AND I've been mentored through a program we have @ the church I attend now, and have done other similar stuff. Helps. Even if you don't necessarily do the full fledged, ( I was a teenage cultist, counseling thing) thing, talking with someone who NEVER had ANYTHING to do w/TWI is SO helpful. They get a "how could you ever have thought like that" look on their face when you talk about some things that helps shock a person back to reality.
Ain't no shame in seein' a therapist. We should all do it for a while at least.
Shifra, your post is a good "Six step program" to answer the how do I get free from TWI, the cult thing. Just wanted to add a "this is what it did for me" perspective.
I figured that God was either real, or He isn't, IF HE did, in fact, live in me, then he WOULD live in me and that He would guide my steps. There are SOOO many psychological triggers in all of that TWI stuff.
I used to think that TWI was a good thing gone bad. No more, now I see it as a bad thing that had some good people associated w/it. All of the good was what good people brought TO TWI, not something that emanated FROM w/in TWI.
"A good tree yields good fruit, a bad tree yields bad fruit."
"By their fruit, you shall know them."
True Christian service REQUIRES that the one serving others serve himself enough so that he has enough available to give to others. "...but rather let him labor, doing good profitable work so that he has enough to give to others...." is what Romans 5:28 is really saying. Jesus said that they way we treat people is how we serve him.
Treating YOURSELF right is the FIRST responsibility we have in treating "PEOPLE." We ARE people, friends.
:eusa_clap:
This was some of the most important stuff I learned after leaving!
Belle, it just takes time friend. It isn`t a process that we can rush. Also the *real self* for some of us is difficult because we got involved when we were 17. The adult that leaves 15 years later has no real self, because the immature self of the teenager they once were doesn`t work as an adult.
For me it is an ongoing exciting adventure of exploring who and what I want to be. It is like starting over with a clean slate. Where I go from here is up to me.
Of course it may be mid life crisis....lol but I am a big believer in exploring new interests...
A common factor I find running through a lot of these posts is a simple thing of acknowledging the authentic self. When making a decision, when formulating an opinion, when reflecting on an experience – it's asking "what do I think?" Rascal's post resonated with me. Joining TWI as a young man - I was thinking how in so many aspects it was like transferring parental supervision from mom and dad to that organization. My decisions, opinions, viewpoint, etc. revolved around TWI's way of thinking. TWI's intellectual standards, decision-making criteria, agendas, priorities, etc. became the artificial self – this overshadowed the authentic self.
"What do I think? What do I want? What do I feel? What is important to me?" Simple questions – yes. But difficult for someone who for so long focused on what other folks thought, what other folks wanted, what pleased other folks. And it feels scary at first – because it feels so selfish. That's becausewe accepted the artificial self as real – it was viewed as good, "righteous", trustworthy, true…and the authentic self was looked upon as bad, "sinful", unreliable, deceitful, fake.
At first, it can take a lot of time as you wade through every detail of an idea or decision. There were feelings very similar to when I first left home – away from mom and dad – feeling the weight of responsibility, the dilemma of priorities, ferreting out all options, exploring personal preferences, determining criteria for validity, etc. … growing pains…flexing your wings…taking flight…freedom! Feeling like your old self again? Whatever that is - don't think I can remember that far back …it just feels natural...it feels so right!
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JavaJane
I was reading through some interesting quotes and found these: (hope they are not too corny)
You have to leave the city of your comfort and go into the wilderness of your intuition. What you'll discover will be wonderful. What you'll discover is yourself.
--Alan Alda
There can be no happiness if the things we believe in are different from the things we do.
-Freya Stark
We can re-choose. Our past is not our potential. -author unknown
The truly silent, who keeps apart,
he is like a tree grown in a meadow.
It greens, it doubles its yield,
it stands in front of its lord.
Its fruit is sweet, its shade is
delightful, its end comes in the garden.
-- The Instructions of Amenemope, Chapter 4
The people who say you are not facing reality actually mean that you are not facing their idea of reality.
-Margaret Halsey
Being unwanted, unloved, uncared for, forgotten by everybody - I think that is a much greater hunger, a much greater poverty than the person who has nothing to eat. We must find each other.
-Mother Theresa
It's a good thing to have all the props pulled out from under us occasionally. It gives us some sense of what is rock under our feet, and what is sand.
-Madeleine L'Engle
Lord, where we are wrong, make us willing to change; where we are right,
make us easy to live with.
- Rev. Peter Marshall (former chaplain of the Senate)
Happiness is the absence of the striving for happiness. -Chuang-tzu (B.C. 350)
People travel to wonder at the height of the mountains, at the huge waves of the seas, at the long course of the rivers, at the vast compass of the ocean, at the circular motion of the stars, and yet they pass by themselves without wondering.
--St. Augustine of Hippo
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waterbuffalo
Thanks, JJ. Those are wonderful!
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T-Bone
Great, Java Jane ! I don't think they're corny. I really like these!
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JavaJane
You are welcome! I really enjoyed those, too!
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Kit Sober
Interesting.
A few days ago I came across a couple of pictures of me before the heartache, before twi. I hung them up on the wall to remind me that there was a life before (and again).
Nice to see and be reminded of the life I had before.
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Ham
Thanks White Dove..
I remember seeing an interview with Robert Plant. He said something to the effect of "we were just a bunch of young punks who stole the blues.."
What is interesting though...
after leaving der vey, my musical interests took up just where they left off..
maybe that's part of the authentic self..
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Shifra
Nice thread!
I tried a lot of things to rediscover myself after TWI. A lot of it didn't work; for example going to church didn't work, and attempting to organize other ex-way folks into a fellowship didn't work either.
Here are some things that actually DID help me, although I'm still working on it:
1. Throw away the Bible you used in TWI. Get a different translation, and definitely do not copy your old notes into your new Bible.
2. Get rid of those old TWI books. E-bay is a good way to do this, and make money at the same time. Dump the Way Mags, the name tags, the jargon, and maybe even the dental floss.
3. Change the way you pray. Stop "thanking" God for everything you want. Instead just ask Him, including asking Him for help in recovering from the cult. In other words, don't say, "Thank you Father for giving me enough money to pay my bills". Just say, "God help me get my bills paid please". It's amazing how when you talk to God in a normal genuine way, it somehow makes you normal and genuine in the process.
4. Quite by accident, I began investigating my Family Tree. Oh how wonderful !! This was fun, and at the same time gave me a fresh and deep sense of who I am, and where I came from.
5. Try to remember what made you happy, really happy, before the days of TWI. Then do this thing.
6. Get professional help. This is not an insult. Before you select a therapist, ask them on the phone if they have ever worked with ex-cult members. If not, they might be able to make a good referral. Be sure to get someone who has this experience. At this point in my life, I am not at all embarrassed to reveal that I see a therapist regularly. In fact, I'm proud of it.
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HCW
Great post Shrifra.
...because the TWI lingo is one of the greatest ways they keep hold of people.I still have the Bible I used in TWI, but I use a different one on a daily basis. I think that after one is free, looking back at the old Bible and the notes, etc. confirms just how controlled you were.
Using a different translation helps SOO much in scraping TWI lingo from one's life.
I think that one of the last steps in becoming really free is to know in detail how one was controlled and what it was that made me personally suceptable.
Fool me once - shame on you - - fool me twice... its MY fault.
I dropped EVERYTHING from my life that had anything to do w/TWI for several years I even limited time spent w/very good friends from TWI. Even friends who also left TWI, my friendship w/them was a direct tie between me & TWI. Even when I did see friends it was NEVER at a Bible study meeting. I stripped TWI from those relationships too. If I couldn't hang w/them around non-TWI stuff, I'd not hang w/them at all. I even stopped going to church, reading & studying my Bible all together.
I figured that God was either real, or He isn't, IF HE did, in fact, live in me, then he WOULD live in me and that He would guide my steps. There are SOOO many psychological triggers in all of that TWI stuff.
I used to think that TWI was a good thing gone bad. No more, now I see it as a bad thing that had some good people associated w/it. All of the good was what good people brought TO TWI, not something that emanated FROM w/in TWI.
"A good tree yields good fruit, a bad tree yields bad fruit."
"By their fruit, you shall know them."
The "Thank you father..." stuff is a big part of the lingo - the control. If one still prays that way, you choose to align yourself w/TWI and are still under their control in that respect."Normal & genuine" is the goal, feels great to be "normal" doesn't it. The TWI mindset - at best - is passive aggressive. At worst - - well, we've seen the worst, right?
None of us "are" TWI or came from TWI, even those of us who were born into it. I have a daughter (now 20yrs old) who was born into TWI. She is as normal, as one can be, even though she grew up in NK and went through school, k-12 @ NK school. She maintained(s) relationships w/her family (non wafers), as I do.
No one in their right mind talks and acts the way that TWI people do. Yes, I AM saying that people who act as wafers are out of their minds. Truthfully, looking back, I was out of my mind back then, even though I thought I wasn't and functioned normally and excelled in many areas of my life. I was insane in every area that I let them control me.
I worked really hard while in TWI not to use a lot of the jargon, but still used some - - IT is crazy. Were it a normal part of Godly Christianity, why is it that basically NOBODY else in the Christian world uses it?
Hmmmm.......
Even if you don't know or can't remember... you know what makes you happy NOW. DO some of it.Just within the last year or so, I've totally let go of the "God first, others second, myself third" concept that TWI pushes. Doing some non-TWI influenced Bible study, I discovered that a BIG part of tithing is a tithe to YOURSELF!!!
True Christian service REQUIRES that the one serving others serve himself enough so that he has enough available to give to others. "...but rather let him labor, doing good profitable work so that he has enough to give to others...." is what Romans 5:28 is really saying. Jesus said that they way we treat people is how we serve him.
Treating YOURSELF right is the FIRST responsibility we have in treating "PEOPLE." We ARE people, friends.
Go ahead, treat yourself to a movie & let the untility co. wait a couple of weeks to get the rest of "their" money. I went through a period where my $$$ was REALLY tight. I stopped suffering by giving companies "all" my money, gave them SOME, & gave me some.
The little things I gave myself w/the SOME $$$ make me a much happier guy. Then I realized that I was giving them $$$ "of necessity." I've become a "cheerful giver" in paying my bills, use some of the tithe I pay to myself & "have some to give to him that has needs" (which makes me feel GREAT, cause I get a real kick out of helping people).
AND. Blessings have been dropping out of the sky.
Hmmm..... maybe I'm becoming an actually Godly fellow??? Eventually, as time went on I found that having a desire to know God was a part of ME. I had a growing desire to study the Bible and now do it as I feel like doing it and no longer feel GUILTY if a day or two or more goes by and I don't open the book.
He loves me anyway.
Don't see a therapist regularly anymore (maybe I should :blink: ) but I did. AND I've been mentored through a program we have @ the church I attend now, and have done other similar stuff. Helps. Even if you don't necessarily do the full fledged, ( I was a teenage cultist, counseling thing) thing, talking with someone who NEVER had ANYTHING to do w/TWI is SO helpful. They get a "how could you ever have thought like that" look on their face when you talk about some things that helps shock a person back to reality.
Ain't no shame in seein' a therapist. We should all do it for a while at least.
Shifra, your post is a good "Six step program" to answer the how do I get free from TWI, the cult thing. Just wanted to add a "this is what it did for me" perspective.
Thanks.
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doojable
This was some of the most important stuff I learned after leaving!
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T-Bone
A common factor I find running through a lot of these posts is a simple thing of acknowledging the authentic self. When making a decision, when formulating an opinion, when reflecting on an experience – it's asking "what do I think?" Rascal's post resonated with me. Joining TWI as a young man - I was thinking how in so many aspects it was like transferring parental supervision from mom and dad to that organization. My decisions, opinions, viewpoint, etc. revolved around TWI's way of thinking. TWI's intellectual standards, decision-making criteria, agendas, priorities, etc. became the artificial self – this overshadowed the authentic self.
"What do I think? What do I want? What do I feel? What is important to me?" Simple questions – yes. But difficult for someone who for so long focused on what other folks thought, what other folks wanted, what pleased other folks. And it feels scary at first – because it feels so selfish. That's because we accepted the artificial self as real – it was viewed as good, "righteous", trustworthy, true…and the authentic self was looked upon as bad, "sinful", unreliable, deceitful, fake.
At first, it can take a lot of time as you wade through every detail of an idea or decision. There were feelings very similar to when I first left home – away from mom and dad – feeling the weight of responsibility, the dilemma of priorities, ferreting out all options, exploring personal preferences, determining criteria for validity, etc. … growing pains…flexing your wings…taking flight…freedom! Feeling like your old self again? Whatever that is - don't think I can remember that far back
…it just feels natural...it feels so right!
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TheHighWay
Excellent points, Tbone!!
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Shifra
T-Bone -
What you wrote was wonderful !! I have heard it said that ...
"There's a difference between being CENTERED and being SELF-CENTERED".
And you are right, this is a very difficult thing to re-learn after TWI.
Shifra.
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