I remember Bob Stanley's music. I thought he had a powerful ministry for music. Some of his songs, especially "Welcome To The Family"....it just get's you right there every time.
Bob sang that song at my wedding..I helped undershepard him..His music is not allowed to be played in the way since 90's..btw,LM, he lived in Tampa the last I heard..
I think that "America Awakes" by Joyful noise was an excellant album...I think that Good Seed and Pressed down were talented and had several really good songs...
For the most part, I think that singers, musicians and song writers were in an environment that discouraged straying from the "spiritual guidelines" that were imposed upon their creative skills...IMHO, Wierwille had too much control over the whole process and conforming to his views were always the criteria...
OK.. but when did you leave?? Bob Stanley you say?? The name isn't even familiar to me because he came after I left I'm guessing. Likeaneagle sez the '90's. 'Splains it for me!
Sudo - Bob Stanley had Acts29 I believe and they had more of a rock sound that was supposed to appeal to the younger crowd at the time. I was in Houston in the early '80's when his group and Takit became popular in the ministry.
In my opinion, VPW and LCM had no business trying to direct artists. They had no training and they had no taste. I heard rant after rant by LCM about how daVinci was overrated.
I left a long time ago so my memories are of the early stuff. (both live at ROA and recorded)
Stuff like PDST, Selah, Cookin' Mama, Paul Vergilio, Tom Lepinski, Barry McCoy,Timothy, Hope, Good Seed.
Didn't Dave Brubeck play at the ROA one year? I think either he or his daughter had taken the class.
There was a group in Cleveland that really kicked some butt too but left when their music was deemed too vague.
At least that was the reason I had heard.
I think they were called Jubal(like the first musician)
All these groups had one thing in common, they were self governing and had room for artistic expression.
Don't get me wrong, I think Joyful Noise and Branded , etc. had some great talent. But, it became clear that they were following orders that were being called in from the sidelines.
I myself was in a little group as part of the Fellowlaborers program. One night at rehearsal, the limb leader, who didn't have any musical background that I am aware of, criticized the way we held our mics. and showed us the "proper" way to hold a microphone. Kinda ticked me off because I had been in the Musicians Union for about 10 years at that point and was pretty sure I knew the correct way to hold a mic. But, who was I to question a MOG?
waysider...That's exactly what I'm talking about...every limb leader felt obligated to "oversee" the musicians in their state (else they feel the wrath of the MOG above them)...and most of them were clueless...they were trying to emulate the way VeePee micromanaged Way Productions...they "spiritualized" it and suddenly they were experts on music...
In the meantime, the artists were being "taught" how to make their music "twi digestible"...and of course, individual creativity was smothered.
I'd like to hear what Socks has to say on this subject...
I remember when there was a study done about color and music. All of a sudden LCM was an expert on painting. Good Gawd! What a mess!
It was during this time that it was announced that Martindale was coming to town to speak and we began preparing...
We put together a "do" for about 500 people...the room was filled to capacity when king okie came out and started teaching us all about "colors"...it was embarrassing...all I could think was "this guys off his rocker"...
...later on, I discovered that he was indeed off his rocker.
It was during this time that it was announced that Martindale was coming to town to speak and we began preparing...
We put together a "do" for about 500 people...the room was filled to capacity when king okie came out and started teaching us all about "colors"...it was embarrassing...all I could think was "this guys off his rocker"...
...later on, I discovered that he was indeed off his rocker.
King Okie teaching about color would be the equivalent of Helen Keller teaching on How to Cut Hair.
Way Prod was a fiasco from day one. vp micromanaging it was an understatement. Every song's lyrics had to be editted and approved by him personally. You wouldn't believe (or maybe you would) how he ruined so many great songs. There were some incredibly proficient writers, and writings, that were crushed and castrated by vp's iron hand. He really believed he was THE authority on music and showmanship.
In reality, he was a complete boob and embarrassed himself regularly by "running" rehearsals (while sipping Drambuie and sucking down Camel shorties). The level of musicianship was amazing, but he kept it surpressed...except the few he personally prefered (who were, of course, "spiritually" on the ball).
Always pointing fingers at performers moving the wrong way, or playing too much, and screaming about how he was wasting his time on out-of-fellowship idiots, and how we wouldn't stand a chance out in the world with talent like that. There was so much fear of vp's "reproof" in Way Prod that it's a wonder that anyone could take the stage at all. Even Saturday Nite Doos were stiff and robotic...at least until he got "loose as a goose" on the booze and didn't pay any attention to the band.
Way Prod was a fiasco from day one. vp micromanaging it was an understatement. Every song's lyrics had to be editted and approved by him personally. You wouldn't believe (or maybe you would) how he ruined so many great songs. There were some incredibly proficient writers, and writings, that were crushed and castrated by vp's iron hand. He really believed he was THE authority on music and showmanship.
Way Prod. did several of my songs. I saw that first hand. They ruined them all. They castrated the lyrics and the melody.
Hey waysider - that chill in the air is hell defrosting - saw Tommy T and Preston T a week ago, and their band. They're doing so well and it was great to see them. It had been way too long, believe me, missed those guys over the years. Jammed together on a tune. It was a real pleasure. e - me if you get a sec. :)
OK.. but when did you leave?? Bob Stanley you say?? The name isn't even familiar to me because he came after I left I'm guessing. Likeaneagle sez the '90's. 'Splains it for me!
In 1988, Acts 29's FOURTH album was in the twi bookstore, and was almost certainly
released in the past 2 years.
If it was released in 1988, and they had released all 4 one a year,
the first would have been released in 1985.
I suspect it was released a little earlier.
The albums are, in order: "Acts 29", by Bob Stanley,
"Ready for Anything", by Bob Stanley and Acts 29,
"It's Hot", by Acts 29.
"God First," by Acts 29.
I never got a 5th album from them, and am unsure there WAS a 5th
album. I know there were newer songs, or at least 1: "Real Life."
It may never have been released on an album.
The first album had as much of a country feel as a folk rock feel.
The second was soft rock-folk rock.
The last 2 were rock through and through.
(I can still hear the opening guitar riff on the song "It's Hot".)
Breakthrough had released their third about 1989-1990, and,
AFAIK, it was carried at Gartmore but not at hq.
Their list was "Breakthrough", "A Thought Away", and "On Track".
When hq did their music challenge, the title track "A Thought Away" was
one of the songs entered.
Of course, there were also LOTS of musicians who released albums while
in the ministry, and you could buy them at an ROA if you kept your eyes
open while walking around. I bought a BUNCH of those.
Way Prod was a fiasco from day one. vp micromanaging it was an understatement. Every song's lyrics had to be editted and approved by him personally. You wouldn't believe (or maybe you would) how he ruined so many great songs. There were some incredibly proficient writers, and writings, that were crushed and castrated by vp's iron hand. He really believed he was THE authority on music and showmanship.
In reality, he was a complete boob and embarrassed himself regularly by "running" rehearsals (while sipping Drambuie and sucking down Camel shorties). The level of musicianship was amazing, but he kept it surpressed...except the few he personally prefered (who were, of course, "spiritually" on the ball).
Always pointing fingers at performers moving the wrong way, or playing too much, and screaming about how he was wasting his time on out-of-fellowship idiots, and how we wouldn't stand a chance out in the world with talent like that. There was so much fear of vp's "reproof" in Way Prod that it's a wonder that anyone could take the stage at all. Even Saturday Nite Doos were stiff and robotic...at least until he got "loose as a goose" on the booze and didn't pay any attention to the band.
OK, I'm done venting for now.
Almost forgot, I was in from '73 'till '86.
One of our corps posters said vpw told them once that he'd originally considered three fields
of endeavour to enter:
ministry
music/entertainment
business
It was also commented that he managed to shoehorn in all 3 eventually.
Since vpw was a musician in high school, and could play a guitar,
he apparently felt qualified to run the musical arm of twi.
He had already learned, back in his radio show days
(if Mrs W's book "Born Again to Serve" can be believed)
that youngsters doing music could interest other youngsters,
Personally,...... and it is very personal to me...... I do love their early music very very much! I feel very alone in this, but I have stood alone before...so I know how to do it! Even if some of the lyrics need rightly dividing or whatever you want to call it. I respect their talent, hard work and the heart and soul they put into the music. I see it as their way of teaching a teaching like we all have in Twig or where-ever. I am proud of everything I do with all my heart for God and that's what I hear in their music!
Everyones different, and me being different, I am sure is no shock to anyone. I love music almost all music from the 1920's till now. I don't know why, but each piece of music is as unique to me as each individual is! I hear them all differently and I treat them with all the same love and care.
I treasure where-ever and through whomever I find replacements for our worn out ones or ones we never afforded before.
I can certainly do thank them all for how much they have blessed myself and my son! Music about God is his way to know God and love him back!
"Mommas don't let your babies grow up to be homos,
Don't let 'em wear earings and carry a purse,
Let 'em chase women, drink whiskey and curse".
- Tom Burke
YEE-HAWWWWW!!!! Chase women, drinkin' whiskey and cursin'!! I wonder if LCM helped Tom write that song. Can you actually imagine Billy Graham selling music at his crusades with such lyrics??? How blind I was. Duhhhhhhhhhhh.
I think "It's Hot" was released in early to middle 1985, if my memory is correct. I vaguely recall hearing it shortly before I took the Advanced Class. We left (or were booted out) in 1994. And I sure agree with you, Rainbows Girl, a lot of the early music really still blesses my socks off no matter how accurate it may or may not be. We sing songs every Sunday morning that are not 100% accurate, and I am sure that God can manage to overlook whatever errors are there and accept the praise that is meant in everyone's heart. I am reminded of the song "Rock and Roll Heaven". Maybe that can be paraphrased to include some of the believer musicians in the 'one he!! of a band".
"Mommas don't let your babies grow up to be homos,
Don't let 'em wear earings and carry a purse,
Let 'em chase women, drink whiskey and curse".
- Tom Burke
YEE-HAWWWWW!!!! Chase women, drinkin' whiskey and cursin'!! I wonder if LCM helped Tom write that song. Can you actually imagine Billy Graham selling music at his crusades with such lyrics??? How blind I was. Duhhhhhhhhhhh.
I'm going to assume you know that this is a take-off of "Mamas Don't Let Your Babies Grow Up to Be Cowboys" by Willie Nelson.
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Lone Wolf McQuade
I remember Bob Stanley's music. I thought he had a powerful ministry for music. Some of his songs, especially "Welcome To The Family"....it just get's you right there every time.
:-)
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likeaneagle
Bob sang that song at my wedding..I helped undershepard him..His music is not allowed to be played in the way since 90's..btw,LM, he lived in Tampa the last I heard..
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GrouchoMarxJr
What do I remember about the music?...
I think that "America Awakes" by Joyful noise was an excellant album...I think that Good Seed and Pressed down were talented and had several really good songs...
For the most part, I think that singers, musicians and song writers were in an environment that discouraged straying from the "spiritual guidelines" that were imposed upon their creative skills...IMHO, Wierwille had too much control over the whole process and conforming to his views were always the criteria...
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Sudo
Lonewolf,
OK.. but when did you leave?? Bob Stanley you say?? The name isn't even familiar to me because he came after I left I'm guessing. Likeaneagle sez the '90's. 'Splains it for me!
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doojable
Sudo - Bob Stanley had Acts29 I believe and they had more of a rock sound that was supposed to appeal to the younger crowd at the time. I was in Houston in the early '80's when his group and Takit became popular in the ministry.
In my opinion, VPW and LCM had no business trying to direct artists. They had no training and they had no taste. I heard rant after rant by LCM about how daVinci was overrated.
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likeaneagle
sudo check your f drive in a few
top row right
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Nottawayfer
I remember Bob Stanley and Acts 29. They had a really rockin' album in 1984.
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waysider
I left a long time ago so my memories are of the early stuff. (both live at ROA and recorded)
Stuff like PDST, Selah, Cookin' Mama, Paul Vergilio, Tom Lepinski, Barry McCoy,Timothy, Hope, Good Seed.
Didn't Dave Brubeck play at the ROA one year? I think either he or his daughter had taken the class.
There was a group in Cleveland that really kicked some butt too but left when their music was deemed too vague.
At least that was the reason I had heard.
I think they were called Jubal(like the first musician)
All these groups had one thing in common, they were self governing and had room for artistic expression.
Don't get me wrong, I think Joyful Noise and Branded , etc. had some great talent. But, it became clear that they were following orders that were being called in from the sidelines.
I myself was in a little group as part of the Fellowlaborers program. One night at rehearsal, the limb leader, who didn't have any musical background that I am aware of, criticized the way we held our mics. and showed us the "proper" way to hold a microphone. Kinda ticked me off because I had been in the Musicians Union for about 10 years at that point and was pretty sure I knew the correct way to hold a mic. But, who was I to question a MOG?
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GrouchoMarxJr
waysider...That's exactly what I'm talking about...every limb leader felt obligated to "oversee" the musicians in their state (else they feel the wrath of the MOG above them)...and most of them were clueless...they were trying to emulate the way VeePee micromanaged Way Productions...they "spiritualized" it and suddenly they were experts on music...
In the meantime, the artists were being "taught" how to make their music "twi digestible"...and of course, individual creativity was smothered.
I'd like to hear what Socks has to say on this subject...
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doojable
I remember when there was a study done about color and music. All of a sudden LCM was an expert on painting. Good Gawd! What a mess!
I was a professional picture framer and P*t L*nn tried to tell me that I didn't know what I was doing....
And then there was that fiasco "Athletes of the Spirit".......
Is it any wonder that the music went downhill?
It would be the equivalent of me trying to tell a brain surgeon how to do his job....
Well - at least I know what a brain is and where it belongs.
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GrouchoMarxJr
It was during this time that it was announced that Martindale was coming to town to speak and we began preparing...
We put together a "do" for about 500 people...the room was filled to capacity when king okie came out and started teaching us all about "colors"...it was embarrassing...all I could think was "this guys off his rocker"...
...later on, I discovered that he was indeed off his rocker.
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doojable
King Okie teaching about color would be the equivalent of Helen Keller teaching on How to Cut Hair.
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Listener
Way Prod was a fiasco from day one. vp micromanaging it was an understatement. Every song's lyrics had to be editted and approved by him personally. You wouldn't believe (or maybe you would) how he ruined so many great songs. There were some incredibly proficient writers, and writings, that were crushed and castrated by vp's iron hand. He really believed he was THE authority on music and showmanship.
In reality, he was a complete boob and embarrassed himself regularly by "running" rehearsals (while sipping Drambuie and sucking down Camel shorties). The level of musicianship was amazing, but he kept it surpressed...except the few he personally prefered (who were, of course, "spiritually" on the ball).
Always pointing fingers at performers moving the wrong way, or playing too much, and screaming about how he was wasting his time on out-of-fellowship idiots, and how we wouldn't stand a chance out in the world with talent like that. There was so much fear of vp's "reproof" in Way Prod that it's a wonder that anyone could take the stage at all. Even Saturday Nite Doos were stiff and robotic...at least until he got "loose as a goose" on the booze and didn't pay any attention to the band.
OK, I'm done venting for now.
Almost forgot, I was in from '73 'till '86.
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polar bear
Way Prod. did several of my songs. I saw that first hand. They ruined them all. They castrated the lyrics and the melody.
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JavaJane
Vague? What?
Oh... Do you mean that they didn't use enough of the approved words?
Maybe they didn't prevail tremendously in the promised land of the triumphant victory while living sanctified?
PREVAIL!!
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doojable
I'm gonna throw up now.......
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JavaJane
ABUNDANCE!!!
(sorry, Tourette's is acting up again....)
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socks
Hey waysider - that chill in the air is hell defrosting - saw Tommy T and Preston T a week ago, and their band. They're doing so well and it was great to see them. It had been way too long, believe me, missed those guys over the years. Jammed together on a tune. It was a real pleasure. e - me if you get a sec. :)
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WordWolf
In 1988, Acts 29's FOURTH album was in the twi bookstore, and was almost certainly
released in the past 2 years.
If it was released in 1988, and they had released all 4 one a year,
the first would have been released in 1985.
I suspect it was released a little earlier.
The albums are, in order: "Acts 29", by Bob Stanley,
"Ready for Anything", by Bob Stanley and Acts 29,
"It's Hot", by Acts 29.
"God First," by Acts 29.
I never got a 5th album from them, and am unsure there WAS a 5th
album. I know there were newer songs, or at least 1: "Real Life."
It may never have been released on an album.
The first album had as much of a country feel as a folk rock feel.
The second was soft rock-folk rock.
The last 2 were rock through and through.
(I can still hear the opening guitar riff on the song "It's Hot".)
Breakthrough had released their third about 1989-1990, and,
AFAIK, it was carried at Gartmore but not at hq.
Their list was "Breakthrough", "A Thought Away", and "On Track".
When hq did their music challenge, the title track "A Thought Away" was
one of the songs entered.
Of course, there were also LOTS of musicians who released albums while
in the ministry, and you could buy them at an ROA if you kept your eyes
open while walking around. I bought a BUNCH of those.
That's how I got Tom Burke's second album,
"A Fistful of Scriptures."
("Chuck Norris, Clint Eastwood, Sylvester Stallone....")
One of our corps posters said vpw told them once that he'd originally considered three fields
of endeavour to enter:
ministry
music/entertainment
business
It was also commented that he managed to shoehorn in all 3 eventually.
Since vpw was a musician in high school, and could play a guitar,
he apparently felt qualified to run the musical arm of twi.
He had already learned, back in his radio show days
(if Mrs W's book "Born Again to Serve" can be believed)
that youngsters doing music could interest other youngsters,
at least a little.
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RainbowsGirl
Personally,...... and it is very personal to me...... I do love their early music very very much! I feel very alone in this, but I have stood alone before...so I know how to do it! Even if some of the lyrics need rightly dividing or whatever you want to call it. I respect their talent, hard work and the heart and soul they put into the music. I see it as their way of teaching a teaching like we all have in Twig or where-ever. I am proud of everything I do with all my heart for God and that's what I hear in their music!
Everyones different, and me being different, I am sure is no shock to anyone. I love music almost all music from the 1920's till now. I don't know why, but each piece of music is as unique to me as each individual is! I hear them all differently and I treat them with all the same love and care.
I treasure where-ever and through whomever I find replacements for our worn out ones or ones we never afforded before.
I can certainly do thank them all for how much they have blessed myself and my son! Music about God is his way to know God and love him back!
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Lone Wolf McQuade
"Mommas don't let your babies grow up to be homos,
Don't let 'em wear earings and carry a purse,
Let 'em chase women, drink whiskey and curse".
- Tom Burke
YEE-HAWWWWW!!!! Chase women, drinkin' whiskey and cursin'!! I wonder if LCM helped Tom write that song. Can you actually imagine Billy Graham selling music at his crusades with such lyrics??? How blind I was. Duhhhhhhhhhhh.
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Jeaniam
I think "It's Hot" was released in early to middle 1985, if my memory is correct. I vaguely recall hearing it shortly before I took the Advanced Class. We left (or were booted out) in 1994. And I sure agree with you, Rainbows Girl, a lot of the early music really still blesses my socks off no matter how accurate it may or may not be. We sing songs every Sunday morning that are not 100% accurate, and I am sure that God can manage to overlook whatever errors are there and accept the praise that is meant in everyone's heart. I am reminded of the song "Rock and Roll Heaven". Maybe that can be paraphrased to include some of the believer musicians in the 'one he!! of a band".
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WordWolf
My guess is that he requested such a song.
We know he was at least slightly involved, since he introduces the album.
Tom, meanwhile, doesn't play that song anymore, but he does play others,
like
"Lord may I always be true to that call,
I want to be part of your story,
And Lord may I serve you with all of my all,
Till I stand before you in glory."
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doojable
I'm going to assume you know that this is a take-off of "Mamas Don't Let Your Babies Grow Up to Be Cowboys" by Willie Nelson.
Or is my assumption wrong?
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