Yes I mean if something really took place. I believe fact is physical truth, and truth is spiritual fact. Not that I am doubting any of the stories. I know what I have done myself to others for sex and general debauchery. So I have no problem believing the worst in people because that is the nature of things.
I never really saw anything wrong with using someone to the fullest extent possible. Especially when they were so easily taken advantage of. I mean really, it was like shooting fish in a barrel.
It meant nothing to me if someone got hurt in my rampages. I wouldn't lose any sleep over it.
Does a snake feel guilty for eating a mouse? A crime is a crime though and should be punished.
The truth is what it is, true. Of course the thing that you may conclude to be true I may think a lie or visa versa. We both could be wrong or one of us could be right. But there is truth just as sure as there are lies.
To men facts are true but to God the truth is a fact. When I say truth I am referring to the eternal. For example: infinity is a truth, distance is a fact. Eternity is a truth, time is a fact. Truth just like fact is either accurate or inaccurate, correct or incorrect.
If I say to you I believe the very idea of instituting an establishment of religion is evil unless God instructs you to do it. I fully believe that statement is true but my believing it does not affect the reality of it. It still may not be true or accurate. Nevertheless I believe it is true, therefore I say so.
Nothing is lost or gained in us agreeing because it does not matter except in emotional terms. So the issue of truth in beliefs is only an issue between a man and his God individually.
If I sound like I know the truth it is because I believe I do, not necessarily because I do. But every individual can be soundly persuaded in his or her own heart that they do know the truth even if they are wrong. This was the case with VPW and his idea to start a secular ministry.
early, i think i understand some of what you are saying and agree
i do want to ask about one thing....
quote:I never really saw anything wrong with using someone to the fullest extent possible. Especially when they were so easily taken advantage of. I mean really, it was like shooting fish in a barrel.
It meant nothing to me if someone got hurt in my rampages. I wouldn't lose any sleep over it.
"when i initially posted something negative about wierwille at the start of waydale, i got blasted to smitherines. and when i talked about sexual abuse....ohmygod. some people said very cruel things"
Yep, I got blasted too a few times on Waydale by some "wierwillites" who would attack anyone if you dared say anything nagative about "Their father in the word". Rev2 comes to mind, remember him?
Anyway when I said "But I also feel that people should hear the truth." I primarily meant erroneous doctrines as taught by VPW.
Ex, I love your humor, and your posts are always a must read for me, just wanted you to know that. And I certainly don't expect you or anyone else to witness or undershepard here. I hope I didn't give you that impression.
[This message was edited by Outin88! on January 05, 2004 at 23:48.]
early, i think i understand some of what you are saying and agree
i do want to ask about one thing....
do you feel that way now ?
?
ExC,
No I do NOT. Nobody is going to survive life we all die or will at the least be changed. I am no exception. Although on a purely survival level I would say do what you want to whomever you want to do it to because you don't get another shot at being the one on top.
Your interests are just that yours not mine. And if I have the power to make you do what I want I will use it. On a purely survival level.
However like I said there is no surviving life for anyone so what is the point of being on top or bottom, master or slave. You live today and tomorrow you die. As a human I have the ability to conclude that there is more to life than what can be seen. Because of this fact I can hope and if there is hope for me then there is hope for others also.
Hope for the things of tomorrow has replaced the pointless desires for the things of today. But I am no fool this is not the case for the majority of people who only live for today and what their hand can lay hold to. Anyone who trusts their fellow man is an idiot. Trust God and you will see man for what he is, lost.
Hi Ex, REV2 had a picture of Beavis and used to get into arguments with Groucho Marx, Evan and others that said less then perfect things about VPW.
Anyway, he stopped posting after a while, I think when CFF gave him a job or somthing, but after a year of posting, to his credit, he acknowledged VPW had some sin problems.
But he was one of many "wierwillites" on Waydale, he's just one that I recall.
Fence...good point there were many many of us that were *advised* to get abortions.
It was considered an egregious sin to let anything interfere with your ability to serve God.
You are right we never thought of it as a form of abuse....but then one day years and years later ...you wake up stunned at what you did in the name of God.
Though you were bullied into it....though you know that you were left with no options if you loved God....the guilt is consuming...when eventually it dawns on you...you know what YOU did and you know that you can never fix it.
Most of us try to make ourselves forget that it ever happened....try to pretend it was no *biggie* like the mogs said ...just some cells that hadn`t oughtta be there...parasites
After a while you know better... it is a shame...a personal loathing that never quite goes away.
So yeah ....though I didnt realise it at the time.....you could consider it as a form of abuse....a betrayal of trust....These people used the invocation of God`s name and his word to induce us into behavior that was amoral as well as personally abhorrant ... but yet we swallowed our revulsion and complied because we loved God and wanted to be pleasing to him.
Geo Amen and Amen....if only they could see how their sacrid doctrines is yet another form of idolotry.
quote:please anyone don't get me wrong when i say this -- because i DEFINITELY believe in putting yourself in another person's shoes and treating them as you would like to be treated --
but i do not feel obligated to witness or undershepherd here at greasespot
i hope that makes sense
She is right. Speak what happened, clear the air of the lies and let people figure it out. We have no obligation to undershepherd here.
I hope they get it and feel for them as well...
Her post made perfect and balanced sense. Many times we have said things like "I used to feel that way." "I was you." "I would have not believed it if it did not happened to me..." Then, we go on to share things and are jumped.
Things we know should be shared. I hope it helps people. I also, at one time, loved Weirwille as the MOG for the world, I defended him to my family, neighbors, church people and friends. I do understand, but what happened happened.
Amen and Amen. You just described what happened to me and my only child.
Only, I still believe that the shame will be dealt with one day once and for all whether here on earth or, for sure, when we see the Lord face to face, because, I'm convinced his love will finally wash it away (one place or the other) for good.
Recommended Posts
Top Posters In This Topic
27
17
20
16
Popular Days
Jan 2
45
Jan 7
41
Jan 5
37
Jan 4
33
Top Posters In This Topic
excathedra 27 posts
Dot Matrix 17 posts
early2it 20 posts
J0nny Ling0 16 posts
Popular Days
Jan 2 2004
45 posts
Jan 7 2004
41 posts
Jan 5 2004
37 posts
Jan 4 2004
33 posts
excathedra
?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
ex10
ohmigosh
Johnny Lingo, do you know how to check your private topics? I started a private topic with you....
Link to comment
Share on other sites
early2it
ExC
Yes I mean if something really took place. I believe fact is physical truth, and truth is spiritual fact. Not that I am doubting any of the stories. I know what I have done myself to others for sex and general debauchery. So I have no problem believing the worst in people because that is the nature of things.
Continued on next post.....
Link to comment
Share on other sites
early2it
I never really saw anything wrong with using someone to the fullest extent possible. Especially when they were so easily taken advantage of. I mean really, it was like shooting fish in a barrel.
It meant nothing to me if someone got hurt in my rampages. I wouldn't lose any sleep over it.
Does a snake feel guilty for eating a mouse? A crime is a crime though and should be punished.
Continued on next post.....
Link to comment
Share on other sites
early2it
The truth is what it is, true. Of course the thing that you may conclude to be true I may think a lie or visa versa. We both could be wrong or one of us could be right. But there is truth just as sure as there are lies.
To men facts are true but to God the truth is a fact. When I say truth I am referring to the eternal. For example: infinity is a truth, distance is a fact. Eternity is a truth, time is a fact. Truth just like fact is either accurate or inaccurate, correct or incorrect.
Continued on next post.....
Link to comment
Share on other sites
early2it
If I say to you I believe the very idea of instituting an establishment of religion is evil unless God instructs you to do it. I fully believe that statement is true but my believing it does not affect the reality of it. It still may not be true or accurate. Nevertheless I believe it is true, therefore I say so.
Nothing is lost or gained in us agreeing because it does not matter except in emotional terms. So the issue of truth in beliefs is only an issue between a man and his God individually.
Continued on next post.....
Link to comment
Share on other sites
early2it
If I sound like I know the truth it is because I believe I do, not necessarily because I do. But every individual can be soundly persuaded in his or her own heart that they do know the truth even if they are wrong. This was the case with VPW and his idea to start a secular ministry.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
excathedra
early, i think i understand some of what you are saying and agree
i do want to ask about one thing....
do you feel that way now ??
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Outin88!
Excathedra said;
"when i initially posted something negative about wierwille at the start of waydale, i got blasted to smitherines. and when i talked about sexual abuse....ohmygod. some people said very cruel things"
Yep, I got blasted too a few times on Waydale by some "wierwillites" who would attack anyone if you dared say anything nagative about "Their father in the word". Rev2 comes to mind, remember him?
Anyway when I said "But I also feel that people should hear the truth." I primarily meant erroneous doctrines as taught by VPW.
Ex, I love your humor, and your posts are always a must read for me, just wanted you to know that. And I certainly don't expect you or anyone else to witness or undershepard here. I hope I didn't give you that impression.
[This message was edited by Outin88! on January 05, 2004 at 23:48.]
Link to comment
Share on other sites
excathedra
no not at all outie !
and thank you.
i cant remember rev2 at the moment. was he related to sunbird ?
?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
early2it
ExC,
No I do NOT. Nobody is going to survive life we all die or will at the least be changed. I am no exception. Although on a purely survival level I would say do what you want to whomever you want to do it to because you don't get another shot at being the one on top.
Your interests are just that yours not mine. And if I have the power to make you do what I want I will use it. On a purely survival level.
Continued on next post.....
Link to comment
Share on other sites
early2it
However like I said there is no surviving life for anyone so what is the point of being on top or bottom, master or slave. You live today and tomorrow you die. As a human I have the ability to conclude that there is more to life than what can be seen. Because of this fact I can hope and if there is hope for me then there is hope for others also.
Hope for the things of tomorrow has replaced the pointless desires for the things of today. But I am no fool this is not the case for the majority of people who only live for today and what their hand can lay hold to. Anyone who trusts their fellow man is an idiot. Trust God and you will see man for what he is, lost.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
excathedra
thanks
:)-->
?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Outin88!
Hi Ex, REV2 had a picture of Beavis and used to get into arguments with Groucho Marx, Evan and others that said less then perfect things about VPW.
Anyway, he stopped posting after a while, I think when CFF gave him a job or somthing, but after a year of posting, to his credit, he acknowledged VPW had some sin problems.
But he was one of many "wierwillites" on Waydale, he's just one that I recall.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
excathedra
glad he got a job ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Don'tFenceMeIn
Hello everyone,
How about the ones who were abused but didn't KNOW that they were abused such as the young girls who were advised to get abortions by clergy.
They weren't gonna tell so how would anyone KNOW or how could they compare notes with anyone else?
Fence
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Zixar
Fence: Good point. Welcome to GSC!
The Secret Signature of the Day has been cancelled by the HTML Police.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Don'tFenceMeIn
Thanks! It's good to see everyone again!
Link to comment
Share on other sites
George Aar
Why don't they get it?
Because they care more about their sacred
"doctrine" than they do about people.
Same thing goes for hard-core communists, environmentalists, or "whole food" nazis.
Idealism is the real problem. When that flourishes, common sense and empathy go out the window...
geo.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
rascal
Fence...good point there were many many of us that were *advised* to get abortions.
It was considered an egregious sin to let anything interfere with your ability to serve God.
You are right we never thought of it as a form of abuse....but then one day years and years later ...you wake up stunned at what you did in the name of God.
Though you were bullied into it....though you know that you were left with no options if you loved God....the guilt is consuming...when eventually it dawns on you...you know what YOU did and you know that you can never fix it.
Most of us try to make ourselves forget that it ever happened....try to pretend it was no *biggie* like the mogs said ...just some cells that hadn`t oughtta be there...parasites
After a while you know better... it is a shame...a personal loathing that never quite goes away.
So yeah ....though I didnt realise it at the time.....you could consider it as a form of abuse....a betrayal of trust....These people used the invocation of God`s name and his word to induce us into behavior that was amoral as well as personally abhorrant ... but yet we swallowed our revulsion and complied because we loved God and wanted to be pleasing to him.
Geo Amen and Amen....if only they could see how their sacrid doctrines is yet another form of idolotry.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Dot Matrix
johnny
I am glad you had the sense to leave the sewing room...
That should have never taken place...
Makes me think of the old what would Jesus do?
Ya think he would have thought that was a great example of God's clergy?
You did the right thing.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
diazbro
George Aar said:
Same thing goes for hard-core communists, environmentalists, or "whole food" nazis.
>>
Man there are a couple of hard core health
food stores in my area and from what I can
see they do quite well given that their markup
is outrageous though the customers don't seem
to mind paying triple the cost for "organic"
bananas.
Anyway I'm not here to debate the
merits of "whole foods" living but I can
definitely support the idea that "whole
foods nazis" exist. I usually call them
"yeasty people". Sterotypically one thinks
that these people are sedate, peaceful
people when it seems to be the exact opposite.
I've seen fights at these places , people
verbally abusing each other over whose
master is the best, religious wars about
buddhism vs agnosticism, people claiming
that all food is tainted with chemicals
placed by the government.
I understand that there are some excellent
examples of healthy living and that eating
well is important. But just don't expect to
find many of these good examples at the
health food stores - at least in my area.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Dot Matrix
BTW EX
Said
She is right. Speak what happened, clear the air of the lies and let people figure it out. We have no obligation to undershepherd here.
I hope they get it and feel for them as well...
Her post made perfect and balanced sense. Many times we have said things like "I used to feel that way." "I was you." "I would have not believed it if it did not happened to me..." Then, we go on to share things and are jumped.
Things we know should be shared. I hope it helps people. I also, at one time, loved Weirwille as the MOG for the world, I defended him to my family, neighbors, church people and friends. I do understand, but what happened happened.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Don'tFenceMeIn
rascal,
Amen and Amen. You just described what happened to me and my only child.
Only, I still believe that the shame will be dealt with one day once and for all whether here on earth or, for sure, when we see the Lord face to face, because, I'm convinced his love will finally wash it away (one place or the other) for good.
Fence
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.