Tonight, I realized FEAR killed the life I would have had

[doojable]

Bumpy.

Please don't take the Corps and lump them all together. I for one only wore my nametag when I was required to do so.

It's so easy to make snap judgements. I keep trying to remember to take each person as I find them and to do no harm

[Bumpy]

I appreciate what you are saying regarding separating the individual from “the whole” of the Way Corps experience. I accept that, and my viewpoint isn’t to blame any individual. I just addressed the question of who de-railed that particular thread.

Anyway, I would like to move beyond that and ask one question...

How far would VP and The Way International have gotten...IF those in the Way Corps, as individuals AND as a collective organization, had not given him (VP), General Nightingale, and those in power, their complete support and allegiance? Obviously some drank from the fountain more than others, but the question still remains?

Maybe this doesn’t address directly this thread, but it might be something worth discussing? Bump

[doojable]

There were lots of folks that empowered the drunk and his minions. Remember the ROA?

Fear was present at every level. Manipulation was rampant.

[rascal]

I agree Dot, physical death, the threat of a real gun leveled at my head didn`t hold any fear for me.

What was so much worse was the fear and shame....the degredation of possibly becoming posessed. The shame of dissapointing God, maybe of becoming a spiritual contaminant to your brothers and sisters.

This was the weapon used to inforce the insane things that were required of us.

I know that when I was accused of being posessed, the shame was so overwhelming, the fear that if I DID try to contact any one for help that I might infect a beloved family member.... I seriously thought that I ought to remove the spiritual stenche of my posessed self from this world.

I was an 18 yr old kid who was trying with all of my heart to do my very best for God. I didn`t know how or where or when I had allowed myself to become contaminated spiritually, but if this new tc`s wife said it was so...than who the hell was I to think otherwise??

I didn`t want to live without God.

[Dot Matrix]

Rascal-

Did we have similar experiences or what? I know exactly what you are saying.

Act2, Highway and Listner-

Does it feel like you awoke from a very long, almost endless nightmare?

[excathedra]

bumpy i LOVED your joke :wub:

[Dot Matrix]

Yes, Rascal a gun to my head would have been less painful then the tearing at my flesh. And I would have rather been shot than to have hurt anyone, but alas I know that I did.

There were days in TWI a bullet would have been welcomed. Just shoot me, ya know?

Edited March 27, 2007 by Dot Matrix

[Listener]

Dot, yes it does seem like we've had similar experiences. And I'm sure there were many more like us.

I pray they have found relief, in some way, that lets them enjoy life once again.

Freedom from that oppressive fear, no matter how you slice the cake, is wonderful!!

[rascal]

One must consider that we did not become so full of fear over night.

Before twi, I would have never dreamed of being afraid that God couldn`t take care of me, or that satan would kill me, or that my family would suffer and die if I did not follow a certain set of rules.

Blow it in a single area after God knows how many years of striving to cover every base, to leave no doors open...and blammo a family member is dead.

Not obeying leadership was the biggest no no...I was willing to do anything rather than risk their displeasure, because it meant that I wasn`t listening to God either.

It was heartbreaking when ordered to go against our concience and good judgement. It didn`t matter how distastefull or dangerous the *suggestion* was, I was too afraid to go against God to refuse.

We were presented with such a distorted view of God and his requirements...sigh

Listener, yes life is very very good since leaving the fear we lived in while involved with twi.

God has shown himself to be tender and caring beyond most of our wildest expectations. Shame on our teachers for causing us to be so afraid of displeasing him.

Edited March 28, 2007 by rascal

[Listener]

Very true, rascal. Had any of us seen what was hidden behind the godly language, we would have run away screaming. It was a finely tuned system...I'll give them that.

The fear had to be introduced gradually to reap the results they needed. And numbing the conscience was a key factor in making the troups obey...teach them not to listen to the still small voice inside...and if they won't learn, force it on them. If they still won't learn, dump them in the garbage heap.

[act2]

Welcome, Listener. Great comments on this subject. It was so subtle. The thought process etc.

I sometimes would share with my now-hubby things that we believed, and he agreed with most. However, the fear that we had instilled in us was not something that I even realized, so of course, I didn 't share that !!!

Hubby still doesn't realize what The Way International did to many wonderful people, but that is ok. I tell it every chance I get!

Hey, Rascal, keep your thoughts coming as well !!!!!!!!!!

(BTW, we were in Nashville recently to see Alan Jackson at the Grand Ole Opry. I didn't know that you lived close to Nashville.)

[Listener]

Thanks, Act2. (I like your handle, very appropriate)

Yeah, my wife doesn't realize much about the TWI stuff either. I've tried to spare her the gorey details. She does know enough to realize that I got my heart ripped out and handed back to me in the name of love on a few occasions. <_< She's more of a saint than she knows. And the biggness of her heart is awesome. (can you tell i'm sweet on her? )

Thanks for the welcome. This is a nice place to hang out. Here, have a cup on me. :D

[waysider]

Hi Listener

My wife was spared a lot of the nonsense also. When we first met, I still bought into the "can't marry an unbeliever" crap so I had her take the PFAL class. (Really more as a formality loophole than anything else.) Then she took Intermediate and proved that tongues with interpretation and prophesy really can be faked if you put your mind to it. She took a few of the other peripheral classes as well but never really had any desire to become a part of the "ministry". She never had to endure the sleep depravation or isolationism that was often imposed on us in the Fellowlaborers "commune". She was spared the "bootcamp"- like weekends designed to break your spirit, the endless meetings and reproof, and days that seemed to drag on forever. She doesn't understand a lot of how these things had such a lasting effect but she is sympathetic and supportive.(almost 25 years together now)

So here's the question that comes to my mind: Was it the "classes" that had such a profound effect on people or was it the lifestyle we immersed ourselves in? I suppose it was really both but the lifestyle was the key ingredient ,at least for myself.

Also, I just realized that she never was required to "burn her bridges",so to speak, like so many were compelled to do.

I'm pretty sure that enters into the recipe too.

Anyhow, nice to see you here at GSC.

[Listener]

Thanks waysider,

I would have to think the attraction was varied for each individual. I was attracted by the idea of understanding what God's power was, and how to utilize it...like miracles and such. That fascinated me. Of course, I now see that I went to the wrong place to learn about that. TWI wasn't about God's power.

I learned a lot thru those years there. Learning such as.....when you touch the hot stove you learn it hurts like he!! and not to ever do that again. ^_^

I'll never forget those lessons! Some were affected more than others...lots of factors involved, I guess. I thank God for those who got away with barely a scratch. As to the others that suffered more, my heart goes out to them. I pray that they will somehow become whole again and overcome their pain.

Nice to see you, too, my friend.

[rascal]

Thanks a lot act2, I appreciate that. Gosh what a shame to have missed you, I am only an hour away from the grand ole opry. I would have loved to have gotten together for dinner.

I was attracted because God needed me in the spiritual battle. He needed me, it was a chance to do something selfless and grand.

I think that is what chaps my arse the most.. all of the selfless service, that giving, the sacrifice, with all of my soul....rather than benefiting God or mankind.....sigh simply went t fill a mans belly....bah

[Listener]

Yes, it's sad that all that effort and giving seems to have been stolen, but God sees the intents of our heart. Isn't that where the rubber meets the road.

[Dot Matrix]

Did you guys ever think about your parallel life? The life you should be living, the one lost? I do.

I think I would have been successful in the entertainment field as that is the direction I was in -- like a calling from birth. Acting, dancing and other things.

Or I would have been married with kids and have a retirement. I just feel robbed, pushed to live on a road that runs next to the road I should have been on.

You cannot go back to the point it veered right or left, only try to move forward with what one has now. But I feel the road I had, I should have stayed there. OR maybe God in his wisdom saw I would not have “made it” but have been an actress on drugs and TWI was a step up from the life I would have had.

I just wonder, ya know?

[waysider]

Dot----

Your last post connected for me because I, too, gave up what I was trying to build as a career in acting and music in order to become more involved and committed with The Way. I look back sometimes and wonder "What if?". It definately conjures up feelings of remorse and melancholy. But, I guess there are plenty of people in this world who never heard of TWI that do the same thing.The best I can figure is "ya just gotta" enjoy the scenery on the road you're traveling and always keep your eyes alert for any unexpected turns that may lead to an enjoyable side trip. And who knows? Maybe that other road was full of pot holes anyway. We'll never know, at least not in this lifetime.

Waysider

[Ariel]

Dear Dot,

Thanks for sharing your beautiful heart. It also struck a deep chord in my own. I cried, for you, for all of us who had the good with the bad and when we had bad, we were doing what we thought was right by not standing up or leaving.

Love to you always, from GOD!

Ariel

[rascal]

Yes, we endured the bad assuming that was the *virtuous* thing to do, that God required this of us.

How do you think he must felt as we meekly accepted the abuse believing that HE required it of us?

[Dot Matrix]

Thanks all, Waysider, Ariel and Rascal

I am glad you can relate. I sang, danced and am a fab actress (if I do say so myself). From the time I could write I wrote and directed plays that I starred in (of course). I was moving in that direction and two things happened I met the wrong guy and found TWI.

The wrong guy? I think I could haved pushed passed that mistake. Well, I was still checking into soap operas in NYC and then all of a sudden I was in TWI. It was like a wind that blew me off course and I just stayed there.

Yeah, I do think what if?

Edited April 1, 2007 by Dot Matrix

[waterbuffalo]

Dot, hi. Just fyi, not advising or anything, but Sarah Ban Breathnach has written a whole book, practically, on this very topic. It's called Something More, Excavating Your Authentic Self and is a superb read, esp. for over 40s women. It's, imo, mind expanding as well as healing. I found it soothing and accepting, also. You might want to check it out starting with "A Tale of Two Lives" on p.38. :)