They overestimate themselves..

[Bumpy]

Translation: Bumpy needs a hug.

Line forms to the rear.

Bonjour de Senegal,

Le vent est TRES fort aujourd'hui! If I am here, where are you? I need to know where to receive my hug!

I am slowly learning I think how things work, but boy can you me misunderstood here! Is that because some people just want to bash or are they resentful of what you might have to say, or how you say it? I mean, I can make a joke out of almost anything, but then who would take me seriously? You have to maybe be a sports writer to be approved? The question might be, how to connect the brother in Christ thing via this invisible media. It's a bit tricky, don't you think?

Anyway, I think of all these people who have so much Word knowledge that others could use, is this the only or last forum? It really does feel sort of Orwellian. Will the last one on-line, please turn out the lights. Too bad about all the divisions amongst people in the way and twi, and especially all the bad feelings! I enjoyed the Word I heard during those days. Too bad the house is so divided, pains me to see it. After all when we get down to it, we're just people sitting in a small space of time waiting for our expectations to be filled before it's over. Amazing how complicated it's all become.

[Bumpy]

Gut-shot Christians sure know how to fight. And then there's a screenplay from Senegal? Bring it to the Seychelles.

No matter how un-qualified I am to say this, I will anyway...WELCOME to this site! Senegal is far away from you as you know, but is supposed to be so BEAUTIFUL!! Are you living there or on vacation?? I might be in Maputo in a few weeks, for sure Durban. That's getting closer.

Screenplays are fun, reminds me of Jonathan Swift and all his laughs at the expensive of the English. Do you write?

[Ham]

This thread has taken on a disturbing tone.......

I can't put my finger on it - but something isn't right here.

I've know that for years..

kinda like, something's rotten in proverbial Denmark..

Bumpy, here's your hug:

(((((( Bumpy ))))))))

My initial thought was that organizations and/or leadership really overestimate themselves, CES being a good example. Really.. I don't think they can bring new light like hasn't been known since ages past, automatically be able to heal practically anybody who crosses their path, have the Creator's inside skinny on people's lives at a whim, or in general, have a one-size-fits-all walk for the lord, that people are "nuts" not to take up the offer..

But the same thing applies to me. Most of the time, I feel like I'm lucky enough just to take care of myself, and PERHAPS a FEW people around me.

Some people hit the "big time".. but they are few and far between.

[Ham]

"WE have the best package around.."

"WE know da word.."

"WE WE WE."

Pride goes before a fall..

The next generation won't even know who JL IS, or was..

Or MG, or JS.

[Bumpy]

I've know that for years..

kinda like, something's rotten in proverbial Denmark..

Bumpy, here's your hug:

(((((( Bumpy ))))))))

My initial thought was that organizations and/or leadership really overestimate themselves, CES being a good example. Really.. I don't think they can bring new light like hasn't been known since ages past, automatically be able to heal practically anybody who crosses their path, have the Creator's inside skinny on people's lives at a whim, or in general, have a one-size-fits-all walk for the lord, that people are "nuts" not to take up the offer..

But the same thing applies to me. Most of the time, I feel like I'm lucky enough just to take care of myself, and PERHAPS a FEW people around me.

Some people hit the "big time".. but they are few and far between.

But is it possible to design a ("business") structure or system framework in which people can feel comfortable? I am not interested in ages past or great revelation or healing, just a group of people to share the Word with and put a few more verses in my head. I don't know anything about this pp thing at ces and I don't think I want to. But if certain programs were set and the atmosphere relaxed, can people not get together for prayer and share? There is such a strong basis of Biblical knowledge on this site, is it not possible to find an administrative solution to keep the 'bad guys' under control? Too bad if it can't be done, because as I said before, maybe this site is the best we're going to be able to do?

I agree with your other point, most of the time I'm happy just to keep my head on straight too, ESPECIALLY here in Africa. This place can become an Islamic asylum nightmare and anything can go wrong at anytime. In short, the Devil's territory. You cross some of these people and you can kiss your #ss bye bye.

[Ham]

But is it possible to design a ("business") structure or system framework in which people can feel comfortable? I am not interested in ages past or great revelation or healing, just a group of people to share the Word with and put a few more verses in my head.

I don't know. The most meaningful discourses I've had have been with a hand full of people around here- a few on GS, but the most meaningful have been with local people in my community.

My thoughts are that if you take a small work that is really enjoyable, maybe getting some genuine results, hang a sign on it, and try to force it to go "big time", all the rules change.

No longer are you free to give, you are REQUIRED to PERFORM.

Lately, I think small is a good thing..

[Gilligan]

But is it possible to design a ("business") structure or system framework in which people can feel comfortable? I am not interested in ages past or great revelation or healing, just a group of people to share the Word with and put a few more verses in my head. I don't know anything about this pp thing at ces and I don't think I want to. But if certain programs were set and the atmosphere relaxed, can people not get together for prayer and share? There is such a strong basis of Biblical knowledge on this site, is it not possible to find an administrative solution to keep the 'bad guys' under control? Too bad if it can't be done, because as I said before, maybe this site is the best we're going to be able to do?

I agree with your other point, most of the time I'm happy just to keep my head on straight too, ESPECIALLY here in Africa. This place can become an Islamic asylum nightmare and anything can go wrong at anytime. In short, the Devil's territory. You cross some of these people and you can kiss your #ss bye bye.

The problem with any organized religious or community group that has leadership by election and also accepts donations and has a budget - even if it started by really good people it will eventually attract the loud pushy know it all types who want to run it a little better and make it a little more organized, who then push out the meek. Then it is all down hill from there.

[Ham]

I agree.

In a lot of ways, I think they start out like a mom and pop business, you know the boss, you belong..

wages aren't too bad, there are some benefits, and they don't work you all the way down to the bone.

Then they retire and sell the business.

Little church in the home, or on the block, then they start to think..

"geeze, this is so cool, EVERYBODY oughta have it.."

Yeah. They HAD it, PERHAPS, when they were small.

[Bumpy]

I agree.

In a lot of ways, I think they start out like a mom and pop business, you know the boss, you belong..

wages aren't too bad, there are some benefits, and they don't work you all the way down to the bone.

Then they retire and sell the business.

Little church in the home, or on the block, then they start to think..

"geeze, this is so cool, EVERYBODY oughta have it.."

Yeah. They HAD it, PERHAPS, when they were small.

Well, I guess if you guys are right, the show is over? Because this may be a great forum to share with wonderful people, some filled with good intentions, and we can all Yak from Senegal to California but we will never meet and enjoy the things which you share face to face! Too bad, because you guys who suffered all the pain are the experts, not me!! I just know I need to see the people I closest to me.

[Ham]

well.. I don't know if the show is over. As far as CES/STFI is concerned, it is up to THEM, in my opinion.

A lot of us pray that they would be restored. I think that is largely up to them.

Same for TWI.

Every passing day though, I see the likelihood slowly evaporating.

[JoePascha]

Well, I know in the Begining that Sue Pierce from the 11th Corps was part of CES, but when she told me that the Lord spoke to her about the Trinity being Ture, and Jesus was God etc, She told John Lynn about that. She ceased being part of CES.

She Studied I believe in Denver Seminary, and is now an ordained minister in a major denomination.

If the CES would teach what all Christians know to be true about Deity of Jesus Christ, and get rid of the other teaching about the Soul of man being asleep until the gathering together, they would have been accepted. Why must they hold on to false doctrine that were taught by the Big Mother Cult, the Way?

There are writting called the Church Fathers, or Patristic Teachings of the Early Christian Fathers and Writters. These documents are from the direct successors of the Original Apostles. I think you would all be amazed what the Church of the First and Second Century truly belived and practice. Why didn't VPW tell us about these great Works of Theology when we were in the Corps? After all us grads go a degree in Theology that is not worth anything in the Academic World?

Joe

[Ham]

but when she told me that the Lord spoke to her about the Trinity being Ture, and Jesus was God etc, She told John Lynn about that. She ceased being part of CES.

No wonder she is not exactly a household word as far a CES or even other offshoots are concerned.

[Sunesis]

Nope she's not. She's an amazing woman. She put her money where her mouth was, got her Masters and now pastors a church - Methodist I believe.

You would be surprised how many people, after they left TWI were shown by God, how many of TWI's doctrines were wrong, and the Holy Spirit, who indwells in every believer, leads them towards the truth. I'm glad she got out when she did. Who cares if she was a "star" in CES or whatever.

[Ham]

Yeah, I think that was what I was trying to say, in a different way.

Just that to tell JL "God told me the trinity is true" would be one way to get off the CES "honor role".

Edited February 26, 2007 by Mr. Hammeroni

[Sunesis]

I apologize if you thought I was being rude to you Ham - I love your posts. But, oh yeah, tell that to JAL and its out the door for you.

[Ham]

Naw, I didn't think you were rude at all.

Sometimes I'm as clear as mud, just tried to clarify a little bit

[Tzaia]

Yeah, I think that was what I was trying to say, in a different way.

Just that to tell JL "God told me the trinity is true" would be one way to get off the CES "honor role".

You would think, now wouldn't you? Dan Tocchini was a devout trinitarian. In fact, he didn't 'advertise' the fact that he was hauling them in from CES because of CES's stand on the trinity and that would hurt business. Both JAL and MG said they were making 'inroads' with Dan. I said no way. He's just humoring you because you are an income source.

The trinity, for me, blurs too many distinctions between what God did and what Jesus did and the purpose of the holy spirit, but I don't get my shorts in a bunch because someone chooses to believe in the trinity.

[Captain Spiritural]

OK - One more time - this time with feeling...

Who here really gives a tiny little rat's chafed behind about the CES "God machine?" Isn't this really about the people it devoured. Music; amazing, healing, foot-stomping music, would not have saved that machine - It only would have lured more folks in to feed the beast.

If you start with garbage, and add sugar and vanilla,bake it in a flaky crust, and serve it a la mode with the finest ice cream in the world -IT'S STILL GARBAGE! Playing music and raising your hands in worship while you serve it won't help either.

And no, this recipe will not end up in the kitchen section.

This is a very funny post ... is this group leader John EgoManic Lynn? if so I remember that guy at Emperoia KS what a prick he was with a Super Ego to boot. Maybe if these guys didnt love $$$$ so much they could really help folks but Christianity in America is a lost endeavor a joke. It's all about the cash and feeding their egos.

Hey love the post though! I am ...