I will not seek vengeance against those who wrong me, but will forgive them and seek reconciliation according to the principles of God’s Word. I will reject small-minded and petty attitudes that demand of others what I am unwilling to give. I will acknowledge the evils of misjudgment and recognize that what I detest in others lives in me as well. I will acknowledge that identifying the root of sin in my own life is a more compelling project than presuming to correct others without first correcting myself.
they say one thing and do another, because they have thr power to understand the situation with the revelation from God being super duper no one eles has it !!
so they do not have to anywyas so there.
they write well the doing of all this well that is what they write about so OTHER folks will know.
Schoenheit is in, but believe what you want. JS is very good at what he's very good at - research.
MG is NOT out. He's still on the board and for now will remain on the board. He can't be removed.
Huh..???
Maybe I've been away from these "high-demand groups" a little too long.......because I see a HUGE disconnect between "very good research guy" as opposed to "nodding in agreement at board mtgs for a momentus/dreamworld interpretation/nose-spider revy environment of evil."
But then, what do I know???? There are people who follow Ernst Aingley and Benny Hinn and swear that their stuff is of God.
According to the by-laws none of the three originating members can be removed. The board can't change any by-laws without unanimous board approval, nor can they remove a president without unanimous board approval. They can change out presidents at the annual meeting, which is why they waited until then.
So then why has he betrayed the others and slapped them with a defamation of character suit?
I think he would disagree that he was the betrayer. I would ask for you to enlighten me and the others exactly HOW he betrayed the others. He hasn't come on here posing as someone else dropping information about others.
"very good research guy" as opposed to "nodding in agreement at board mtgs for a momentus/dreamworld interpretation/nose-spider revy environment of evil."
JS is good at research. There are other areas he struggles with, like reading people.
are their salaries public knowledge ?
Not individually. Employee salaries are a line item in the yearly financial statement to the partners.
Ladies and gentleman of the jury, you've heard a witness testify she has seen spiders coming out of the noses of the possessed…and another individual claim a monkey flew out his butt. Now you must decide if that was in fact a spider monkey or if the spiders acted snotty towards my client.
What a psychodrama!...and these guys actually believe that they have answers to help others?...They think they are Christian "leaders" called to minister to their followers?...when they bite and devour each other with insane doctrines and vicious attacks against each other?...What an example!
...I'd kick the whole bunch of them out of the life boat.
Oh Groucho, where's the love in that? You're just a big ol' meanie!!!!
Picture a lifeboat in the ocean with one guy rowing, one guy sitting doing nothing and the third guy in the back punching holes in the boat.
Wait, take that back. One guy's polishing the oar, the other guy's swearing at the water and the guy in the back's punching holes in the boat.
No. Wait, One guy's beating the other guy with the oar, the guy in the middle's hiding the last of the food and the guy in the back's waiting for them to knock each other out of the boat so he can finally get some sleep.
Socks, I think its more like a poorly constructed, or just plain old leaky boat, and only has the capacity of carrying one of the board at any one time over the lake without sinking.
Problem:
get all three over to the other side alive, with the thought:
can't leave MG and JL alone, without MG bludgeoning JL.
Can't leave JL and JS alone, without JL bludgeoning JS.
...I'd kick the whole bunch of them out of the life boat.
But they can't be kicked out I guess. So you just have to take away the water that floats their boat ... which would be the money ...
How nice for them that the three are permanent members of the board, and all board members have veto power. It would be hard to ever make a change that would step on anyone's toes.
That's it then ... drain the tub this boat is floating in ... three men in a tub, glub glub glub ...
So, sorry to detour the board for a question... but I have been out for 7+ years, busily making life for myself, and just recently found this board. I only know of CES peripherally -- JL founded the org after breaking away from TWI... yada.. yada...yada.
I don't think they are in my neck of the woods (DC area) but am not sure.
How big is this organization? Are a lot of former TWI'ers actively participating?
I think he would disagree that he was the betrayer. I would ask for you to enlighten me and the others exactly HOW he betrayed the others. He hasn't come on here posing as someone else dropping information about others.
well that's ONE definition of betrayal, but consider the following:
from what everyone can ascertain from the documents and the threads with personal reports from people's actual similar experiences, and people's firsthand knowledge of the character, behavior and history of those staff members directly impacted - many of whom are known personally by many people here - i think we'd have a fair shot at believing they may have been betrayed. wrongful dismissal could potentially bring suit against the ministry, a betrayal to all those who have worked to support it's goals.
right now it is hard for anyone to be 'enlightening' to others in this whole affair because of the secret 'inner circle' nature of how things have been run and are being run during these changes - it's only gossip outside of Indy, inside of Indy it's 'private leadership meetings.' definitions of gossip have been badly misused - but missusing scripture is another issue.
1 tim 5:19 Against an elder receive not an accusation, but before two or three witnesses. 20 Them that sin rebuke before all, that others also may fear. 21 I charge thee before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, and the elect angels, that thou observe these things without preferring one before another, doing nothing by partiality. 22 Lay hands suddenly on no man, neither be partaker of other men's sins: keep thyself pure.
it appears that verses 19-21 were attempted - perhaps that's a matter of opinion but your definition of 'betrayal' seems to involve the idea of people not knowing what's going on, but we need to know the details of why people are suddenly gone. we have a moral obligation to stop support of something that may be seriously wrong, unbiblical and sinful based on verse 22.
people supporting CES with their lives and their money need to know about what seems to be *sheer craziness* going on, people really need to understand why they are seeing friends fired and 'resigning.' there are folks concerned that their kids were just at LOL right in the middle of this affair that they didn't know about - that's not right to withhold from them.
i would like to be enlightened as to how 1 Cor 6:1-8 fits in with bringing a lawsuit against the board of directors and staff from a church, which could be seen as betrayal to the people (and longtime friends) involved in the suit, and also could be seen as betrayal to the supporters of CES based on how the lawsuit could impact the ministry.
1 Cor 6:1 Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints? 2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? 3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life? 4 If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church. 5 I speak to your shame. Is it so, that there is not a wise man among you? no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren? 6 But brother goeth to law with brother, and that before the unbelievers. 7 Now therefore there is utterly a fault among you, because ye go to law one with another. Why do ye not rather take wrong? why do ye not rather suffer yourselves to be defrauded? 8 Nay, ye do wrong, and defraud, and that your brethren.
i would like to hear that explanation, especially verse 8, 'Nay, ye do wrong, and defraud, and that your brethren.'
What a psychodrama!...and these guys actually believe that they have answers to help others?...They think they are Christian "leaders" called to minister to their followers?...when they bite and devour each other with insane doctrines and vicious attacks against each other?...What an example!
...I'd kick the whole bunch of them out of the life boat.
Why don't we just leave them in the life boat and take the cruise ship?
I think he would disagree that he was the betrayer. I would ask for you to enlighten me and the others exactly HOW he betrayed the others. He hasn't come on here posing as someone else dropping information about others.
Are you refering to yourself? Or do you think Mark Sanguinetti from Northern California is my made up ficticious name? And are the scriptures below clear enough for you or do you need a commentary? Also did you even bother to look at them after 1Broken1 posted these on page 2 here?
1 Corinthians 6:1-8
DARE ANY OF YOU, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints? 2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? 3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life? 4 If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church. 5 I SPEAK TO YOUR SHAME. Is it so, that there is not a wise man among you? no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren? 6 But brother goeth to law with brother, and that before the unbelievers. 7 Now therefore there is utterly a fault among you, because ye go to law one with another. WHY DO YE NOT RATHER TAKE WRONG? WHY DO YE NOT RATHER SUFFER YOURSELVES TO BE DEFRAUDED? 8 NAY, YE DO WRONG, AND DEFRAUD, AND THAT YOUR BRETHREN.
Are you refering to yourself? Or do you think Mark Sanguinetti from Northern California is my made up ficticious name? And are the scriptures below clear enough for you or do you need a commentary? Also did you even bother to look at them after 1Broken1 posted these on page 2 here?
1 Corinthians 6:1-8
DARE ANY OF YOU, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints? 2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? 3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life? 4 If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church. 5 I SPEAK TO YOUR SHAME. Is it so, that there is not a wise man among you? no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren? 6 But brother goeth to law with brother, and that before the unbelievers. 7 Now therefore there is utterly a fault among you, because ye go to law one with another. WHY DO YE NOT RATHER TAKE WRONG? WHY DO YE NOT RATHER SUFFER YOURSELVES TO BE DEFRAUDED? 8 NAY, YE DO WRONG, AND DEFRAUD, AND THAT YOUR BRETHREN.
Mark S. is right.
Mark G. needs to learn to *turn the other cheek*.
But as usual -- that is an IMBO (in my biblical opinion).
Picture a lifeboat in the ocean with one guy rowing, one guy sitting doing nothing and the third guy in the back punching holes in the boat.
Wait, take that back. One guy's polishing the oar, the other guy's swearing at the water and the guy in the back's punching holes in the boat.
No. Wait, One guy's beating the other guy with the oar, the guy in the middle's hiding the last of the food and the guy in the back's waiting for them to knock each other out of the boat so he can finally get some sleep.
No. No, wait. I'm working on it.....
Socks, do you mind if I borrow this? I am experiencing momentary writer's block and could not come up with anything nearly as witty and funny, yet so very true.
Socks, do you mind if I borrow this? I am experiencing momentary writer's block and could not come up with anything nearly as witty and funny, yet so very true.
So, sorry to detour the board for a question... but I have been out for 7+ years, busily making life for myself, and just recently found this board. I only know of CES peripherally -- JL founded the org after breaking away from TWI... yada.. yada...yada.
I don't think they are in my neck of the woods (DC area) but am not sure.
How big is this organization? Are a lot of former TWI'ers actively participating?
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Danny
JS as the President. Didn't he do the research for the pp stuff?
That's like putting the chickens in the fox house.
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excathedra
STFI Code of Conduct
#8.
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pond
your killing me EX!
they say one thing and do another, because they have thr power to understand the situation with the revelation from God being super duper no one eles has it !!
so they do not have to anywyas so there.
they write well the doing of all this well that is what they write about so OTHER folks will know.
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Tzaia
Schoenheit is in, but believe what you want. JS is very good at what he's very good at - research.
MG is NOT out. He's still on the board and for now will remain on the board. He can't be removed.
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excathedra
how's come ?
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skyrider
Huh..???
Maybe I've been away from these "high-demand groups" a little too long.......because I see a HUGE disconnect between "very good research guy" as opposed to "nodding in agreement at board mtgs for a momentus/dreamworld interpretation/nose-spider revy environment of evil."
But then, what do I know???? There are people who follow Ernst Aingley and Benny Hinn and swear that their stuff is of God.
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Mark Sanguinetti
Tzaia says,
So then why has he betrayed the others and slapped them with a defamation of character suit?
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socks
Mark S, think "property". They inherited in Sonoma county, didn't they? Where'd I hear that...
Defamation of character = malicious intent.
That's Christianity with a Capital "C", isn't it?
Get out.
Get out.
Get out.
Get out.
Get out.
Get.
Out.
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Tzaia
According to the by-laws none of the three originating members can be removed. The board can't change any by-laws without unanimous board approval, nor can they remove a president without unanimous board approval. They can change out presidents at the annual meeting, which is why they waited until then.
I think he would disagree that he was the betrayer. I would ask for you to enlighten me and the others exactly HOW he betrayed the others. He hasn't come on here posing as someone else dropping information about others.JS is good at research. There are other areas he struggles with, like reading people.
Not individually. Employee salaries are a line item in the yearly financial statement to the partners.
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T-Bone
Ladies and gentleman of the jury, you've heard a witness testify she has seen spiders coming out of the noses of the possessed…and another individual claim a monkey flew out his butt. Now you must decide if that was in fact a spider monkey or if the spiders acted snotty towards my client.
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GrouchoMarxJr
What a psychodrama!...and these guys actually believe that they have answers to help others?...They think they are Christian "leaders" called to minister to their followers?...when they bite and devour each other with insane doctrines and vicious attacks against each other?...What an example!
...I'd kick the whole bunch of them out of the life boat.
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socks
Oh Groucho, where's the love in that? You're just a big ol' meanie!!!!
Picture a lifeboat in the ocean with one guy rowing, one guy sitting doing nothing and the third guy in the back punching holes in the boat.
Wait, take that back. One guy's polishing the oar, the other guy's swearing at the water and the guy in the back's punching holes in the boat.
No. Wait, One guy's beating the other guy with the oar, the guy in the middle's hiding the last of the food and the guy in the back's waiting for them to knock each other out of the boat so he can finally get some sleep.
No. No, wait. I'm working on it.....
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ChasUFarley
I'd vote 'em all off the island...
Just when this is as weird as I think it can possibly get... someone takes some LSD and does some prophecy while they're watching the Exorcist....
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Ham
Socks, I think its more like a poorly constructed, or just plain old leaky boat, and only has the capacity of carrying one of the board at any one time over the lake without sinking.
Problem:
get all three over to the other side alive, with the thought:
can't leave MG and JL alone, without MG bludgeoning JL.
Can't leave JL and JS alone, without JL bludgeoning JS.
Sounds like a problem for my Math 300 class..
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rhino
How nice for them that the three are permanent members of the board, and all board members have veto power. It would be hard to ever make a change that would step on anyone's toes.
That's it then ... drain the tub this boat is floating in ... three men in a tub, glub glub glub ...
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Inkernet
So, sorry to detour the board for a question... but I have been out for 7+ years, busily making life for myself, and just recently found this board. I only know of CES peripherally -- JL founded the org after breaking away from TWI... yada.. yada...yada.
I don't think they are in my neck of the woods (DC area) but am not sure.
How big is this organization? Are a lot of former TWI'ers actively participating?
Thanks in advance.... :)
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1broken1
Tzaia
well that's ONE definition of betrayal, but consider the following:
from what everyone can ascertain from the documents and the threads with personal reports from people's actual similar experiences, and people's firsthand knowledge of the character, behavior and history of those staff members directly impacted - many of whom are known personally by many people here - i think we'd have a fair shot at believing they may have been betrayed. wrongful dismissal could potentially bring suit against the ministry, a betrayal to all those who have worked to support it's goals.
right now it is hard for anyone to be 'enlightening' to others in this whole affair because of the secret 'inner circle' nature of how things have been run and are being run during these changes - it's only gossip outside of Indy, inside of Indy it's 'private leadership meetings.' definitions of gossip have been badly misused - but missusing scripture is another issue.
1 tim 5:19 Against an elder receive not an accusation, but before two or three witnesses. 20 Them that sin rebuke before all, that others also may fear. 21 I charge thee before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, and the elect angels, that thou observe these things without preferring one before another, doing nothing by partiality. 22 Lay hands suddenly on no man, neither be partaker of other men's sins: keep thyself pure.
it appears that verses 19-21 were attempted - perhaps that's a matter of opinion but your definition of 'betrayal' seems to involve the idea of people not knowing what's going on, but we need to know the details of why people are suddenly gone. we have a moral obligation to stop support of something that may be seriously wrong, unbiblical and sinful based on verse 22.
people supporting CES with their lives and their money need to know about what seems to be *sheer craziness* going on, people really need to understand why they are seeing friends fired and 'resigning.' there are folks concerned that their kids were just at LOL right in the middle of this affair that they didn't know about - that's not right to withhold from them.
i would like to be enlightened as to how 1 Cor 6:1-8 fits in with bringing a lawsuit against the board of directors and staff from a church, which could be seen as betrayal to the people (and longtime friends) involved in the suit, and also could be seen as betrayal to the supporters of CES based on how the lawsuit could impact the ministry.
1 Cor 6:1 Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints? 2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? 3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life? 4 If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church. 5 I speak to your shame. Is it so, that there is not a wise man among you? no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren? 6 But brother goeth to law with brother, and that before the unbelievers. 7 Now therefore there is utterly a fault among you, because ye go to law one with another. Why do ye not rather take wrong? why do ye not rather suffer yourselves to be defrauded? 8 Nay, ye do wrong, and defraud, and that your brethren.
i would like to hear that explanation, especially verse 8, 'Nay, ye do wrong, and defraud, and that your brethren.'
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doojable
Why don't we just leave them in the life boat and take the cruise ship?
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Mark Sanguinetti
Tzaia says,
Are you refering to yourself? Or do you think Mark Sanguinetti from Northern California is my made up ficticious name? And are the scriptures below clear enough for you or do you need a commentary? Also did you even bother to look at them after 1Broken1 posted these on page 2 here?
1 Corinthians 6:1-8
DARE ANY OF YOU, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints? 2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? 3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life? 4 If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church. 5 I SPEAK TO YOUR SHAME. Is it so, that there is not a wise man among you? no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren? 6 But brother goeth to law with brother, and that before the unbelievers. 7 Now therefore there is utterly a fault among you, because ye go to law one with another. WHY DO YE NOT RATHER TAKE WRONG? WHY DO YE NOT RATHER SUFFER YOURSELVES TO BE DEFRAUDED? 8 NAY, YE DO WRONG, AND DEFRAUD, AND THAT YOUR BRETHREN.
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dmiller
Mark S. is right.
Mark G. needs to learn to *turn the other cheek*.
But as usual -- that is an IMBO (in my biblical opinion).
:)
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Mark Sanguinetti
Socks, do you mind if I borrow this? I am experiencing momentary writer's block and could not come up with anything nearly as witty and funny, yet so very true.
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dmiller
Socks rocks --regardless of topic!!
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socks
At your service! :)
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TheInvisibleDan
"Hey! Are you guys playing cards?"
Welcome Inkjet!
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