Johniam----------The story I heard years ago was that there were some who came to HQ,on their own, even before there was a WC. It kind of reminds me of Marylin On "Northern Exposure" . She showed up in the drs. office and announced she was there to start her job as receptionist . The dr. said he didn't need a receptionist but she persisted and was a staple of the show throughout its' run. I don't know for a fact but I think D@nnie may have been one of those few who reported for work before "the doctor" even knew there was a position to fill. I too heard the stories of living in a teepee in the woods and smoking pot. Contrast that to some of the M&A accounts posted here and it will baffle the mind how allowable practices changed so radically over time. D@nnie was truly one of a kind. One of the good ones was lost when D@nnie passed.
Del Duncan gave a teaching at a California limb function and the general theme was to listen to God when He calls. His example was himself and the zero corps. He talked about VPW calling him, telling him that God usually gives a man one chance, but that he was invited to come back for the 1st corps anyway but that VPW was going to ride him hard while he was there. Del cried, said going back into the corps was a turning point in his life, etc, etc. It was a very moving teaching at the time. Sorry I can't remember any more of it, it was about 32 years ago.
As I think about it, I have to wonder if the failure of corps zero wasn't VPW's fault in some way. For all his flaws, VPW was not stupid. I'm sure he quickly realized the flaws in his corps program and corrected them. As far as I can tell, there was nothing coming close to a rebellion in the corps after that until maybe the sixth corps?
As I think about it, I have to wonder if the failure of corps zero wasn't VPW's fault in some way.
One of the commentaries on Sun Tzu's "the Art of War" included this story.
One emperor challenged his great general to make a disciplined force of the Emperor's concubines.
(To show he could do anything, not so they'd actually go into battle.)
The general equipped them, appointed officers among them, and had the basics demonstrated
(parade-ground, exhibition stuff, not real fighting stuff.) Then he gave a simple instruction
for attention with the weapon over the shoulder. The "army" giggled and did not carry it out,
resulting instead in dropped weapons and much tittering.
The general pointed out that if a general's directions are unclear, it is the general's fault,
but if his directions are clear, and the soldiers STILL do not carry them out, it is the fault
of the OFFICERS. After some "officers" were beheaded, the military unit had no difficulty
carrying out the previous instruction.
The point being, that if ONE person turns out bad, it's likely the person.
If ALL of them turn bad, there's a problem with the PROGRAM, and the people in CHARGE
are responsible.
vpw had ZERO training in any programs himself, and had ZERO study in how to run a
successful program. He figured you could just cobble something together easily.
His first attempt failed so completely he disbanded it and blamed them.
His second attempt may have followed his instructions,
but that's more the result of him demonstrating harshness (like beheading concubines
to show you're serious) than him actually having an excellent program.
The complete failure of the program was the fault of those running it,
which is to say, vpw.
For all his flaws, VPW was not stupid. I'm sure he quickly realized the flaws in his corps program and corrected them. As far as I can tell, there was nothing coming close to a rebellion in the corps after that until maybe the sixth corps?
Of course, what's considered a "flaw" depends on who's doing the consideration.
They followed orders unquestioningly, and paid on time.
That was what vpw considered a success.
(Following orders was always his big sign, and how lcm got to be his fair-haired boy.
I have documentation on the money thing, from a reliable source,
if you need it.)
As to the flaws being corrected, the program had people paying money to perform
manual labour. They were taught some Bible (which they didn't have to go in for-
everybody learned some Bible), and did calisthenics (we have photos),
were loaned out to farmers for manual labour, and kept up the grounds.
In between, there were some "leadership training" things taught by people who had
little business doing so since they had no formal training to do so.
We also had people sent hitchhiking, or transported in the homemade trailer hitches
like cattle. Some people were hospitalized, and some died, as the result of these
measures which saved money. All of that was because the program required
hazarding the lives and safety of its students so they could follow the directives
of unqualified climbers and go up some mountansides.
When it was pointed out that women were getting raped hitchhiking, vpw himself
insisted it remain a requirement for the program, since they could potentially get
raped anywhere. (His comments are in the "Heart of the Way Corps" tapes.)
So, vpw considered the frugality of the program to be paramount, even when was
kept at the expense of the safety of the students.
So, people were EXPENDABLE, but the money came in, and the people in the
program always did what they were told, and much of what was taught was of
dubious benefit. Depending on who you ask, that makes it a great success,
You realize, of course the zero corps was just called the way corps at the time. My understanding is the folks ....ed vpw off so much he tossed out the whole bunch. Later started it up again with a different bunch and it "took," So of course the official history would never mention the failures. Later it was referred to as the zero corps as a form of derision.
I knew a guy who was in fellowships in Mass (this was before I went in the 5th corps) I later found out he had been zero corps. He wasn't much of a leader. Don't know why he stuck around after being booted. Probably felt guilty.
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TheHighWay
Yes, I believe Mary Poppins would have been kicked out of the Zero Corps, too...lol.
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waysider
Johniam----------The story I heard years ago was that there were some who came to HQ,on their own, even before there was a WC. It kind of reminds me of Marylin On "Northern Exposure" . She showed up in the drs. office and announced she was there to start her job as receptionist . The dr. said he didn't need a receptionist but she persisted and was a staple of the show throughout its' run. I don't know for a fact but I think D@nnie may have been one of those few who reported for work before "the doctor" even knew there was a position to fill. I too heard the stories of living in a teepee in the woods and smoking pot. Contrast that to some of the M&A accounts posted here and it will baffle the mind how allowable practices changed so radically over time. D@nnie was truly one of a kind. One of the good ones was lost when D@nnie passed.
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Jim
Del Duncan gave a teaching at a California limb function and the general theme was to listen to God when He calls. His example was himself and the zero corps. He talked about VPW calling him, telling him that God usually gives a man one chance, but that he was invited to come back for the 1st corps anyway but that VPW was going to ride him hard while he was there. Del cried, said going back into the corps was a turning point in his life, etc, etc. It was a very moving teaching at the time. Sorry I can't remember any more of it, it was about 32 years ago.
As I think about it, I have to wonder if the failure of corps zero wasn't VPW's fault in some way. For all his flaws, VPW was not stupid. I'm sure he quickly realized the flaws in his corps program and corrected them. As far as I can tell, there was nothing coming close to a rebellion in the corps after that until maybe the sixth corps?
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WordWolf
One of the commentaries on Sun Tzu's "the Art of War" included this story.
One emperor challenged his great general to make a disciplined force of the Emperor's concubines.
(To show he could do anything, not so they'd actually go into battle.)
The general equipped them, appointed officers among them, and had the basics demonstrated
(parade-ground, exhibition stuff, not real fighting stuff.) Then he gave a simple instruction
for attention with the weapon over the shoulder. The "army" giggled and did not carry it out,
resulting instead in dropped weapons and much tittering.
The general pointed out that if a general's directions are unclear, it is the general's fault,
but if his directions are clear, and the soldiers STILL do not carry them out, it is the fault
of the OFFICERS. After some "officers" were beheaded, the military unit had no difficulty
carrying out the previous instruction.
The point being, that if ONE person turns out bad, it's likely the person.
If ALL of them turn bad, there's a problem with the PROGRAM, and the people in CHARGE
are responsible.
vpw had ZERO training in any programs himself, and had ZERO study in how to run a
successful program. He figured you could just cobble something together easily.
His first attempt failed so completely he disbanded it and blamed them.
His second attempt may have followed his instructions,
but that's more the result of him demonstrating harshness (like beheading concubines
to show you're serious) than him actually having an excellent program.
The complete failure of the program was the fault of those running it,
which is to say, vpw.
Of course, what's considered a "flaw" depends on who's doing the consideration.
They followed orders unquestioningly, and paid on time.
That was what vpw considered a success.
(Following orders was always his big sign, and how lcm got to be his fair-haired boy.
I have documentation on the money thing, from a reliable source,
if you need it.)
As to the flaws being corrected, the program had people paying money to perform
manual labour. They were taught some Bible (which they didn't have to go in for-
everybody learned some Bible), and did calisthenics (we have photos),
were loaned out to farmers for manual labour, and kept up the grounds.
In between, there were some "leadership training" things taught by people who had
little business doing so since they had no formal training to do so.
We also had people sent hitchhiking, or transported in the homemade trailer hitches
like cattle. Some people were hospitalized, and some died, as the result of these
measures which saved money. All of that was because the program required
hazarding the lives and safety of its students so they could follow the directives
of unqualified climbers and go up some mountansides.
When it was pointed out that women were getting raped hitchhiking, vpw himself
insisted it remain a requirement for the program, since they could potentially get
raped anywhere. (His comments are in the "Heart of the Way Corps" tapes.)
So, vpw considered the frugality of the program to be paramount, even when was
kept at the expense of the safety of the students.
So, people were EXPENDABLE, but the money came in, and the people in the
program always did what they were told, and much of what was taught was of
dubious benefit. Depending on who you ask, that makes it a great success,
or a great failure.
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My3Cents
You realize, of course the zero corps was just called the way corps at the time. My understanding is the folks ....ed vpw off so much he tossed out the whole bunch. Later started it up again with a different bunch and it "took," So of course the official history would never mention the failures. Later it was referred to as the zero corps as a form of derision.
I knew a guy who was in fellowships in Mass (this was before I went in the 5th corps) I later found out he had been zero corps. He wasn't much of a leader. Don't know why he stuck around after being booted. Probably felt guilty.
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