that case was so high profile in hind sight the media did a awful awful thing to that poor family.
but at the time it was so very horrifc and frightening all the kids home for the holidays and people wanted to feel they caught the guy or girl who did it.
I feel bad for them now and I do hope they get the person who did it.
this guy from out of the country should be in jail just for being creepy enough on his own without a crime.
Maybe he confessed to get out of the country. I would rather be in a USA jail than one in Thailand.
Is what is really going on. I didn't know he had charges against him in Thailand, and this provides an excellent reason for him to "confess" the way he did. He probably got into following the case for his own twisted and perverted reasons, and then when he got into trouble in Thailand, knew tht he had left a "cyber paper trail", that would help get him out of Thailand where he could be coddled by our sorry a$$ed legal system here in the states. I mean, if all he is facing is "child pornography charges" in Cali, then he'll make out just fine. I mean remember how that Connecticut judge gave some guy only six months for raping a six month old child? An Infant?
And then of course there is my old elementary school friend whose fourteen year old mildly retarded was seduced and molested for a year by my friends own brand new husband (the sick ****!), and led into all of the sex acts, who is now on the verge of walking away from it. Yeah, my friend is so steamed and wants it all to end so badly and has no real money that she is near to the point of saying "screw it" and walking away from it all and not fighting it when they let him walk....
Yeah, I would say that this perv made a wise move, to get out of Thailand. Somebody simply needs to put a bullet between his eyes. A nice hollow point .44 magnum would do the job quite nicely...
I finished reviewing the 98 page affadavit. I won't post a link here, because it is truly disturbing and difficult even to just glean info from, let alone read and absorb, without getting sick. Reading through it, though, made it easy to understand why the DA's office wanted to either include or exclude this creep one way or another.
He is sick, twisted, perverted and worthy of a lot more than he will get if extradited to California to face the charges there. Only good thing is that now he is known for what he is. If found guilty of the misdeamenor charges he faces, he will have to register as a sex offender, and anyone in their right mind will raise alarms from this moment forward if he comes anywhere near a child.
Hopefully, he will have little or no peace the rest of his life, and he brought this upon himself by his own sick actions. Justice will find him-one way or another.
I admit I am disappointed that the evidence cleared Karr. It was worth the try anyway. I in no way can find fault with the DA for going after him to make sure, and I applaud her for stickihng er job on the line to give it a go. Unfortunateely, it may cost her the job, even though she is very qualified, and was highly thought of by her peers. For several months, the guy had been warming up via emails for his outright confession of the crime he didn't do. Even going so far as getting messages to Patsy Ramsey before her death, implicating his guilt.
For this reason, I disagree with JLingo on the confession being a way to get out of Thailand. the guy is sick, no question, but not a murderer. (yet, anyway. It remains to be seen if his condession eventually becomes a self fulfilling prophecy) At least now he is in the databases, and if and when he is freed, he will be watched. That is a very good thing that arose from Boulder's pursuit of him.
Since I live nearby, I have followed this case from its Christmas eve beginning so many years ago. While nobody can applaud the Boulder police, it seems they had many obstacles to overcome from the git go. The initial investigation was not done well, and was shoddy in the beginning stages at the house that night. They did finally get it together, and there is much that has been witheld from the public. HOWEVER, with our grandstanding governor sticking his nose in it and virtually demanding that they find a way to charge Patsy, they almost were forced to put aside other efforts. The DA at the time ridiculed the police, for not finding a way to charge Mrs. Ramsey.
SHE DID NOT DO IT. I was and am, very convinced of that. I saw her tears, I heard her voice, I know people who know her. I hope they finally find the person who DID, since at this time he ( I guess remotely could be a she) is still out there somewhere, perhaps in your village.
As we all know now, there was never enough to charge Patsy Ramsey, not evidence, motive, opportunity or anything else. There was even less reason to pursue Dad or brother. To answer medicwife, both were outright cleared early in the investigation, due to DNA and OTHER evidence.
I disagree that the case was or is now seriously "botched". NONE of the mistakes made by the police department then or now likely prevented, or will prevent an arrest, but they did give false hope to millions who are infatuated with this case. The plain facts are, the perp's DNA is not yet in the national databases. Nobody has been found that meets the criteria for charging murder.
What exactly do you feel was botched? Every lead has been followed, and if new ones arise, they too will be followed. I They will find him sometime., or they will not.
One thing that disturbs me however is that while this cute little white girl's death was an absolute travesty, why is it that the death of young non-white non-rich children barely can find the way to a single front page? Yet Jon Benet gets worldwide attention 10 years later? We follow the money way too much IMHO.
Well, I didn't say he was not a sicko. Like I said before, I thought he was up to these sick sick communications with the college professor and anyone else because he was getting off on thinking of himself as the one who did it. But when he got into trouble in Thailand, ALSO found a very convenient way to get himself extradited due to his "cyber paper trail".
And Hap I totally agree with you on this:
One thing that disturbs me however is that while this cute little white girl's death was an absolute travesty, why is it that the death of young non-white non-rich children barely can find the way to a single front page? Yet Jon Benet gets worldwide attention 10 years later? We follow the money way too much IMHO.
~HAP
Reminds me of the book "A Time To Kill" (John Grisham) when in the defense lawyer's attempt to clear his client for shooting the brutal rapists of his little daughter in his conluding statement, he described the whole sordid scene, then told the jury to close their eyes and then asked them to "just imagine if this little girl was white".
And that got the black father off the hook for killing his daughters' rapists...
I have often thought it amazing that this little girl, whose parents dressed her up like that, got so much attention, and yet in the wake of it all, there have been many many rape/murders ofpoor little black girls, who only get a small blip on the radar screen...
Maybe if it happened like that to the daughter of Halle Berry, we would see the same outrage, I don't know.....
It gained so much attention because of the little girl's participation in the pagents. I recall those images as being the first thing splashed all over every front page and TV show. The media was who propelled this story to the front pages, thanks to their research or whoever provided the footage from the pagents to them. As usual, it was ratings that pushed the story along, thanks in part to those very images. As soon as the story heated up again, the very same images were dug up again.
It is sick and unfair, but a fact of life. Hap is right-stories like this get much more play than others which are just as tragic. Someone is looking at demographics and deciding what we want to see, not what we should see. And, they milk these types of stories to the last drop. There are so many other cold cases in this country which are yet to be solved, but they don't get the same coverage. Lack of pictures, lack of videos, lack of titillation keeps these stories local only or buried for good. Sad-but true.
By the way, this just in. You all may remember the thread I started about a friend whose daughter had been sexually abused by my friends new husband? The friend of mine whose daughter is mildly retartded, whose new step father molested her for a year and led her into many many sex acts? Well, I just got an e-mail from her this morning, and I will post here what she told me, and what the DA told her:
Bad news yesterday. I've gotten my crying, teeth gnashing, hair pulling out of the way. The DA here in San xxxxx said they have decided not to go forward with the case and the other two counties probably will also drop theirs due to the fact that when she interviewed xxxxxx, xxxxxx was very easily led to answer any way the DA wanted her to, she changed her answers and basically just wasn't going to be a "good witness" and the defense would have a field day with her. SO SAD! It's like the more vulnerable you are in this world the least protection you get. I told them it was really sad, that I saw what I saw and he walks. Walks, laughing at us and thumbing his nose at us and his whole family will feel vindicated and smug.
But life isn't fair and it will go on and there will most likely be hard times to face in the future. Dad told my the best revenge is to live well and be happy and that's what I intend to do. I haven't told xxxxx yet. It took me a while to get my act together to even face her after talking to the authorities yesterday. She knew I had been crying but didn't know why. We have an appt. with the counselor tonight and the DA said she'd call her and let her know the outcome and get help as to how best to explain it on xxxxxx's level. The main thing I want her to know is that she did everything right and it's not her fault.
And so, my sweet friend from fifth grade, my fifth grade girlfriend and her sweet sixteen year old daughter have just gotten the shaft from the "justice" system. Her daughter was fourteen when it started, and at fifteen, my friend walked in on them and he was naked with a hard on, making her do an "act". But that doesn't matter, they are throwing the case out! WTF!!?? But the girl is mildly retarded you see, and doesn't nderstand anything other than "he made me do all of these things...."
Sorry for the de-rail, but, it is sort of related. And, I x'd out her daughter's name and the town they are from...
Yeah, pi$$es me off royally too. And now my friend "Allison" (I think I called her that in that thread I started when I told the story) has to tell her daughter that this slime gets to get away with all that he did to her.
Well now, I guess that the upside to it is that at least Allison and her daughter can just move on now. The trial would have been worth the heart ache if they could have hung the ba st ard, but now, well, I guess the upside is that they can close this chapter of this bad Book, and move into the future where things can get better. There will be more chapters, but maybe, at least, they will be different, and the heaviness can drift into the past. I mean, nothing can change what he did to her anyway. Bad thing is that he is free to do it again.
I've missed a lot of this story. So he "confessed" to killing the Ramsey girl, but he didn't really do it. I heard something about a computer, but don't know the details. What is it he did that he's in trouble for now? And why on earth would he confess to something as horrible as killing a little girl, if he didn't do it? Not that I expect anyone to be able to answer that last question, of course. It just amazes me that someone would do that.
Transcripts from the show I mentioned. The show opened with Karr's recording of what happend to this little girl with him pleading with someone to help, intersperced throughout the show with video or audio of him saying it was accidental, etc.
Now the implication from him is that he had nothing to do with it. It's mind spinning to say the very least.
The computer lost had information about his alleged attacks on children, not nec Jon Benet and somehow it got "lost" so they couldn't proceed forward with prosecution of alleged crimes.
I missed the first half of the interview (thanks for the transcript, Shell) but what I saw on the second half made me ill. Especially when the subject of a book and/or movie came up. Why this guy should profit from what he did is beyond me.
You know, Larry (bless his heart) tried so hard to get the point across that the hoopla started with Karr's bizzare statements and actions. Karr was trying to bring himself across as some victim in all of this. Sick, sick, sick! No, he hasn't been found guilty of anything, but he can not justify anything but having a sick, twisted, perverted mind to have written and said what he has. And he wants to continue teaching???? Anybody in Atlanta who even considers hiring him is nuts.
I could be wrong, but I thought I understood that even though the computer was lost, the entire contents of the hard drive were preserved. The reason the case was thrown out was that the defense showed that whatever was posted on the drive was posted before Karr moved to California, and therefore there were no California laws broken. Wherever he lived when the postings were made might have jurisdiction to charge him, but now without the computer, it may be harder to prove or the jurisdictions don't have laws covering it. Who knows?
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pond
that case was so high profile in hind sight the media did a awful awful thing to that poor family.
but at the time it was so very horrifc and frightening all the kids home for the holidays and people wanted to feel they caught the guy or girl who did it.
I feel bad for them now and I do hope they get the person who did it.
this guy from out of the country should be in jail just for being creepy enough on his own without a crime.
his history is really sick.
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excathedra
and he's quite obsessed with little children i hear
do you think we'll know these kind of answers in the "hereafter"
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coupcake
I read the DNA did not match. Whatever the case is this guy is bad news.
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excathedra
i feel really sorry for his boys
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Eagle
DNA came back on this guy...it isn't a match.
Eagle
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Ductape
Early reports said he was out, now I see on the net he goes back to California for child porn charges.
General Population in a major pen is to good for this freak.
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pond
I think we wont have a need to know anymore ex.
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medic's wife
As a former "show kid" myself...this case has always haunted me. There are ALWAYS the PREDS out there.
But I truly do not Think Patsy EVER had a thing to do with it.
Why did SHE come under the gun and not the dad nor the brother????
Ususally a mom involved with a talented kid might live a little 'vicariously" through that child....she would NEVER kill her....I don't think
I was so hoping for vindication of Patsy.
Why Have they not looked closer at that MALE realtives????
I think the police in CO have bothchered this case BEYOND solving
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J0nny Ling0
I think that this:
Is what is really going on. I didn't know he had charges against him in Thailand, and this provides an excellent reason for him to "confess" the way he did. He probably got into following the case for his own twisted and perverted reasons, and then when he got into trouble in Thailand, knew tht he had left a "cyber paper trail", that would help get him out of Thailand where he could be coddled by our sorry a$$ed legal system here in the states. I mean, if all he is facing is "child pornography charges" in Cali, then he'll make out just fine. I mean remember how that Connecticut judge gave some guy only six months for raping a six month old child? An Infant?
And then of course there is my old elementary school friend whose fourteen year old mildly retarded was seduced and molested for a year by my friends own brand new husband (the sick ****!), and led into all of the sex acts, who is now on the verge of walking away from it. Yeah, my friend is so steamed and wants it all to end so badly and has no real money that she is near to the point of saying "screw it" and walking away from it all and not fighting it when they let him walk....
Yeah, I would say that this perv made a wise move, to get out of Thailand. Somebody simply needs to put a bullet between his eyes. A nice hollow point .44 magnum would do the job quite nicely...
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medic's wife
Johnny Lingo...you are So correct...a bullet would do him better than he deserves.
What truly troubles me is how these Boulder CO bottched the case so badly.
What troubles me more is the fact that Jon Benet is forever silenced.
If you cannot tell already, I a a victim of a crime.
Jon Benet must have been the bravest little girl....and I think she is someone's personal angel as we speak.
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topoftheworld
I finished reviewing the 98 page affadavit. I won't post a link here, because it is truly disturbing and difficult even to just glean info from, let alone read and absorb, without getting sick. Reading through it, though, made it easy to understand why the DA's office wanted to either include or exclude this creep one way or another.
He is sick, twisted, perverted and worthy of a lot more than he will get if extradited to California to face the charges there. Only good thing is that now he is known for what he is. If found guilty of the misdeamenor charges he faces, he will have to register as a sex offender, and anyone in their right mind will raise alarms from this moment forward if he comes anywhere near a child.
Hopefully, he will have little or no peace the rest of his life, and he brought this upon himself by his own sick actions. Justice will find him-one way or another.
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HAPe4me
I admit I am disappointed that the evidence cleared Karr. It was worth the try anyway. I in no way can find fault with the DA for going after him to make sure, and I applaud her for stickihng er job on the line to give it a go. Unfortunateely, it may cost her the job, even though she is very qualified, and was highly thought of by her peers. For several months, the guy had been warming up via emails for his outright confession of the crime he didn't do. Even going so far as getting messages to Patsy Ramsey before her death, implicating his guilt.
For this reason, I disagree with JLingo on the confession being a way to get out of Thailand. the guy is sick, no question, but not a murderer. (yet, anyway. It remains to be seen if his condession eventually becomes a self fulfilling prophecy) At least now he is in the databases, and if and when he is freed, he will be watched. That is a very good thing that arose from Boulder's pursuit of him.
Since I live nearby, I have followed this case from its Christmas eve beginning so many years ago. While nobody can applaud the Boulder police, it seems they had many obstacles to overcome from the git go. The initial investigation was not done well, and was shoddy in the beginning stages at the house that night. They did finally get it together, and there is much that has been witheld from the public. HOWEVER, with our grandstanding governor sticking his nose in it and virtually demanding that they find a way to charge Patsy, they almost were forced to put aside other efforts. The DA at the time ridiculed the police, for not finding a way to charge Mrs. Ramsey.
SHE DID NOT DO IT. I was and am, very convinced of that. I saw her tears, I heard her voice, I know people who know her. I hope they finally find the person who DID, since at this time he ( I guess remotely could be a she) is still out there somewhere, perhaps in your village.
As we all know now, there was never enough to charge Patsy Ramsey, not evidence, motive, opportunity or anything else. There was even less reason to pursue Dad or brother. To answer medicwife, both were outright cleared early in the investigation, due to DNA and OTHER evidence.
I disagree that the case was or is now seriously "botched". NONE of the mistakes made by the police department then or now likely prevented, or will prevent an arrest, but they did give false hope to millions who are infatuated with this case. The plain facts are, the perp's DNA is not yet in the national databases. Nobody has been found that meets the criteria for charging murder.
What exactly do you feel was botched? Every lead has been followed, and if new ones arise, they too will be followed. I They will find him sometime., or they will not.
One thing that disturbs me however is that while this cute little white girl's death was an absolute travesty, why is it that the death of young non-white non-rich children barely can find the way to a single front page? Yet Jon Benet gets worldwide attention 10 years later? We follow the money way too much IMHO.
~HAP
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J0nny Ling0
Well, I didn't say he was not a sicko. Like I said before, I thought he was up to these sick sick communications with the college professor and anyone else because he was getting off on thinking of himself as the one who did it. But when he got into trouble in Thailand, ALSO found a very convenient way to get himself extradited due to his "cyber paper trail".
And Hap I totally agree with you on this:
Reminds me of the book "A Time To Kill" (John Grisham) when in the defense lawyer's attempt to clear his client for shooting the brutal rapists of his little daughter in his conluding statement, he described the whole sordid scene, then told the jury to close their eyes and then asked them to "just imagine if this little girl was white".
And that got the black father off the hook for killing his daughters' rapists...
I have often thought it amazing that this little girl, whose parents dressed her up like that, got so much attention, and yet in the wake of it all, there have been many many rape/murders ofpoor little black girls, who only get a small blip on the radar screen...
Maybe if it happened like that to the daughter of Halle Berry, we would see the same outrage, I don't know.....
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topoftheworld
It gained so much attention because of the little girl's participation in the pagents. I recall those images as being the first thing splashed all over every front page and TV show. The media was who propelled this story to the front pages, thanks to their research or whoever provided the footage from the pagents to them. As usual, it was ratings that pushed the story along, thanks in part to those very images. As soon as the story heated up again, the very same images were dug up again.
It is sick and unfair, but a fact of life. Hap is right-stories like this get much more play than others which are just as tragic. Someone is looking at demographics and deciding what we want to see, not what we should see. And, they milk these types of stories to the last drop. There are so many other cold cases in this country which are yet to be solved, but they don't get the same coverage. Lack of pictures, lack of videos, lack of titillation keeps these stories local only or buried for good. Sad-but true.
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J0nny Ling0
By the way, this just in. You all may remember the thread I started about a friend whose daughter had been sexually abused by my friends new husband? The friend of mine whose daughter is mildly retartded, whose new step father molested her for a year and led her into many many sex acts? Well, I just got an e-mail from her this morning, and I will post here what she told me, and what the DA told her:
And so, my sweet friend from fifth grade, my fifth grade girlfriend and her sweet sixteen year old daughter have just gotten the shaft from the "justice" system. Her daughter was fourteen when it started, and at fifteen, my friend walked in on them and he was naked with a hard on, making her do an "act". But that doesn't matter, they are throwing the case out! WTF!!?? But the girl is mildly retarded you see, and doesn't nderstand anything other than "he made me do all of these things...."
Sorry for the de-rail, but, it is sort of related. And, I x'd out her daughter's name and the town they are from...
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medic's wife
Dearest Johny Lingo
I am so sad to see the "system" fail so badly once again
It failed on me, too
I honestly cry when I read things like this....that is w I do my volunteer work
Look up National CASA online
I'm a local volunteer. And I swear upn oath I will keep these kids away from these "preds" as much as I can!!
This poor girl you mention will NOT feel Vindicated...an important part of the healing process.
I never had that either.
BUT I became a woman that is "dead set" on geting kids OUT of these situations!!!!
Much Love to you Johnny....and a big HUG
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medic's wife
Can we do a new thread entitled "STAMP OUT PERVS PERIOD"""??
Do a Google search for CASA Natonal. Stands for "Court Appointed Special Advocate"
That's what I am
I fight against this ilk every day
It takes training folks....fund raising....HELL raising. You name it.
But I will give up on this cause when I aM COLD AND IN THE GRAVE.
This whole thing just ....es me off....royally
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J0nny Ling0
Yeah, pi$$es me off royally too. And now my friend "Allison" (I think I called her that in that thread I started when I told the story) has to tell her daughter that this slime gets to get away with all that he did to her.
Well now, I guess that the upside to it is that at least Allison and her daughter can just move on now. The trial would have been worth the heart ache if they could have hung the ba st ard, but now, well, I guess the upside is that they can close this chapter of this bad Book, and move into the future where things can get better. There will be more chapters, but maybe, at least, they will be different, and the heaviness can drift into the past. I mean, nothing can change what he did to her anyway. Bad thing is that he is free to do it again.
CASA huh?
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excathedra
hap, you have any thoughts re: the detective steve thomas ?
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Stayed Too Long
Confesses to another murder.
Click 'Get Image' after web page appears for new murder confession.
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Shellon
This guy being interviewed by Larry King tonight.
He's lying through his fidgety eyes and sweaty forehead.
They lost the computer with all the evidence so it doesn't matter.
Atlanta, watch your babies and he wants to teach again. Never convicted of nuttin, so he might.
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Bluzeman
I've missed a lot of this story. So he "confessed" to killing the Ramsey girl, but he didn't really do it. I heard something about a computer, but don't know the details. What is it he did that he's in trouble for now? And why on earth would he confess to something as horrible as killing a little girl, if he didn't do it? Not that I expect anyone to be able to answer that last question, of course. It just amazes me that someone would do that.
Rick
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Shellon
Transcripts from the show I mentioned. The show opened with Karr's recording of what happend to this little girl with him pleading with someone to help, intersperced throughout the show with video or audio of him saying it was accidental, etc.
Now the implication from him is that he had nothing to do with it. It's mind spinning to say the very least.
The computer lost had information about his alleged attacks on children, not nec Jon Benet and somehow it got "lost" so they couldn't proceed forward with prosecution of alleged crimes.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0610/16/lkl.01.html
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topoftheworld
You know, this just makes me sick.
I missed the first half of the interview (thanks for the transcript, Shell) but what I saw on the second half made me ill. Especially when the subject of a book and/or movie came up. Why this guy should profit from what he did is beyond me.
You know, Larry (bless his heart) tried so hard to get the point across that the hoopla started with Karr's bizzare statements and actions. Karr was trying to bring himself across as some victim in all of this. Sick, sick, sick! No, he hasn't been found guilty of anything, but he can not justify anything but having a sick, twisted, perverted mind to have written and said what he has. And he wants to continue teaching???? Anybody in Atlanta who even considers hiring him is nuts.
I could be wrong, but I thought I understood that even though the computer was lost, the entire contents of the hard drive were preserved. The reason the case was thrown out was that the defense showed that whatever was posted on the drive was posted before Karr moved to California, and therefore there were no California laws broken. Wherever he lived when the postings were made might have jurisdiction to charge him, but now without the computer, it may be harder to prove or the jurisdictions don't have laws covering it. Who knows?
Whatever---just--yuck!!
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