Evolving Religion

[Abigail]

The book I am reading, which I shared a bit about in a previous thread, covers a great deal of the history of Judaism and how it has evolved and changed over time. I am finding it very fascinating. Here's a simplified summary.

According to the author, the Torah (O.T.) was originally written after the destruction of the first Temple during the invasion of Babylon. The reason it was put into writing was because the Jewish people wanted to preserve their laws and legends. - they were afraid it would be lost as the Jews were scattered. Hence the notion that the books weren't actually written by Moses and an explanation for some of the contradictions.

The Mishna (Oral Traditions/laws) were then put into writing shortly after the destruction of the second temple (which historically may actually have been a third) after the Romans invaded, for the same reason. The author views the Mishna as an incredibly inventive and valuable evolution of Judaism. The Rabbi's who wrote it, were finding a way to adapt to a world that would not tolerate the strict orthodox interpretation and practice of the laws. As they also recorded their debates over the meaning of these laws and traditions, and how they were to be applied. The Mishna and the Gemarah (debates) are what make up the Talmud.

In the process, the Jews evolved from "fighting religion" to one that became increasingly more interested in peace and more focused on study, rather than war. Even today, the Rabbi's debate what it all means and how it is to be practiced.

Now, look at Christianity, or Muslim, or almost any older religion and it seems that those religions also evolve. Do you think, at some point in the future, we will evolve spiritually to the place where we all agree? Or at least to a place where we can all live together peaceably?

[Stayed Too Long]

Do you think, at some point in the future, we will evolve spiritually to the place where we all agree? Or at least to a place where we can all live together peaceably?

There are so many intrepretions of the bible today, even though it states it is of no private intrepretation. If it were possible to let it intrepret itself, so everyone would know it was the correct one, why are there so many around? Just within Christianity there are thousands of "right dividings". How can this be possible? Expecting these thousands of Christian religions to agree is slim to nothing, and then throw in the Jewish religion, which ignores the New Testament.....well easier to part the Red Sea or move mountains.

Edited August 16, 2006 by Stayed Too Long

[waysider]

Abigail---------I sense from your last two questions this issue must weigh heavy on your heart, Mine too. In my opinion ( and that's all it is), yes there will be peace and agreement, but it won't be on this earth. It seems like the older you get, the harder it becomes to make any sense of war, or at least the wars we are seeing in our lifetimes. Maybe religon evolves alongside our perception of this world we live in.

[Bramble]

'Do you think, at some point in the future, we will evolve spiritually to the place where we all agree? Or at least to a place where we can all live together peaceably?'

I don't know that people will ever all agree. I would be quite content if people would get past the notion that 'my way' is the only right and true way, all others are false and evil and destroying the world/humanity etc. To me it seems obvious that so many people, holding that same view of their very different beliefs, are primed for conflict and wars in the name of their god(s). Not to mention conflict with family members, neighbors, co workers etc who think differently than they.

Sigh...but then I spent most of my adult years in a cult...conflict with unbelievers was a good thing. It meant we were taking a stand and all that...

[Abigail]

There was a time, when the different sects within Judaism fought with and killed each other. There are still those (albeit they are increasingly few in number) who will shun those from a different sect - tell them they are not really Jewish.

I see this same thing occuring within the Muslim community. The Sunni's v the Shihites (SP), for example. It has also occured within Christianity. But it seems the Jews, for the most part, have grown past the desire to kill other Jews who have slightly differing beliefs. I think the Christians, for the most part, have as well. So I am hopeful that someday the Muslims will l also evolve past this. And perhaps one day, we will all grow to the point where we can agree to disagree, or accept each other regardless of our differences.

Interfaith dialogue could go a long way toward moving this along.

[GarthP2000]

Abigail,

It seems your model of evolutionary change (for the better, no doubt) might have a few throwbacks in it. Ie., examples of certain factions of various religions (sometimes known as staunch fundamentalists) who seem to be resisting said evolutionary change. I think VPW's TWI was a classic case of one of them.

Overall change in any group of people usually will incur various (to use a term I saw elsewhere on this board ;) ) 'hacks' to fight the change, no matter how ludicrous their reasoning for doing so. And I think that fear is at the basis of this resistance.

[Abigail]

You are correct, Garth. Historically and presently. But it has been fascinating to read about how the changes within Judaism have occured and are still occuring today. Most have them have come about out of adversity and a need to adapt, as the Jews scattered throughout the world. Most of those changes have faced resistance from within in addition to the conflicts they were facing from without. Yet ironically, even those who were resistent unknowingly eventually adopted many of the changes as well - it just took them longer.

I would also say, I think many of the changes have been an improvement.

[GT]

Dig deeper.

You might find that judaism, islam, christianity have their roots in Egyptian and Babylonian mythology.

Egyptians would be proud to know their gods were still being worshiped, indirectly, 5.000 years later.

[GarthP2000]

GreasyTech,

Well technically, one could say that all of our gods/deities/spiritual beings have evolved (in one form or another) from the earliest sun gods or unseen sprites in the woods or supposed ghosts, all whom the earliest bronze age voodoo doctors/shammans tried to appease/cajole/pray for better crops/etc. They just evolved/morphed into more sophisticated forms, to now we have gods that are appeased/preached about from televangelists. <_<

What's more sophisticated about the current day, you may ask? Televangelists wear MUCH nicer suits than the bronze age priest/voodoo doctor did.

[Bramble]

Dig deeper.

You might find that judaism, islam, christianity have their roots in Egyptian and Babylonian mythology.

Egyptians would be proud to know their gods were still being worshiped, indirectly, 5.000 years later.

The Horus/Jesus similarities are pretty amazing.

[Abigail]

Actually, the author does touch on that in a number of places throughout the book. I guess I didn't bring them up because it wasn't really new information to me.