We moved back stateside, and we let the kids play around the neighborhood. I got the local newspaper and within a couple months we had a drive-by shooting 2 blocks away, then I was noticing 'attempted' child-abductions on my block [men driving by and trying to pull girls into their cars].
My daughter is almost 13 and I get absolutely freaked out when I don't know where she is. I had her check in with me every so often when she was younger and ask her to do that now when she is away at a friend's not in the neighborhood. She forgets sometimes, however it is getting better.
We had a discussion the other day when I thought she was coming staight home from school and she was at the library. I found her and explained how it really frightens me not to know exactly where she is because that is the best defense against anything happening to her that shouldn't. I told her that while we can't dwell on bad things happening, we want to guard against that. It's like locking your house or car up to prevent a potential issue.
I would have the kids stay close and check in often. Maybe have them only go 3 or 4 houses away if they have friends in that perimeter. Normal, imho, doesn't exist.
I'm sorry that our world is like it is now. When I grew up in even this little town, we rode our bikes all over, walked, we had no worries about any bad folks.
Now, raising my 9 year old in same little town, I never ever ever allow her to be out alone, even in our yard.
She walks to the neighbors and even then I walk here there or at the very least, I stand outside and watch her walk into their door.
I hate that it has to be like that, but it's the way it is.
We've never had a child taken in this area, altho domestic violence and child abuse seems to be very prevelant here; they say because of the low income.
Teaching my child to fear? Maybe, but I'd rather she know that there is stuff to be very concerned about out there and know what to do to protect herself.
Child predators unfortunately are out there like never before in history and it's sad that out children can't play safely.
I study this stuff in school all the time and it makes it worse for me, which isn't good. I ended up scaring my child by trying to explain to her too much and it caused problems with her sleep, behavior, schooling, etc.
What I learned from that experience was a reminder that we need to protect them and teach them but according to their age level and understanding, like we teach them other life skills and instructions.
I find it sad that I have to do a background check on her friends parents, teachers, neighbors, etc., but it's my job.
Sexual offenders are SUPPOSED to register their current address and it's available to you, the parent and neighbor to read.
There is no way to absolutely protect them every second of every day, I'm aware of that, but I think it behooves us to do so every second that we can. Walmart... never out of my sight. The local grocery....never out of my sight.
She's 9 now and in too few years she'll be going more places that I can't control as much.
She'll be fully prepared and know what to do and if she fails to do so then I'll be her chaperone on alot of outings.
I don't think it would being teaching them fear...just a healthy respect for the not-so-good things around them.
By respect, I don't mean the "look up to kind", but I'm using that term the way we respect bad thunderstorms for the damage they can do.
I don't recall the exact ages of your children, but one of the things I would consider is buying them a "call home cell phone". You can buy a prepaid phone and phone card. I think you han restrict the numbers called on it...but I would definitely have the 2 of them stay within shouting distance of each other and have one of them keep this on them.
Use a digital watch if the children are too young to get the reading of a regular watch and tell them when you expect them to call...when the watch reads 2:15 for example.
Something else you may have to do it organize them and you for things to do together out of the house. Library...does the area have a pool in summer...those kinds of things. Are there playgrounds where they can meet and play with other children while you're there so you have the peace of mind of knowing they're safe AND they have freedom to explore?
Is there a boys club? How about a Police Athletic League?
You can't structure all their time...that's not letting them be kids! But you can make arrangements for safe secure play time and events if it's not a good idea to go too far off the block.
You're earning your "mommy striipes" here. I'm sure you'll pull it off. I doubt your children will consider it fear in the negative sense because of how you will present it to them. You demonstrate a definitely I'm with you, kids. I'm fighting with you and for you attitude...they'll pick up what you want them to understand.
I do keep them pretty busy with structured activities. In the summer they go to a daycamp while I am at work - swimming, visiting retirement homes, crafts, field trips. . .
On my days off I like taking them to the beach or the park, etc. Plus they are usually activie in at least one sport at all times.
But they do need some downtime. Aaron is reaching an age where he doesn't want mom watching over him all the time. Last summer he would get upset because I didn't want him riding his bike three blocks away to a friend's house by himself. And he really really wanted to go down to the corner store by himself.
No way was I letting him do that - I've seen the groups of boys and men who hang out in front of that store. Eventually I compromised on that one by having an adult neighbor go with him.
I let them roam the entire block and checked on them frequently. But this past few days I keep thinking - it only takes a few seconds to grab a kid and force them into a car. And despite all I've tried to teach them about talking to strangers, etc. Aaron really is still very niave in many ways.
I do try to get them to play in pairs or groups instead of going off by themselves, but there is no guarantee they will stay together. Last summer Aaron lost his brother in the alley behind a friends house, just forgot about him and went back to the boy's house. Poor Jacob was three houses away from the boy's house and didn't know how to get back there. He just stood in the alley and yelled - I heard him and went and got him.
I have considered packing up and moving again. But the reality is, it is unlikely we are going to find a neighborhood much better for what we can afford to pay. It used to be you could rent a house in a decent neighborhood for $500 - $600 a month. Now a house in a decent neighborhood is likely to run you at least $800 - $900 a month.
The owners are selling the house we used to live in. $82,000. I was floored they were asking that much. The place was totally run down, leaking water pipes, roof looked like it was ready to cave in any day now. One bedroom has no heat. The kitchen was a hallway with a stove and fridge. It was tiny, tiny, tiny, which is why we finally left our beloved neighborhood for a bigger home.
my neighborhood seems okay but of course i teach my child all the stuff. i started reading books on how to teach him when he started walking i think :)-->
he has a cell phone. it is my tracking device. even when he's going from one place to another he gives me a call just to let me know. i like to know where he is but i'm tired of driving all around the neighborhood - that's why the cell. plus when they were building a fort in the woods and heard a noise he called me and i was there in less than 5 minutes.
i pray a lot.
your kids are still pretty little, abi. i can remember going on the next block where my son wanted to play in a street hockey game. he was probably 6 or 7. i sat there in my car the entire time watching him play (it was cold out).
ps. walkie talkies are a lot cheaper and work great other parents have told me.
(one time i read that kids can't really judge the distance of a car when crossing the street until they are about 8 years old. that freaked me out and i thought about it all the time, thank god he's past 8 and he's real careful crossing the street)
Haven't heard anything yet, ExC. I have seen fliers posted up at gas stations and such and someone left one on our door yesterday. I still can't figure out why this wasn't front page news. If someone saw her in the paper they might know something.
How do you handle these issues with your children? How do explain to them the reasons why the streets are so unsafe without instilling them with fear instead of caution?
abi, let me know if you want me to find some of the books i got about what to say to your kids to help them be wise without making them basketcases ? PT me and i'll send you whatever i have
They found her body and have arrested an "aquaintence of the family" who just got out of prison a few months ago.
Please keep her family in your prayers.
I also found out this morning, we have 17 (yes 17) registered sex offenders within about a 5 block radious of our home. Three of them committed crimes involving minors under the age of 13 and one of them is a repeat offender.
Given what I know about the high recidivism rate of such offenders I am very very upset. IF we stay in this house through the summer, we will be finishing off the fence around the yard and putting LOCKED gates on it. The boys will NOT be allowed to roam the block freely anymore - not without an adult.
EXC please check private topics.
I am distraught beyond words over all of this - the loss this child and the horrendous terror she must have experienced. The fear for the safety of my own children. Outrage that these people are allowed not only back out on the streets again but are in neighborhoods where there are LOTS of young children for them to prey upon.
Dear Abigail, Even though I have never lived in an area like you haved described, my heart really goes out to you, I can't even begin to fathom how you must feel. Just wanted to let you know that you are in my prayers.
If this is the Michigan case, there was no Amber Alert issued on Saturday, when the girl was last seen, because she left her grandmother's house willingly with this "acquaintance of the family." The Amber Alert was issued on Sunday.
There's a website to check on Amber Alerts, if you're interested:
Yes its the same case, Pirate. My understanding was that she left "willingly" but under "suspicious circumstances". Who knows what the hell that means. In either case, there was a very short blurb in the back of the paper the day after she diappeared and nothing on the front pages until several days later. From the sounds of it, front page or not may not have saved her life - but it could save someone else's. :(-->
Cowgirl - this is the first time I've ever lived in a neighborhoodl like this too. I spent my early childhood in a very small and very safe town. I guess I always saw this city through those same eyes until the past couple of weeks.
Sad to say, but I think kids should not be allowed to play around the 'hood without supervision until they are big enough to defend themselves and cognitive enough to know when a situation is dangerous or possibly dangerous...and fast enough to run like hell when needed.
It drove my son nuts, but he was saved from some very "lewd fellows of the baser sort". Today, he's glad I put my foot down.
We now live in a small town, and my kids do have more freedom than they did when we lived in a big city. They can ride their bikes to the pool or to a friend's house. We know almost everyone on our block, the block behind us, and the block north of us, know where many of their school friends live, know their parents--and where they work.
When we lived in the big city I heard gunfire more than once, the school was locked down two times. Nothing like that here.
But here we don't have enforced leash laws, though people will call the sherriff about dogs. That was a big change.
I'm so sorry about that little girl in your neighborhood, Abigail.
We've had so many cases in CA like that, far far too many. It is heart breaking. I can't imagine how the parents live through it.
I was always totally PARANOID when my daughter was little. We lived in an apartment complex that had a court yard and I always watched her. There were other little kids that lived there, mostly girls, and I would have them over for juice and kind of watch them too when they ran around with my daughter. Even if she walked through the complex to her friend's apartment, I would walk with her.
When she took the school bus home, I would wait outside the complex for the bus, even though it dropped her off right in front of the complex. I'd see other kids get off by themselves.
Now she's 16 and goes all over the place. Like Exie, I pray a lot. And she has a cell phone. If I don't know where she is, I call her. I get a little panicked if she doesn't answer. (and ....ed!)
One day I called and she and her friends had driven up "into the mountains." Geeeesh
But as for being little, it was in the 50's and I wandered around the neighborhood from one friend's house to another...and I know I was under 7 years old, because we moved from that house when I was 7.
I remember some guy working with a maintenace crew in the street asking me would I "go off with him? It's now or never." It gave me a kind of icky feeling. He might have just been kidding around. Who knows.
My mom once said, "I didn't worry because I couldn't see why some one would want to steal a kid." I guess she was pretty naive.
I don't know what it's going to take for this to stop or what we can do for our babies.
Like all other things raising them, I guess. Teach and teach and teach and since we can't trust anyone else out there, we gotta find a way to trust what we've taught them.
Shell and Abi are better parents than I. Looking back I remember there were times that I let Ryan out of my sight for a few minutes while I attended to something necessary. It did not enter my mind that someone was capable to think of doing what I thought was the unthinkable or that someone was capable looking at him with different eyes than mine which were filled with such love and compassion whenever I looked at him. Thankfully Someone with much bigger eyes than mine was covering for me during those times of lapsed judgment.
We lived in Trenton, NJ and in Chicago, IL in some neighborhoods that rate at the bottom of the evolution poll.
There was a drug dealer across the street in our neighborhood in Chicago (we won't even go into how horrible Trenton was....suffice to say it was a PIT of evil), there were shootings in the park, there was a gang house very very nearby. Steve!'s car window was shot out while we were on our honeymoon.
All of this was totally unaceptable....we were determined to move, no matter the cost, at the earliest opportunity.
While we were in those neighborhoods we put into place a myriad of precautions (mostly common sense). One of the things we did and continue to do is to is establish a family codeword.
No matter who it is, what uniform they wear, or what they say...if they do not know the code word for our family....our children do not budge an inch...unless it is to run screaming for *911*.
We had one close call with our oldest daughter...but because of our talks with her, the code word, and her own self-worth...she walked away (with a few choice and very appropriate words).
We will NEVER settle for the "unsafe" neighborhood again....we moved...whatever the cost....our children are MORE than worth a few extra bucks.
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Galen
Scary
We moved back stateside, and we let the kids play around the neighborhood. I got the local newspaper and within a couple months we had a drive-by shooting 2 blocks away, then I was noticing 'attempted' child-abductions on my block [men driving by and trying to pull girls into their cars].
Man some places crime is just terrible.
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reikilady
My daughter is almost 13 and I get absolutely freaked out when I don't know where she is. I had her check in with me every so often when she was younger and ask her to do that now when she is away at a friend's not in the neighborhood. She forgets sometimes, however it is getting better.
We had a discussion the other day when I thought she was coming staight home from school and she was at the library. I found her and explained how it really frightens me not to know exactly where she is because that is the best defense against anything happening to her that shouldn't. I told her that while we can't dwell on bad things happening, we want to guard against that. It's like locking your house or car up to prevent a potential issue.
I would have the kids stay close and check in often. Maybe have them only go 3 or 4 houses away if they have friends in that perimeter. Normal, imho, doesn't exist.
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Shellon
I'm sorry that our world is like it is now. When I grew up in even this little town, we rode our bikes all over, walked, we had no worries about any bad folks.
Now, raising my 9 year old in same little town, I never ever ever allow her to be out alone, even in our yard.
She walks to the neighbors and even then I walk here there or at the very least, I stand outside and watch her walk into their door.
I hate that it has to be like that, but it's the way it is.
We've never had a child taken in this area, altho domestic violence and child abuse seems to be very prevelant here; they say because of the low income.
Teaching my child to fear? Maybe, but I'd rather she know that there is stuff to be very concerned about out there and know what to do to protect herself.
Child predators unfortunately are out there like never before in history and it's sad that out children can't play safely.
I study this stuff in school all the time and it makes it worse for me, which isn't good. I ended up scaring my child by trying to explain to her too much and it caused problems with her sleep, behavior, schooling, etc.
What I learned from that experience was a reminder that we need to protect them and teach them but according to their age level and understanding, like we teach them other life skills and instructions.
I find it sad that I have to do a background check on her friends parents, teachers, neighbors, etc., but it's my job.
Sexual offenders are SUPPOSED to register their current address and it's available to you, the parent and neighbor to read.
There is no way to absolutely protect them every second of every day, I'm aware of that, but I think it behooves us to do so every second that we can. Walmart... never out of my sight. The local grocery....never out of my sight.
She's 9 now and in too few years she'll be going more places that I can't control as much.
She'll be fully prepared and know what to do and if she fails to do so then I'll be her chaperone on alot of outings.
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krys
I don't think it would being teaching them fear...just a healthy respect for the not-so-good things around them.
By respect, I don't mean the "look up to kind", but I'm using that term the way we respect bad thunderstorms for the damage they can do.
I don't recall the exact ages of your children, but one of the things I would consider is buying them a "call home cell phone". You can buy a prepaid phone and phone card. I think you han restrict the numbers called on it...but I would definitely have the 2 of them stay within shouting distance of each other and have one of them keep this on them.
Use a digital watch if the children are too young to get the reading of a regular watch and tell them when you expect them to call...when the watch reads 2:15 for example.
Something else you may have to do it organize them and you for things to do together out of the house. Library...does the area have a pool in summer...those kinds of things. Are there playgrounds where they can meet and play with other children while you're there so you have the peace of mind of knowing they're safe AND they have freedom to explore?
Is there a boys club? How about a Police Athletic League?
You can't structure all their time...that's not letting them be kids! But you can make arrangements for safe secure play time and events if it's not a good idea to go too far off the block.
You're earning your "mommy striipes" here. I'm sure you'll pull it off. I doubt your children will consider it fear in the negative sense because of how you will present it to them. You demonstrate a definitely I'm with you, kids. I'm fighting with you and for you attitude...they'll pick up what you want them to understand.
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jen-o
all my kids have cell phones so i can keep track of them..
but when i was a kid we roamed freely without fear and i could get a whole bag of candy for 25 cents... yeah...some candies were 2 for a penny.
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Abigail
The boys are 5 and 7, will be 6 and 8 by summer.
I do keep them pretty busy with structured activities. In the summer they go to a daycamp while I am at work - swimming, visiting retirement homes, crafts, field trips. . .
On my days off I like taking them to the beach or the park, etc. Plus they are usually activie in at least one sport at all times.
But they do need some downtime. Aaron is reaching an age where he doesn't want mom watching over him all the time. Last summer he would get upset because I didn't want him riding his bike three blocks away to a friend's house by himself. And he really really wanted to go down to the corner store by himself.
No way was I letting him do that - I've seen the groups of boys and men who hang out in front of that store. Eventually I compromised on that one by having an adult neighbor go with him.
I let them roam the entire block and checked on them frequently. But this past few days I keep thinking - it only takes a few seconds to grab a kid and force them into a car. And despite all I've tried to teach them about talking to strangers, etc. Aaron really is still very niave in many ways.
I do try to get them to play in pairs or groups instead of going off by themselves, but there is no guarantee they will stay together. Last summer Aaron lost his brother in the alley behind a friends house, just forgot about him and went back to the boy's house. Poor Jacob was three houses away from the boy's house and didn't know how to get back there. He just stood in the alley and yelled - I heard him and went and got him.
I have considered packing up and moving again. But the reality is, it is unlikely we are going to find a neighborhood much better for what we can afford to pay. It used to be you could rent a house in a decent neighborhood for $500 - $600 a month. Now a house in a decent neighborhood is likely to run you at least $800 - $900 a month.
The owners are selling the house we used to live in. $82,000. I was floored they were asking that much. The place was totally run down, leaking water pipes, roof looked like it was ready to cave in any day now. One bedroom has no heat. The kitchen was a hallway with a stove and fridge. It was tiny, tiny, tiny, which is why we finally left our beloved neighborhood for a bigger home.
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excathedra
that is a tough situation abi
my neighborhood seems okay but of course i teach my child all the stuff. i started reading books on how to teach him when he started walking i think
:)-->
he has a cell phone. it is my tracking device. even when he's going from one place to another he gives me a call just to let me know. i like to know where he is but i'm tired of driving all around the neighborhood - that's why the cell. plus when they were building a fort in the woods and heard a noise he called me and i was there in less than 5 minutes.
i pray a lot.
your kids are still pretty little, abi. i can remember going on the next block where my son wanted to play in a street hockey game. he was probably 6 or 7. i sat there in my car the entire time watching him play (it was cold out).
ps. walkie talkies are a lot cheaper and work great other parents have told me.
(one time i read that kids can't really judge the distance of a car when crossing the street until they are about 8 years old. that freaked me out and i thought about it all the time, thank god he's past 8 and he's real careful crossing the street)
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excathedra
ps. have you heard anything about 12-year-old girl who lives with her grandma ?
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Abigail
Haven't heard anything yet, ExC. I have seen fliers posted up at gas stations and such and someone left one on our door yesterday. I still can't figure out why this wasn't front page news. If someone saw her in the paper they might know something.
I am very worried about her.
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Shellon
No Amber Alert?
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excathedra
abi, let me know if you want me to find some of the books i got about what to say to your kids to help them be wise without making them basketcases ? PT me and i'll send you whatever i have
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Abigail
They found her body and have arrested an "aquaintence of the family" who just got out of prison a few months ago.
Please keep her family in your prayers.
I also found out this morning, we have 17 (yes 17) registered sex offenders within about a 5 block radious of our home. Three of them committed crimes involving minors under the age of 13 and one of them is a repeat offender.
Given what I know about the high recidivism rate of such offenders I am very very upset. IF we stay in this house through the summer, we will be finishing off the fence around the yard and putting LOCKED gates on it. The boys will NOT be allowed to roam the block freely anymore - not without an adult.
EXC please check private topics.
I am distraught beyond words over all of this - the loss this child and the horrendous terror she must have experienced. The fear for the safety of my own children. Outrage that these people are allowed not only back out on the streets again but are in neighborhoods where there are LOTS of young children for them to prey upon.
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Cowgirl
Dear Abigail, Even though I have never lived in an area like you haved described, my heart really goes out to you, I can't even begin to fathom how you must feel. Just wanted to let you know that you are in my prayers.
Cowgirl
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Pirate1974
How awful. I can't even imagine.
If this is the Michigan case, there was no Amber Alert issued on Saturday, when the girl was last seen, because she left her grandmother's house willingly with this "acquaintance of the family." The Amber Alert was issued on Sunday.
There's a website to check on Amber Alerts, if you're interested:
Team Amber Alert
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Abigail
Yes its the same case, Pirate. My understanding was that she left "willingly" but under "suspicious circumstances". Who knows what the hell that means. In either case, there was a very short blurb in the back of the paper the day after she diappeared and nothing on the front pages until several days later. From the sounds of it, front page or not may not have saved her life - but it could save someone else's.
:(-->
Cowgirl - this is the first time I've ever lived in a neighborhoodl like this too. I spent my early childhood in a very small and very safe town. I guess I always saw this city through those same eyes until the past couple of weeks.
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excathedra
large percentage of danger for poor little ones - people they know
http://www.cpiu.us/childsafety.php?name=
http://www.childlures.com/
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CoolWaters
Sad to say, but I think kids should not be allowed to play around the 'hood without supervision until they are big enough to defend themselves and cognitive enough to know when a situation is dangerous or possibly dangerous...and fast enough to run like hell when needed.
It drove my son nuts, but he was saved from some very "lewd fellows of the baser sort". Today, he's glad I put my foot down.
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Bramble
We now live in a small town, and my kids do have more freedom than they did when we lived in a big city. They can ride their bikes to the pool or to a friend's house. We know almost everyone on our block, the block behind us, and the block north of us, know where many of their school friends live, know their parents--and where they work.
When we lived in the big city I heard gunfire more than once, the school was locked down two times. Nothing like that here.
But here we don't have enforced leash laws, though people will call the sherriff about dogs. That was a big change.
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outandabout
I'm so sorry about that little girl in your neighborhood, Abigail.
We've had so many cases in CA like that, far far too many. It is heart breaking. I can't imagine how the parents live through it.
I was always totally PARANOID when my daughter was little. We lived in an apartment complex that had a court yard and I always watched her. There were other little kids that lived there, mostly girls, and I would have them over for juice and kind of watch them too when they ran around with my daughter. Even if she walked through the complex to her friend's apartment, I would walk with her.
When she took the school bus home, I would wait outside the complex for the bus, even though it dropped her off right in front of the complex. I'd see other kids get off by themselves.
Now she's 16 and goes all over the place. Like Exie, I pray a lot. And she has a cell phone. If I don't know where she is, I call her. I get a little panicked if she doesn't answer. (and ....ed!)
One day I called and she and her friends had driven up "into the mountains." Geeeesh
But as for being little, it was in the 50's and I wandered around the neighborhood from one friend's house to another...and I know I was under 7 years old, because we moved from that house when I was 7.
I remember some guy working with a maintenace crew in the street asking me would I "go off with him? It's now or never." It gave me a kind of icky feeling. He might have just been kidding around. Who knows.
My mom once said, "I didn't worry because I couldn't see why some one would want to steal a kid." I guess she was pretty naive.
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Shellon
Abi, I too am sorry to learn about Samantha.
I don't know what it's going to take for this to stop or what we can do for our babies.
Like all other things raising them, I guess. Teach and teach and teach and since we can't trust anyone else out there, we gotta find a way to trust what we've taught them.
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oenophile
Shell and Abi are better parents than I. Looking back I remember there were times that I let Ryan out of my sight for a few minutes while I attended to something necessary. It did not enter my mind that someone was capable to think of doing what I thought was the unthinkable or that someone was capable looking at him with different eyes than mine which were filled with such love and compassion whenever I looked at him. Thankfully Someone with much bigger eyes than mine was covering for me during those times of lapsed judgment.
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Cindy!
We lived in Trenton, NJ and in Chicago, IL in some neighborhoods that rate at the bottom of the evolution poll.
There was a drug dealer across the street in our neighborhood in Chicago (we won't even go into how horrible Trenton was....suffice to say it was a PIT of evil), there were shootings in the park, there was a gang house very very nearby. Steve!'s car window was shot out while we were on our honeymoon.
All of this was totally unaceptable....we were determined to move, no matter the cost, at the earliest opportunity.
While we were in those neighborhoods we put into place a myriad of precautions (mostly common sense). One of the things we did and continue to do is to is establish a family codeword.
No matter who it is, what uniform they wear, or what they say...if they do not know the code word for our family....our children do not budge an inch...unless it is to run screaming for *911*.
We had one close call with our oldest daughter...but because of our talks with her, the code word, and her own self-worth...she walked away (with a few choice and very appropriate words).
We will NEVER settle for the "unsafe" neighborhood again....we moved...whatever the cost....our children are MORE than worth a few extra bucks.
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excathedra
code word, healthy self esteem, etc., are good things you said
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Cindy!
yes, our new home is 400 dollars more a month....we changed our budget to accommodate...how hard is that?
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