If they didn't change their fundamental theological basis (such as what Armstrong's WW Church of God did), an apology would not change my disagreement with them.
The reason for this is because my theory is that all of the abuses stemmed from a fundamentally flawed theology, not that the abuses were an abberation of a fundamentally sound theology (such as the position held by a good portion of the posters here).
When I stop posting on gsc, the reason will have nothing to do with what twi does one way or the other.
I hear what you are saying but maybe I didn't make my thoughts clear. I didn't mean that doctrine or research of these different groups should not be discussed, I was more inferring it may be time to let go of any animosity toward certain individuals and move forward. Are we out for blood? Would God want the browbeating to continue? What does the Word say?
If discussions were to continue, then would you include discussing the World Wide Church of God, not just TWI. Why pick on one organization over another, you could include most religions in this type of discussion. I personally don't agree with most of the religious groups in this world?
I hear what you are saying but maybe I didn't make my thoughts clear. I didn't mean that doctrine or research of these different groups should not be discussed, I was more inferring it may be time to let go of any animosity toward certain individuals and move forward. Are we out for blood? Would God want the browbeating to continue? What does the Word say?
Lorna,
I'm really not out for "blood" now, per se. Actually, the theory I espouse treats the perpetrators with a considerable amount of mercy, as they would be victims of the theology they preached, as well as the commonly known and acknowledged victims, some of whom post here. Exposing the flaws of that theology, even tangentally (such as the threads that refer to connections between twi and liberty lobby, twi holocaust denial, etc.), help shed light where the darkness exists.
As far as holding onto any personal animosity, yeah, I tend to agree with you. However, shedding light onto their works of darkness is very appropriate.
Most people on this board know I'm Catholic. I have never denied that there have been some priests (approx 2-4% from 1960-1980) who were unable to control their urges toward pre-teen and young teen boys. I've looked into the causes of this and believe I understand what those causes were. I have also talked about the sins of Pope Paul IV and have seen the errors there (a major scandal that resulted in the establishment of much of Protestantism)
It would be very possible for me to be a practicing Catholic and be in total ignorance of those scandals. There are many in the Church who would have preferred to have kept the clergy abuse scandal quiet and under wraps. But it was important to expose that dark chapter in Church history to the light. Because it showed how corrupt many in the Church hierarchy has gotten...and now there are many, like me, who watch the actions of that hierarchy very carefully.
Now the analogy falls apart at this point: had the Church hierarchy actually followed established guidance, it's likely that the clergy abuse scandal would never have occurred...or would have been dwarfed in its scope compared to what happened. My belief is, in the case of TWI, many of the abuses can be traced back to the theology that was taught.
But the critical point is this: bringing the light of the facts to the situation dispel the darkness. So exposing the abuses and the abusers, along with an analysis of the reasons for that abuse, is a good thing. Keeping it up is also a good thing, at least until such time as the structural changes needed to truly correct those problems has occurred.
If discussions were to continue, then would you include discussing the World Wide Church of God, not just TWI. Why pick on one organization over another, you could include most religions in this type of discussion. I personally don't agree with most of the religious groups in this world?
Personally, I think discussions of Armstrong's group, the JW's, or any other group are out of scope for this board, unless they relate back to how twi functioned. After all, this is an ex-TWI board. There are plenty of ex-JW boards out there, as well as ex-Armstrong boards, etc. I don't think that many of the posters here would be overly interested.
I thought I had left most of my emotional hurt/anger behind me regarding twi... I thought I was able to discuss the ins-and-outs of this group, and my time with it, rather factually and dispassionately... but recent events have revealed to me that some of those dark feelings are still around. I might have put them in an airtight box and stored it in the highest, deepest closet shelf I have in my mind, but they are still there and if someone lifts the lid of that box, they still come pouring out.
Clearly, I still have work to do to make myself whole. But I find that most of my remaining emotions have to do with specific individuals, not the organization. So, if twi-the-international issued a formal apology today...
1 - I would be genuinely suspicious of its sincerity
2 - I might appreciate the effort, depending on #1
3 - I would be watching closely to see if any actions/changes followed their words
4 - I would keep posting on Greasespot because it is a personal journey... if twi suddenly became perfect tomorrow, it wouldn't change what they were yesterday, and I still need to better understand THAT and the part it played in my life. That's why I post on Greasespot.
I am with Mark on this one, an apology would be a move in the right direction, However ...
Without a change in the doctrine that enabled them to become viscious and destructive in the first place, they are still a spiritually unhealthy group.
Even if all of the above changed, there would be plenty to talk about because it takes a long time to unravel the unhealthy thought processes that years of association with twi has developed within ourselves.
If their "formal apology" was in the form of a letter sent to each one with an enclosed check reimbursing us back all tithes given to them under the misrepresentation that they were a "Biblical Research" group, - in addition to reparations made to all victims of abuse - yeah, I might accept a sabbatical from GS for a spell.
But that's total fantasy. A "sincere" apology? To return their words to them, we all know "sincerity is no guarantee for truth". Words aren't enough. They're going to have to prove it.
I agree with Mark, Rascal and Invisible Dan - it can't be just a going through the motions/window dressing kind of thing and would also like to throw in II Corintians 7:11:For behold what earnestness this very thing, this godly sorrow, has produced in you: what vindication of yourselves, what indignation, what fear, what longing, what zeal, what avenging of wrong! In everything you demostrated yourselves to be innocent in the matter.
if they gave a sincere apology it would bless me but I would still post here because the believers in the Way could come and fellowship with us
This is a great healing and there will all ways be a need of healing until Christ makes a end to death
So yes I will still come here
Wouldn't it be great to read how a twi was loving and talking about their visit in a good way at Grease Spot Cafe
But as for sincere apology the Way Ministry needs to get on 60 minutes or something like that and not just give us a sincere apology but all the churches, gays, and others groups their bad mouth a sincere apology
then maybe they could help other churches, gays, and other groups get more right with love and stop that name calling and yelling
Interestingly enough, it seems that TWI is now getting ready to release apologies to certain people in certain areas. Catcup has just started a thread about it.
I agree with Dan, et al - good posts.
They're just going thru the motions like a sorry hung-over abusive husband on a Sunday morning after he's beat the crap outta his wife for the umpteenth time. "Gee, I'm so sorry. I love you. Please come back."
It wouldn't be sincere and there wouldn't be the necessary changes to prove the sincerity of any such apology and there certainly wouldn't be anything in writing, given the extreme liability they face if they were to admit even 1/100th of their wrong-doing.
Even if they did do all the above, I wouldn't go back. I see the doctrine as wrong, based on lies and deception. They don't really want the "truth", if they did they wouldn't have done the things they did to those who pointed out errors in their logic. They'd have a lot of changes to make to come clean - a whole effen lot, but even if they did make all those changes, I wouldn't go back.
I won't quit posting on GSpot either. This is my "hang out" and it's about far more than just TWI. And, there are still folks out there who don't know; folks who were hurt terribly; folks who had their lives destroyed by TWI and they continue to find the Cafe daily. I want to be here for them, too. They'll need to decompress, talk about their experiences, ask questions, etc.
We have great discussions on doctrinal issues and similar sorts of things in the Doctrinal section. This site is not just about TWI and has so much more to offer than just "TWI bashing". To imply that that's all we do here is an extremely uninformed opinion as the least.
Agreed Belle, Even if twi came clean and was wiped off the map with the bankruptcy of making restitution to those they betrayed and destroyed.....(though how you would apologize and make restitution to those who lost their lives is beyond me)....
I am always at a loss as to why folks think we need to STOP talking about what happened to us in twi...I almost started a whole new thread with the question.
If someone apologizes for wrongs done in the past, you can forgive; but it does not mean that you have to trust ever again.
If a father is abusive to his family and later regrets it and apologizes, he can only gain trust again by showing time after time that he is sorry and changed. TWI can give lip service, but they need to show they are worthy of trust by action time and time again. Some people are beyond giving TWI that privilege to their lives again and rightfully so. TWI will continue to feel the consquences of their executive decisions. People need to be more important than they have been in that organization.
I am always at a loss as to why folks think we need to STOP talking about what happened to us in twi...I almost started a whole new thread with the question.
Is it because some think that we are angry and hateful and need to just get over it?
It is because some folks can't stand to see something or someone they once or still admire raked over the coals or "spoken evil" of ?
Is it because some honesty want folks to move beyond the hurt they perceive, while assuming that no long speaking of what happened in TWI is a sign of healing?
Very interesting posts. On Catcup's other thread I posted about the funds we sent in so you can read it there if you like to. I certainly don't disagree as to the abuse or if anyone has problems with the doctrine. From what is happening, there are those that are in that are being encouraged to say they are sorry? Does that mean the teaching they heard implies that the leadership was not aware of the abuse? Of course they knew and were behind most of it due to the pressure they put on BC, FC. etc.
I would never go back and was not asking about that, I was more interested in forgiveness if it were sincere. As far as not trusting them again, trust is earned and it would take them a long time to earn it back but at least those that were severely injured by TWI might get some peace in their lives if they were at least convinced that they were sincere.
As far as doctrine, anyone is free to debate those issues. I personally never expected them to be perfect and have utilized the principals of The Word I was taught and they work. As far as giving money back, in which I gave plenty over 29 yrs, I don't even care about it, I gave it to God not TWI and he has blessed me abundantly over an above what I ever expected.
One last thought, I honestly cannot say if they are still being so hard on Homos or the Catholic Church etc. I don't think most of us can speculate that they are. I have family in and I don't hear any of that anymore, I think it went out with LCM.
thanks for sharing, love you guys (all inclusive noun)
Would you finally let it go if it was based on a sincere apology? Would you stop posting on greasespot about TWI? What would be the right thing to do if they gave a formal apology?
What would be the right thing to do if they gave a formal apology?
The right thing for them to do would be to close their doors, liquidate their assets, and redistribute their funds to everyone who ever gave money to them.
That is the only, ONLY "right thing to do" for The Way International.
Would I "let it go?" Only if they admitted their guilt, liquidated their assets, and redistributed them to everyone who ever gave money to them.
Would I stop posting on Greasespot cafe about TWI? Probably not, EVEN IF they closed the doors.
Why?
Because the day we forget what they did, the day we stop telling what they did even after they are dead and gone, is the day they get away with it, the day their deeds are buried in the fertile ground of ignorance and enables an evil seed to spring into action and birth the system anew.
In the nineties I knew several young families living in near poverty, while faithfully sending their ABS(We'll just drop out of the health insurance program at work, yeah, that will work.)to HQ so LCM and pals could wear designer clothes, have 'servants' and take fancy vacations to the Bahamas etc. IT wasn't used to move the word--the believer on the field forked all the money out. TWI provided us with Nazi way corps though.
They have it all on computer. Let them cut the checks. That would be a real apology.
Would I forgive an individual if they came to me personally and asked for it? I can only let you know that we will definitely come to an understanding. They will be made to understand exactly what they did very clearly and have another chance to reply to what I tell them. Then we will see if they are really apologizing. If they are sincere, then we will go from there.
But the organization itself does not deserve forgiveness, nor should it continue. The only just thing would be for them to formally apologize, liquidate, and permanently close their doors.
If the person extending the so-called "apology" to me was PAID MINISTRY STAFF at the time of the offense, I would be asking specifically if they are specifically NOW acting in the capacity of an agent for The Way International in the act of the apology, or speaking solely for themselves.
If they are acting in the capacity of an agent for The Way International in extending their apology, then TWI might be seen to be admitting guilt. And if they do, there's a legal door that just opened. So perhaps they had better get all their ducks in a row before they let people loose to apologize...
Well, they had the chance to apologize to Mr. Pipes after he sent the letter I reposted in the "Letter to Rosalie" thread. They didn't so much as hint that anything was wrong, in fact, they stated that they were NOT going to change their position. And Rosie didn't even have the courtesy to respond back to him. She let his local WC handle it "verbally" and with nothing in writing.
BUT, to be honest, Bob Moynihan did apologize for any wrong that he did when they were here at my house to tell me that I was "free to'take a break' from TWI for a bit".
Imagine, Bob sitting back on my couch, rolling his eyes and in the most sarcastic voice he can muster, "Well, I"m sooooo sorry if I've ever hurt anybody." See, he apologized. <_<
An apology, sincere or not, and reparations, adequate or not, would have zero influence on me with regards to ever "going back".
The reason I am no longer affiliated with WayWorld is because I realized it's a nonsense organization, peddling superstition and feel-good aphorisms, while it's sole raison d'etre is to serve it's own collective belly.
It is beyond useless. It simply sucks up ones resources and life energy and gives NOTHING tangible in return.
Why would anyone ever return to such a life-sucking hole? Whatever for?
It simply sucks up ones resources and life energy and gives NOTHING tangible in return.
That is a very clear statement. I was always confused about the "hit or miss" results of applying the principles taught by VPW.
My parents already taught me all the things that PFAL espoused about behavior and character. The rest of it seemed to enforce separation rather than chohesiveness and reaching out.
I always loved the example set by Mother Theresa [i'm not Catholic]. She never said much; her life was about doing and giving, not about telling the world about what she did.
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markomalley
If they didn't change their fundamental theological basis (such as what Armstrong's WW Church of God did), an apology would not change my disagreement with them.
The reason for this is because my theory is that all of the abuses stemmed from a fundamentally flawed theology, not that the abuses were an abberation of a fundamentally sound theology (such as the position held by a good portion of the posters here).
When I stop posting on gsc, the reason will have nothing to do with what twi does one way or the other.
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LornaDoone
Hi Mark,
I hear what you are saying but maybe I didn't make my thoughts clear. I didn't mean that doctrine or research of these different groups should not be discussed, I was more inferring it may be time to let go of any animosity toward certain individuals and move forward. Are we out for blood? Would God want the browbeating to continue? What does the Word say?
If discussions were to continue, then would you include discussing the World Wide Church of God, not just TWI. Why pick on one organization over another, you could include most religions in this type of discussion. I personally don't agree with most of the religious groups in this world?
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markomalley
Lorna,
I'm really not out for "blood" now, per se. Actually, the theory I espouse treats the perpetrators with a considerable amount of mercy, as they would be victims of the theology they preached, as well as the commonly known and acknowledged victims, some of whom post here. Exposing the flaws of that theology, even tangentally (such as the threads that refer to connections between twi and liberty lobby, twi holocaust denial, etc.), help shed light where the darkness exists.
As far as holding onto any personal animosity, yeah, I tend to agree with you. However, shedding light onto their works of darkness is very appropriate.
Most people on this board know I'm Catholic. I have never denied that there have been some priests (approx 2-4% from 1960-1980) who were unable to control their urges toward pre-teen and young teen boys. I've looked into the causes of this and believe I understand what those causes were. I have also talked about the sins of Pope Paul IV and have seen the errors there (a major scandal that resulted in the establishment of much of Protestantism)
It would be very possible for me to be a practicing Catholic and be in total ignorance of those scandals. There are many in the Church who would have preferred to have kept the clergy abuse scandal quiet and under wraps. But it was important to expose that dark chapter in Church history to the light. Because it showed how corrupt many in the Church hierarchy has gotten...and now there are many, like me, who watch the actions of that hierarchy very carefully.
Now the analogy falls apart at this point: had the Church hierarchy actually followed established guidance, it's likely that the clergy abuse scandal would never have occurred...or would have been dwarfed in its scope compared to what happened. My belief is, in the case of TWI, many of the abuses can be traced back to the theology that was taught.
But the critical point is this: bringing the light of the facts to the situation dispel the darkness. So exposing the abuses and the abusers, along with an analysis of the reasons for that abuse, is a good thing. Keeping it up is also a good thing, at least until such time as the structural changes needed to truly correct those problems has occurred.
Personally, I think discussions of Armstrong's group, the JW's, or any other group are out of scope for this board, unless they relate back to how twi functioned. After all, this is an ex-TWI board. There are plenty of ex-JW boards out there, as well as ex-Armstrong boards, etc. I don't think that many of the posters here would be overly interested.
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Bug on the Wall
This is a really interesting question...
I thought I had left most of my emotional hurt/anger behind me regarding twi... I thought I was able to discuss the ins-and-outs of this group, and my time with it, rather factually and dispassionately... but recent events have revealed to me that some of those dark feelings are still around. I might have put them in an airtight box and stored it in the highest, deepest closet shelf I have in my mind, but they are still there and if someone lifts the lid of that box, they still come pouring out.
Clearly, I still have work to do to make myself whole. But I find that most of my remaining emotions have to do with specific individuals, not the organization. So, if twi-the-international issued a formal apology today...
1 - I would be genuinely suspicious of its sincerity
2 - I might appreciate the effort, depending on #1
3 - I would be watching closely to see if any actions/changes followed their words
4 - I would keep posting on Greasespot because it is a personal journey... if twi suddenly became perfect tomorrow, it wouldn't change what they were yesterday, and I still need to better understand THAT and the part it played in my life. That's why I post on Greasespot.
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rascal
I am with Mark on this one, an apology would be a move in the right direction, However ...
Without a change in the doctrine that enabled them to become viscious and destructive in the first place, they are still a spiritually unhealthy group.
Even if all of the above changed, there would be plenty to talk about because it takes a long time to unravel the unhealthy thought processes that years of association with twi has developed within ourselves.
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TheInvisibleDan
If their "formal apology" was in the form of a letter sent to each one with an enclosed check reimbursing us back all tithes given to them under the misrepresentation that they were a "Biblical Research" group, - in addition to reparations made to all victims of abuse - yeah, I might accept a sabbatical from GS for a spell.
But that's total fantasy. A "sincere" apology? To return their words to them, we all know "sincerity is no guarantee for truth". Words aren't enough. They're going to have to prove it.
Danny
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T-Bone
I agree with Mark, Rascal and Invisible Dan - it can't be just a going through the motions/window dressing kind of thing and would also like to throw in II Corintians 7:11:For behold what earnestness this very thing, this godly sorrow, has produced in you: what vindication of yourselves, what indignation, what fear, what longing, what zeal, what avenging of wrong! In everything you demostrated yourselves to be innocent in the matter.
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year2027
God first
Beloved all
God loves you all
if they gave a sincere apology it would bless me but I would still post here because the believers in the Way could come and fellowship with us
This is a great healing and there will all ways be a need of healing until Christ makes a end to death
So yes I will still come here
Wouldn't it be great to read how a twi was loving and talking about their visit in a good way at Grease Spot Cafe
But as for sincere apology the Way Ministry needs to get on 60 minutes or something like that and not just give us a sincere apology but all the churches, gays, and others groups their bad mouth a sincere apology
then maybe they could help other churches, gays, and other groups get more right with love and stop that name calling and yelling
thank you
with love and a holy kiss blowing your way Roy
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ChasUFarley
Interestingly enough, it seems that TWI is now getting ready to release apologies to certain people in certain areas. Catcup has just started a thread about it.
I agree with Dan, et al - good posts.
They're just going thru the motions like a sorry hung-over abusive husband on a Sunday morning after he's beat the crap outta his wife for the umpteenth time. "Gee, I'm so sorry. I love you. Please come back."
"And did I say 'I'm sorry'?"
As usual, they're just wasting their breath...
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Belle
Yeppers, I agree with everyone else.
It wouldn't be sincere and there wouldn't be the necessary changes to prove the sincerity of any such apology and there certainly wouldn't be anything in writing, given the extreme liability they face if they were to admit even 1/100th of their wrong-doing.
Even if they did do all the above, I wouldn't go back. I see the doctrine as wrong, based on lies and deception. They don't really want the "truth", if they did they wouldn't have done the things they did to those who pointed out errors in their logic. They'd have a lot of changes to make to come clean - a whole effen lot, but even if they did make all those changes, I wouldn't go back.
I won't quit posting on GSpot either. This is my "hang out" and it's about far more than just TWI. And, there are still folks out there who don't know; folks who were hurt terribly; folks who had their lives destroyed by TWI and they continue to find the Cafe daily. I want to be here for them, too. They'll need to decompress, talk about their experiences, ask questions, etc.
We have great discussions on doctrinal issues and similar sorts of things in the Doctrinal section. This site is not just about TWI and has so much more to offer than just "TWI bashing". To imply that that's all we do here is an extremely uninformed opinion as the least.
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rascal
Agreed Belle, Even if twi came clean and was wiped off the map with the bankruptcy of making restitution to those they betrayed and destroyed.....(though how you would apologize and make restitution to those who lost their lives is beyond me)....
I am always at a loss as to why folks think we need to STOP talking about what happened to us in twi...I almost started a whole new thread with the question.
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Nottawayfer
If someone apologizes for wrongs done in the past, you can forgive; but it does not mean that you have to trust ever again.
If a father is abusive to his family and later regrets it and apologizes, he can only gain trust again by showing time after time that he is sorry and changed. TWI can give lip service, but they need to show they are worthy of trust by action time and time again. Some people are beyond giving TWI that privilege to their lives again and rightfully so. TWI will continue to feel the consquences of their executive decisions. People need to be more important than they have been in that organization.
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Goey
Rascal posted:
Is it because some think that we are angry and hateful and need to just get over it?
It is because some folks can't stand to see something or someone they once or still admire raked over the coals or "spoken evil" of ?
Is it because some honesty want folks to move beyond the hurt they perceive, while assuming that no long speaking of what happened in TWI is a sign of healing?
Could it be something else ?
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allan w.
It would be an apology 'on paper only' imo. As fake as most of them involved.
I don't agree with Mark that twi theology was the cause of abuse, too many good people including leaders that did not succumb to 'animal instincts'.
Every religion, denomination, secular instituitons have their share of 'abusers'.
It is the victims, not the perpetrators, that MUST keep speaking up, including Catholic churchgoers (former and current)
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LornaDoone
Very interesting posts. On Catcup's other thread I posted about the funds we sent in so you can read it there if you like to. I certainly don't disagree as to the abuse or if anyone has problems with the doctrine. From what is happening, there are those that are in that are being encouraged to say they are sorry? Does that mean the teaching they heard implies that the leadership was not aware of the abuse? Of course they knew and were behind most of it due to the pressure they put on BC, FC. etc.
I would never go back and was not asking about that, I was more interested in forgiveness if it were sincere. As far as not trusting them again, trust is earned and it would take them a long time to earn it back but at least those that were severely injured by TWI might get some peace in their lives if they were at least convinced that they were sincere.
As far as doctrine, anyone is free to debate those issues. I personally never expected them to be perfect and have utilized the principals of The Word I was taught and they work. As far as giving money back, in which I gave plenty over 29 yrs, I don't even care about it, I gave it to God not TWI and he has blessed me abundantly over an above what I ever expected.
One last thought, I honestly cannot say if they are still being so hard on Homos or the Catholic Church etc. I don't think most of us can speculate that they are. I have family in and I don't hear any of that anymore, I think it went out with LCM.
thanks for sharing, love you guys (all inclusive noun)
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Catcup
What would be the right thing to do if they gave a formal apology?
The right thing for them to do would be to close their doors, liquidate their assets, and redistribute their funds to everyone who ever gave money to them.
That is the only, ONLY "right thing to do" for The Way International.
Would I "let it go?" Only if they admitted their guilt, liquidated their assets, and redistributed them to everyone who ever gave money to them.
Would I stop posting on Greasespot cafe about TWI? Probably not, EVEN IF they closed the doors.
Why?
Because the day we forget what they did, the day we stop telling what they did even after they are dead and gone, is the day they get away with it, the day their deeds are buried in the fertile ground of ignorance and enables an evil seed to spring into action and birth the system anew.
Never, never forget.
Never again.
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Bramble
In the nineties I knew several young families living in near poverty, while faithfully sending their ABS(We'll just drop out of the health insurance program at work, yeah, that will work.)to HQ so LCM and pals could wear designer clothes, have 'servants' and take fancy vacations to the Bahamas etc. IT wasn't used to move the word--the believer on the field forked all the money out. TWI provided us with Nazi way corps though.
They have it all on computer. Let them cut the checks. That would be a real apology.
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Catcup
Would I forgive an individual if they came to me personally and asked for it? I can only let you know that we will definitely come to an understanding. They will be made to understand exactly what they did very clearly and have another chance to reply to what I tell them. Then we will see if they are really apologizing. If they are sincere, then we will go from there.
But the organization itself does not deserve forgiveness, nor should it continue. The only just thing would be for them to formally apologize, liquidate, and permanently close their doors.
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Catcup
And by the by....
If the person extending the so-called "apology" to me was PAID MINISTRY STAFF at the time of the offense, I would be asking specifically if they are specifically NOW acting in the capacity of an agent for The Way International in the act of the apology, or speaking solely for themselves.
If they are acting in the capacity of an agent for The Way International in extending their apology, then TWI might be seen to be admitting guilt. And if they do, there's a legal door that just opened. So perhaps they had better get all their ducks in a row before they let people loose to apologize...
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Belle
Well, they had the chance to apologize to Mr. Pipes after he sent the letter I reposted in the "Letter to Rosalie" thread. They didn't so much as hint that anything was wrong, in fact, they stated that they were NOT going to change their position. And Rosie didn't even have the courtesy to respond back to him. She let his local WC handle it "verbally" and with nothing in writing.
BUT, to be honest, Bob Moynihan did apologize for any wrong that he did when they were here at my house to tell me that I was "free to'take a break' from TWI for a bit".
Imagine, Bob sitting back on my couch, rolling his eyes and in the most sarcastic voice he can muster, "Well, I"m sooooo sorry if I've ever hurt anybody." See, he apologized. <_<
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LornaDoone
Good response Cat, makes sense
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dmiller
NO. :)
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George Aar
An apology, sincere or not, and reparations, adequate or not, would have zero influence on me with regards to ever "going back".
The reason I am no longer affiliated with WayWorld is because I realized it's a nonsense organization, peddling superstition and feel-good aphorisms, while it's sole raison d'etre is to serve it's own collective belly.
It is beyond useless. It simply sucks up ones resources and life energy and gives NOTHING tangible in return.
Why would anyone ever return to such a life-sucking hole? Whatever for?
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That is a very clear statement. I was always confused about the "hit or miss" results of applying the principles taught by VPW.
My parents already taught me all the things that PFAL espoused about behavior and character. The rest of it seemed to enforce separation rather than chohesiveness and reaching out.
I always loved the example set by Mother Theresa [i'm not Catholic]. She never said much; her life was about doing and giving, not about telling the world about what she did.
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