templelady

WHAT THE SAM HILL IS THAT INSANE LAUGHTER???????? MAKE IT STOP!!!!!!!!!! No I didn't

And Martin Luther was a Roman Catholic Priest who had the epistle of PAul to read because his church had preserved it. TO say that PAul is the root of Protestantism or any Christian ism is heresy Jesus Christ is the Only ROOT

That's bad--really bad <_<

You make it sound tlike they are dragged kicking and screaming from their mothers arms. Being a missionary is VOLUNTARY. You are not excommunicated if you don't go--in fact nothing happens to you if you don't go. Many young men do go and young women also. It is a commitment they make--two years serving the Lord. What most people don't understand is that other that the First presidentcy the 12 Apostles and the Quorum there are no paid positions in the LDS Faith. Everyone supports themselves with an outside job--Every calling in the church is unpaid whether you are the Bishop the Stake president, or the bulletin person. ThE Mormon TAbernacle choir is all unpaid volunteers--when they tour they pay for their own airfare, hotels meals. What motivates us is the Love of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. No one is forced to do anything--you can refuse a calling , or leave a calling whenever you want. LDS teachings on Lucifer LUCIFER: Literally the Shining One; also Lightbringer or Son of the Morning. Lucifer is also known as Satan or the devil. The name Lucifer appears only once in the Bible (Isa. 14: 12, but cf. Luke 10: 18). Apparently Lucifer is the name of the devil before his rebellion and fall. Latter-day revelation clarifies the fall of Lucifer and equates him with Satan (D&C 76: 25-38; cf. Rev. 12: 1-17; 2 Ne. 9: 8; D&C 29: 36-38; Moses 4: 1-4). WAR IN HEAVEN This term arises out of Rev. 12: 7 and refers to the conflict that took place in the premortal existence among the spirit children of God. The war was primarily over how and in what manner the plan of salvation would be administered to the forthcoming human family upon the earth. The issues involved such things as agency, how to gain salvation, and who should be the Redeemer. The war broke out because one-third of the spirits refused to accept the appointment of Jesus Christ as the Savior. Such a refusal was a rebellion against the Father’s plan of redemption. It was evident that if given agency, some persons would fall short of complete salvation; Lucifer and his followers wanted salvation to come automatically to all who passed through mortality, without regard to individual preference, agency, or voluntary dedication (see Isa. 14: 12-20; Luke 10: 18; Rev. 12: 4-13; D&C 29: 36-38; Moses 4: 1-4). The spirits who thus rebelled and persisted were thrust out of heaven and cast down to the earth without mortal bodies, “and thus came the devil and his angels” (D&C 29: 37; see also Rev. 12: 9; Abr. 3: 24-28). DEVIL: The devil is called the prince of this world (John 12: 31; John 14: 30; John 16: 11); the adversary (1 Pet. 5: 8); Beelzebub, meaning the prince of the devils (Mark 3: 22); the wicked one (Matt. 13: 38); the enemy (Matt. 13: 39); Lucifer (Isa. 14: 12; D&C 76: 26); Satan (Rev. 12: 9); prince of the power of the air (Eph. 2: 2-3); Perdition (D&C 76: 26); son of the morning (D&C 76: 26-27); that old serpent (Rev. 12: 9; D&C 76: 28); the great dragon (Rev. 12: 7-9); a murderer from the beginning (John 8: 44); a liar from the beginning (D&C 93: 25); and the accuser (Rev. 12: 10). The importance of not accommodating temptation in the least degree is underlined by the Savior's example. Did not he recognize the danger when he was on the mountain with his fallen brother, Lucifer, being sorely tempted by that master tempter? He could have opened the door and flirted with danger by saying, "All right, Satan, I'll listen to your proposition. I need not succumb, I need not yield, I need not accept—but I'll listen." (The Teachings of Spencer W. Kimball, p. 163) Brother in this sense is used since the LDS recognize GOD as the creator of all (we are not trinitarians) THerefore God created Jesus his only Begotton son and he created Lucifer --the angel of Light. Their "brotherhood' comes from both being the creation of God and in no way places Lucifer on an eqaul footing with CHrist. Christ is the second person in the Godheaad and always was, while Lucifer was an angel who chose to rebel. we speak of the brotherhood of man, Christians acknowledge that we all all the children of Adam and Eve yet we can differentiate between that "brotherhood" and our natural siblings--so to is it in heaven

JB I don't care if you disagree with me , I don't care if you quote me but DO NOT put words in my mouth I never said Paul was a heretic

So let's see--VPW is told that Leonard is in the middle of a class and he doesn't want to see VPW right then. I mean he is told by Leonard himself SO what does VPW do?? Disregards Leonards express wishes and shows up anyway (so if VPW told you you couldn't come to the ROA and you showed up anyway how long did it take the "bless patrol" to send you packing???) THen when confronted about his misdeed (we all know VPW was big on confronting) Does VPW 1-acknowledge his error 2-apologize for disrespecting Leonards wishes or 3-blow Leonards justifiable annoyance off. Scenario A Piffle class is running-VPW is teaching it live-suddenly in walks someone that not only isn't registered but someone who was told by VPW himself that he couldn't attend--- What would VPW DO??? the ego and self justification is unbelievable

So he has this great spritual revelation in TULSAKnows how to speak in tongues HAs the Holy Spirit (direct communication with God) And with all this he doesn't get the message that he is suppossed to read the newsletter. BUt wait he says 'it was so badly priinted you could hardly make out a word' Whos Neliie! that means--can it be!?!?--that he actually did read it at least some of the time -- but that contradicts----- it's the basically the same that worries me--I mean I can understand how a teaching or class in the five senses world evolves--But per VPW God was right there showing him--so it should not have needed to be changed at all.

Well I don't have the ORANGE book, nor do I know anyone who does, nor Am I going to go buy a copy on Ebay. FOr those of us who are thius deprived Chapter and verse please And please don't tell me you don't have the time--you could have posted the requested Quotes 10 times over in the amount of time you have been beating around the bush

If that is the criteria we already know that a whole lot has been taken-away from the books mentioned in the OT that are nowhere to be found to the work of various synods that selected which scriptures we were permitted to keep and which were to be rejected-- many of which they destroyed . The Catholics and Protestants can't even agree on the books of the OT. Is it really so far fetched to believe that God would find a way to preseve the plain and precious truths that were lost or destroyed?? HOw do I know that he was witnessing to the apostles after his resurrection --by faith Sacred not secret--BTW you can go to the Library of Congress and get /request a copy of the actual service Some peole wear crosses, some ministers wear special collars, some wear scapula, or pins, we wear our "garments " so we have a constant reminder of our promises and covenants with God. You have got to stop reading that anti-Mormon liturature

MIke MIke Mike I submit that continued dining at the cafe will open you to further danger. It is clearly not PFAL based. It is also futile to try and get the rest of us to change to a PFAL based reality Therefore in order to be true to your own stated belief to read nothing but PFAL material--please avoid threads such as these for your own well being ================ That said here is MO's stress reducer Take a dozen hard boiled eggs -more if you are really upset--these eggs need to be really hard maybe 7 minutes After they cool write the name of the person who is causing the stress in black marker on each egg. go outside where you can hose or shovel up the mess standng 10 to 15 feet from a wall hurl eggs one at a time at the wall. The eggs will explode in a shower of fragments This works -- I did it with my ex's name and Mr Urquharts name it is very satisfying ================== Okay MIke if you are still here I am ready for you to explain and complain how the wanton destruction of graffiti covered unborn fetuses of poultry can lead to debil spurt possession. Chapter and verse from PFAL please Citing the spritual state of poultry Why writing names on eggs is spritually unsound Why relieving stress by making fowl bombs is an open door to possession

def59 If you want to discuss the specifics of the LDS faith start a thread and ask your questions in the doctrinal forum--elsewise please stop trying to derail Wordwolf's thread Thank you

Catcup! While enroute to TWI Your Check was placed in a mail sack with an envelope addressed to Anton LaVey. Your Check, in its envelope, was sitting back humming the latest rap tune so it had its spritual trapdoor open. And of course them Debil Spurts rushed right in. Now throughly possessed Your Check, with the help of its Debil Spurts, changed the address on the envelope, from TWI and Mr Wallace, to the Tooth Fairy. The Tooth Fairy, being honest, found all the teeth you shed in your childhood, calculated their worth at 25 cents apiece and came up with $8.00. That has left her with $2.00 extra. As I type she is wracking her brain as to what she can give you to compensate you for that $2.00. As soon as she figures it out you can expect a package with all your baby teeth and whatever else she comes up with. So you see this is all your fault for A- not training your check to keep it's spritual trapdoor closed by SITing and B- Not having the forsight to believe for 40 teeth so the tooth fairy would not be in this quandry

when I had my experience I felt the inside of me was as warm from the light as the outside-when it was over I felt like I had been exposed to sunshine on the inside--so I don't discount this as being a vaild feeling of the manifestation, that said--there are many possibilities 1- VPW actually experiencecd the manifestation 2- VPW wanted so badly to experience SIT he thought he experienced the manifestation and had heard from others how it felt 3- VPW experienced the manifestation didn't experience the feeling that others had but said he did 4- He lied about the whole SIT experience 5- He experienced it but somewhere down the road figured out how to use the experience to make his stature in the eyes of men grow. Personally I'm for #5

Thank you Mike for posting RGs findings. Most interesting--I would have to agree that VPW did in fact complete the requirements for the degree issued by Pikes Peak-- Accredidation is another matter all together So I am willing to concede VPW did have what he, and obviously some others, believed to be a valid doctorate. What he did with that doctorate is another discussion altogether Now back to topic Proofs, Mike, pretty please

We only have Paul's word that he was--I'm not saying he wasn't but this is a mighty thin argument for rejecting the work of others After Paul died is the key here, he wasn't around to confirm their authenticity--Am I saying they weren't authentic-- no--but synods convened years even centuries after the fact are not always the best of arbitrators. Never said he was disqualified--was pointing out that Christ's mandate to the 12 was to preach to the JEWS. It was only after the 'natural" (Jews) branches rejected what was taught, and not all of them did, that the "wild" (Gentile) branches were to be grafted in. Did Jesus know about Paul already??? I honestly don't know-- he knew someone would be called by God to preach to the gentiles but whether he know it would be Paul specifically ----- And while we are on the subject of Paul let us review exactly what those epistles contain Letters to the city states of Ephesus Corinth Galatia Phillipi Thessolonica Colosse the city of Rome Personal letters to Timothy, Titus, and Philemon The Hebrews in Jerusalem That leaves --say about 80% of the known world obviously there is a lot missing

Question , If VPW never taught these things How would he know that absolutely nobody could receive them???? Sounds like Ego boosting to me

GOOD MORNING IRAQ :) I sang in tongues once--many years before Piffle. It was a Sunday morning in a Free Methodist church and all of a sudden I was singing inside my head along with the choir in a language I've never heard before or since. I felt like my whole being was going to float up from the floor and explode while all the while I was in this cocoon of white and gold light. It was the most uplifting experience I have ever felt in my entire life. I heard that language in my head because it was spirit talking to spirit--I had no need to communicate with a non -english speaking person Nothing in TWI ever even remotely came near to that experience. Do I believe you when you say you speak in tongues yea, I believe the rest who say it was real for them too. What I don't believe is that it had anything to do with Stiles or VPW or TWI, It just happened to you while you were in TWI. A BIG difference. SIT is from God at His will and discretion. I can sure see where you would need it in Iraq for comfort and support, I can see where you would need it in TWI to sustain you. I know a young LDS woman who served a mission in Russia. She tells of the time she went to a home to have discussions with an extended family. Amoung the members was a very elderly woman who spoke no English yet followed the discussions even when the missionary spoke little or no Russian. Explained her family, "she always hears what the missionaries say in Russian no matter what language they speak" SO yes I do believe SIT is very much an active manifestation for whomever GOd so decides--- not some formula expounded by VPW in piffle

Now that I am on the doctrinal thread I can ask-- Just why do you belive salvation is unattainable in the LDS churcH??? Precisely what doctrine or doctrines that affects salvation has been distorted significantly??? --I want chapter and verse from LDS teachings (actual teachings not what some anti mormon literature SAYs are LDS teachinsgs)

MIke I 'm all for it Quit talkiing about the proofs Quit threatening to show us all Quit making nasty cracks Wheel out those proofs Cite them, chapter and verse please And then we can get down to serious discussion of each point If you don't produce the proofs you claim--of what value are they?? As long as said proofs remain a nebulous idea floating around this thread they are like the illustration VPW used about having a check in the bank. If you never drew out the money it would be the same thing as never having the check And please don't tell us to look for ourselves-- most of us don't have all the resources available to us anymore so be a good guy and refresh our memories with actual quotes Thank YOU

When in Rome....... Under Danish law prostitution is not a crime unless it is the sole means of supoort Therefore a protitute who followed that law would simply be working at her profession just like a maid, food server or other worker. They pay for eveything else so therefore it should be covered under their laws Now as for here in the US of A NONONONONONONONONONO NO HOW NO WAY

I know that TWI arranged transport out of Alaska after he was released and had him taken in by believers in Ohio (which is a whole story in and of itself) I know that the Urquharts were dropped from corps staus in 1994 (there is a list on the links on the main G S page) Even if he continued after 1994 to be "under TWI's wing" it would be very hard to prove that TWI either knew or sanctioned him not reporting his whereabouts to Alaska. My guess is that at worst, TWI would have distanced themselves from that whole registering issue by simply not bringing the subject up --which isn't a crime. If Urquhart is still where TWI can find him I would suggest that one of you WAYGB hike into town to a payphone and drop a dime to your nearest law enforcement official anonymously. With all the lawsuits and bad publicity you really don't need this one to add to the plate.

First Paul was not an Apostle when Jesus gave this commandmentSecond Christ's first priorty was the the Jews-- he came as their Messiah, it was the Apostles job to see that that news was spread. Gentiles were the wild branches grafted in but only after the the natural branches failed to bear fruit. and Third Paul was but one of many Jewish followers of Christ who preached outside of Jerusallem Paul is the one we know about because he was literate, and had time in Rome to write letters and make copies of same which were preserved. The Mediteranean region was no stranger to the news of Christ carried by many, Paul himself mentions, Timothy, Barnabus, and others. Their writings if any and the groups that they converted remain largely a mystery to us. By this statement you prove my point precisely We DO NOT owe our roots to Paul Protestestant denominations owe their roots to the Roman Catholic Church To the monks who labored through the dark ages preserving scriptures To Peter who sat on the throne of the Holy See To Christ who taught Peter And to the Apostles who spoke and taught the words of Christ from firsthand knowledge until they could be preserved in writing Paul would have been nothing without them Paul's epistles are Paul's interpretation of the Message of Christ --The message he learned from others who actually spoke and learned from the living Christ. .Do you really think GOd couldn't have gotten the job done with out Paul??? Stephen died for his efforts, Timothey and Barnabus, Aquilla and Priscilla carried on long after Paul was cooling his heels in a Roman villa. After Paul was imprisoned and sent to Rome he carried the message of Christ nowhere new. He simply kept in contact with the churches he had preached at.

You are correct Wordwolf I shall do better Back to topic The meeting with Stiles it what gets to me You meet this guy, wouldn't one of the first topics of conversation be the weather??? I mean that is one of the tried and true openings when meeting a stranger, safe, a moment to get the feel of another person, especially the case after a blizzard of such magnitude--the weather would have been on everyones lips. Second ---and I'm not saying this to step on toes--I offer it to show why I find the whole episode from snow to an all nighter questionable. I don't subscribe to the belief that we can turn Speaking in tongues on and off like a tap. This manisfestation is IMO for the specific purpose of being able to communicate with another who doesn't speak the same language when God deems it necessary. So I have a lot of trouble believing in VPW's account, or if in fact , evening went as stated, believing that anyone truly operated this manifestation--because there was no need. Yeah, session 12 in PFAL was for me the moment I truly realized that I didn't "belong" because I never could get behind SIT as taught in TWI

Sharon, If you are by chance reading this I'm with CW on this. Now is the time LET HIM GO Turn him in Whatever he has told you about the legal repercussions to yourself--understand that he is using fear as an excuse to keep you at his side. He is the one who abuses, he is the one who failed to register YOU ARE AN ABUSED SPOUSE Any court looking at your health issues and temperment versus Rich and his behaviors WOULD NOT hold you responsible for what he has done. Anything you need I will help as much as I can BUT, please, please make the nightmare end for all of us

It must be LDS bashing month on the forums --oh well THe difference is that there were eyewitnesses, who saw and held the plates. In later years at least one of these witnesses left the LDS faith. Even while repudiating the LDS faith he steadfastly maintained that he had seen and held the plates, There was no reason for the witnesses to lie, they gained nothing from their testimonies, neither riches nor favors. Given the climate of the 1800's vis-a-vis the LDS --it would have been much easier and safer to deny the plates existence yet they never did, not even the one who was no longer LDS