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PIFFLE "Promotes harmony in the home" Actually that is true! :o Dat's Riight! BUT,... it must be understood within the chapters and verses,.. and the contexts floating around in the ol' crocs... er, ol' docs noggin. To him, perfect harmony was Mrs. W at home, and him getting his lusts met anyway he could do it elsewhere. Perfect harmony. Another example for those who need further explanation: Craig likes girls... Donna likes girls... So she shouldn't mind that he finds it elsewhere. Perfect harmony. <_<

Thanks Waysider, That was good, kind of a blend of jazz, blues, country. they had some nice Gibsons. I listened to several other songs too, the man is seriously funny.

Ham and waysider, You must be true believers of K-PAX. :biglaugh: For the uninitiated, the movie K-PAX had an ancient alien visitor in a modern day US asylum who spoke to his doctor about how the universe operated. K-PAXian theology taught that the universe ran in a ever continuing cycle of big bang, expanding, then collapsing back to the pre-bang. Then doing it over and over again in a never ending cycle. Every cycle is exactly the same, all history is the same. When it finally gets around to you, Attila , Napoleon and Hitler will have already made their contributions to society. You will be be born in the same place at the same minute on the same day as you have for five thousand times already and will for countless infinities of times yet to come, over trillions of eons into the future. On such a day you will eat a bowl of grapenuts at 7:30, go to work at 8:59, spill coffee over your keyboard at 3:47 and beat your dog with the newspaper at 5:43 because of the endless repetition of the universe. In spite of this revelation K-PAX tries to get his caretaker to reconcile with his estranged son, breaking with the preset destiny. ...or is it?! The K-PAX theology given above is also from the Hindu religion. They have the same creation theory and even their chief gods do not know of the eternal re-cycling until he learns it from an older god. So kids,... Whatever happens has already happened and will happen again for countless eternities, so eat drink and be merry, for tomorrow you die and will be born again... and again... and again....... :blink: :wacko:

teachme, Pretty good work, by the way.

teachmevp, WARNING: For the overly serious, the following instruction is presented with a thoroughly implanted tongue-in-cheek. When I first showed up at WayDale, back when computers were a series of beads on a series of strings on a little square frame, I used to write like you. My paragraphs were pages long and hard to read because of the incredible density of all those letters in such a small space. Many feared me because they could not see the whites of my pages. Finally some kind person had the unmitigated gall to inform me of the difficulty they had trying to read my blatherings and said it would be really nice if I broke the paragraphs down to small, simple, easy to read partitions so they didn't get lost before they got mid-way through even my small paragraphs. So I grudgingly conceded to the great unwashed masses and broke down my massive super paragraphs into smaller mini-paras and not only found the masses loved me, but that I also suffered much less eyestrain reading my own prodigious printed ponderings. (OK, they really only liked me a little bit more, and some even muttered: "So that is what he meant!") If you are like me, you probably think in long paragraphs because to you, your subject matter is one big thought. Break it down even if it doesn't make paragraphical sense just so it is easier to read and thusly to understand. Understanding is what you want to achieve. Besides what you see in my structure above, I will break up your starting work so you can see and consider the difference: Anyway look at it and think it over. I think you will find this much easier for others and you to read. (Some other paragraphic mega-builders might also consider this too.)

teachmevp, The second death has long been an area of interest to me. It is mentioned only four times, all of them in the book of Revelations. The number and where they are highly significant in themselves. 4 is the number of man, 6 is man's number in his current fallen state as I remember. And the book of Revelations is the only book devoted to future events yet to come. Here are the four references; Rev 2:11 11 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death. KJV Rev 20:6 6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, KJV Rev 20:12-21:1 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire. KJV Rev 21:8 8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. KJV The greek words are plain, simple words which mean exactly 'second' and 'death.' If you look at them... The first is a warning, and the second is a promised guarantee. The third and fourth are both used as the meaning and finality of the term; lake of fire. Something said twice is supposed to establish that it will come to pass. (The numerology is half remembered, but based on Bullinger, not twi.) To me, it has always been simple and straightforward and sensible. Does it make sense.... That a loving God has a place he has a large part of his creation living in eternal torment? That a perfect and sinless God has a place in His universal being for a pustular pimple of evil and pain and misery festering on forever? No! It does not. Moreover, when people have suffered the worlds evil, great torment, excruciating pain, whether evil or illness, when there has been no hope for better, how many have begged for death's release from their afflictions. (All of which were much less torment than eternity in hell will have them suffer.) But the ordinary man of the sin nature, though he dislikes acknowledging God, still cannot bear extinction, so he rationalizes hell ain't so bad. He will still be ALIVE and so busy shaking hands with all his friends and won't notice his feet are cinders and the fire has reached his knees. That man better start protecting his most prized private parts or the devil may having his fried mountain oysters for lunch. I have more, but I am tired. excie, I will include here what I thought of writing in your "are the dead alive" thread, but you were wanting experiences, not doctrine, so I passed then.

excie, Never ever let go of the hope, the absolute basis of Christianity is that the hope is true, based on the works of Jesus Christ. You asked if you could see God. Scripture says if He were to show his true majesty, it would melt the universe, let alone your face. But it also says we will see Him face to face. ( l Cor 13:12) He can easily take on a form we will see and be blessed by. On the judgement day, certainly those who stand before the throne will see the judge. The prosecutor, lucifer. The defense council, Jesus. :) (A side thought; If lucifer had known the full majesty and glory of God, he would never have been stupid enough to try to overthrow God. What lucifer had seen must have been enough that to that point God was big enough to be the boss, but not so big that lucifer could not beat Him and take over His throne.) Keep the hope sweetheart, dear and precious and close to your heart. ;)

I had two obvious episodes with angels, one seen in a vision of sorts, and one I felt. I said obvious, because I believe we have all, probably many times, entertained angels unawares as the saying goes. There was this young lady who kept vacillating between us and our arch rivals who also tended to get her into mischief. She went out on a double blind date with one of those friends from the other side. It turned out the dates were drug dealers and pimps out to recruit new girls. Totally freaked, she called me from an auto dealership they used as a front, wanting me to come get her. I told her to remember what we had taught about God being bigger than the pimp's god, and to imagine a wall of protection between her and them and then did a short prayer for her safety. While I was praying, I got this image of her staring out of the front window of the dealership. Then I saw this little angel about 16 inches tall sitting centered on the back of her shoulder, protecting her head. He was just kind of sitting there facing a rear door, relaxed, smiling, slaping his left hand with what amounted to a small bat. Immediately, I felt at ease and peaceful. I told the girl about the angel and her being safe, and went to get her. By the size of the angel, he was doing no big thing. --------------00000000--------------- The 'felt' incident happened a few years later. I was married, living in Columbus, Ohio, and we had a fairly new Toyota my wife was really proud of. The weekend day before had been the coldest on record for the area. This Monday morning rose nearly as cold as the day before. My VW would not start and my wife reluctantly gave me her car keys. The Toyota started up slowly too, but it started up. We lived on the northeast corner of Columbus, and I needed to get to the Grandview Heights area, to the west of downtown to work. My route was to go west on the I-270 outerbelt until I got to State Road 315, which is like an interstate highway into that area west of downtown. Basically, it was like 4 and 6 lane interstate all the way to work. A 16 mile, 20-30 minute journey each way every day. This very cold morning, the car never did warm up, and the suspension felt stiff all the way. The road had been plowed and salted, but it was too cold for the salt to do it's job. There were many really slick black ice patches too. All 16 miles had cars stalled and abandoned by the side of the road like I've never seen before or since. Traffic was moderate and going slower than usual because of the ice patches, but still doing about 50 miles per hour. Me too. After getting off onto SR 315 south, I put myself in the middle lane, following by a couple hundred yards, a yellow VW. About one mile south, I looked in my mirror to see relatively heavy traffic a quarter mile behind me. Looking forward again, I see the VW swerve and start to spin at about 360 degrees very two seconds, slowly heading to the right side of the road, aimed at an abandoned Buick on the side. Before I could react, I hit the ice and started to spin too, also toward that Buick. There I was, getting that panoramic 360 degree view every two seconds, and I could see that not only was I still heading toward that Buick, but I was also gaining on the the yellow VW. Knowing my car was out of control, I rested my noggin on the headrest and watched the scenery go by. I started a little conversation with God reminding Him that Lori really really liked this car and thanked him taking good care of it. As the yellow VW blurred by, I thanked God for taking care of the VW too since I have always loved that breed. I then relaxed, closed my eyes and gave it up to God. The next spin around as I calculated it, I would hit the V-Dub and then we would hit the Buick. I felt a bump as if someone had put their foot in front of my right rear tire. Opening my eyes, there I was traveling straight down the middle lane at 45 miles per hour. As I regained control of my breathing I looked in the mirror to see the V-Dub, safe, whole and pulling to the side in front of the Buick. Further back, the traffic, being warned by two spinning cars had slowed considerably and safely traveled the ice patch. In spite of the bitter cold, the rest of my day went wonderfully. To God be the Glory!

johniam, That is absolutely not what excie is saying. It has nothing to do with the greatness or insignificance of the organization or not. Is a sin less a sin because it was done in small church rather that a large one? Is a sin less a sin because because it was done by a believer rather than an unbeliever? Whether someone is raped or molested by a priest, by Sandusky, by uncle harry or daddy or by vp, is the damage to that persons body and soul any less? Who will God hate more, a 'natural man' molesting someone, or someone who is proclaiming himself to be god's personal representative who is molesting a child of God? Matt 18:6 But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were drowned in the depth of the sea. Now, if that weren't enough in itself, way teachings were that if a man of god allowed the devil just a little opening into his life, it set things up for the devil to get bigger and more evil into the man-o-gods life. That may just have something to do with why twi started out so sweet and became progressively more legalistic and evil as it matured into RosyLie's personal vision of twi.

I've seen the Redneck Resort on TV, it looks the fun place. Where would I like to go; I'd like to go back to where I was before my illnesses disabled me. My favorite place is Ludington, Michigan. Half way up Lake Michigan and on the shore. (My dad's hometown.) Thailand and Okinawa were wonderful places to spend a year or two in the early seventies. To tell the truth, anywhere you are at, it will be as wonderful or miserable as you make it. That is the most certain thing I learned while in the service to my country, and again in service to twi.

Let us not forget the overflow room in the basement. Ohhhh yes, the worlds finest third class accommodations. <_< (For new folk, National Home was the pre-fab building maker that the BRC was made from)

Awww.. the good ol' days when the BRC was only half full, and populated with: About one third... long time standing local folk in their Sunday best. About one third... staff and early way corpse in their sunday best too. (Including The Loy'd Craig himself as a real human before he ascended up on high.) And..., About one third... reforming hippy converts in their sunday best blue jeans. Yes Virginia, there was a time when the dress code was more relaxed. But they were supposed to be your best blue jeans. The best times were in the summer when you could sit outside under the trees, smoke, and hang loose with your friends.

Actually, I think last 40 years show very well where we went from there. <_< :wacko: :blink: :o

skyrider, This is very important, don't forget, this is a clone ministry, only your clone can sign up!! Thank god for modern science. :blush:

I always wondered why squirrels considered collecting nuts was such a prophetable business.

Oh, excie you unbeliever, you. Just as Saint Peter when he was going to the cross, felt himself being unworthy of being crucified in the same manner as his Lord, had himself hung upside down on the cross, Saint Chris, every bit as humble as Peter, and seeking a similar solution to please his lord, turned himself around on the operation table and had his left nut removed. :wacko: :blink: Lord.... I apologize for that last st....

Speaking of borrowed cars, Remember how so many of the "Rocks" finished with cars in a field getting stuck in the mud. A call would go out for people with four wheel drives to loan their suv's to grounds crews to help get folks unstuck. How wonderful, how loving, how giving, How many times did those 4-wheeler owners get their vehicles back with something broken because those grounds crews didn't know or didn't care about how they used and abused them.

Yes outie, The auditorium has been full of it for a very long time. It's a good thing they built the ceiling so high, so it can hold so much premium manure. Have the grunts turn it over occasionally and they will have wonderful compost. :B)

johniam, As sweet as your intentions may be, passing the electric kool-aid has already been done. It leaves a big mess to clean up too. Yes......, I'm sick too.

Oh, what the hell, why not just go back to the ol' BRC! (biblical research center for all you late comers. It held about 250 people, All sunday teaching came from there from the mid sixties til the big auditorium opened.) Awwwwwwww.... Now wouldn't that be nostalgic! :dance: RosyLie, Just think of the propaganda value of that. People might come back just so they could sit out under the trees on the wierwille lawn in the summer like they did 30 years ago. Whoooops... Sorry VP, I didn't mean to sit on your face...!?! :o :P

waysider, I think vp had that part right, Rosyli....., er, ...the adversary did go through OldSkools notes and he did have the most miserable of sundays.

OldSkool, If I remember right, you came in after pfal was laid to rest. Those of us who took it might remember: There is a segment in pfal where vp talks of walking in the spirit and letting the spirit work within you as you teach, thusly uplifting the fellowship in the glory of the Lord. All are blessed, all are healed, all are rejoicing in the Lord and all needs are met. And on the other hand...... His example of the standard wimpy ordained clergy was on monday, going to his office, pulling out some paper and starting his next sermon. tuesday, wednesday, thursday, and friday he keeps reworking, rewriting, editing and perfecting his notes for the sunday sermon. On saterday he types it out inj full and perfect form to be read on sunday. Then vp bends over as if readinf from a page and in a slow deliberately mocking tone says: "Dearly beloved brethren in the Lord." Then he stands upright, looks into the camera and says: "My God, isn't the spirit just working in that poor fellow." There was a period in the '70's and early '80's where many took his example to heart and did their best to walk in the spirit and bless others as the class and ministry had exhorted us to do. It was the wonderful miraculous goodtimes that many of remember with such fondness. Well RosyLie, please tell us again how you are the true holder of the twi legacy? (I know you are snickering, Hinder!) <_<

I see OldSkool has given a definitive answer to the question, and I will back it up with these observations: For a few years, the Dayton station I get has occassionaly ran the the packaged for TV Sunday services. I haven't looked recently whether they still do it or not. I did watch all or portions of 4 or 5 episodes here and there and I was left with these impressions. Everything was stiff, dull, and somehow running in an odd slow motion. The music The singing Their shuffling, I cannot call it choreography The teaching was dullest of all, and very basic, almost pre-pfal. The smiles were ...creepy. Not as good as I remembered, they were being genuine the best they could be, but it wasn't right. The teachings were done from a small wooden podium in front of the closed curtains. The very large dark green curtains and the small podium gave an essence of of dark and gloominess which added to the measured slow pace of the teaching. The stage area looked the same with the same curtains and props I had seen in the '80's and '90's, except duller, due to age I guess. Either that or they lack people who know how to to light and film a stage properly. I found it interesting that most of the camera work was done from the balcony area. when they did a wide view shot, you could see some of the audience. You never saw back more than 3 or 5 rows. Occasionally, the rows were not filled all the way to the end. Anyhow, that is what I remember from watching those episodes from 2 to 4 years ago. You can make of it what you want. :B)

Ohh..... I don't know about that. RosyLie has been known to be Dictatorially crass. And she has been known to be Genteelly crass On rare occasions as she has transmogrified from the one to the other, she has had a moment of middle crass.

Poor Jesus, just think of all those expectant Nuns he has to deal with! :blink: And.... Oh yes! Happy Birthday, Excie!