Bob

Found some corpse notes in the Waydale archive dated April 8th, 1998: He made it 3 more years. Quite a long time... :D--> :D--> :D--> Rosalie and Harve have past their 5 year tenures also. Are they going to step down?

LLP, I have no idea what you just said. Wasn't the issue with MN TWI's SUPPORT OF HIM? What does that have anything to do with renouncing one's faith? Faith and support of an organization should be two different things, no? I have never heard of TWI being refered to as a "worldly entity." It has always been God's household, most perfect thing on earth. If it is a worldly entity, then how is faith associated with supporting it both with your money and time? Huh? IF? He was tried and CONVICTED. There is no if anymore. He did it and is paying for it. AND TWI STILL SUPPORTS HIM! I don't know what to think of people like you. I know a little girl who was attacked just last fall at a branch meeting. TWI tried their same COVER OUR foot job on it. The mother still supports TWI. It's DISGUSTING! I think signal hit the nail on the head. You have a good income, as you have boasted of before, and TWI treats you with kid gloves. They won't do anything to interupt their revenue stream from you. And you take the GREEDY foot view of, as long as it hasn't happened to me.... These must be your benifits you claimed earlier, getting off being treated like something special. Seen it too many times. You're not special, you just have something they want....MONEY! Unfortunately, your money is paying for tomorrow's abuses.

LLP, see me responded to some of your questions here also, for which it would be nice to know your response. It's a very informative post: see me's post

Could you elaborate on what rewards you are reaping? To be honest, I can't name one thing of any value I got in return for my ten years in there. And why is it considered a reward?

LLP, I noticed you posted on the "Anyone new here" thread. Seeing you're back, I wonder if you could take the time to tell me how or why you accepted and or justified TWI's position (since it appears you have). Not trying to badger you. It is a question I really would appreceiate if you could answer. There's no wrong answer. Private topic is fine.

Dog house?

I'm a cheap bastard. If Steve!'s not using the guest bedroom, you think I could invite myself to it?

I think I have a trip to Orlando coming up also. I'll probably miss Steve!, but Belle, think you'd like to meet up with me? ;)-->

Cool. Mr. Eastwood does not like being impersonated.

OK, now for the Bible verses. In regards to salt and loosing it: This is talking about commitment, not specifically to TWI or any other group, but commitment in general. If what KC Pillai taught is correct, when the salt covenant was taken, it was taken between TWO people. They were BOTH making a commitment to each other. A) The only salt commitments I saw in TWI were in marriage ceremonies (my ex broke hers), ordination, and the latter numbered corpse. Unless you were ordained or part of the latter corpse, you never took a salt commitment with TWI (eating in the meal tent doesn’t count). The marriage salt covenant was between the husband and wife and excluded TWI (contrary to what my ex claims). If it included TWI, then the one performing the ceremony for TWI should have been licking the salt. B) The commitment is a TWO WAY STREET. TWI loves to continually remind it’s TWIts about commitment to their household, but what is their commitment to it? To live off it the rest of their lives? Whatever they claim their commitment is, it was thoroughly broken when Vee Pee and Craig were so blatantly hiding some weird, screwed up belief that all the women in the kingdom/household belonged to them. When they started abusing women behind closed doors, marking and avoiding those trying to expose it, they thoroughly violated any “salt covenant” between them and the lowely TWIts (if one even existed). Therefore, no one could ever be held responsible for it any longer. You’re free to leave. In fact, staying with it would be more of a slap in God’s face. In regards to “do good unto all:” This just a good policy to have. It would make you think twice if it said the opposite. Being good to someone is quite different from owing your life to them. In regards to “Obey them that have the rule over you:” Whoever gave TWI rule over anyone? Did God decree it? Did Jesus throw his mantle on them? Anyone can teach the Bible and give their interpretation of it. Just because you buy into it doesn’t mean they own you for the rest of your life. Think folks! Life is a gift (from God if you choose to believe so). Why the hell should it EVER be given to someone else? We could really have fun with this verse if you want to go into the origins of the book of Hebrews. Contrary to what TWI believes, it was not written by Paul. An interesting note also. There is a writing, I forget where I read it, I can find it if you want, that basically was a complaint from the Corinthians. This was after Paul was dead and someone had sent some “leader” to them to be in charge. Their complaint was why did they need a leader? They had never had one before so why did they need one now?

OK, I've been bad and disappeared from my thread for awhile. Even after asking for Bible verses and Belle so kindly providing some. I'll be sure to get to it today, but I wanted to mention a couple things. Excathedra, loved your response and quite simply makes the absolute most sense in only one sentence. :)--> Moony, I think Vee Pee started with the amplified to make his "literals according to usage" but he changed them to give his meaning to a verse, not what it actually said. The only excuse I ever heard in TWI for using the KJV was that all the research books were based on it -- which is not true. The fact that they still insist on using it shows they are not a research group, but only another religion worshiping some text. The "thee" and "thou's" makes it sound much better when referring to God. But then you end up with their ignorance of Old English creeping into their doctrine (having two definitions for throughly and thoroughly, having God "replenish" the earth, etc).

This is a better link, going directly to the post (if this is the post you were refering to): To the topoftheworld

Shellon, I think to get the analogy correct, you need to move a little south of the genital area.

Raf, So true. Without us, TWI was nothing. BUT: God = The Word TWI's Household = The Word Things equal to the same thing are equal to each other. Therefor: TWI's Household = God --And (if I follow TWIt logic properly)-- If I owe my life to God, then I owe my life to TWI... I was hoping someone would pop in some Bible verses to attach to this. Seems like no one agrees with TWI's logic, so I'll play Devil's advocate for awhile... "You're life is not your own, you were bought with a price."

I'm in no rut! I spent 10 years in that crap hole. Am I to ignore that 10 years? No way. It is a part of me. I'm not going "close that chapter" and just ignore it. I think "closing the chapter" is burying it under a carpet so it doesn't have to be dealt with. ** I see a cat fight starting. :)--> My money's on Belle! ;)-->

They're building something alright. A stash of cash and a retirement for a few elites. They've also managed to build a corps of slaves to do their bidding. Probably best to keep your kids away from it.

I don't think so. Going over the stuff time and again, in lively discussions, gets the brain juices moving. Helps dig out the crap still remaining. Besides, there are many innies that lurk here. I think the ongoing discussions help them. ***edited to remove a word I don't use anymore...can't believe I used it....there I go again!!!!

Yes. What would life be like without the dark ages. All those hundreds of years when the RC churched ruled. All those people tortured and executed for not putting up with their ****. I'm sure thankful that they made up for it by giving some family a meal when they were hungry. Now what are they going to do to make up for all those altar boys they molested? Hmm... OM. Do you know what a hypocrite is? Or do you believe that just because someone gives off the pretense of doing good and someone buys into it, then we must take the evil with it? If I have a dog that I really like, always been good to me, jumps up and down when I walk in the door, but then one day bites off my daughter's finger. What do you think I'm going to do with that dog? Say well, he does have a lot of good qualities. I guess I have to take the good with the bad. NOT! That dog's going down immediatly. He will not be remembered fondly either.

They are not a research "ministry," nor have they ever been. Give their "research" to people who do know how real research is to be done, and it would only be laughed at. Their research is based on so many invalid assumptions it's laughable. Their biggest error with their research? Ignoring history, which they seem so hell bent on repeating.

OM, you're only giving reasons for not having religion. If I have to take the evil with the good, I'll pass and stick with what I have (and save a ton of money). I'll lay off your evil and omniscience statement before the thread completely derails.

George, you are the vengeful God of the Old Testament. :D--> I like your analogy, but if I may, I’d like to tweak it a bit. Assume you like ants. Assume also you started this ant hill and placed two ants in it, male and female. Assume also you left out the rules about eating from the wrong tree, etc. You want to see your ant hill grow and multiply. You’re weird like that. But then, these ants start worshiping you like George stated. You are their God. They’re spending a lot of their time sitting in meetings, talking to other ants in neighboring ant hills, trying to get them to come live at theirs. But they’re not spending enough time working on their own. They’re not spending enough time building their own families. They’re renting ant hills from others when they could have their own. You tell them to stop it. Just be ants and grow your own ant hill. Some agree but are then kicked out by the others, marked and avoided. Damn it! I just wanted a nice ant hill. I wanted my ants to be ants! Not these robots going through the motions worshiping me. In the end, maybe soaking the thing with gas and setting it on fire is the best thing to do. Damn ants won’t listen to me.

No. Just because a con artist suckered you into something doesn't mean you should be thankful because you found some use for it.

TWI can't be fixed. Name one thing that an innie has gotten fixed in TWI in the last 20 years (or ever). There isn't one. Why? If an innie challenges the elite higher ups on doctrine or practice, he is labeled rebellious. If he does not change his thinking to match theirs, he is shown the door (with a smile on their face since they are doing the "loving" thing). If you're an innie and you see things aren't right, what are you doing about it? Waiting for someone else to take the initiative? Don't hold your breath. Don't get me wrong, people have tried in the past. A lot of them are here and they can tell you themselves how they were shown the door and the labels put on them afterward. But you will never hear what they tried to do within TWI. You will only hear how messed up they were. You think you got what it takes to change TWI? You've committed your life to it. You might as well make it right if you're going to be there for the long haul. What are you waiting for? Scared? Is this something really worth committing your life to?

LOL! A thread where every post is by OM, praising old doc vic, always renewing his mind to rid it of the negatives spoken of him here. No, he never ripped of everything and claimed it as his own. No, he never abused women, took advantage of them. No, he never was a power hungry monster. No, he wasn't an alcoholic. Hell, he never smoked and latter died of cancer. No, he's a saint and we must continue his legacy...

This bears further discussion. I actually presented this scenario to my now ex-wife. She insisted she would have crossed over to Paul. This is absolutely dishonest given her actions in the current. She has never even considered anything taught by someone else, especially if it disagreed with current TWI doctrine. If someone taught something that didn’t disagree with TWI but TWI never taught on it, she still wouldn’t consider it until TWI passed judgment on it. She would have never seen it back then, and certainly not now. Current innies say there is nothing better out there. Hog wash! You haven’t looked. You haven’t considered. Even if there isn’t (which isn’t true), why would that justify staying where you are? If things aren’t right, do something about it. Either fix it, or cut your loses and move on. Life is too short.