Raf

I wouldn't dare. It's a little devious, but not that devious.

I think that's just dishonest. Isn't one of the chapters of OGOL called "The Man-Man's Redeemer"? You've SUNK when you're plagiarizing Wierwille. :) By the way, did anyone have trouble following JCOPS, with all those footnotes and references to other books, including the book by Ernest Martin that beat Wierwille to the punch on Sept. 11, 3 B.C.? I'm just curious, because I've been told footnotes are a distraction. Meanwhile, I've never heard anyone accuse VPW of plagiarizing Ernest Martin (because he didn't). :)

And Mussolini made the trains run on time, but as has already been established, Craig was already off his rocker by this point. The fact that he succeeded in keeping it from you was admirable on his part. But his descent had already begun. Just because you didn't see it doesn't mean it wasn't true. Lots of things you don't see are true. What Oldiesman is saying is tantamount to saying that after Titanic hit the iceberg, the smart thing to do was stay on board until things got REALLY bad. No. The smart thing to do would have been to get into a lifeboat forthwith. Unfortunately, many of us got into lifeboats that had leaks in them, while others just jumped into the water. But we survived, and we weren't on the Titanic as it sank. History proved us right.

I suspect this will get a Best Picture nomination. Won't win, and probably shouldn't. But I hope it gets nominated.

It's accurate to your perception, Oldies. Not to the reality of what was going on behind the scenes. (My impression was also inaccurate as to what was going on behind the scenes, as I did not know CG was what he apparently was. I always thought he was a good, if dull, teacher).

I started posting with my real, full name back on Waydale and on the CES board. I changed it to my first name and the year of my birth. Then, out of minor concern for identity theft and acceptance of what I was being called anyway, I shortened it to just plain Raf (harder to misspell, too). My avatar is me. It used to be Jon Lovitz in a tuxedo doing an impression of me at an NAHJ function.

Can I jump in? I did skip a turn, after all. :) This takes a teensy bit of thinking.

Oh DANG! I remember this one! grrrrrr...... Body Double ? Dang! Looked it up and I was wrong.

LAE, I say this unequivocally: Anyone who stayed after 1989 got fooled. I'm not rubbing it in their faces. (Perhaps you are not aware that Oldies and I have disagreed on this publicly for several years now. Nothing I say on the subject surprises him; nothing he says on the subject surprises me). There's nothing snide or arrogant in what I said. Sorry you took it that way. LCM cleverly masked an egotistical power grab as a reasonable request. Now, I do acknowledge that many who left got fooled, too. Not knowing Chris Geer, it took me longer to see what a doctrinal problem he was. And it wasn't until many years later that I knew his role in TWI pre-POP. Thing was, by that point my closest friends and I were so adamant about not following men that we didn't follow Chris Geer off the doctrinal deep end. That's a separate issue, one I'll be happy to address. But it doesn't change the fact that LCM snookered everyone, and Chris Geer snookered lots of people too. The difference is, many who left with CG were better off because we had a little practice at distancing ourselves from a would be MOG. When it came time to shake CG off our sandals, it was a piece of cake by then. What we all should have done was left any vestige of TWI and TWGB (Geer) in the rear view mirror.

The Prime Minister of Israel suffered a stroke today. This does not bode well. (I expect this thread to get moved to politics and tacks eventually, but mods, please wait a couple of days until we see how things turn out).

Excellent!

Speaking of which, enjoy: http://www.youtube.com/watch.php?v=zLElfJ9YCh0

Ralph Bellamy Trading Places Denholm Elliott

Linda, Things went nicely for Oldies. Therefore, they went nicely for the ministry.

I don't agree with this. Astrology is the belief that the stars influence our lives. Nothing in those two books even remotely suggests such a thing. It only suggests that there are signs in the heavens, concludes that those signs include constellations, and proceeds to show how, in Wierwille and Ernest Martin's opinions, those signs corresponded to events we see in the Bible.

But it's fun. Coffee?

It was CORNY! It was HOKEY! and it was... FUN! I really enjoyed it.

I'm going to go back to karmic's, because it wasn't that hard. I was just busy. Starting with Shopgirl... Claire Danes Romeo + Juliet Brian Dennehy

On the contrary, he was manifesting it right then and there. I understand. That's why you got fooled. Some of us didn't. He was at the beginning of his control-freak peak. Those who left never got to see it firsthand, praise God. And Mussolini made the trains run on time. But he was still a freak who needed to be brought down, as was LCM. Your start date is off by a few years. But sadly, you still don't.

You know, when it comes to plagiarism, I hear you guys saying that we should not be accepting the world's standard and we should allow God's Word to prevail blah blah blah. But suddenly the world's standard is wholly appropriate when a control freak demands your loyalty. Which is it? Lots of people recognized that LCM was not truly asking people to stand with him, but to stand UNDER him. Those people were fired. And those who were not in a position to BE fired left gladly. And history proved us right. :)

I'm not sure about that last line. It absolutely does not apply to me. But that's neither here nor there.I actually agree with what you said here, WTH. I think CES did a bangup job with that book, and they wouldn't have had it not been for JCING. Are there flaws with CES's book? I think so. But there are good points as well. One of my beefs with the CES book is that JCING is not in the bibliography (I'm going to check again to make sure I am not mistaken). JCING belongs in the bibliography of that book. This, of course, I disagree with entirely. It's self-serving and stupid. Why are people who are trying to grow in their knowledge of scripture "bickering," while idolatrous sycophants who have no desire to grow beyond the limited perspective of a lecherous plagiarist held to no account whatsoever? Please. If you ever decide to grow beyond PFAL, there are plenty of genuine Christians who'd love to help you see a more excellent way.

Even if Wierwille said the problem "had been solved," I wouldn't believe him, nor would I accept the ludicrous thesis that his written works comprise said solution, seeing as those written works contradict each other and contain errors which prove (according to the very standards of those written works) that they are not what Smikeol claims them to be. I do not start with the premise that PFAL is not "The Word of God." On the contrary: to prove or disprover a thesis, you must start with the presumption that said thesis is true, then test it. As I test PFAL, as ANY HONEST PERSON tests PFAL, they can ask themselves simple questions to determine its veracity. If PFAL is true, then it will not contain any errors nor will it contradict itself. PFAL fails on both counts, proving the thesis false. On its merits, not on (verified and documented) accusations of plagiarism or (verified and documented) evidence of the lecherousness, vindictiveness and dishonesty of its "author," who is VPW and not God. To whatever extent PFAL has something positive to offer, praise God. But everything positive that is offered in PFAL is available elsewhere to anyone who chooses to seek it.

If I were to lose a friend due to my lack of devotion to VPW, I would rejoice in the knowledge that a false and phony friend was exposed. As it stands, I did not lose any friends for that reason, and I know that I chose my friends wisely. :)

Good one! Jean Harlowe was in Public Enemy with James Cagney Cagney was in Ragtime with Brad Dourif Brad Dourif was in Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers with Cate Blanchett Cate Blanchett was in The Aviator with Gwen Stefani Let's try this one: Fred Astaire/Hector Elizondo Par is 5.

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