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"You people just want to live off the fat of the land!" One of the things top leader screamed at the top of his lungs because no one had been there to direct where he should park at the hangar he had been to a million times. He was screaming this to full time staff that were being paid on a "need basis". He screamed about this for 20 minutes because no one had apparently been spiritually sharp enough to realize he was about to arrive. Seriously, how dumb do you have to be to need someone directing you where to park in a dinky parking lot with hardly any other cars?

I guess I don't remember him because he was probably nice. LOL.

The name is familiar- but I'm not sure who he is. What did he do? It might jog my memory. How many languages did he speak/teach?

Yeah, after something like that I wouldn't have heard a word either. The sad thing is, your experience happened in 1983, but it didn't stop there. I had a similar experience long after that with another leader. Screamed his head off. Wonder if the screamathons continues to this day.

In America.

Top leader once said: "Slavery was not as bad as it was made out to be. They were in loving households and were taken care of." I'm still gagging over that one.

Good post, you said it well.

I remember that time. i felt humiliated to show our twig coords how much I was making at the time. It wasn't much per hour and I felt embarrassed when they said they thought I would be making more than this. In my budget I had made gifts/entertainment one category because I did not know when I would need to buy gifts and when I would be able to go out. I was told I had to specify how much I would spend on gifts that year and how much I would have to spend on entertainment for the year. It had to be seperated and I had to stay committed to the amounts I decided. This really perplexed me, because what if I was invited to a wedding or a baby shower? What if there were no movies I wanted to see? I gave them some made up amounts that I did not stay "committed to". In fact, that year at Christmas I ended up regifting a lot of things. I know it sounds terrible to some people, but bless my Mothers heart and the hearts of her friends. I was sent so many baked goods and jams, there was no way I could use or store all of them. So I gave them to friends, telling them my Mother or her friends had made what i was giving them. It seemed to go over well. So I had money left over that I used on some unexpected bills instead. But I knew the reproof I would have been met with if I had ever told anyone this. I think your vacation was a special blessing. While you were able to see the contrast because of it, I was not yet able to at that time. I tapped danced to every thing they wanted me to do and I was super stressed they would find out I had not stayed "committed to" how much I spent on gifts and entertainment that year. So many ridiculous demands. And so unnecessary. Bramble, I don't know why you sharing about your vacation touched me so much but it did. While my awakening was very gradual, I was eventually able to see the contrast also. I started to make friends that were truly fun, interesting and supportive. The contrast was stark. I also think your brother has probably been blessed in many ways because of the love you and your family have for him. It's not easy being mentally ill. Those of us who are not should never judge or condemn anyone who is. It is not their fault and they have to be brave every day. i'm glad he has you.

I haven't thrown all of it out because some of it was good and helpful to my life. But I had to throw a lot of it out, not really the bible but the OCD and poor examples we had of Christian leadership. I enjoyed Bramble's post about visiting family for three weeks. That was very touching. I'm so glad you got to have that time. "the harsh, cold demanding life we lived in TWI" would have condemned a terminally ill Father, a mentally ill Brother and a fragile Mother. What a blessing to Bramble and her family that twi was not a part of that special vacation.

Not the point. It's about respect. You choose to use foul language around your children. That's your business. But it's not your place or anyone elses to decide that other peoples children have to listen to your foul language. Self involved people tend to think that if they are comfortable with something then everyone else should be too. Like coughing on you or talking with food in their mouths. I'm not saying you are necesarily self involved- I don't know you. People going to a bible meeting are going there to hear the bible, not swear words. It is selfish, self indulgent and immature to use a bible meeting to throw a temper tantrum. So that would be like a smoker with the flu coughing into your face or your childrens and responding with "Children won't be hurt unless you are." It's just plain rude. There are certain common courtesies we offer each other. It's about respect.

Interesting, now that I think about it. It was another way they violated our privacy and right to raise our children as we see fit. How dare the loyster or anyone else for that matter think they have the right to introduce other peoples children to foul language? Even Hollywood has more respect than some of these twileaders did. They put ratings on movies so parents can know if there is bad language and decide if they want their kids exposed to it. Yet, that same courtesy was not extended to us by these so called gawdlee twileaders at a so called gawdlee gathering where children were already present. They took away the right of the parents to decide what's best for their children by ambushing everyone like that.

I watched a news show about the girl who had been held captive for 18 years. She had been abducted by a man and his wife when she was only 11 years old, held in a storage shed for years and eventually bore two children to the man who had held her hostage. It has been asked repeatedly why she didn't leave. She had become afraid of the outside world and wanted to protect her two daughters. She said it was hard to explain. But one thing she said was revealing. It was directed to the kidnapper and went something like "you were wrong about everything". He was known for his egomaniacal preachings. While I would never compare my experiences with hers, I think I understood what she meant by that. When someone is only really listening to one voice, you become dependant on it. Even though on some levels you're acknowledging their behavior is bad, somewhere along the line they got you to believe they are right about the most important things and that they are the only "safe" choice. I remember being so afraid I would be M&A over nothing. I had seen it happen to others and it scared me to death. So I outwardly agreed with everything they said and did whatever they wanted me to. Someone on the outside looking in would have seen it as this: All I had to do was leave and things would get better. I would no longer be subjected to viscious verbal assaults, every aspect of my life would no longer be monitored, I would no longer be under the rule of egotistical leaders, and I wouldn't be working for free anymore. Sounds great doesn't it? So why did it take me so long to break away? Because I fell for their fear tacticts. People who oppress other people are good at it. Even to this day, I will sometimes find myself slipping, thinking they still have power over me. Like if they found out I've been posting here and what they would do to me. But now I shake it off right away and keep moving forward. I'm happier, healthier and I don't care about their approval/disapproval as I once did. (They can clean there own damn "limb homes.") I have a bunch of wonderful friends now and I'm living a great life. I get to do things that are truly fun. (They can string their own damn chairs.) twi was rarely fun or fufilling. Most leaders did not know how to be a friend and they certainly did not know how to inspire. They never were and never will be better than anyone else, no matter how many temper tantrums they throw. I'm now on the outside looking in and I see it too. Things did get better. Much better.

It's weird really. Even those ettiquette books we were required to learn from would not have justified some of the behavior that went on. I remember someone sharing how saying the F word sometimes will be the only way to get someone's attention. I could see that, I would yell it if it would stop someone from getting hit by a train. But the exception became the rule and it seemed like they were swearing all the time.

On a previous thread it was mentioned how RD swore at someone in an attempt to be loving to someone else. In my experiences, leaders would throw public temper tantrums and use foul language. They were often applauded as if losing control like this was godly. Does anyone have any examples like this to share? chockfull, on 04 July 2011 - 01:53 PM, said: The same tired tripe that has been used by countless egomaniac TWI leadership to justify their lack of control over their tongue. I know this believer guy who bought a window washing business from a WC graaad about to go on staff. The deal was, the wc guy would retain an interest, get a percentage of the profits and believer guy would also make payments. Well, believer guy started losing the big accounts (he had an odd personality which contributed to the problem) and was unable to keep up the payments to wc guy. Situation came to light and beleiver guy was M&A for taking on a debt (and probably also for being odd). WC guy got a good talking to about how it was an ungodly deal. He said he learned a lot. But he was not M&A and is on staff to this day. Believer guy was devastated, loved being in twi. Was not "allowed" to talk to any of the other believers. His world was coming to an end. He told his Mother, who was never in twi. But she felt bad for him so she wanted to help. She calls the ordained limb cwoord and asked if there was anything she could do to help and tried to explain how devastated her son was to no longer be velcom at der vey. He responded by telling her "It's none of you f---ing business lady!" and hung up on her. Nice eh? All that ettiquette taught yet he wasn't decent man. He thought he was great for being disrespectful to an elderly woman. From the previous thread-All RD did was set a bad example when he swore like that, but nice that he's since apologized for things. He'd probably be embarrassed to know anyone admired him for that incident. It was so long ago and a mistake he probably doesn't want to relive. (I know there are things I said and did that I wouldn't want people admiring to this day.) BTW- the lc that behaved in such an ungentlemanly manner by swearing at the elderly lady is now a full time paid RC with twi. Probaly has never occured to him to apologize.

I know this believer guy who bought a window washing business from a WC graaad about to go on staff. The deal was, the wc guy would retain an interest, get a percentage of the profits and believer guy would also make payments. Well, believer guy started losing the big accounts (he had an odd personality which contributed to the problem) and was unable to keep up the payments to wc guy. Situation came to light and beleiver guy was M&A for taking on a debt (and probably also for being odd). WC guy got a good talking to about how it was an ungodly deal. He said he learned a lot. But he was not M&A and is on staff to this day. Believer guy was devastated, loved being in twi. Was not "allowed" to talk to any of the other believers. His world was coming to an end. He told his Mother, who was never in twi. But she felt bad for him so she wanted to help. She calls the ordained limb cwoord and asked if there was anything she could do to help and tried to explain how devastated her son was to no longer be velcom at der vey. He responded by telling her "It's none of you f---ing business lady!" and hung up on her. Nice eh? All that ettiquette taught yet he wasn't decent man. He thought he was great for being disrespectful to an elderly woman. All Rolpha DB did was set a bad example when he did that, but nice that he's since apologized for things. He'd probably be embarrassed to know anyone admired him for that incident. It was so long ago and a mistake he probably doesn't want to relive. BTW- the lc that behaved in such an ungentlemanly manner is now a full time paid RC with twi. Probaly has never occured to him to apologize.

you lucky bastud you had a TV LOL. Only because the Mother of one of my room mates sent him one for his birthday and he was a really nice guy who shared. Put it in the living room so we could all use it. Right on. You said it well. I was tired and afraid of being reamed out for being honest. Work full time, twi over time. Couldn't say enough already, they would flip out.

I once pretended to be sick because I didn't want to go to a session of the plaf class that was being run in the city. We had all been admonished to attend every session to show support. I was probably in charge of something dumb that really wasn't necessary. Anyway, I lived in a wy home with several other believers. As we were all rushing around getting ready, I realized how badly I didn't want to go. I wanted solitude and to watch a movie of the week on TV. So i said I was sick. Of course my room mates prayed for me and one of them called the limb coord. I got on the phone with him, he prayed too. Then he gave me "permission" to stay home and rest. I was home free! Yahoo! I made some popcorn and settled onto the couch happy as could be. Then I heard it. A car pulling into the driveway. I peeked out the window and it was two believers coming to the door. I rushed to hide the popcorn under the sink and turned off the tv. They had been sent by the limb coord to "bless me". They had been at the class and were chosen to minister to me because of how boldly these two held forth the word. They stayed with me until all my room mates returned to all tell me how "blessed" "deliverd" and "awesome" taking this session for the 85 millionth time changed their lives. Boy, that sure back fired on me! LOL!

I said a lot of things like that too. Part of it for me was, I really did believe they had been chosen by God to lead us and I bought into all of their self promotion and hype. Even if something didn't sit right or make sense, I would assume I was spiritually screwed up for not seeing it their way. So I would mindlessly mimic and praise, thinking I would 'get there.' But then I finally saw the truth. These leaders had nothing to offer and never really helped anyone. Whenever it came close to where they would have to do any real work or minister, they covered up their inadequacey by throwing a temper tantrum. It's nice to be free from all of that.

About JL, I feel sorry for him. I wonder if he ever has any fun?

I think the worst of it is when they would "confront" someone on their death bed. Or when they publicly ripped them to shreds after they died. Or being unkind and condemning to the family and friends.

I wonder if he still throws temper tantrums. Does he have anyone to listen to them? Does he have anyone to care if he throws one? I remember he would talk about how pure his heart was. GAG.

Wanted to say thanks to all that kept this site going, I know it helped myself and others to heal from all the insanity twi brought to our lives. I have had to figure out why I got involved in twi in the first place and why I stayed for so long, even when the abuse became increasingly sadistic. Why I joined: 1) I always wanted to be a good Christian. 2) I wanted to understand the bible. (I had tried several times to read the bible from Genesis to Revelation, but would never get to far) 3) I wanted friends who were good people, who didn't take drugs or drink too much. 4) I was lonely and traumatized by events in my family and the demise of my parents. 5) People in twi were really nice to me and cared about me. 6) I started to understand the bible better. 7) WOW seemed like an amazing adventure. Why I stayed: 1) Loyalty-I'm pathalogically loyal. 2) I believe in forgiveness. 3) I did believe the doom and gloom Craig and others predicted for anyone who left. 4) Fearful of being kicked out-so I wouldn't receive previous referred to gloom and doom. 5) Didn't want to lose relationships with people I loved, didn't like the thought of them writing me off if I were to leave. 6) It was like putting quarters into a slot machine, or paying for insurance policies. Would it all pay off and make sense once I finally walked away and it was too late to go back? Would I miss the promised land after all of that time working for it? 7) Where would I go and what would I do? No longer the youngster I was when this all started. But when I was finally brave enough to venture out and think for myself, my life became really good. Not perfect (I was way behind financially for a person my age) but more fun and peaceful than it had been in all my years with twi. I made interesting friends, got a good job, bought a house (YES A MORTGAGE) took vacations that didn't involve meetings where I sat in a hotel conference room being yelled at by a twi prima dona, or sitting in a corn field being yelled at by a twi diva, donated and gave to charities who actually help people, volunteered, went to events I THOUGHT were fun, went shopping without turning in an itinerary to a leader who had nothing better to do, stopped thinking other Christians had it all wrong, and most of all RECEIVED SO MANY BLESSING FROM GOD. Too many to name, but you get my point, I wasn't a grease spot by midnight. So, do you have something to share about why you got in, why you stayed and was it better once you moved on from twi?

Why is the site closing down?