Bramble

I guess I don't see what is so important about Fox News or why Obama needs to read it.There's plenty of news sources out there.

I think that anyone that left TWI in the past few years would still hold TWI beliefs, and I think that would be normal. I don't think they are being stupid, I think it takes people time to start thinking for themselves without the constant rush to renew their minds back to TWI doctrine. Those habits have to drop away.

Honestly not sure what you are posting about Bolshevick, so I'll pass your post, perhaps another will hop right on it. I was talking about 'branding/marketing' equating a word Christian with "good." Or I could have used neighborly, or decent. or giving. whatever Branding is about the sound bite, the immediated reference or connotation, not the depth of an issue. Is it really a good idea to take the word Christian, a large, diverse belief sysem, and brand it 'good, neighborly etc until the word Christian would equate to a value like neighborly? We here at GSC already know that not all things labeled Christian are actually good or neighborly, some are destructive to their followers. Obviously I am not communicating what I was trying to say. I give up. Things to do. But I did think Billy sounded like a great guy.

I agree, things and words have value. If all things and organizations labeled Christian are also equally labeled good then how does that help anyone? While all Christian organizations and people SHOULD be good, not all are! Isn't that pretty much the point of GSC? A group that self labled "Christian, Bible study, The Way etc" was not a good organization--but it used the labeling of organizations that SHOULD be good. It was deceptive. Why not let Christian be a descriptor word for a belief system, that whole huge system that covers many different groups and people?

Disobeient children were stoned in the old Testament. Lcm taught it more than once and I heard it through out the nineties.

Equating a religious identity with good action/good values looks alot like marketing/branding to me.

We, especially my husband, had a hard time believing this was happening to us. Our HFC was an old friend of hubby's. But as time went on, we saw lots of couple leave, or some divorced with an innie spouse and a M&A ex, huge custody battles. Our last coule of years in I was aware that I was a target. It finally became clear to hubbyafter the HFC got a little too bold, and it was a big factor in our leave taking. After we left we had contact with others who ahd been in our fellowship but left--all couples, all with the same story of division. By the time we left I had a plan to leave my husband--not divorce him, just get out of the area with the kids, and hope he would wise up, but it never came to that. Huh, being so evil and all I hadn't cut all ties to my family and former friends and had a place to go.

There are other fundie groups that abuse, they are in the news all the time for starving their babies etc or forcing young women to be 'wives'. Abusers love anything thing that can back up and approve their authoritarian stance, and they can find it in the Bible, just like TWI did. All those 'be subject' and 'obey' verses becaome so handy in the wrong hands. I have a friend who once belonged to a fundy non denominational group called The Chapel, but it only had one, two hundred people. STill she had to divorce to get away, went through their version of M&A, and one of her children did not get treatment for a brain tumor until almost to late. She has had many of the same recovery issues as many of us here at GSC.

Equating generosity or compassion or neighborliness with Christian? There are kind, generous neighbors of all types of religious and nonreligious backgrounds. I think those that give a great deal somehow know either by experience or by compassion or empathy, what it is like to be alone with no resources or helping hands, and how much better life can be with those things. It is always heart warming to find a jewel of a human being, no matter what belief system they hold.

I didn't have the statue, but we did have the trustee print in a nice frame. Still have the frame. Also hed those yearly theme posters in cheap frames. Now I have western wilderness pictures on my living room walls.

Sad. Seems the new boss is the same as the old boss. Must obey authoritay!

How can we know when we are bound so tight into this physical body and world? At best we can glimpse the next world, perhaps there are some, mystics or saints, who understand more than average people. I think those things that are important in this world are important in the next--loved ones, family, community, peace, love, understanding...

As far as I'm concerned, the TWI doctrine on 'bitterness' goes hand in hand with the 'just get over it' view on forgiveness. In TWI if some leader did you evil and you were upset about it and didn't get over it right away as if it never happened, then YOU were more out to lunch than the one who did the evil. Very convenient doctrine for abusers. Gives them all the breaks and puts all the hard work and change on the victim. Your emotions are inconvenient to the movement of the Word, get over it, God wants you to. I say, remember what they did and don't tell them it is all okay, which is what they want--all okay and they haven't changed a bit.

The problem I see with looking for outward expressions of faith is that humans can fake very well. They can even fool themselves and refuse to examine what is really with in(like in TWI unrenewed mind stop thought action). They can auto pilot and they can mimic. I think it takes time to really see what motivates another, because what they might say motivates them might not actually be so--and not even that they are deliberately lying, but because they are unaware. It takes time to really know.

Love it. I always wanted a pygmy goat but there are city ordinances against them.

Faith and proof are individually decided within a person, not validated or invalidated by others. An 'inner knowing.' People know what they know. That is why it is so hard to force others to believe a certain way, some 'know' something else deep within. We can decide they lie or are faking, or choose to join them in their beliefs because we think they are right, or accept that they have a different inner reality than we ourselves do. You are the one who decides if the track record proves anything to you. Or if you want to walk that path and see where it takes you.

Mmmm, fried green tomatoes with parmesan cheese!

I was at the local pool with my brother and sister and my best friend Meri Lou. One of our mom's would pick us up right before dinner. The pool sold sno cones or we could walk across the street from the park to a little store to get a snack. There was a group of kids from our school who went there most days so there were always kids to talk to, and we spent many hours diving for pennies. I had a crush on a red haired boy and Meri had a crush on a life guard with really blue eyes. It was much fun!

I remember back when I took PFAL and went to my first ROA how astounding it was that I (I!)should have happened to have found a group with the greatest man of God since the apostle Paul bringing all the new light. How special and life changing, how important to take a stand etc. It was a big part of why I got so invested in TWI.

TY gc. It has been a very strange summer! At least the farmer's market has live music.

We have had numerous hail storms this summer, unusually stormy here but our house is up a yard or so from the street so at least we didn't flood like nmany neighbors. The garden really took a hit. :( We had a pvc arch over the peppers and tomatoes so could cover them easily enough, but nothing else seems to have made it through the quarter size hail except the herbs and perrinneals like rhubarb and horseradish. The siberiean motherwort and sage didn't even notice the hail. Waa! Off to the farmer's market.

We moved to a city we had never been to while in TWI. We do see way bumper stickers once in a while, but I don't know if they are current or really old. Since we moved here in 2001 we haven't seen any old Wafers we knew, though we have had a few letters and phone calls.

We didn't know about the corruption and didn't find out about it until LCM resigned--we got a second hand computer then and found Waydale. It was shocking to us, because we thought we were the ones in the wrong, not spritual enough, not disciplined enough. We left because there was no way we could meet the standards we were held to and life was a misery trying to attain only to fail over and over. Of course, failing required reproof, and reporting our misdeeds up the chain of commannd. That was horribly embarassing Ugh. I SO do not miss "the ministry." I'm SO glad my kids weren't subjected to that crap. We never deserved to be treated like that!

Perhaps your friend is not getting over it because there are issues that require more than time to heal. Perhaps she needs counseling, or is depressed and could find medical help or a combination. Outside of TWI, there is no shame in seeking such help or suggesting it to a loved one.

In TWI think, bitterness is a super spiritual emotion that renders everything a person knows, remembers, records, feels, experienced, studied etc inaccurate and spiritually suspect. Being bitter is alot like being possessed. Heavily influenced, at least. In fact, if a TWI leader did you great wrongs, and you are bitter, you then are actually more wrong and out of fellowship than the person who did you evil.Yup.