Bramble

I don't know, another spot. TWI Thing? Human Nature thing? But I do know this: we had two corps leaders that hubby and I thought were the greatest, they protected us from some crap, were really great to us. Later I found out that the very same leaders who I respected so much, were treating other believers right in my branch like possessed pieces of crap, and making their lives hell. Why, I don't know. I guess it is the same tendancy as teacher's have to have a pet, or parents who have a favorite child...

I don't pray as in supplication or beseaching for anything. I meditate and tap into what I perceive is my diety...I don't ask for stuff so much as ponder a situation. I do look for lessons and insight, paths of action.

Let's recap: Rascal's first post on this thread: Johniam'sfist post and reply: quote: Imagine, maybe there is more to our healing than just moving on. Maybe there are layers, levels that need to be examined each one at a time, only to be seen and presented as the previous layer has been examined and addressed. See the pain; be the pain. IMO pain is OK as long as it's used in moderation Rascal's reply: John you completely mischaracterized my point in attempt to belittle my statement. You are a big boy and I am certain, capable of legitimately making your own comments without lying about someone elses pov. It is rediculous to think that you understand why myself or anybody else returns here or even more silly, what is healthy or acceptible for anybody else. Please try to answere for yourself, as that is the only one who`s perspective and motive you are qualified to comment on. This post has been edited by rascal: Jun 13 2007, 10:49 PM Jeaniam's first post and reply: Why don't you take your own advice? And BTW, why don't you learn how to spell or at least install a spelling program on your computer? Posted just so readers can see what really happened, not the righteous spin of the iams. In my view, Rascal did nothing wrong and doesn't need to quit doing anything! I thought Rascal's first reply was very insigtful and not any type of iam baiting.

TL. Basically, they want to shut someone up because they don't like her pov, and if she doesn't shut up they will keep hounding her.

Ents: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ent The moving trees in Lord of the Rings

DCFS= Department of Child and Family Services I haven't met any abused teens, but we do have a kid practically living with us. The parents have had a huge financial crisis, moved out of their lovely home into a run down old house in a warehouse area. They have a son, much younger,who is having lots of problems, keeps mom busy--she can't work because child care won't accept him. The boy is getting help, but the older child is kind of left in limbo. I suggested to mom that kid join my kids in the marching band as a flag twirler, since the child doesn't play an instrument. Turns out, the kid is actually really good at flag twirling( harder than it looks) and is having a blast--they get to travel. Since practice starts at 7 am, kid sleeps over alot so I can transport.

Sidenote--I took PFAL in college, and my hubby's wow family had been directed to live in the college area. Two years later I went wow--and we were directed to find housing in the college area...I think it is because too many adults could see right through the cr@p, but the younger folk did not.

I think one of the valuable things here at GSC is in being able to view conflict from a safe distance--especially for those who were in for a long time and developed habit patterns of 'how high should I jump?' Even if you are involved in the conflict, there is a degree of separation that isn't there in a face melting session. Also, the playing fields here is level, which it never was in TWI. I think many of us kept or reverted to an unhealthy child like attitude toward leadership, which is unnatural for--I'll say most--adults. Isn't that the journey of adolescence and the young adult years--to become independent men and women?Many of us worked so hard at being like minded and obedient we stopped thinking for ourselves, bit our tongues said 'yes sir.' Being in print, people can read, reread, evaluate and come to their own conclusions about what they consider acceptable, not what they are told is acceptable. For people coming out of TWI, conflict is shocking! It is more realistic, IMO, to see that conflict is everywhere and see how people handle it rather than isolating yourself to avoid it.

[quote name=Jeaniam' date='Jun 25 2007, 08:40 PM' post='345293' And I am only asking that Rascal be willing to earn my respect by her postings, not her emotional outbursts. wow--just wow. I think that speaks for itself.

How you might approach someone makes a huge difference. If you want to embarrass them or shut them up, then its easy to take a cheap public shot. If you want to help someone you see as a friend or loved one, you'd do it a different way. People are smart enough to be able to tell the difference when someone comes at them with a correction. If the person has never, ever been kind or friendly to me, then I would suspect the cheap shot. I have a teaching degree, but I am not a good typist--I work on a 10 key all day, so I experience a little hand fatigue sometimes. I do alot of IM and chat--people get their points across with out perfect spelling and grammar all the time. I notice it but it doesn't bother me. Busy body reproovers, nit picky people--now those bother me. Who needs that? How does it better anyone's world?

As far as the topic goes--many of us come here to examine behaviors that were common and acceptable in TWI --like half thought out reproof or directives from leadership-- that we could not question without inviting a whole can of worms to be opened in our lives. Here, we can question, examine, pull apart, think through, conclude, decide, and not blindly obey those who see themselves as spiritual authoritays. Here, people earn their respect by their postings, not by their position in the Household.

Sorry , Bolshivick, but as far as I know trees don't move, they are stationary, except for the wind moving their limbs. Ceders kind of rustle, they are similar to a pine tree in shape. I don't know an animal with a tail like that that eats grass. Maybe a cow?

Reproof? It must be great to fellowship with you guys! Do you critique every tiny little thing, every imperfection just glares, distracting you etc? All done out of love and concern, perfecting the saints and all that? I think I'm having a flash back! I didn't start this one Jean--you put it out there on a public forum and people responded. Quite revealing.

Hmm, I'm getting a mind picture of ENTS.

I never said that I, Bramble,was being bullied and stalked. I'm not, and if I was I would raise a stink--the soap opera forum doesn't scare me. I was actually thinking of Rascal, TL( issue in the past) and Exxie, who has had some pretty nasty confrontations over time.

I'm not sure how cedars move! Limbs in the wind?

QUOTE 'Do you and Bramble really enjoy being victims as much as you appear to. You were 'victims' in TWI and now here you are being 'victimized' again just because someone disagrees with you (despite the fact the you initiate the confrontation just as often as not).' You mentioned my name, Jean. Did you forget???

Have a wonderful birthday!!!

I always thought it was an elephant.

I actually wasn't referring to myself as one of the stalking victims, Jean. I don't think my experience in TWI was anything as dark as some other women on this site, plus I feel that I can pretty much take care of myself on a forum. This little dust up is small potatoes compared to some. I was thinking about several women who have had stalkers on this site in the past year or two and made an observation. I 'm certainly not the only one who has seen it--why don't you, Jean, address the other posters on this thread who have popped up in defence of Rascal, hmmm? But I can see how you could think I was referring to myself, since you have taken upon yourself to question my presence on a thread, and have made insults to me in the past. ON TOPIC: I think this little bruhaha illustrates one of the Way Doctrin layers we came away with--The belief that We, Way Believers, the Knowers of Truth since it hasn't been known since the First Century Church, spiritual authoritays in all matters, with all people, have the right to demand that people conform to our standards of thinking and action. I think we are seeing 'I AM the Authoritay!' layer still firmly in place in some people. Leadership in TWI did not back down or say they were wrong EVER in my experience. What they do is of God. Right.

I too have a general observation about the stalkers types ...they seem to be attracted to stalking A) women B) women who have been candid about horribly painful abuse situations in their past Hmmm

I think there are lovely people with TWI beliefs, but I think there are also those who see the world very much in an us vs them adversarial view. Not just TWI but other high demand groups. And I think that destroys people and families and communities. It is one thing to keep to yourself in your little group, it is another thing to demonize those not part of your group--because if you think of others that way, how are you going to treat them? Somehow you're going to have to get around to thinking, well, this is how they deserve to be treated, they brought it on themselves( justification for many evils in TWI). So somehow it becomes godly to become hard and cruel...saw alot of that in the nineties, from people who weren't always that way.

I've been thinking about your post JavaJane. I think the doctrine was easy for me to dump because to me it did not seem to work at all--the longer I stayed in TWI, the worse our lives became, the more our life style was dictated as 'The Word' and yet the uglier it got and the better' unbelievers' lives looked. Other habits though, are pretty ingrained. We are never late! Our kids are the one who are never in trouble and help out the teachers etc(ya--even at their strict academic school, they are the teacher's pet.s Thank goodness black hair dye and skull earrings are easy to find, or else they would be nerds.) And if a higher up at work says we should do somehting this way not that way, I don't brush it off as easy as my co workers, who are freer to say so and so is an idiot, that is not how it is done etc. Prior to this job I taught preschool, where I was the boss for the most part, directed teacher aids etc. Once summer is over and I'm not locked into my kids band schedule, I plan to apply for supervisory jobs--give me that control!! I suspect that is a Way hold over. Hubby and I don't like to join groups, even though we do see the need to be on the school site council etc. We find we are very critical about how things are done...TWI hold over. We want every thing planned out well ahead of time, and the plan adheared too, while many feel it is fine to 'wing' it...Really, we were involved in Master Gardeners and just couldn't handle it! This is a big difference for hubby because he's the outgoing type, and once was the pres of this club, and that club...

In the LCM daze a new person showed up at our fellowship, a few minutes late. HFC met them at the door to reprove them for lateness. Nope, they didn't come back.

OMG--that tornado. My kids still hate thungerstorms. Leaderdang was so surprised it happened--knew nothing about it. They gave us a week to clean up our yard and those infampous gutters. The neighbor's enormous tree pulled up sewer lines and tore down power lines when it crashed her roof. It was huge, they had to tear down fences to get it out. We didn't have water or electricity for a week, the Red Cross fed us, but we didn't say anything about that( too much like welfare, ya know). Two people died not two miles from our house. There was mobile home siding in our yard...creepy, since the mobile home court was far away. And! And!! The lesbian nurses with the goddess statue in their yard gave me their cell phone because they were worried about me home alone all day with little kids, no phone. What if something happened? No one had phones! And most of the neighbors were little old women, without phones, too. I did not tell anyone that--heck, they would have made us move out of a neighborhood that had lesbians! With cell phones! we would have been marked and avoided for using a lesbian's phone! Hubby couldn't afford to take off from work, we cleaned our yard in the evenings. By ourselves. I'd say that tornado was a defining moment with our relationship with TWI. The kindness of strangers was more likely what we could depend on in a disaster, not the 'one true prevailing household of God', where we had sunk so much of our lives. They were horribly callous. They treated us like they hated us--I think they did. If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck... It took awhile to sink in, but once it did...God seemed to work through all those non believers far more than he did through the believers...made you wonder. I did NOT want to go through the downfall of modern civilization as we knew it at Y2K with those people. I figured we'd be thown to the wolves, or roasted on a spit to keep everyone else full. T-BONE Nope – "timeout" is the ticket. It drives them nuts! It's like being stuck in traffic for adults. Hilarious.