soul searcher

Always in a hurry Never stop to worry

I Feel Fine?

"Love is an illusion created by lawyer types like yourself to perpetuate another illusion called marriage to create the reality of divorce and then the illusionary need for divorce lawyers."

Drilling down, so to speak... 1 Peter 2:13 Submit yourselves for the Lord’s sake to every human authority (NIV) From the ESV: Be subject for the Lord's sake to every human institution I'd have to say there's very little doubt about the meaning of that verse. 1 Peter 2:18 Servants, be subject to your masters with all respect, not only to the good and gentle but also to the unjust. "Also to the unjust?" :( I have found the above troubling ever since I started reading the bible (which was about a year and a half ago). It's repeated several times in the Pauline Epistles. It's the same with the "wives submit to your husbands" thing. I'm thinking that I must be the worst kind of sinner, being the anti-authoritarian I've always been. The very idea of me -- or anyone -- submitting unquestionably to a boss/master/authority (and doing it with a smile) is incomprehensible. For good or bad, I am almost physically incapable of conforming to a pre-arranged set of rules with faith and without question.

cool thread But I'm clueless on this one. Was it written by a blues artist?

Need another clue or hint.

Platoon?

Interesting post, Sunesis. Thanks. And thanks to the rest of you that responded. I think I need to study this some more and re-formulate my questions. Maybe I'll dig into some of that 17th century English history Steve Lortz suggested.

Interesting. My ex-Way friend (who was in from approx. 1983-2008) to this day will not carry a mortgage or car loan. Everything has to be paid in cash. Not that she's rich or anything. I'm pretty sure she picked up that irrational belief in TWI. She also learned about wooden spoons. (That wasn't nice of me, I know.)

there you go! Note that most web sites cite the early lyric, which doesn't include the "sand all over your feet" verse. Even though almost all covers, including the Beatles', sing it that way. I don't know if that makes sense. your turn

1 Peter 2:13-14 Submit yourselves for the Lord’s sake to every human authority: whether to the emperor, as the supreme authority, or to governors, who are sent by him to punish those who do wrong and to commend those who do right. (NIV) The commentary says Peter is urging Christians to submit to all legitimate authorities, whether or not the persons excercising authority are believers. But there obviously came a point many times in history when the people decided to revolt. Did they think they were acting with God's blessing? Also, totalitarian regimes like China, North Korea and Myanmar Republic have existed for years. Evil as they are, I don't think they're going anywhere soon.

Answering my own question... My NIV study bible says that the "governing authorities" refers to the civil rulers at the time, "all of whom were probably pagans". "Christians may have been tempted to not submit to them and to claim allegiance only to Christ" "Even the possibility of a persecuting state did not shake Paul's conviction that civil government is ordained by God." Interesting. So was Paul wrong?

Yeah, my own comment above regarding the Revolutionary War got me thinking and I came to the conclusion that my question is not a good one. When governments become oppressive the people will revolt, as they should. I'm puzzled by the very first verse of Romans 13, "Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God." Could this mean that the Roman authorities were established by God? Very good point. I have to think about this some more.

So what was TWI's position on holding a home mortgage? Not allowed?

It sounds like an odd mixture a war movie and stoner comedy. Is is that war movie satire with Ben Stiller (that I didn't see)?

Are you smoking this sh#t so's to escape from reality? Me, I don't need this sh#t. I am reality. There's the way it ought to be, and there's the way it is. Elias was full of sh#t. Elias was a crusader. Now, I got no fight... with any man who does what he's told. But when he don't, the machine breaks down. And when the machine breaks down, we break down. And I ain't gonna allow that... in any of you. Not one. What's with the two elipses? (elipseses?)

Opening lines of the song: Well how can you say you will when you won't, Say you do, baby, when you don't?

~(yes, we see) ~ It's the greatest girl-group song by the greatest girl-group ever: The Shangri-Las. your turn

Happiness is a Warm Gum (I used that one recently, too.) Everything about you is so doggone sweet You got that sand all over your feet

give us another line

I met him at the candy store He turned around and smiled at me You get the picture?

I think, like cman said, one has to determine who exactly are the God-appointed "governing authorities". I have a hard time believing that God would have a hand in the establishment or maintenance of evil governmental regimes. Of course, I also have a hard time believing that God wants slaves to submit to their masters. :)

Nobody brought up the American Revolutionary War, which would seem to go directly against the verses I posted.

Saturday Night's Alright For Fighting?

Not at all. It's just that Republicans are usually the ones railing against taxes. Now, I realize that nobody likes to pay taxes, but GOP politicians often campaign on promises to lower taxes (and there's nothing inherently wrong with that), but they also demonize democrats as "tax-and-spend liberals", even socialists. Of course I do. But I was mostly interested in how Christian Conservatives feel, especially about verses 6-7, "This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God’s servants, who give their full time to governing. Give to everyone what you owe them: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor." It seems to me that many conservatives have a very negative, even militant, opposition to any and all taxation. That's okay. But if you identify yourself as a political conservative and at the same time believe that the bible is the inerrant word of God, then I think there's a conflict. Maybe this does belong in the politics forum. I went back and forth on it.