OldSkool

When they lived with Rosalie they were in her basement apartment. I can verify this first hand and could post their names and tell you the city they currently reside, I have no beef with them so I will refrain. However, this happy couple (as of 2008) even had the pleasure of having Rosalie visit them when she takes her vacations.

Good points. I was basing my views on a "furtherance of the gospel" perspective. But we all know that the way international isn't really about that.

Hey buddy, you geniuses think you are above being marked and avoided? My family and I have marked and avoided the way international and anyone who is standing with them. Don't think for a moment that it doesn't apply to you and your beloved ministry. This has been continued:

You know, I could understand if James Trimm had plagiarized one of the way international's garbage publications such as the collaterals, are the dead alive now, etc. But to go after someone for coming up with a new version? That one has me baffled. I would think a work of this nature would only serve to help add insight and understanding to the bible by having another Hebrew / Aramaic based text to use for reference. How low, how very low.

Before I start I am going to give enough personal information so that whoever is current WAYGB will know who I am. John if that's you, and I assume it is, you can rest assured I would not be here on Grease Spot now had I not been treated so horribly by Rosalie and John Rupp. Hopefully you will tell them I say Thanks!! It's because of them that I am free from the way international, happy, and prosperous today. You guys didn't think I would go through what I did and quietly creep away did you? I just left the way international two years ago. I was way corps, have been section coord. assistant department coord., department coord., and was on the president's. cabinet. I know the inside workings of the way ministry and let me tell you one thing. It has only changed in appearance. Just because the teachings are delivered in a lower tone of voice does not mean that the people who are running the place, the same people who were shoulder to shoulder with Craig Martindale and named in the Allen lawsuit as accomplices, have made any meaningful changes unless they were forced into legal compliance - probably under counsel from their lawyers. I heard Rosalie say first hand that she hates all the changes that have had to happen since the Allen lawsuit during a rant she went on because someone on staff (he was clergy so it made it worse) went to their kids little game on a Sunday afternoon instead of going to the Sunday Teaching Service. Furthermore, she came after me and my family, by proxy, via John Rupp. I was treated horribly and endured months of harassment that only abated when she went too far and I took the first steps in initiating a harassment complaint against them. My crime? Requesting to be reassigned to a nearby city where my son's doctors are because he has a serious health condition. Driving several hundred miles each week was causing a financial hardship and making things difficult for us by adding hours of travel time. I could go on but will move on to my next point. I told my mother, who was an advanced class grad, how we were being treated and she decided to leave the way ministry. She was contacted by her former fellowship coordinator and was told that if she had any hope of her grandson being healed of his disease then that hope was now gone because she was leaving the way international. She could expect God's hand of protection and healing to depart from her family. This happened in early 2009. So don't give me the way international is better and different speech. I am sad to say that you have been deceived. The Allen's exposed the way ministry as a corrupt organization that systematically abuses it's followers. The results of that sunlight was to white wash the facade and hide the evil deeper in the shadows. Never believe the bull$#i+.... that says the way international has changed since craig was ousted. It has been corrupt since victor paul wierwille and is corrupt today as it has ever been.

Put me down for an order of three. 1 - XXl 1 - Medium 1 - Child size----lol! That way my whole family can wear it!

I would ask 10 educated Germans to translate that and see what came back.

Yep, now that's the way to screen applicants to make they are serious about coming on staff to receive advanced training.

It wouldn't surprise me if they still did this crap. Since the Allen lawsuits the directors lecture other's extensively about private inurements. I would take an educated guess and say that they still have their angles.

OMG! I can remember hanging out at magazine racks pretending to read something I had no interest in because someone else was browsing something similar just to be able to strike up petty conversation and turn it to the way international's classes. And the hours spent door to door.... :blink: :excl: Besides these "cold call" efforts there was friends, family, fellow-workers. That was the mantra. How did we treat those who refused? We shook the dust off - a.k.a - we ignored them because they were no longer class prospects. After all, why waste time with those who refuse to believe? Well, riches were the motivation but that motivation was cloaked in monavie being a miracle cure. If you talked to someone trying to sign you up as a distributor you would certainly hear of it's healing properties and how God gave us the earth and all that is therein for health and prosperity and now we have Monavie to help us live the more than abundant life. (I am paraphrasing but you get the jist) It was all very pious sounding.

Well, here's the psychological side of things. There are many that equate lofty positions of service, aka major assignments, with those of the highest admiration. Many way corps are position hungry and will do most anything to get that title, or become clergy. Whenever anyone receives a lesser assignment from one higher up the pyramid the whispers go round for weeks. "What happened to so and so?" The assumption is always that they screwed something up and were demoted. Even if the person said I want less responsibility for now. So, to assign someone to start a fellowhip and build to a branch is calling them less than the minimum requirements to be way corps which is to be a branch coordinator. The folks that received these assignments this particular year (2008-2009 ministry year) received no meaningful help from the wayfers in their assigned areas. So in other words they had to bust their a$$es to get of of double secret probation. To succeed in this assignment you would have to pretend that you and your family were alone and starting new work and you would have to live under the gun wondering if you would be able to keep your all important corpse status. Does anyone remember a biblical person who did the same to others? Yep -Phaoroah! Make your own bricks and harvest your own straw!

Yes! And her attitude towards people who are less fortunate than her (read many in the way international and most, if not all on Staff) is they should not be concerned about money because God will provide for them. Now, I don't disagree with this in principle. BUT - the circumstances that are engineered against people in the way ministry cuts off most avenues to make money. You damn sure will be hand to mouth on Staff, you are STRONGLY discouraged from obtaining a loan for any reason (business or personal), the way ministry lifestyle for many disqualifies them from having a meaningful career. But she is probably loaded and has no financial hardships due to her inheritance (aka silver-spoon) and the roof over her head is bought and paid for. Hypocrite! You are exactly right. Most Staff are paid minimum wage and 6 hours at time and 1/2. (46 hour work week) That's what they call a salary based on an hourly wage. Quite a contradiction, eh? Cabinet make around 24,000 and up, depending on how many kids you have and a few other variables. They still give a child allowance. You should hear some of them raise hell when the kids move away and they receive pay cuts. I base the $24,000 on what I made, my wife's pay and the child allowance had us living comfortably, off-grounds. We probably made approximately twice as much as the average staffer. Rest assured, with the cost of living in that area of the country we were comfortable. Again - right on the money. My experiences in leadership positions at HQ were riddled with politics and self-promotion. The twist is it's all based on a pseudo-self sacrifice on who can stay in Rosalie's favor, by willingly submitting to petty micromanagement, and who can work the longest and spend the most hours in service. After all, as cabinet and department coordinators we were exempt. So yes, Communist regime has eerie similarities. I.E - Do not speak against our Dear Leader! (theres more but I will spare everyone for brevity's sake) She answers to ABSOLUTELY nobody. Same as Victor Wierwille, and same as Craig Martindale. (except the lawsuit cramped Craig's style) She maintains the facade of being a team player that delegates well. In reality she is the benevolent dictator - she knows what is best for others but excuses herself from her own mandates! She delegates seemingly major responsibility with meaningless authority. That way you have to check with your director, who checks with her, on anything of merit. She does not delegate, she puppeteers. I could go on. Great post, thanks for the thoughts.

She stays because she feels that everyone else is too incompetent to lead the way ministry. She is surrounded with people who are more capable than her and her main hallmark of leadership is to micromanage and stifle their talents. And if you get out of line she will try her level best to teach you humility by harassing the daylights out of you. The people she has promoted have no back bone. The occasional person that she promotes that decides to keep their testicles instead of becoming a eunuch is quickly demoted. Her track record speaks for itself. She has taken a cult that became centered around Craig Martindale and refocused it on Victor Paul Wierwille. She has enshrined that focus in policy and layers of procedure so that it will not change. What is is right now, in all of it's spectacular boredom and mediocrity, will only get worse as time goes. Great job Rosalie!

I was away yesterday and just caught this morning. Shellon, I am sorry to hear that you have been subjected to this yet again. If these idiots were really Christian they would follow the example set by Jesus - compassion, understanding, sympathy, and above all love! By their own actions and words they qualify themselves as false. False prophets, false teachers, false brethren that demonstrate contemptible hypocrisy. Keep fighting for your family and know that you are doing the right thing and it's worth every effort.

Oops - big typo - maybe I should send my posts to way publications first...

ROFL! Ya, I forgot to mention that it also has ground Jimson seeds in it....lol

I think this is part of it. But I also think that the conflict of interest extends a little deeper. Competition of time is a big one. If the way corps have time to promote monavie then naturally that time should be spent promoting classes and "establishing people in the word." Let's ignore the fact that many mindless and onerous levels of busy work are layered into way corps lives. Let's also ignore cp3 and any other health related topics...lol....anyways. Also, I remember Rosalie lecturing a group of us that the people in the ministry should not have to feel an obligation to buy juice from their way corps leadership. It was all about people using their "position" to influence their sales. Now, the Vision and Direction document has many goals that all come back to one litmus test - revenue should be steadily increasing from a given area. A.k.a money being generated from classes, new people starting to tithe, and grads increasing their abundant sharing. I think it's revealing. From my perspective of hearing her private lectures, I think she felt threatened that time and money would go to monavie, a multi-level marketing scheme, and away from the way international - definitely another type of multi-level marketing scheme. And since monavie had spread across the ministry so fast, I think she felt threatened. So to summarize: 1 - conflict of interest stemming from the desire to micromanage all that can be micromanaged. 2 - conflict of interest resulting from lost time promoting monavie 3 - conflict of interest from the way corps using their positions to sell juice instead of the way international 4 - conflict of interest because money that could be given to the way international was instead being used to purchase juice. With the proper control, time, and influence exerted by the way corps that money should flow into the way internationals' coffers. Maybe Rosalie should have the way corps sign a non-compete agreement.

I see, thanks for the clarification.

Naturally, I have had advanced training at the way international. Well, they're way corps and are always in training. It's like a recursive acronym that....oh my I've gone cross-eyed....

Ahh, interesting point. They have by attrition been forced to hire way more people. Yet, they will not increase staff pay. The official line of BS that has been handed around during placements and other high level meetings is, to paraphrase, "People should not work on staff at the way international expecting to make money. Instead they should be there to grow spiritually by serving at an advanced level." Now never mind obvious scripture like the laborer is worthy of his hire or Vicster's ethics teaching (which I like) that business transactions should be mutually beneficial for both parties. Coming on staff is meant to be an opportunity for mature advanced class grads to be trained. After all HQ is a training location. Now, where is my johnny mop, I need to go scrub some urinals. You would not believe my advanced urinal scrubbing techniques that I learned while on staff at the way international. I'm even know how to place the johnny cakes just so that contact is guaranteed releasing that wonderful scent.

Thanks WordWolf. James - CliffsNotes next time?

I think you're right! I feel....so exposed....

I have no idea. Maybe you don't mess with the guy who knows all the secrets? You are cracking me up!

No, it's freeze dried Acai juice sweetened with white grape juice. Acai is nasty by itself. Oh, Ira Berger was one of the people who received a punishment assignment. He went from years as cabinet to going to S.C. to start a fellowship and build to a branch within a year. Actual wording chosen by Rosalie.

This was in 2008.