OldSkool

Ive been looking instead at the revelation God gave concerning Jesus Christ and the revelation God gave to Jesus Christ which he gave to us in the form of scripture.. wierwille is an imposter and PFAL is leaven. Galatians 1:12 “For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.”

I really appreciate your post, T-Bone! This really puts so very much in perspective that I have been trying to understand. This line right here. When I left TWI I found myself lost, wondering where in the world I would ever take someone that I had witnessed to. I felt lost without TWI thinking that there was nowhere to send people to learn what they needed to know and without a "ministry" I wandered, floundered around, and was kinda lost until I let go of my idols - TWI was my idol. Over time it began to gel in my heart that the only place I ever needed to point anyone to was Jesus Christ. He is quite capable to take care of the people that God has given him. We understand that the Spirit of truth came on Pentecost as recorded in Acts 2. All things that the Father hath are mine - theres an order revealed in these verses - the father has given all things into Christ's hands and via the spirit Christ shows us the things that God has put into his hands. Jesus tells them in these verses that they will be seperated from him during his crucifixion but then gets right to his resuerecction and eventual ascension that they WOULD see him again. This prophecy is confirmed all through the book of Acts. Acts 2:33 is the an awesome summation and fulfillment - Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear. God exalted Jesus to his right hand. If your God's right hand you are second in command...who else has ever been God's righ hand man? Not even Adam. God set the pattern - Jesus Christ received of the Father the promise of holy spirit and he - Jesus Christ - shed forth the promise which they saw and heard! That is in no way shape or form absent! We tend to think of his reign as his millenial kingdom only, well, at least I did based on wierwilles heresy that Christ is absent, the bible takes his place, Christ is sitting there like a bump on a log until the next administration....geez! But it's much larger than that. Christ is doing his thing right now, he is reigning right now. Obviously, the second coming hasn't happened yet but all things are under his feet just not all things subdued just yet; it's coming but the authority is there. Wierwille wanted the glory for himself. He actually tried to supplant Christ by calling him absent and then treating his dinky 501-c3 as the body of Christ. Sadly I used to believe that mess and sadly there are still people that do. I think you are right - Christ was absent from his life and he tried to project that outwards to us. I really enjoyed the book quotes. More later - I need to think over some of the things you posted. Thanks again!

Thanks! Im gonna check out that thread.

Thanks! It seems I distinctly remembered wrong....lmao

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosalind_Rinker Graduated college and was a counsellor at: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/InterVarsity_Christian_Fellowship#Bible_Study Biblical research, teaching, fellowship ministry that uses ....drum roll plz...inductive reasoning. So, yes, he likely copied this from her as well. The way international brags that they teach inductive reasoning in their study methods. Which most likely means wierwille copied this from her/Intervarsity Christian Fellowship. I distinctly remember that she was the one who introduced wierwille to Bullinger, however, I defer to others for confirmation because I can't give you a source.

All I can say is wow! I've pretty much realized that once you know that VPW and LCM were predatory in nature when it come to extra-marital affairs (being nice saying it that way) then it become easier to spot the cover stories. For example wierwille and Rinker going to the Church late at night to "pray" after everyone else went to bed. As a married man I would want my wife present instead of being alone with another woman late at night...yeah...what could go wrong there....now in VPW's case I'm sure he invited Rosalind to HQ so he could get some alone time and then the spiel about taking her into the Church building alone, late at night to "pray"....or as Twinkie says more correctly to "prey". Twinkie I have to say knowing what we know about Martindale Im sure his story is what you say it is...a cover story. Only thing that makes sense.

I didn't know but had stong suspiscions from reading that goofy transcript. Yes Mike, I read the thing in it's entirety - even stopped to disect some of the statements which is when that statement about Rinker was screaming at me. I can't help but think it was creepy when he said they went to the Church to pray after everyone else had gone to bed and the everyone else in this case was his wife and kids. It makes me wonder if this was common knowledge back then and the people he was payin lipservice to where his inner circle at the time. Martindale had that inner circle thing going too - his inner clique that would pimp for him and arrange situations for his affairs. Somehow I tend to think that wierwille came up with the method and Martindale simply put his methods into play and likely improved upon them a bit.

Its all that and worse. Christians are under no obligation to tithe. We aren't under the law and the tithe was to take care of the Levites who took care of the temple. The Levites were to do the tithe of tithes oe heave offerings where they would tithe off of the tithes they received to cover the high priest. That's all done away with. Christians are told to give as they purpose in their hearts to do so and to be cheerful about it as well, because God loves a cheerful giver. Mr. Biblical Research should have known better.

I didn't realize that people still believe what I am about to post from a way international facebook group. From their own words. The context of the quote is which American cities will the Way Ambassadors be sent...appareantly participation is so low there are only two cities - Orlando Florida and Kansas City MO...I digress...anywho... Yes...they still believe that the crime rate is going to plummet in these cities because all the light they will be speaking and that light will dismantle strong holds and the crime rate will plummet...

You have to arrange the proper anagram.

Wierwille was talking about Rosalind Rinker here. How inappropriate is it for a married pastor to take a single lady anywhere after everybody else had gone to bed. Who the heck is everyone else, Mrs. Wierwille? Rinker went and stayed with them for a week according to VPW so he waits until his wife is asleep and goes off with this lady just the two of them? Talk about a recipe for disaster. Given his history of extramarital affairs this is an eyebrow raiser for me.

So the Word lives because VPW stood on it. I thought it was the Word of Life because God authored it and stands behind it to the point of sending Jesus Christ who was the Word made flesh... Oh...VPW stood for the Word whenever the Word was know to him. Sounds like he never missed a step....gheesh.

So, mike! How do you know what TWI's lawyers are advising them? Do you even know the name of the firm that represents them? Also, you do understand that TWI has copies of everything they ever recorded for the most part? Most of the materials, including the reference you made to the old SNS, are actually in the main library of the OSC. Not only do staff use them for study but the various publications departments use that library for reference when they are editing their little hearts out. Your acting like these materials are hidden away somewhere. They had to pull most of wierwilles recorded content because of all the rants and raves he used to go on....not to mention you would be able to trace his recordings straight back to the original authors. (..oh wait...I forgot plagariasism doesnt matter because this is wierwille we are talking about. ) Actually, I realized while I was studying university of life tapes on Romans while I was in-residence that wierwille had lifted most all of his content from The Just and the Justifier by Charles Welsch who was an understudy to Bullinger. https://www.amazon.com/Just-Justifier-Charles-M-Welch/dp/0851561349 Also, they don't want to be a cult anylonger so they can't very well hang out the old deceased cult leaders dirty laundry now can they? BTW - you reaching out the leaders their privately is laughable. They get people with all kinds of crazy ideas coming at them all the time. Howard Allen is probably the biggest yes man on the planet. Saying yes was his main job no matter which director/trustee he worked for. And btw - I had a good relationship with Howard, knew him personally, and worked for the man for several years when I cordinated the grounds department. Part of his emiritus job was looking after TWI property. I can tell you beyond a shadow of a doubt that calling him about anything of this nature got you a polite "ok then" and a "goodbye"!

From the following link: http://minet.org/www.trancenet.net/noway/witness/vwdeath.shtml Hey Mike, why would God lead wierwille to a non-Christian spiritist and then have wierwille incorporrate his garbage into TWI material? You do know the law of believing is false...right? https://cloud.disroot.org/s/2eaS5BbmzAQcMHZ Thats one of the main problems with wierwille's itchy ears. He followed men who mixed the occult into Christianity. Same with EW Kenyon. While I have studied this topic extensively these links I am posting are simply random links from searching out the authors names. I do not necessarily agree with the website and I am in no way affiliated with them. I say this because I sense a straw man attack on the horizon. People can present factual information without being right about everything else, or being perfect. Maybe they are fundamntalist of maybe they like eating couliflower in their underwear by the pale moon light. Stick with the material at hand. Thanks in advance. https://truthwatchers.com/the-word-of-faith-heresy/

And turn around and say that we don't understand what he is talking about. Like we can't hear his words or something....probably thinks were all devil posessed and cant understand "spiritual matters"...lol

Awesome post T-Bone...couldn't have said it any better. Mike. I read your post, noted your insults, noted the extremely twisted logic and also noted Twinky's very appropriate point that we are not at all discussing the subject...etc. Your own words convict your delusion. I have nothing more to say except enjoy your ditch.

Excellent responese T-Bone. Mike - so you are saying it's ok for people to steal because everything belongs to God. That logic could hold true over anything then if it were to hold true over intellectual property. Why not go steal your neighbor's chainsaw? I mean God created all the raw material to make it. But lemme ask you this - The way international holds the copyrights for VPW's stolen materials including, but not limited to, PFAL - classes and books. Why do they so aggressively defend their copyrights in court if none of it matters? And to be clear, I'm don't even care about copyright matters in this case. Im concerened with the complete lack of godly ethics from the supposed man of God. Stealing is stealing and God condemns it whenever and wherever it occurs. Just because wierwille stole intellectual works it's still stealing. But you wierwille fan boys have to move heaven and earth aside to rationalize the lies your idol told of himself. My advice, toss Wierwille out the picture and dedicate your life to following Christ and his teachings.

MAybe I'm going out on a limb of common sense here, but why didn't God just give the error free revelation to wierwille in the first place? Why would he need wierwille to collect all these materials and make them error free. Another question: If wierwille made them error free then why has the way international been revising and editing his materials for 37 years now specifically to remove errors and make his materials agree with each other? My former wife was very involved in that process as one of the lead copy editors and I know dang good and well wierwille's works were full of errors and I'm not talking punctuation here. Im talking doctrinal content that had to be queried from way publications to presidents publications to the then research department coordinator D@vid Ch@vousti3. What would all of that be necessary if wierwille made anything error free?

I always wondered what qualified "proven ministry research" like PFAL - that is above reproach or even further review. I mean proven ministrty reasearch has been edited and sanitized like all way materials. By sanitized they have all but purged Wierwille's ramblings and rants from the record. Whitewas job all the way. Proven ministry research. Maybe that's the buzzwords to keep anyone from looking further to see just how, when, and from whom the materials were stolen. Think your three points here probably quantify proven ministry research...lol....lame attempt at humor here with some underlying truth. Peace!

Moon Pies are a staff of life...without Moonpies there would be no happiness and wihthout happiness there would be no Moonpies.

Addressing these three points out of an excellent post. The line about the holy spirit field - VPW said he dedicated his life. TWI has gone a few steps further and I can't tell when the upgrade happened but they say vvictor paul wierwille was raised up for the holy spirit field. As if God specifically called and dedicated his ministries to uncover the holy spirit field that has been hid since first century. I kid you not. I was taught this concept during my corps training repeatedly and dang near verbatim. The idea of "ingesting" nothing but ministry materials is also a key element of the corps training. We weren't allowed to watch/read anything secular unless the corps coordinator approved it and only during "self structure time". Otherwise, we were to study only way minstry publications, or approved publications. By approved publications I mean material related to TWI but contributed by someone that VPW didn't actually steal from outright, such as George Lamsa or KC Pillai. Don't get me wrong. These ideals were still pushed at the FNC level with the class coordinators being instructed to suggest the students put aside all secular material for a period of time and read nothing but "the word" (which basically meant ministry publications) and at the end of that time their minds would be so renewed they wouldnt even recognize themselves. This garbage is set in stone. The way is a preservatation society that has enshrined wierwille and many of the things he did when he was alive. He is their guiding light and their idol.

I think it's Aramaic, which they mistakingly believe was the first language ever or something like that. Aramaic was used as a diplomatic language through out the Persian empire, making Hebrew much older. I think the best anyone knows is Aramaic originated with the Arameans around the 11th century BC. Im going from memory here so if anyone finds out different cool. Heres the thing with feedback in the way international. Hardly anybody gives honest feedback. Most feedback is lipservice designed to go along with what the directors want to do. Ive seen that hold true from the field to the cabinet/director level. Heck most field guys will filter what they consider negative feedback out so it never reaches HQ, in the case of soliciting feedback from the field. The only feedback I ever really seen during cabinet meetings was lipservice basically reinforcing the directors wishes. There's no honest feedback. It may be a little better with Vern running the show but that mindset is so ingrained in TWI culture that Vern cannot undo that.

Yep....they have a new outreach program...mostly same as old outreach programs with some tweaks and a new name. Kinda sad really; try something new for a change. Thier only guiding light is their accumulated wisdom which basically equals institutional memory. https://www.theway.org/connect-and-grow/way-ambassadors/

The way international is built on victor paul wierwille, not Jesus Christ. Sure, they mention his name at the end of a prayer and they love to talk about his accomplished works, but otherwise they have nothing to do with him. That's anti-Christ btw. In practice they completely side step Jesus Christ and have no fellowship with him. The Bible clearly states otherwise: 1 John 3:1 That which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ.” The content of way international books is a hodge podge of sources that tickled the ears of wierwille and gave him a schtik to sell - classes, books, etc. I don't care that his stolen materials quote bible verses and sound spiritual - wierwille's materials are loaded with lies. As for Wierwille, the following versus handle his ilk. 2 Timothy 3:1-7 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. 2For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away. For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts, Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.