brainfixed

out of pure stupid curiosity i watched the jesse ventura program "conspiracy theories" and what a load of stuff that sounded just like way international stuff! the episode i watched was all about the "biderberger" group (i think that's what it was). the climax of the whole hour (yes i stupidly watched the whole hour) was that through forcing people to get the h1n1 vaccinations this group was going to not only destroy the human immune system to the point that 9/10s of the world (yes, the program insisted it was going to be the world) population would die off, the survivors would be sterile. well dang. i guess the program hasn't gotten the memo that the h1n1 vaccines aren't getting out like they were supposed to get out. oh and i guess the program also didn't get the memo that the h1n1 pandemic didn't happen. but the whole message of the show was not to trust the health care system at all and ventura had this "doctor" flown in from "someplace in panama" for a "brief standing only" visit in the united states on a tarmac "located somewhere in the midwest" so this "doctor" wouldn't be identified and snatched up by united states officials that are part of this biderberger group and hauled somewhere and shut up. well this "doctor" didn't look so healthy herself and she was obese and gray looking and i could tell she was a smoker, but she proclaimed that she treated "heads of state" in her "drug free clinic" located "somewhere in panama". it just reminded me so much of all the hush hush secrecy surrounding the movements of "leadership" if and when "the adversary" was on the move to "get them", and does anybody remember the "green life" stuff? what i remember was my mom making me take like 5 or 6 pills before i ate anything so that i wouldn't eat as much because those pills would swell up in my stomach and i could live on that granola cereal for days and days without having to eat anything else, but boy oh boy did i fart and belch! but it seems like all the same stuff from all the same not so good thought processes.

good thinking stuff here and thanks a lot for the input, but please remember that "mental ill health" is not the same as "mentally ill" no more than being "hiv positive" is the same as having full blown aids, and there are things such as "situational" anxieties and "situational" depressions much like there are "situational" reactions like if you're allergic to shell fish and go out and eat a big shrimp dinner. and also try to remember not to rip at each other when replying here because even though i might say "us" and "we" i'm really not so dumb as to think "everybody" had the same reaction or the same thoughts or the same results as i did.

yah it's like being in preschool or something and playing "mother may i" or something. it's kind of hit me square in the face why it took me so long to learn self determination but here the answer is right here on greasespot cafe and it's because i was raised in a cult that led people into a brain habit that made us think we had to have somebody or something holding our hand for every little thing like walking to kindergarten or somebody or something was going to get us and get us good and dead if we didn't tweak our brains and our habits just so and like this and i'm surprised we didn't have to all wear tin foil hats or something! ok this is kind of making me mad because i can look back now and see where my brain started baking off in the bad directions now and boy oh boy i can really pinpoint it right to the way international!

this is a spin off discussion from the "plan the adversary out of your life" discussion, and it came around to geisha saying and i replied a couple of others made some pretty funny replies. but anyway here's the thing that geisha got me thinking about is did the way international lead us into mental ill health?

so that brings up a whole nother topic doesn't it? i think i'll start one.

"listening for voices in our head, hearing them, doing what they say. . . . . or blanking out instead of engaging in what is going on around us" "I remember reading something from JAL about knowing the difference between Jesus' voice and God's voice speaking to him. . . . that is two voices right there." i'm no professional therapist or anything but i wouldn't think these things are mentally healthy things to practice.

after this discussion and the last two i just responded to i am beginning to wonder if "doc vic" was like a neo nazi or something? seriously this stuff sounds like he was trying for a "super race" or something.

this discussion makes me think of a novel i recently read titled "i know this much is true" by wally lamb. it's about identical twin brothers, one that is paranoid schizophrenic and the other that is trying to take care of him, and is told from the voice of the caretaker brother. very interesting stuff when it comes to comparisons to the way international because the mentally ill brother says so many things that are so much like what was said and repeated and taught often in the way international and are like this discussion right now, and how the caretaker brother tries to make sense of it all. good read if anybody is interested, and it's quite interesting to the whole discussion about the "adversary" and what is and is not "devilish" or at cellular or molecular or genetic levels or "spiritual" levels.

something i am finding out now that i am "over 30" is that when i wasn't "over 30" it all seemed like such a good idea to "change the world" with a "new, improved" vision of things and when i read discussions like this one and i see how "doc vic" used young people to do his dirty work i get to thinking about how society as a whole uses young people to do its dirty work, and i even think of other religious groups and nowadays how every "non-denominational" religious group is run by people barely in their twenties thinking they are going to "change the world" with some "new, improved" vision of things. there's this one church that i used to go to because it was so "hip" and "with it" and the pastors were young and "alive" (meaning about my age) but now they're still about my age and have children and out of college and they've done everything the "old timers" we were so disgusted with had done like begged for more tithes and offerings, made bigger boards with more "suitable" board members (in other words, more "old timers" with more money to invest in programs) and are even shunning those "off beats" that helped them start the church because they don't pay tithes and offerings as much as others do. so what i'm trying to say is that i think "doc vic" picked up on the same old idea that if you want to start a movement, get the kids to do it and then you can dump them once they're used up. don't get me wrong, i'm not saying that's a good thing or that i agree with it at all, but i'm just saying he was hardly the first or the only con man to run this particular con.

oh, waysider, it isn't wisdom but pure fear because there's been times i was too messed up to think straight enough or even move well enough to work so i'm afraid to go back to those dark places! and belle i would be torn if i was looking forward to seeing my living brother and had to miss him but he called me every name in the book except my own for christmas for too many years so i just skip talking to him if i can but he found me on the internet and did it again this year, so i wish he was working or something, and my legs aren't really strong but i keep them working as best i can and they're doing me pretty good so it's a real gift when they keep me going all day. i'm glad your job is good, too. oakspear those are such nice things to get for christmas!

ok this is kind of a grumpy thing and kind of not but i've heard enough complaining about this so i thought i'd just say something here where nobody knows me really and then it's out of my system and i won't go off in a bad temper and maybe with the humor that i see around here i can be out of my bad temper. so what i got for christmas was to be able to work, but i'm glad i was able to work, you know? and i got to wake up in the morning, and i'm glad i was able to wake up in the morning. and i got to walk around on two good legs all day, and i'm glad i was able to walk around on two good legs all day. and then i got stuck after running off the road coming down a steep hill in the ice but i'm glad i had a car that i was able to get stuck in. do you see where i'm going with this? i don't do family during the holidays and i usually do friends but this christmas i worked and i heard a bunch of really bad grumbling and complaining and a lot of people just didn't come to work so it made twice as much or more work for us that did come to work but who cares really because at least we have a job and the ability to work and a place to go home to once we're off work and all that. ok so now i'm done.

it was a few years after i left that i figured out that i was having problems from leaving because i couldn't wait to get out and had planned my escape for what felt like my whole life because i was a kid and it was my "coming of age" thing so i was leaving home as much as i was leaving the way international and with the abuse and all i was "free" finally, and i always knew the way international was bad news and when i first heard the word "cult" and understood what it meant then i knew the way international was a cult, but like i said, it was a few years before i realized that i had actually be "in" myself. once i realized that, then the "free fall" for me was thinking i'd never ever be fixed but end up like my mother and brothers and sisters, and i did the "free fall" for a few years before i got any help.

i think that because people mix religion with government that people don't get that in america "marriage" is a legally binding contractual agreement so that even if they think they're doing some romantic religious thing "before god" in a church and taking vows that say something like "love, honor and cherish, in sickness and in health, for better and for worse, until death do us part", well then those are legally binding words that if brought into a court of law the "injured party" can clean out bank accounts and get ahold of other financial assests, make the "injuring party" pay off marital debts, get long term support not only for children but for the "injured party", and bring things back into court over and over again depending on the longevity of the marriage. i work in a field that deals with this all of the time and maybe older people think the "no fault" divorces really are "no fault" but nowadays since public assistance is so limited and so hard to get and state budgets are going to hell in a hand basket i see it all the time when the "injured party" is "counseled" to find fault, document fault, how to "trigger" fault, stay in the marriage for as long as possible so that certain laws will kick in (changing from state to state) for the best "benefits" of divorce, what to do, where to go, what to say and what documentation to have ready when the "injured party" is ready to make a move and all that. i am always seeing that divorces nowadays are so often up to 5 years in the planning by the "injured party". be very very careful before you take a vow "before god" because in america those are legally binding words and the courts don't very much like to look at the religious end of things because there's a whole other world that says "freedom of religion" means that two consenting adults were of legal age and legal wherewithal to know what they were getting into, so unless one or both of the marrying partners were minors, the argument that the "before god" vows were taken while in a cult and the "before god" part was distorted to the point of not understanding will not usually fly.

yah, and you said it first and i seconded it, and i think the vote is in that no matter how you dice and chop up the bible, the man was no "man of god" and any "revelation" he "received" was probably a filling in one of his teeth tuned to a very bad "madtv" version of the "twilight zone" and he probably needed to be on seroquel or something similar to shut up those voices in his head and shut down those hallucinations and tame those delusions of grandeur. and probably some healthy doses of salt peter wouldn't have hurt, either. (yes i know that salt peter is an explosive but can't a girl have some fun?) edited to add that i looked it up and salt peter is an additive to explosives and some say it was used to stop the hornies in the military and some say it wasn't and others say maybe so maybe no but whatever it is used in toothpaste and ice cream and the possible side affects are cancer and reproductive problems, so i still say some salt peter couldn't have hurt.

i vote for "lewd fellow of the basor sort" as written in the old testament and don't get why the old testament is "written to us" for this and for tithing and multiple sex partners but not "written to us" when it says "do not commit adultery". :wacko:

i don't think i will ever get married because i don't want to ever make a vow that i feel i might have to break because i saw what "the vow" did to my brothers and my sisters when they went wow or corps and they couldn't break "the vow" even when they knew they were serving men not god, so i get it from the outside looking in about "the vow" and it is sad and i hate it that "lewd fellows of the basor sort" tied my family up into such a vow!

even though my head knows that my family was going to be my family with or without the way international i can't help but to wonder if it would have gotten so bad if it weren't for the way international because my mom was at one time somebody i could turn to but then she got deep into way indoctrination and became somebody that was my worst enemy in the end because she turned against her own children if it meant choosing the way international or her children, and the same thing with my brother and my sisters. so i can't say i miss my family but i can say i miss what my might have been given a different chance at things, but even that is a "what if" fantasy because i'll never know for sure if it was way indoctrination or their basic nature.

i think that what hiway and waysider are saying are on the mark with this because there is a whole big difference between helping people find their own potentials and turning people into what you think they should be, which is why i have such a problem with most religions, corporations, pacs, unions, or whatever you can name that have their own agendas and just need bodies to do their labor and bring in the cash.

i've been so afraid to say anything in this discussion because i know there's nothing i can really say except that here i am (and many more than me) rooting for you. i like the things you write about roy and you're so brave so much and sometimes i wish i could just play superman for you or something but i know and you know that can't happen or isn't even realistic, but you're doing good holding on and hanging in from what i can see and i hope you keep doing it because you're like a lighthouse on some dark and stormy seas more often than you would ever guess and i'll bet for more people than could or would ever say so, and i thank you.

i love this topic! it really is that simple!

well i'm glad i'm not ex way corps because i wouldn't be able to "talk nicey nicey" particularly if i ran into some certain people because i'd want to take them through some "trenches" and see if we "bonded" afterwards. edited to say that this discussion got a whole lot deeper than i thought it would get for me and i'm not threatening any violence towards anybody but i'm speaking sarcastically and i use words to express myself but i'm not even that good with words.

i always wondered how it was that my brother and my sister could be high school dropouts with barely tenth grade educations and be high and all knowing corps leaders. <_< what really bothers me, though, is that the stuff sunk into my brain. why? i still don't get it.

for me the trauma bond makes sense because well it was pretty traumatic what us kids that i knew were going through and we most certainly were in fear of our lives and knew that we knew that we knew (yes, we thought like that about it) some of us would really be killed at some point by some of the leaders or even our parents and we had to escape to survive. yes it was like that for us kids that i knew but i am not saying it was like that for all kids but i am saying that i do get the "foxhole" thing but i don't have much to do with those kids nowadays and they don't have much to do with me because we really don't have anything we particularly want to talk about that we have in common, but we do check in on each other a couple of times a year and some of us are dead now from suicides or "hard living" or something else and it's not the "good old days" or "friendship" or "fellowship" we remember when we remember those that have fallen, so i don't get the whole "foxhole" thing totally because there is no "glory" to fall because of the things we fall from or to fall from what caused the things we fall from.

these are all good things to think about like with the idea about the veterans and being in foxholes because there was certainly trauma bonding in the way international, and i don't doubt that some true friendships were made, either, and i know that if i had any idea that i was interacting with some of the people that made my life a living hell back in the way international days i wouldn't care what they were today i would have a hard time getting along with them today, so yah these are good things to think about. it is also good to recognize and comprehend that whether i like it or not the way international was a deeply engrained part of my life and the people of the way international made up my world when i was involved and there is a grieving process that needs to be done whether it's over the lost relationships, the lost time, the lost innocence, the lost sense of spirituality, the lost faith or whatever, there's still a grieving process and that process deserves compassion and tenderness and understanding from others that have gone through it. at least i think so.

for me it was the exact opposite because for me the people were the harm and the message was the redemption, and the one message i got loud and clear was the "i have no friends when it comes to the word" and it gave me permission to detach from the abusers and cling to the doctrine for my salvation. imagine what it was like when i realized the doctrine drew me just as far away from salvation as the people did.