Shellon

For me in my life, my personality, I have to figure it out; it's who I am. That way I can, I hope, understand why, where, when I found myself there to be available to their rape, abuse, control, emotional battering and hopefully, as I said in the first post "learn something". And God forbid if I'm ever the cause of it happening to anyone else. But yeah, first myself. I have to understand things, I just do. It's not always pretty, it's often reliving the shi+, but once I do, it's better and the chances of do overs are rare, if ever.

Yes, Brainfixed, I'd agree; they don't care. And in an organization like The Way International, they had/have every manner of pedophile, rapist, batterer, abuser, arsonist, burgler and whatever, allegedly. (gotta add the allegedly, ick). And indeed the victimizer will often take any victim s/he can get so long as they get their fix of whatever it is they fixate on or need. For anyone victimized by them, I hope it offeres some solace or comfort that they were NOT at fault, they didn't do anything to attract the attack or the abuse. Stinks of the rape victim that is raped again in court cuz they were wearing something "wrong" doesn't it? We do not have to own that which is not ours.

This story takes some twists and turns as I follow a new path of what I hope is self discovery. It's not without pains and, finally, the release of tears, the acceptance of what is mine and what I can give to others. A lot of admitting that I did the best I could, my husband did his best, our children have much to be proud of and it's going to be alright. Someday. I have to believe that this will eventually prove to be a good thing and I'll see my way out the other end stronger and better. I'm mostly happy and proud to announce a book being written telling the story of how two people wandered into an abusive, manipulative, oppresive religious organization and only one of them made it out and what it cost. And what it still costs today, every day. I've been considering that price recently and it's been mostly brutal and painful as I look at the heart and realize (or admit) that. The support of a few who hang in there no matter how rough the road gets or how many times they have to hear the story has been priceless and there will never be thanks proper. With tears I can only say that it's not been on purpose that I journey that trail, but of necessity, for life, to get to the place of understanding that continued breath is the right thing. God knows I'd rather do something else. My 14 year old, who didn't know I was listening : "It's been almost 13 years daddy" Oh Amazing, Amazing Grace

I guess that's my point. If someone falls off a 10 story building, The Way would offer that if s/he was paying attention to God, s/he would have seen the dumb edge of the building. Never mind that they have eyeballs in their heads, right? The illogic is so much the point too, isn't it? My argument today is that if someone falls off the building, I have to wonder what Way Leadership told them it was ok to stand so close to that edge.

lol no, that's my youngest daughter; she's 14 now. Yeah, she used to say "this is America, I have rights" when I was scolding her about something.......hahaha, I'd forgotten about that. ---------------------------------------- I've spend much time lately thinking about the standards of The Way International and their one liners that were coined for whatever reason, no reason at all or using The Bible as their excuse and the sheer DAMAGE caused and still rippling in lives. My daughters and my grand daughter teach me so much more than I ever might them, actually, as I but listen and really hear what they say. My grandpa said "listen to old people and kids, they'll both tell you the truth". So true huh? I'm blessed, I'm thankful, I'm learning and understanding more and more daily as I deal with this stuff and take it on; painful and no. I'm at a really fantastic place of gleaning from those who truly seek to enrich my life, add to it's emotional well being and consider my value. http://www.youtube.c...h?v=mBL8vop4Cb0

My dad used to ask me, when I was in some trouble with him and at the end of his lecture "Shellon, did you learn anything?" I learned to anticipate that question and depending on what my current infraction was and the azs chewing that came with it, I'd prepare my answer accordingly to get out of there the quickest. Where did you let the Adversary in? My theory, plan, idea or stategy that had never let me down with my dad never worked for that one. I mostly always knew to expect it, but it never made sense to me and I never knew at which point in the current infraction I had done such a horrid thing as let the devil into my lives, my marriage, the lives of my children. I always learned something though! If something was amiss in my marriage, who the he!! knew when it started; all I knew was that it was current and we were in some deep fecal matter, shouldn't that really be the point at the time? If one of my children was sick, for me to spend time in my memory, which was very sharp then, going over and over things, places, actions, people, etc and blah and geeze.....to figure out where I opened the door for the adversary to try to kill my baby, was 1) a time waster when I really needed to be taking care of my child 2) silly and 3) still a time waster. When I couldn't seem to conceive our second child, surely I'd allowed the devil in somewhere, one day, somehow. My answer was the wrong one: why was this all my fault? I don't recommend that, by the way. Like holding of breath; not recommended. The story of my husband dying and TWI blaming the dead man and then turning their accusations and questions onto me seemed to fall into all of the "where did you let the adversary in' and then spilled over into every other thing. How about something like he had a rotten organ beating in his chest that he didn't take care of and it failed as expected. What did he learn? Nothing. What did I learn? That it wasn't the devil, it was a man who was an adult and had the free will to do whatever he wanted in regards to his health; his wife nagging him notwithstanding. I refuse to accept fault for that and I also refuse to give the devil due for it. If my life is in the toilet, yes, maybe I did "fail" somewhere, maybe I did miss a beat when I was marching to a different one, maybe I ought to accept responsibility for what I did, didn't do, should have done, could have done, maybe it serves well to answer "did you learn anything?" I eventually do get to those realities and painful truths. I just prefer to consider things like the human body isn't always cranking along as it should or we would like it to. If I lose a job, maybe it's because the job suckedasshugely; nothing to do with the devil. If one of my kids is ill, maybe they simply got sneezed on at school and caught the most recent crud. I understand and remember TWI's other lecture of "not only did you let the adversary in, you locked the door on God". Black/White/The End. I sure don't miss giving the adversary, the devil, lucifer, call it whatcha want, they did, so much credit for what's going on in my life and the lives of my kids. My almost 5 year old grand daughter was telling me a story about some kids throwing sand on her head, taunting her with words of "Tell the teacher, Cry, Go ahead you baby" and after we talked about it a little bit she said "Nama I know they are just meany poopheads, I iggynore them" I think I get it.

Oh yeah, and I also believe that we human beings have no idea of what we are really capable toward our better good until our feet are in the fire, the gun is pointed at our head or it's the final hour. Then I believe we rise above the bullshi+, we stand up a little taller and we stop being afraid. This is applicable whether it's our lives, our marriages, a cult or other organization or what's in that annoying mirror.

Ok, I'll take a stab at it. What I believe........ I believe in the general goodness of people when all the circumstances are lined up in the right directions. I also believe people lie and manipulate if it serves their cause and they'll do so without a shred of remorse or even concern. Since this is a site About The Way I believe that The Way was a good idea in the Weirwille's basement with a few fellars sitting around the fireplace yaking about the Bible and it got sorely out of hand in a manner too fast for anyone to try to or want to stop. I believe the children should respect and revere their parents but the parents gotta earn that stuff. I believe that in this journey we do the best we can to get up in the morning and climb through the day. Sometimes it's an easy adventure, other times it sux beyond our stamina, but at the end of the day before we put head to pillow, we ought assess that day and be damn sure we did our level best. If we didn't, pray for tomorrow to get here sooner in order that we might remedy, apologize, repair and/or otherwise fix what might be fixed. I believe that people who harm children should combust immediately once proven. I believe in love and I believe in the giving and recieving of same when and only when two people are willing to communicate in every possible manner and not be afraid. I believe that I am on this earth for more than my kids or my man, although those fill a great place and, in fact, come first. I believe I also serve a purpose to humankind in general but have no clue what that might be. I believe that tomorrow might arrive and if it does, it will probably close in the usual fashion with the hopes of another one. I believe that the tongue is the most powerful weapon and should be brandished with the most extreme care. I believe that life is good, God had it figured out and somewhere along the line something horrid fu cked it up. I used to believe I could fly, now I know I can walk, even if some days I have to literally grab my pant leg to do so. I believe in the power of the human condition to do as much harm as it does good in equal speed. I believe that if we don't open our eyes, ears and mouth, we'll soon be blind, deaf and mute.

Roy I relate to the orginal story as my oldest was present at her sisters home birth when she was 13 and her sister was then present when she gave birth 10 years later. Thankfully neither of them had to assist in the births

oh yeah, and...... I, too, know John and this is still a fantastic statement

Now we just Way more healthy

HA ! HA ! And Amen !

yeah, good way to go too! The same day, yesterday, a ran into another miserable comforter in the grocery. She patted my arm and said "how are you?" to which I of course replied "doing very well, thanks" when she said in a syrup dripping voice "reeeeeeeealllllllllyy, are you really doing well, do we need to talk?" She is, as she often reminds me, a Christian woman. WHAT THE PHUECK So, in my maturity, I said 'and how are you' to which she of course replied she was fine and dandy thank you. I said "are you sure?" and she was taken aback, replying "well, you don't have to be bi+chy". I had to say it "yes, in fact I do have to be bi+chy, I'm past sick and tired of your condescention and pompious smirky shi+ to me. Another thread for another universe, but I sometimes think I have a tattoo on my face that says I'm incompetent and stupid, talk to me thusly. TWI is just the straw that breaks the thing and the vessel through which they suck. And no, a little dance is not wrong, it's about time.

'Tis true, so true. I guess I'm at a place in life where I'm just vomitus about their shi+, seriously just so sick of it, tired of it and have zero time for any of it. I like understanding that whatever they want to do, say to me, it's not my problem.

Happy Birthday call last night that was a blast from my past and she said "you sound sad, are you sad?" I said "no, not sad, I'm pizsed off" She said "negative thoughts and feelings? You know better, we'll be believing for you" The next thing she heard was "if you'd like to make a call, please hang up and dial your number again" Yeah, that cheered me up

Happy Birthday Willy and Whitney ~!

Chas, Happy Birthday to your sweet boy ~! ~! ~!

lol yeah, that is the best one and usually works too huh? Thanks!

Hi Tzaia, while I appreciate your suggestions I am not able to pick up the phone and ask them why. I am already aware, as has been stated; to get to me, to make sure my children "know the truth". If you want to make a huge mug of something enjoyable and take the time, the entire story of "what happened" is here http://www.greasespotcafe.com/ipb/topic/20442-expressions-of-freedom/ And not to mention that the situation surrounding my husband's death doesn't need to be discussed as to what my children know, how they know it or who tells them what. Every disgusting detail, every painful memory, every action taken by doctors, paramedics and their mother has been told my children. This should have never had to be done, had others not approached them and made those kinds of questions necessary. This necessitated my answering their questions honestly. Some of the details surrounding his death are still quite painful to even me. Not specifics that children need to have in their heads. Now, on the other hand, my children and I are straight up about everything; there isn't a subject that is off limits in our house as far as questions and honest answers. So, this one need not be either if they have questions. And surely one can understand how painful it is for two smart young women to have to reconcile how those that find it necessary to hurt them with information, hurt their momther and obviously cause pain, can still profess to love them. These intrusions have been a constant dull throb for the 13 years since his death and it's required conversation WAY past what should have been healthy exchanges for me and my girls. But........we'll keep doing it if my girls have questions or need comfort. I know why they're doing it, I know what their goal is, I understand their pain too, even and I have the utmost trust and surety in my daughters as to their handling of such intrusions; hell, they encourage me often more than I them. I can understand if you've not read our story or not had the blessing of knowing my children. Amazing women, they. If they weren't my kids, I would sure want them to be my friends. They are the best parts of their father, the better parts of who I am. I'm a realist, I know that any relations in or out of TWI are potentially violatile; I accept what is. I made the decisions I did in leaving TWI fully aware of the consequences and ramifications therein. This issue was one I spent significant thought time on and knew I was ready. That end doesn't necessarily make what I knew would happen less painful when it happened; just kept the shock at bay.

I agree on the old wounds being ours, Jeff. What rips my guts is that people know the best way to get to someone; through their children. So much of TWI, for me, has been and continues to be how NOT to treat people. In 1982 I first too PFAL and speedily understood I'd fallen in some pretty serious sewage that required me to figure out how to play the game(s). I'm not shocked by anything they do, I'm not even necessarily hurt by anything they do. Unless they mess with my kids. I'm preaching to the Choir, I get that.

I'm on a tear, can't get this one off my brain today. I want to provide those who would continue to involve my children in their shi+, or here's the latest one; actually blame my children, with mirrors. Let 'em look in the reflection, let 'em smash them, I couldn't care less today. WTF? This mornings accusations are that if I'd taken my eldest to doctors sooner, she'd not have had the severe Endometriosis that has required the Hysterectomy she just had three days ago. Additionally, I should have seen that my youngest had the health problems that are making the quality of her life right now less than the "best". Finally, had I not dropped the ball on my believing where their dad was concerned that brought about his death, he'd be here to handle our children's health issues "right". Are my kids still involved? Yes.

I'm sorry for your losses, Bramble and thankful, too, that you didn't have to hear their crap. For me when my husband died while we were still encased in their silliness it was a fantastic excuse, yes, to blame me, blame a dead man, blame anything/anyone. The reality is that he died, the end. Nothing else. The other reality is that he was responsible for his own death. My children were told, recently, that I was responsible for their fathers death. I can only imagine how that flew into their brains and yes, the information came from TWI and others. "Your mom didn't love him didn't take care of him" "Your mom gave him ________ medicine when he was not feeling good that day" "Your mom started CPR on your dad before calling 911, wasting precious time" It goes on...... The fact is that their dad had massive heart problems that he ignored and the damage was such that his death was but a matter of time at the rate and style of life he was living. Of course since I was his primary meal preparer, his diet was my fault. Since I was his helpmate, I failed. Since I was his first prayer partner, I failed to believe God and back up my husband. I failed, the end. He'd still be alive today were it not for me. These are the things my children hear. And worse, now, when my eldest is recovering from major surgery, they dropped more of this stuff on her. If TWI and others can blame me they don't have to look at their own hand in the death? Yeah, maybe so. But it was with anger and further sorrow that I offered my children the Autopsy results from a Coroner's office. Not that they insisted or even asked, but I needed them to have the counter balance of accusations. What is maddening is that a 14 year old has to be offered her fathers Autopsy report and toxilcology screening results. I believe that my step brother's wife killed him and I shall not be convinced otherwise; there were no remains to autopsy, no blood work done since she had him cremated within 24 hours of his death. I know what that feels like to wonder and question. I get it, is my point. What pizses me off in our case is that they didn't have the courage to confront me, directly, as to my husbands death; to ask me their pained questions that anyone might normally have when a seemingly healthy young man of 35 suddenly drops dead. They told my children what they were so sure was true. I would have welcomed their questions, their need to know, their curiosity and concern that would have been expected even. What they didn't understand, and assumingly never will, is that my kids are strong women, smart women and they don't fall under the stupidity of such insults to their mama. TWI can not get to my babies, no matter how many times they have tried, and continue to try. We're 13 years out of TWI almost now and even in the last 2 days the accusations have continued. It is a part of our lives and I guess it shall be. My children are not involved, no, but they have to deal with it, still. What a shame. Maybe my children are still involved............I just know that I am no longer responsible for it. Maybe that's enough. Maybe it's not.

I thought it said Belching and moaning, so I thought it was in referance to....umm well, something else. Betching, moaning, screaming, hollaring, denying, complaining, accusing, bemoaning, bi+ching, lying. Yeah, I recall. If someone is having sex, the twi folks are having better sex. If someone is having a meal, the twi folks are eating better. If someone is excreting, twi folks have a gold seat on which to put their snobby azs. If someone is driving a red truck, the twi folks' truck is redder. The world sucks, we have to live in it and we have to tolerate the worlds crap. Blah puke

Thanks Bramble, yup, sad isn't it? And of course my children's father died and was held up as an example of unbelief after he died. See people, this is what we mean, ya believe us now? It's tough enough when our babies are sick without their bullshi+, guilt, condemnation and the added stress of them just freakin breathing near us. A few health issues have come up since we got the heck outa there and I've remained so thankful that I didn't have to jump through their hoops, answering their questions, acting on their suggestions and revelations and discernations and confusion while knowing that I, as the mom, already know what to do.

Since my oldest is in the hospital after having major surgery yesterday and my youngest is ill with something intestinal as well as something we're not completely sure of yet, I'm reminded of dealing with medical issues in TWI. So much easier, now, to just take care of things and not have to just believe God or TWI's guilt laden bullshi+ and never know for sure if I'm doing what's right for my child; taking a shot and hoping, then of course facing the consequences of my inaction, bad choices cuz I listened to the wrong person, or faced my self in the mirror when my child was still sick after I'd wasted days following silliness. For me that nonsense started off quickly when my oldest was a year old; my inaction almost killed her and you think TWI would have backed me up or visited me in prison? I know my child, period, amen, the end. Now I can act accordingly, freely, confidently. And I don't have to wait for some one's permission or stupid opinion about a kid they've never met, don't know like I do or has lumped into some pile of "my kid had that and.........." While in TWI, that was always my biggest pain. I'm the mom and it's my job and my responsibility to know what she needs. And I do.