johniam

Since we're talking about the Red Sox, they say there's only 7 players on this year's team that were on the '04 team. I thought of 6: Manny, Ortiz, Varitek, Schilling, Wakefield, and Timlin. Who's the 7th? Boy, they can sure thank Youklis and Pedroia for this year's WS appearance. But I'll be surprised if Colorado still plays with the same fire that won them 21 of 22. Too many days off.

Good morning to you, too. Say hi to everybody else in the asylum for me.

quote: Maybe Wierwille's problem was he was born in the wrong time period? Maybe if he had been around in Solomon's time, or other times when men had many many wives, he wouldn't have been hassled so much by some posters. Bullseye! They won't admit it, but they think even having that much sexual desire is evil.

quote: It's clear you don't understand the term "agnostic", which basically means the "clean slate" you are talking about. Atheism is what you are more against and consider a belief system, although there are different types of atheists. Atheists like me and apparently George simply stopped worrying about the whole "god" thing and moved on with our lives. I see no evidence that a god exists, so I don't believe in it. It's not that I have "proof" there is no god, there's just no proof that there is one either, so why should I believe in it? It's not a "belief system", because there is nothing to believe in. It's literally the absence of belief. I think everybody has a belief system. I was taught that atheists are SURE there's no God, but agnostics weren't sure, but leaning that way and not easily swayed by religious people. Former Detroit Piston center Bill Laimbier described himself that way once. He said he's not sure one way or the other if there's a God or not, but he definitely doesn't allow religious people to tell him how to go about his business. I've never read or heard a dictionary type definition of agnostic, but I'm curious as to the breakdown of...a (not) gnostic (the gnostics were a very influential cult during the 1st century). Interesting. But even saying there's no proof of the existence of God in and of itself is systematic. It presupposes that the issue has been considered, weighed, and evaluated. That's pretty much what a belief system is. I don't think religion should be penalized as a belief system just because it includes a God. God's not down here directing traffic; it's just you and me on a level playing field. I don't have a problem with that.

I think it'll be like last year. Detroit breezes through the first 2 series' and then has to wait a week before playing in the WS and comes out flat losing to a team that just won a hard fought 7 game series.

The expression is 'we all wear many hats' referring to the roles we play in life. I think a "me" is one of those roles. I took a sociology class. I thought my teacher was born of the wrong seed. Still not sure she isn't. But the class material was interesting. I think I'm a 'unfrozen hunting and gathering person'.

quote: Uh, so you became a Christian all on yer own? All of a sudden it dawned on you that there was this guy Jesus and he'd done some really neat stuff for you? That's why I say "beyond that required of other conclusions".

Of all the things LCM said, one still rings true. He said that it was God who made people with the appetites they have for many things, but it's the adversary who manipulates those appetites in ways that are hurtful to people; something like that. If all said is true, then LCM had/has some hurtful appetites of his own, but that's a different topic. I believe that God gave us brains so we'd use them. We all seem to gravitate toward forming conclusions about our environment(s), some permanent, some temporary, and one of those conclusions is about how we got here with all the ramifications. Agnostic isn't nothing; it's a thought through belief system just like any religion. If what you say is true, that Geo meant we're all born with clean slates, then yes I agree, but to me saying we're all born agnostics suggests that any conclusion reached about a God requires some outside tampering beyond that required of other conclusions. THAT I don't agree with.

quote: We're all born agnostics... No, we're all born humans with brains with an appetite to believe...something. quote: Lookie at a page from the Muslim world Click Here! and see how similar it is to Christian web sites. PEOPLE!! LISTEN TO ME!!!!!! Can you not see??? Religions.. ALL RELIGIONS.. are man made my dear friends. Yeah, so is everything else man made. I guess man needs to make stuff from time to time. Do these Muslim websites say that God raised Jesus from the dead and that his finished works are the payment for mankind's sins? If not, they can't be too similar.

quote: I think I'm trying to put myself back in to a box if I try to put a lable on my belief system. There's 2 boxes everybody is in; they're called time and space, and they're fairly rigid. Wherever you are, THAT'S where you are, nowhere else and whatever time and date it is, THAT'S what it is, not another. This continuous common reality makes it easy for us to put other things in boxes, not because there's nothing else there, just because life is easier to process with a good filing system. Even God's word is not going to process everything for us, but IMO it sure covers a lot of ground. In fact, it covers "wherever you are". :)

quote: When it came to the bible it seemed apparent to me that I was taking this guy's word that this other gy's word that these guy's words in a book were not only accurate, but truth and God's Word. It seemed that in order to have faith in God I needed first to have faith in those other guys. Dang if that isn't what Rom. 10:14 says in a way. Remember, faith cometh by hearing, not by seeing. It takes at least as much faith to be an atheist as it does to be a Christian. Cause to be an atheist you're still basing it all on this guy and that guy and this other guy...whoever you HEARD it from. Right?

I can testify as to a journey from atheism to Christianity. My upbringing was ultra liberal. By the time I was in high school I was open about my atheism. I was convinced that the only reason anybody believed in God was because they were convinced they would go to hell if they didn't. I thought they were brainwashed; I made fun of it. Sure, there were people who believed in God whom I respected; my grandma, and people I saw regularly who didn't shun me because of my professed atheism. But mostly I saw people who believed in God as not allowing themselves to enjoy life; that was the stereotype I held. I went to a liberal church, though. Interesting that Ann Coulter's recent book calls liberalism a church, because my mom always told me to say I went to a LIBERAL church if other kids on the street asked me about that. The church is called Fountain Street Church and the likes of Robert Frost, Stokley Carmicheal, and recently Michael Moore have been guest speakers there. But after 9th grade I stopped going to that church because I found it boring. But things happened along the way. In 4th grade I was in church and there was this room where they showed cartoons before Sunday school and on this day they showed an hour long movie about Jesus. In that church Jesus was not viewed as evil; just as one religious leader among all the rest. So I watched the movie and it gave me a good feeling. So I walk to my Sunday school class and when asked where I was I said, "I saw a movie about JESUS!!!!!" Loud laughter followed. They weren't mean about it, just skeptical, but the film definitely made an impression on me. In 10th grade some guys, both of whom are still atheists, talked me into going to a Christian fellowship just to check it out nothing better to do. It was about the size of a twig, but midweek at a Presbyterian church. During the meeting I felt a very powerful presence in the room, especially when they all prayed. It felt good. I even prayed myself. This was before I ever started using drugs. I later felt the same powerful presence during every session 12 I was ever at. But I basically blew it off, although I wasn't as quick to claim to be an atheist anymore. In 1973 I was hitching from STL to San Francisco and I got picked up in St. Charles, just 30 miles west of STL and got a ride all the way to Seattle. At first there were 4 people in the car, 3 guys, 1 girl. They witnessed to me aggressively. I accused them of cramming their religion down my throat. They stopped. In Kansas City, 2 of the guys got dropped off, including the most aggressive one. By the time we got to Denver the remaining guy apologized for being too pushy and simply told me how God helped him out of a serious legal situation and that if I ever got really bummed out with life to ask for His help. In 1975 I spent the summer as an assistant park ranger at Wilson State Park in Harrison, MI. I was away from my friends most of the time. Two coworkers each invited me to their church. One was weird. They were into loud sobbing during the sermon and several people came up to the altar and said praise Jesus a lot. It was confusing. Only went once. The other one was much different. Same powerful presence. The minister talked to me personally and during the sermon he spoke of John the Baptist, how he was strong and not blown around by every wind of peoples' opinions. The past few years at that time saw failed attempts to keep jobs, failed romantic relationships, failure to stay in school, and deteriorating relationships with family members. I wished I was strong. But this, too, I blew off. Then in fall of '76 a musician friend whom I respected witnessed to me. He had tried to witness to me previously, but my prepared one liners always backed people off, including him. Not this time. He was bold and confrontational. No surprise he'd just taken PFAL. So later that night I told God I'd give it a try for one year but that I needed to see undeniable results. Thirty one years later I feel that was the smartest decision I ever made. Christianity rerouted a very troubled life. At one time I would have creditted TWI for most of it, but if they hadn't been there something else would have. I think going from Christianity to atheism would be a demotion, but that's me. Use this post as an anti-model if it fits.

When I was in Jr. high one day we got sent home from school early. I walk into our yard and the curtains in the big window in front of the house are closed. Hmm. THIS is unusual. I wonder what's going on. I open the side door to go in as always and I hear loud big band style music coming from the stereo in the living room. So I walk in there and lo and behold, my mom has the vacuum placed in the center of the room and she's dancing the jitter bug (or something like that) while pretending that the vacuum is her dance partner. She wasn't naked, but she saw me and got all embarrassed and would never talk to me about it. My initial response was "Whoa, Mom. All RIGHT! You go!" but this raised questions. My dad had been dead for a few years and I wondered how often she did this. She wasn't given to religious superstitions, but she may have thought that my dad was monitoring her life from beyond the grave. She lived 32 years after he died and never remarried. I also now wonder which of her "me's" was this an extention of? Possibly it was a combination of mother and homemaker and widow. Here she was trying to make her home a presentable place for me, the other person who lived there, and anyone else who might drop by, but that vacuum became a vehicle for SIN!!!!! It wasn't her fault; it was that damn vacuum. OK, it must now be obvious where I was going with this, but I'm chickening out. Not going to go there. You can't make me.

Don't look at the 5 senses...WHEN???? Many times in scripture God has people do things that go against conventional wisdom. Examples: 1) the elder would serve the younger when Jacob and Esau were born 2) Jacob guided his hands wittingly when blessing Joseph's 2 sons Ephraim and Manassah so that the right hand was on the head of the younger 3) Samuel thought Jesse's eldest son was the next king of Israel, but God refused him Don't look at the 5 senses. So, I'm not supposed to look at traffic signals? No. If God's word is clear, either by scripture or by revelation, THEN don't go by the 5 senses. Conventional wisdom is part of the 5 senses.

This thread is like so many others; it's like those movies and cop shows where they go to the shooting range, clip a target on the wire, zoom it back as far as they want, then shoot at it, zoom it back to them and you see bullet holes in the head and heart areas. I got to admit this one used more imagination than the average, but the first post just neatly listed the targets single file and didn't even have to zoom it anywhere, just fire away. Never gets old, does it?

Gen 3:22 - ...behold the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil... Gen 6:5 - and God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually Gen 8:21 - ...for the imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth... Jer 17:9 - the heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked; who can know it? Luke 11:13 - if ye then, being evil... Is it possible...that God, knowing how evil man seems to gravitate toward, has a different criteria for choosing who He works through than politically correct, or man's morality, or whatever other flawed, 'set up for failure' standards mankind uses? Do you think Noah wasn't just as evil in the imagination of his heart as anyone else living at the time? It says he found grace in the eyes of the Lord. Why not VP? Gideon was a poor man in Manassah. God gave him power. He had 70 kids. Must've liked his tang, too. Saul was so afraid of success he hid among the stuff. God gave him power. He abused people. David was a man after God's own heart. God gave him power. If VP raped anybody then David raped Bathsheba. Solomon pleased God. God gave him wisdom, honour, and riches. He, too, abused people. This idea that VP couldn't possibly have been a MOG is based on politically correct and other man made standards. Isaiah 55:8 says ...my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways (v.9) as the heavens are higher than the earth so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts. In the previous verse (v. 7) the higher thoughts and ways are...to have mercy and abundantly pardon. Man's thoughts and ways are often to NOT show mercy and not even marginally pardon. That's part of the evil. This thread proves to me something I've felt all along: that even though the "VP defenders" are greatly outnumbered by the condemners, our words are stronger than yours. They have more impact.

I don't know, but he once said that Nelson Rockefeller had all the gold in Fort Knox shipped somewhere else in 1975.

I have a friend who lives in Cincinnatti and I went to visit him in 1997 and he had in his car a street guide for the whole state of Ohio, so I looked up the HQ area and lo and behold, Camping Blvd and Rock of Ages Blvd from tent city were actual streets. TWI must've had to allow this in order to have the ROA at that location, because I remember seeing police cars occasionally cruising through tent city on those streets. They were in our space.

I understand not liking friends as disposable; bad choice of words, maybe, but you make it sound as though friendship is a commitment at the same level as marriage. I think of friends as a role people play in our lives, a necessary role, but a replaceable one, too. A spouse? That's technically replaceable, but not like friendship. Friends can violate you to the point where you'd kick them to the curb more easily than a spouse would. Hopefully.

Definitely not dull.

It seems to me that it's easier to make friends as a child simply because you're in a larger pool of candidates to select from. I lived in the same house from age 1 until graduating high school. On my street, there were 2 kids a grade older than me, 1 kid in my grade, 2 kids 2 grades younger than me. Those were the kids I did the most stuff with (build tree houses, go camping, play sports, etc.) but there were kids older and younger than those as well. Then mix with that all the kids in school plus new kids to meet in Jr. high and then high school. But it was all determined by decisions my parents made for me; not my own decisions. By the end of high school I was in a clique with 4 other kids. We all got high together and liked pretty much the same music. I stayed close to one of those guys for a few years after high school, but none of the others. I think friendships are determined in large part by where you meet and what you have in common. Today I exchange emails with only 1 of the friends I had in high school. He wasn't one of the friends in the clique, but we had music and drugs in common. He is now Christian, but not TWI and we both have wives and families. TWI was OK for awhile because I was genuinely into the agenda and so were all my friends from TWI, but after getting married and having kids, I felt that the leadership was more meddlesome. I had different needs now and had to make certain adjustments and they were getting in the way all the time. They didn't have to do that. But since becoming a spouse and parent, it seems like the pool of friend candidates has shrunk. Not because there aren't other married couples with kids out there, just that I don't have as much time anymore to spend with friends. Full plate, y'know. I think also that in order to have friends you have to learn better how to BE a friend, give and take, learn how to not exploit a friend's sensitive areas, etc. I would like to think that anywhere I go I have something of substance to contribute to any potential friendship, learned by trial and error from previous friendships. That's all I can do really, is approach friendships with that or a similar attitude. I've made friends from jobs, bowling leagues, and other stuff like that but right now my closest friends are from the fellowship I go to. We do all kinds of things together. Yesterday a group of us helped build a deck for somebody. It was great; we got work done and enjoyed each other's company. We go camping, canoeing, and stuff like that. Great bunch of folks. True, if something happens and the fellowship breaks up, we'll have to find something else, but friends are more disposable today than they have been in past generations, IMO.

I recently read a book about Jim Morrison. I was never in the Doors' fan club or anything like that, but I've always liked their music. Jim had a vocal delivery that I found compelling. Of all the bands I never saw, which includes some very big names, the Doors is the one I now wish I'd made more of an effort to see. But the book has some unflattering things to say about Jim. It was written by someone close to the group and was quick to point out good things Jim did well (musically, on stage, etc.), but he was really an a$$hole a lot. He was always drunk. The 'Soft Parade' album was basically the 10% of the studio time when he WASN'T too stoned, drunk, or otherwise self absorbed to get anything done. That's part of why there's string and horn arrangements on that recording that aren't on the others. He was also cruel and sadistic at times to those close to him. But I still have Doors music in my house and car. I can play and sing 3 of their songs. He had a good singing voice IMO and only Elvis has been seen more often than he since he died. Not a 100% match, but in a lot of ways VP is the same to me. VP was a researcher; he borrowed from people, but he also rejected stuff from the same people he borrowed from. PFAL was basically VPs product. IMO it was a good product.

I once got picked up hitch hiking by a truck driver who related stories of couples in cars who would deliberately position their cars so he could see down into them and then put on a show for him. Also heard that R and B singer Teddy Pendergast got into a serious wreck by driving while someone performed oral sex on him. Don't know if that's true or not. OK here's a funny one. There was a wow in STL in the late 70s who had been a cop in Mississippi. He said he was out on patrol one night and him and his partner saw a car parked in a secluded area. They wanted to check it out, so they snuck up to it and when they turned all their lights and flashers on (flashers? ) there was sudden movement in the car. When he and his partner got to the car it was a couple in their early 20s and all the guy had on was his tie. The cop says to the guy, "Hey, your tie ain't straight." They didn't do nothing to them; just told them to get a room and left.

I still say that millions of animals can't be wrong...about being naked.

quote: I love being naked. I had a friend once who told me he drove around naked and jerked off. He's dead now. But, millions and millions of animals can't be wrong. The guy died of a drug overdose at age 35. No the animals weren't driving, they're just naked.