johniam

It was written in 1972 by a woman named Elena Whiteside. She spent a day driving around places with Dr. Wierwille and she asked him questions as they rode and it paints a nice picture of twi paradise. Even those who left are treated kindly. Both Waysider and Wordwolf have referred to it before. Perhaps they still have their copies of it. I would think you could get it on Amazon or Ebay, but I don't know.

OK, you want a book? For innies? Duh, how about the way living in love. Any current innie who never read that book, reading it, would now have a chance to see that it was like THAT back in '72, but it's like THIS right now. Why is it so different now than it was THEN? Why do I get yelled at so abruptly if I ask leadership about this book? Hmm. Let me think about this. THEN you might have an open door to recommend other books. If you give a current innie a book for the sole purpose of dissing twi...and the current innie LIKES twi...well, you catch more flies with honey, right?

quote: "As part of their service to the Roman Church, the Jesuits encouraged people to continue their obedience to scripture as interpreted by Catholic doctrine." Sounds like you're saying all Jesuits are catholic, but not all catholics are Jesuit. Jesuits are like AC grads (more activist) and the general term 'catholic' is foundational mass grads, sort of. OK, I get it. quote: The original poster is looking for recommendations for books to offer to innies. This poster's all set to pass judgement on people even though he obviously doesn't know anything about them. That's the standard twi thing. You might remember from the 'Changed' film that Mrs. Strauhal, a catholic, said she SIT while still in the catholic church, long before ever having heard of twi. This reveals that catholics can be in the body of Christ, too. Mrs. S is certainly not the only one. So much for passing judgement. BTW, which books have YOU recommended on this thread?

quote: I'd like to see Walter Cummins, do you happen to know his speaking schedule? I receive his quarterly newsletters, but haven't seen him publish a speaking or teaching schedule. Or are you going to visit him one on one, maybe that's what you meant... Operabuff: On the net try scriptureconsulting or continuinginthscriptures. Sorry, don't know how to post a link. But I'm seeing him do a seminar over a weekend in Chicago. Gonna be at least 50 people there, maybe more. The websites give a fax # and a phone #. I hear about stuff like this in the fellowship I attend. Nothing on the website about a speaking schedule. He did a similar seminar in Dayton last April. Hope this helps.

quote: He even bemoaned being the number two cult when we were behind the Moonies. PFAL 77 "We have to try harder we are number 2" Number 2? Never saw that one. Every book on cults I ever looked at had the Moonies and the Hare Krishnas firmly positioned at #1 and #2. Then twi, the Children of God, and Garner Ted Armstrong rotated at 3-5. I'm pretty sure VP was being tongue in cheek when he said that. quote: If there isn't someone equally as charismatic to step in and take over when the big dog dies....the cult usually dies with him. This has pretty much happened with TWI. So how many people does a cult have to have in order for it to be alive? I'm going to see Walter Cummins next month. He's still got it going on. There's people all over the country and world still into moving the word. It's called the body of Christ.

quote: If you wish to have a meta-discussion of this practice, please do so on your Soap Box thread. Otherwise, let's get back to topic, shall we? Sorry, coach. Won't happen again. 10 push ups OK?

quote: If you truly believe that, then there should be absolutely no challenge in transferring that value to the people VP plagiarized the stuff from in the first place. Nope. VP was the presenter. James Taylor's hit songs are all covers of other peoples' songs, but I'd rather see James perform them than those others. A presenter has to connect with the presentees. That was VPs strength. That's why all of you heard it from VP. That doesn't make him God. I had 4 tomato crates full of sns tapes going back to the 70s. Ninty percent of them are now in the trash dumpster. Kept a select few. Listened to 'the red thread' last night. VP could connect with an audience. Yes, I know that the end of that tape where he started out with "in Genesis, he's the promised seed of the woman" and so forth through every book in the bible ending with "in Revelation he's the king of kings and Lord of Lords" that he got that from Bullinger. So what? Do you all really believe that the only reason you ever listened to VP was because you were brainwashed? Do you really believe he was of the devil? Sounds like a sea of speculation and an ocean of doubt to me.

quote: I imagine there are a number of Catholics, even Jesuits, who would carefully read JCING. I never heard of any. Sure never WITNESSED to any. As soon as they find out JCING then THEY became the closed minded glassy eyed robots. TWI never told me this; I saw it first hand. BTW what's the difference between a catholic and a Jesuit? Thought they were one and the same.

quote: Therefore, I am not surprised that facebook shows slivers of this cult element. Many of these people will go to their graves....staking their belief system on twi's doctrines. At least now you acknowledge that there are more people than just me who still value what VP taught. If something isn't broken, no need to "fix" it. VP was just a man; God's word stands forever.

So you really ARE saying there's a devil spirit behind Stan the Man's statue? All those kids who get close to it and touch it are touching a devil spirit? Creepies, Mudhead!

quote: I had read bits and pieces of Karl Marx's writings (or at least the English translations) before I became involved with The Way so, when I heard Wierwille misquote it (Advanced Class, perhaps?), I knew the source, even though he did not cite it. Here, by the way, is what Marx actually said: "Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people." - Karl Marx The erroneous point that Wierwille was attempting to make was that The Way wasn't a religion and, thus, it was superior to other belief systems. VP quoted Marx saying religion is the opiate of the people in that teaching 'the way of life and death'. He said that's the only thing those birds (communists) ever got right. I think it's interesting that religion is considered an inferior belief system, and subsequently is discriminated against, by the so called 'educated' world.

quote: Does anyone recommend giving any of these books to people in the Way? Not any more than I would recommend giving JCING to a catholic priest.

So all those statues of Stan Musial, Lou Brock, Enos Slaughter, etc. outside the entrances to Busch stadium? That's idolatry, too, right?

They sound like they could have been influenced by REM. Sounds good.

Sands of time by Fleetwood Mac. Their success with Stevie Nicks has been so enormous that many don't realize they existed for 8 years before she got on board. Sands of time was on the 'Future Games' album from 1971. First album with Christine McVie on it. Written and sung by guitarist Danny Kirwan. Nice tune. Found it on youtube. Have it in my head a lot lately.

Congratulations. My mom was widowed at 53. Over the first 10 years she got 2 proposals, but turned them down. Didn't see the point in it. She lived out her life being a widow almost as long as she had been a wife. Never seemed to regret not marrying again. I can't picture myself getting married again if Jean and I divorce or if she dies before I do. I think it is definitely a 'life victory' for 2 people to connect like you 2 have at your ages. Bravo. I too wish you the absolute best.

I used to spend all my allowance money on candy and soda. Back then you could get a regular sized candy bar for a nickel and a gigantic sized one for a dime. But there was this ice cream store named Jersey Junction not far from where I lived. Single scoop - 10 cents, double - 20 cents, and triple - 25 cents. It's a wonder I still have any teeth left.

VP said that right at the beginning of session 2. It made me think of that song by the Doobies 'Jesus is just alright with me'. Everybody thought that song was promoting Christianity, but no, he's not the Son Of God or the savior, he's just alright. VP was thinning the herd, I think.

Good to see that Jeb Bartlett's got a new gig.

quote: ......some of my most memorable times during my twi-tenure were "God-moments," with holy spirit within and the sanctity of that one-ness. That was my zenith of true fellowship and perfect peace. Did any of those "God moments" ever happen during teachings? There were times when I would be listening to a teaching and something would click and for as long as 3-5 minutes I'd screen out everything around me and think about whatever clicked. It was a good thing, IMO. Of course, I never had to worry about LCM and his dreaded squirt gun.

This one I remember from a sns tape from the late 80s. Can't recall the teaching title, but LCM was at high volume and he said, "If you're a woman, and you CAN'T be the guardian of a home or a helpmeet to your husband, I don't care if you can run every corporation there is, you're a moron!" Somebody here has got to remember that one besides me.

Wordwolf, do you personally have any experience in fast food? I do. Six years as an asst mgr and 10 years over all. All my mgr years were with Burger King, but I also worked at McDonalds, Hardees, and KFC. Not good pay/ not bad work. During a typical lunch rush we had 25 people on the crew. All working at a fast pace in close proximity with each other. Those with the least experience did drinks, fries, broiler, dining room cleaning, the easy stuff. The mgr in charge did not have a fixed position; had to be free to go wherever there was a need. The best qualified workers went to drive thru, whoppers, small hamburgers, and specialty sandwiches. The prettiest girls were, of course, on front counter. Sex sells, y'know. Many days things went well. But if enough people called in sick, or if someone (an asst mgr perhaps) just had an attitude about something, it didn't take much for hell to break loose. I had a pressure point that seemed to require less and less to be reached as time went on. I last worked this job 20 years ago and I don't miss it. But the best mgrs were the ones who could keep their cool the longest. I didn't see many times when other mgrs got in trouble for just yelling at people. If they got in trouble it was for sexual harassment, stealing money, racial insensitivity, substance abuse, calling in sick too much, stuff like that. But even the best of mgrs had to yell at times to keep order. I'm not saying it was the norm, I'm saying it was something all mgrs had to have the capacity to do. Part of the job; nature of the beast; whatever you want to call it. Yes, perhaps 'scream' is not the best word here.

quote: And, yet, Wierwille claimed that, when he was at the end of his rope,debating an exit from ministerial work, he asked God for a sign and.....voila!, the sky turned black with snow. So, which is it? You can ask for a sign or you can't ask for a sign?.....silly little details often seem to spoil a good fib. You can ask God for anything and God can do pretty much anything. He can do exceeding, abundantly above all that we ask or think, remember? You merely can't ask God for things with the attitude that God HAS to comply. Don't you have ANY confidence toward God anymore?

quote: So now WordWolf is THE DEVIL? No more than Whoopie Goldberg.

quote: Having big vision is fine. Having ambition is fine. Having ambition to climb over and squash everyone else to achieve one's vision is dead wrong. Yeah. I'm on board with that. I knew a guy in twi who told me after I'd known him for years that he wanted to be the next pres. of twi, that he actually prayed about this every day, but he never showed any tendencies to squish people. Hmm. Maybe he should have.