Oakspear

I'm going to bed and have to work tomorrow...don't youse guys get all crazy while I'm gone! Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

We all had our own "personal" TWI's that had more to do with with who "got us in the Word" than who the "leaders" were. There were good times, good people, and great godly things happening...more in spite of "the Way tree" than because of it Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

Happy Birthday! (Sorry, no songs, no earrings, no butts ) Oakspear (one week short of 45)

Oh, horse.... Mike. Anyone who fought against the abuses was driven out, both under Wierwille and Martindale. The record is pretty clear (TWI1, TWI2, TWI3 thread for starters) I'll grant that for many, the abuses are seen with 20/20 hindsight, and were missed as they were occurring, but many others spoke up and were thrown out on their ears...it was Wierwille's game all along. Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

Rascal is not defining herself by what she hates, she is pointing it out and identifying it...two different things. She is a wife and a mother (of a large brood, btw) and therefore has plenty to occupy her life besides her opinion of Wierwille. Rascal's attitude toward "Doctor" is only sinful, etc. if he was "The Man of God", which there is scant evidense for, and which she does not believe ( as I do not) . You, of course, are entitled to your opinion. You can only be "thankful for how God has materfully arranged for us to hear the Word" via Wierwille and PFAL if you believe that God did in fact do the arranging. There is plenty of evidense to indicate that God did not have anything to do with it, but that Wierwille copied the works of others. By saying this, I am not trying to change your mind, which is, as you have said, made up on the subject, just to put things in perspective regarding those of us who don't see things the way you do Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

One of the great things about this thread is that many people who were actually there in the supposed "good old days" weigh in with their own perceptions of that time. It wasn't all sweetness and light and good times and the love of God. Occssionally someone pops up and makes the assetion that Martindale ruined it all, but that Wierwille was a true man of God. The whole picturte is a little more complicated than that. Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

Combo-Wise © is a variety of snack whereby several types of Wise © potato chips are included in the same multi-bag package. Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

Just bringing it to the top again :D--> Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

By "The Word", you apparently mean Wierwille's writings. Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

Doing an "exorcism" on-line seems a bit much, and I think Mike's reaction would be the same (indignation) whether the diagnosis was correct or not, so his rejection of that "solution" doesn't prove anything one way or the other. Ad hominem attacks are unneccessary and add nothing to the discussion, nor do accusations of possession or mental illness. On the other hand, some of the assumptions and allegations from Mike's side could be done without also. That all being said, Steve's and Mark's rebuttals of Mike's positions and assertions are the best that I've seen in a while. They use Mike's own words, as well as Wierwille's words, (which Mike reveres) to make their points. Instead of attacking Mike's premise with logic, which many of us have tried in the past, Mark and Steve have been utilizing Mike's premise to attack his conclusions. It's all very logical. No surprise that Mike isn't buying it though. Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

Wolf: I don't think that they were independent in their goals, maybe in their methods, since they did succeed in maneuvering Neo and the others to be just where the Architect wanted them to be. What about that scene at the end where Neo destroys the sentinels with a wave of his hand? How can he do that? All previous hocus pocus was explained as an individual manipulating their projected mind and body within the Matrix. Well, in that scene they weren't in the Matrix! They also didn't give us much on the "traitor" either. Just the one scene with the knife (why was he cutting parrallel gashes in his palm?) and when he was on the sick bay table at the end. His name was "Bane" wasn't it? Bane as in "Cause of death or destruction"? Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

6/22? Just two days after mine Happy Birthday! Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

fart jokes! just what this thread needed :D--> Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

ah think ah feel a filibuster comin' on :D--> Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

I went to see the movie tonight, and there were so many details crammed in there that I will have to watch it again. :D--> Things that made me go "whoa": The revelation that much of what the "rebels" thought were their own operations was part of the Matrix's control mechanism; like the Oracle turning out to be a program, and "The One" being a predictable side effect of the Matrix itself, the sixth in a series of "Ones". Ghosts, aliens and vampires being simply programs that were not doing what they were supposed to do. There were a couple of places where I wasn't sure if characters were humans or programs, but in most cases decided they were programs (like the french guy and his wife, and the dreadlocked albino twins). Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

The thread in the Open Forum was about biblical references, but I wanted to just talk about the movie in general: :D--> If you haven't seen the movie...do not continue! Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

ubiquity...the word has lost all meaning :D--> Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

...ubiquity Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

ubiquity Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

Since you were so polite, Mike, I'll forgoe my plan to filibuster your discussion of ubuiquity by quoting the Book of Mormon. Carry on. Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare [This message was edited by Oakspear on May 16, 2003 at 22:45.]

Mike: Surely you've figured out by now that your opinion is not going to go unchallenged! By all means, don't wait for those who disagree with you to "run out of gas" before launching into a continuation of your one-note theme. I can see why you, someone who is on a "mission" of sorts, might think that anything that doesn't support your opinion is "clutter" and therefore a distraction, but many others do not think so. What might non-posters who come here for "the topic" think? Maybe that GreaseSpot is a hodgepodge of ideas and filled with an eclectic collection of ex-Ways who by no means agree on what the Way experience was all about. Nuttin' wrong wit' dat :D--> Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

Mike: As much as you would like the threads you start to be exclusively about promoting your position, dissent is allowed. Steve is not changing the subject, nor derailing, but he is disagreeing with you and presenting his reasons why. The fact that YOU are not convinced by Steve's argument is not relevant. The fact that YOU have decided that YOUR mind is made up is not enough. Sorry Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare [This message was edited by Oakspear on May 16, 2003 at 22:46.]

There are three kinds of ex-Wayfers... Those who can count and those who can't Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare

Gimme Ten Steps; Gimme Ten Steps Mister --------------------------------------------- By the way, "doctor" (gag) was not always "ten steps away" from the scandals. He was confronted to his face at times, but pre-internet. What means did people have to broadly deseminate information, and more importantly, compare notes, during those days? Individuals who spoke up had no support group like we have today. Factor in Wierwille's complete control over the "Way Tree" and you see how God wasn't covering anything. Oakspear "We...know how cruel the truth often is, and we wonder whether delusion is not more consoling" Henri Poincare