tonto

cheranne, that is one fine Merry Christmas greeting! T'would be fun to see the looks on the faces of the wayGB when they open it up!

Happy late birthday, Paw (and an early happy Thanksgiving)! tonto & T-Bone

A few years ago (maybe 3 or 4) I heard that they were living in Seattle, but that's about as much as I know.

Thanks for the pictures, George! Everyone looks great and your home is lovely...so sorry we couldn't be there with you all. I see that the strange one is wearing yet another t-shirt sporting (not the biblical kind) a Kinky Friedman quote...I'm jealous. Hugs to all, tonto & T

Hey there George, I'm sorry to say we won't be joining you Friday night as we originally planned, and by the looks of things it doesn't look like we'll be able to make it Saturday. T-Bone and I have both been burning the candle at both ends (or burning both ends with candles) lately and we're just plain worn out. We were looking forward to hanging with you, your lovely wife and the rest of the greasespotters. I should know by mid-week if we can make it Saturday...will that be too late to let you know? tonto & T

I don't know if this is even topic-worthy, but this weekend two young women, Moonies, came to our door. I had just come back home from grocery shopping, hubs and daughter were out walking the dogs, and I heard the doorbell ring and figured it was high schoolers raising money for band. One of the girls was holding a box and the other must have been the designated spokesperson, because she launched into her pitch about being on a mission with her non-denominational church and blah blah blah. I didn't hear anything after she said "non-denominational church" so I stopped her and asked her the name of her church, and she said "Unification Church". I told her that many years ago I spent a good deal of time and energy in another "non-denominational church" and that I'm not interested but told them to have a good day. I wanted to sit them down and warn them of wasting their youth serving a cult leader but I didn't believe they would listen. The thing that hit me was that it's a new generation now, and even with so much information a keystroke away, most younger people don't know about the moonies, the children of God, the way and all the splinters. Shoot, many young people can't find Idaho on a map. I tell myself that people know better now, but that's not true. There's a new generation, ripe for the picking. Just look at V2P2's "farm".

geisha, I wanted to let you know that I made your apple bread recipe last week and it was wonderful! We had some here at home and I took a loaf in to work while it was still warm from the oven...my coworkers scarfed down every crumb before lunchtime. Lots of good stuff to try on these threads...now I just need more time. Thanks again!

Count me and T-Bone in, wine in hand. George, that's too funny about the adult beverage-ally challenged store clerk. Ah yes, the bible belt. When I was a little girl, the blue law didn't allow non-food items to be purchased on Sunday unless there was a dire need. I remember my church-going mother being furious that she had to sign a form in order to buy a pie pan from the grocery store on Sunday. Ya gotta have pie. See you all soon!

Awww, you guys warm my heart! Really, I mean it, and I am looking forward to seeing many of you at the Q. It's too bad all of us can't be there, but I'm blowing kisses to you and sending cyber-hugs right now. I'm not much for birthdays, but this one was so much fun. Me and the fam went to the State Fair of Texas. I've only been there once that I can remember, and that was 35 years ago. My friend, her then-boyfriend and his friend (a blind date for me) went and it was awful. In those days they still had the freak shows..."pretzel man", the bearded lady...just horrible and sad. My date was a doufas and the only good thing I remember was seeing some beautiful quilts in one of the exhibit halls. Anyway, it was such a bad time that I never had the desire to go again, but the other day I got a wild hair and decided it might be a fun family-kind of thing to do. What a beautiful day it was...the freak shows are no more, and it's not just concrete and midway barkers. We went into the butterfly gardens, got to pet miniature donkeys, listened to the Kildares (Celtic-rock), saw a bird show, rode some rides, ate a corn dog (the best corn dogs ever) and just enjoyed being together. We started getting tired, so we missed the pig races and the evening lights, but we went home and got cleaned up then went out for dinner at a really good Pan-Asian place. It was a rare, beautiful day when everything went smoothly, everything worked. I honestly didn't expect this from you guys...and now this is the icing on the cake. Thank you from the bottom of my heart! Love, tonto

The years we were twig coordinators in Colorado and then in Texas (70's & early 80's) we sent every penny of our and our twiggies' abs into HQ. We asked leadership, and the stamps, cost of the money order was to be supplied by us (and was)...anything else would be "stealing from the ministry that taught you the word" (!) Sometimes some of the believers would chip in to help with coffee, but for the most part, the coffee for twigs and snacks was supplied by us. Good grief...how embarrassing that the cost of coffee, stamps and money orders mattered, but when you make diddley-$hi+ and are spending a large percentage of that on "the things of the ministry", every penny counts. We were also told (multiple times, mulitple teachings, from multiple leaders) that the tithe was the minimum required...to really be giving you had to at least be giving 15% of your pre-tax income. This absolutely did not include sponsoring people in the way corps (which we did the entire time we were in twi until we finally went in ourselves). Corps sponsorship was not considered abundant sharing, nor was the cost of gifts for traveling leaders. I distinctly remember beyotching to hubs about having to cough up money for a freakin' rhinestone elvis-type suit for "Doctor's" gift for his visit to Gunnison. Yep, we had holes in our underwear but "Doctor" needs a rhinestone suit. Speaking of Gunnison...the leader's advances and seminars and work trips there were costly. We lived on the Eastern slope and had to make a 6 hour drive (one way) over the continental divide in our van, and that took loads of gas. More than once we made the trip with a load of people who didn't offer or have money to help with gas, but we were expected to bring them. The thing that makes me the angriest about all that is that is took away the joy of giving. It was owed. "Before you pay bills, write that first check for abs...that way you're putting God first". Dammmmmned theiving grifting abusing using liars. Oh, oh, oh! And I almost forgot...remember in the Way Magazine when they came out with "Remember the Way in Your Will"? Hey, they're not satisfied with turning you into a pauper while you're still breathing...when it comes to your heirs...let 'em eat $hi+, let 'em eat cake. Bas turds.

Hi Jeff, I keep meaning to ask, but would you mind revealing which splinter group you were with? In my opinion, they're all bad news. PM me if you wish, and if not, that's fine too. And I'm with WB...I think the dog had the right idea. I'm glad you're out and they can't get their hooks in your son. All the best to you, tonto

Chas, can you put that on a T-Shirt...proceeds to Greasespot? Seriously, I'll order two.

Goey...verse 3?: See the corn grow Doggie porno Stick his finger in your ear VP promised bible knowledge And promoted fools like Geer

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaaaaaaaahhh!! OK now, an aside to you "abundantly sharing" innies...this is an example of what your hard-earned money is paying for? Please, tell me you can't possibly approve of that. Your money would be better spent on a "Brazilian wax" for Rosie. Ugh. Bad visual? So was that production.

Rg, 'fraid not. As long as there is money to be made, ego to be stroked, smoke to be blown, people to be used, it will keep on happening. As far as him rectifying his grandfather's mistakes...nahhhh. I'll bet he thinks the only real mistake his grandfather made was to annoint LCM.

Of course there's no way to know how things really would have turned out, but during the rough times (when I was fed up with any and all aspects of my life), I used to tell myself it would have all been much better if only I hadn't gotten into twi. I've told myself that I would have discovered some fabulous artistic talent of mine lurking just below the surface...I would have been thinner and witty and would have been swept off my feet by Jam es Tay1or or Jack$on Bro wne or some other successful singer-songwriter...I would have had perfect children who never made mistakes... Meanwhile, back in real life...before I got in twi I was hungry for change...looking for meaning and purpose to my life, looking for a way to get closer to God, looking for true love, looking for my life's dream. I was fed up with my church and the hypocracy I saw there. I didn't have a burning desire to have an education or career (plus I couldn't have afforded to finish college on my own). I was lonely and drifting. I was ripe for the picking. I had good and bad things happen as a direct result of being in twi. Only God knows where my life would have gone without it...it might have been better, but it could have been much worse... You know, after we left twi in the late 80's we struggled on so many levels for quite a few years, but I've been amazed in the past few years at the restoration in our lives...sorta Job-like, in a way. Enough r-a-m-b-l-i-n for now.

Hi WG, I just wanted to give you a big hug for being a responsible pet owner. I'm going to brag because today after work I'm picking up our daughter's freshly spayed oh-so-cute rescued terrier mix. Ton-tett has wanted a cat (no...I'm allergic) or small dog for the longest time, but we had adopted/rescued a brother-sister lab/collie duo eight years ago and we just weren't ready for three dogs. Sadly, we had to have the sister put to sleep earlier this month...a nasty sarcoma had been removed, but came back with a vengence. She was such a sweet dog, but she had a very good life. Anyway, with only one dog left...a grieving dog...we started looking at the pound and at the weekly Pe+$mart rescue/adoptions, but didn't see a good match for our daughter. I happened to check craig$list (I never go on there...musta been revelation ) and someone had just posted a picture of a wonderful little dog who was going to have to be taken to a shelter the next day...the woman had exceeded her dog-limit with her landlord. I called the number and drove through Dallas traffic (!) that evening to pick her up. My daughter (and T-Bone & I and our other doggie) are delighted to have her as part of the family. Hugs to your Buckeye and all the other responsible pet owners and furry children out there!

They disinfect bowling shoes? Really? VP visited our campus (Rome City) frequently during the last year of his life and never once mentioned a fish hook and for that matter never mentioned cancer. He talked about the damage done to his eyes during the filming of the wonder class (thanks waysider) and even passed the eye around so we could admire the handiwork of the thing. No kidding. I remember being surprised it wasn't round...it was just a curved front piece. Perhaps like a codpiece?

Cake, I'm sorry you and so many other way kids suffered at the hands of those who were supposed to lead by loving example. I in no way intend to excuse of defend twi or the abusers...I'd be among the last to defend twi and don't doubt they botched many teachings about child-rearing. That said, part of what I remember being taught (at the limb level in TX then by Cindy B**nad*** at Rome City) about using the spoon/rod of correction made/makes sense to me and went something like this: Never do it out of anger...if you (the parent) first make sure the child knows the rules, (for example, don't touch the knobs on the stove) then he knows what is expected. Then, when the child touches the knob, get up and give a light tap. Same thing...everytime he touches it. When the kid keeps touching it on purpose just to see if you really mean it is exasperating, but the point is supposed to be to show that you (the parent) mean what you say. The goal is/was supposed to be that the child learns to trust and obey God by trusting and obeying the parents. Our closest twi friends had a boy eight months older than our son and I can honestly say they were a great example of how to use the spoon/rod correctly. Unfortunately, they were the exception and not the rule. There always seemed to be parents whacking too hard, too often, too over-the-top. Our son was four when we entered the family corps 11 (1984), was a pretty easy-going kid and managed to make it out of there ok. There was only one incident where an interim-corps staff girl whacked him and left marks on his bottom. My blood still boils when I think about it, so it's probably a good thing I can't remember her name. Probably because of my background, I don't have a problem with corporal punishment. My parents used to whack me and my sister with a flyswatter (minor infractions) or "the board" (a paddle...reserved for more serious stuff). My father's belt was a last resort. My only complaint is that they would wait until they got mad before we would get a spanking, so it really hurt. However, I never felt abused or unloved because they made sure on a daily basis we knew they loved us. Also, my parents were the only ones doling out the punishment. There is no way they would have let anyone else lay a hand on us, not a relative, not a friend, and certainly not the preacher. I can hardly imagine what it must have felt like for the twi kids...everywhere they turned there was someone ready and willing to whack them. One more thing, I've seen households where the kids run all over the parents...not good for anyone involved. There has to be balance or the children will grow up to believe that the world revolves around them. Enough ramblin' from me...slow morning at work. ;) (edited by tonto to add year of family corps)

BNIS, I didn't see the link on stiffy's website either, but you can access v2p2's site directly at sowersonline.com...they have added new pictures since I last looked. The work has begun..whoo-hoo! Golly gee...less than two months 'till the slaves um, trainees arrive! There sure is a lot of competition out there in ex-way world for the dollars of the hard-working believers, eh?

In contact with those who were in the know, WD??? HAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

I finished it over the weekend and yes, it was hard to put down. PurpleDays said what I feel: I confess that during the thirteen years I spent in twi, I was in awe of those who got to be close to "doctor" and was thrilled that he made frequent visits to the Indiana campus during what would be the last year of his life. In fact, I felt like a loser because I didn't get to work the back room while he was alive and only "got to" wash the outside of the motorcoach and only "got to" work with him once (read...a small group of us tore down a shed while he stood around). Snort and double snort! Through the years there were always things that didn't add up but I wouldn't allow myself to "think evil of the man of god". Holy crap...I'm so very thankful I never made it to the inner circle, and I'm so sorry you and all the others got snared in his trap.

Uh...John has had a job for how long? A couple of years maybe? After living off the abs of twi and ces followers for what, more than 30 years, then finally having to earn his own money for a year or two...that means everything is ok now? For me, one of the biggest problems with the offshoots is that they enable their leaders to live off the income of their followers. It's not healthy for the followers and it sure as h e ll isn't healthy for the leaders. It's like giving a recovering alcoholic a job in a liquor store.

Here dooj, allow me: Why? I'll tell you why. :D Maybe, just maybe, he remembered the old ministry campaign to "remember the Way in your will". A significant number of the members of "this group of people now entering retirement years" are/should be making wills and getting their affairs in order. I can't imagine anyone leaving anything to twi, but there are probably those who could be convinced to remember one of the many "other ways" (offshoots) in their wills. Like I said before...trolling for rubes.

Spot-on use of Positively 4th Street, DWBH. I think JAL hopes his letter will act as a sort of "spiritual viagra" by trying to rev up former plaf followers into "doing something" for Gawd in this, our day and time and hour. The mindset that you have to be "doing something" is part of our past cult-think. It usually involves guilting you into opening your mind/heart/wallet/legs to the one encouraging you to "do something". Maybe not at first, but it will. In my NSHO, he's trolling for rubes.