mstar1

Id agree that the Yankees probably need Santana more than the Sox, although of course he would be a huge addition around here and I'd love to have him to watch for a few years at least. Beckett, Santana, Dasuke, Schilling, Lester looks very very tempting. Plus they still have Wakefield who won 18 and Buchholz who threw a no no with electric stuff and Masterson a year or so away.... Thats 8 quality starting pitchers! Holy camolie! Another beauty is that with what they are losing ( Matt Clement, Brendon Donnely, Joel Piniero, Doug Mirrabelli etc,) they could sign Santana without raising their payroll. ........... Its sort of interestiing that the Yanks would go for him to keep him away from the Sox, but that goes with the territory to a certain extent on both sides these days. . I dont honestly remember all that much at the moment how the Yankees built thier teams in the 90's ( and Im too lazy to look it up and refresh my memory right now,)but there seemed to be a steady stream of players coming up from within the system-Williams, Pettitte, Posada, Rivera, Jeter etc..., and shorter more reasonable contracts that they relied on as their 'winning formula'at the time. To me its odd that they changed something that was working and instead started to aggressively pursue the biggest and most expensive names in the 00's. It all looks good on paper, but they have had years of Giambi's, Johnson's, Clemen's etc, that really havent panned out as expected.... I have a funeral--I'lol be gone for a few days------

It probably is their best deal. I like the way it has been played so far from my angle. No matter how it ends there is no big down side for the Red Sox I said a page or two back that I'd hate to give up any of the young guys in Boston, but for a two time Cy it would work for me to give one, which they dont seem to be budging on...Jacoby would be good in alot of ways for the Twins although Id hate to see him go, Lowrie and Masterson are excellent prospects. If they threw Ellsbury in to force the Yankees to pitch in Hughes that also works well. An example of The Winners Curse? If the Yankees do make the trade it will force Johnny Damon back to center which will cost them a little defensively over Cabrera.... Who knows--- there is along way to go yet, Im surprised the Dodgers didnt make a better play for him, he looked like he would be a perfect fit.. ........ HERE is todays very strange historical baseball document that is now up for auction. A Guide to Players regarding Obscene Language from 1898 areal absurdist piece of Major League History

This Santana thing has been like watching a poker game NY added Hughes to the pot Boston added Ellsbury but took out Lester... NY calls---says the Twins have until Monday to decide, or they're not interested (could it be another 'we are not going to sign ARod' bluff?) Santana, drops 27 teams out of the game, says he wont wave his no trade clause except to NY or Boston. Twinkie fans are busy fantasizing about their future lineups-which all look good... the twins played their hand pretty well ----somethings gotta give soon... ....rounding third....here comes the throw......

There are different things about baseball that lure different people. Some people want to be outside on a sunny day, I know others who arent comfortable unless they know the VORP, BABIP. OPS+, win shares and defensive ratings of everyone in the majors. Im somehere in the middle. I enjoy good fan forums as a way to connect with other fans but I hear you honestly most of them are pretty crappy. I had to look around for a long time to find any of quality and value, Im a member HERE? which I think is one of the better ones on the internet and also read THIS ONE, Both of them strive to keep the signal to noise ratio high and the posts intelligent and at least somewhat thought provoking. Those two are pretty solid online communities that have been around quite awhile..that are worth checking out for any baseball fan who wants to read something at least semi thought provoking...I dont know which ones you may have gone to..there are hundreds but a lot of them are junk. I never said the Yankees,or other teams havent built good teams i dont know who would or logically could say anything like that. Lots of organizations have built good teams , there are lessons, lots of lessons, (good and bad) to learn from all of them...successful ones are worth looking at for the patterns in their rise...and also in their downfalls. life is always live and learn or be trapped to endlessly repeat the same mistakes over and over

They've taken the time to build a good organization, a good team, and a very good farm system, which I think is the real key--well --- along with the revenue building things that they have taken the time to build over the last 6 or so years that allows them to do these things well The Free Agent market seems like an incredibly inefficient way to build a team, at least to me, the RS draft and develop players well, which to me at least is exciting knowing that there are fresh young good ballplayers in the pipeline... I doubt anyone is a 'lock'--ever, there are always too many variables in any one season, but I do think that they have worked very hard to position themselves well on alot of fronts for the possibility of winning. Right now its looking good from my vantage point to see good quality baseball for alot of years yet--whether they will win or not--well who knows....... The Yankees of course are always tough and will continue to be especially after they move into their new state of the art place and increase their profits yet more. Everyone who wants to be competitive will have to adapt their own situations yet again, Im pretty sure that the RedSox wont lay down and die but will stay on top of that from a business standpoint. You are probably right as far as the Yankees-RedSox thing, Its always been there. RS/Yanks fans have always known about it. Its who they are, they have a history in it..Im sure there is the same type of thing between the Cubs/Cards , Dodgers/Giants and other teams. Its natural. Its a century old.. FOX has blown it out of proportion to people to whom it is an irrelavancy for the last 5 or 6 years and made a mockery of it totally missing any f the greater inherent qulaities of it.. Maybe they should let it alone, quit trying to excite people in Peoria, Tupelo or Boise and let it be where it belongs between Sox fans and Yankee fans like it always has been and always will be... If other people dont like the rivalry between the two then thats fine, it shouldnt be forced on them. There are p l e n t y of other reasons and things to like about this game plenty.... i dont know about the 'homerism' thing, It can bring out some undesirable qualities in some but most likely they already have those qualities anyway. Just about everybody I meet (who is a baseball fan) is a fan of some team or another, whether its the Indians, Cubs, Pirates, Orioles, Yankees Red Sox. Mudhens or SwampBats. I generally never have any problems with them unless they are mentally unbalanced or drunk which they generally arent...I dont care if Tom likes the Rangers, or Simon likes the Cubs, there is enough common ground where it isnt an issue. Same goes for Yankee fans except there is usually a little more sparring involved. If you are averse to people rooting and caring for the home team, I dont know really what you could do-- id be hard pressed to name a neutral ballpark anywhere in the world

I found this; Maybe I'll go take a trip and look through the microfiche. ...still no word on Santana

I should check into that---Im not far from the place in Pittsfield, MA that outlawed the playing of base-ball within 80 yards of the Meeting House in 1791 because they were breaking too many windows....(the first written record of baseball anywhere). I dont know anything about the why's and wherefores of the law in Worcester, whether if it was for breaking windows, because people were missing work, whether it was some 'morality' act, or some other reason. I do think the origins and growth of the game is icredibly interesting though. Id love to have access to early recordsa and films and watch Tris Speaker field a fly ball, Cobb steal, or Honus Wagner make a play--I wonder if any of that stuff exists anywhere and where on earth you could get access to it...

I dont know what I am getting anyone yet this year Last year I was at an impasse with a friend who had grandchildren. I had no idea what to get her I finally bought her a 250 foot roll of bubble wrap at a packing supply house. She of course gave me a quizzical look but before you go thinking I am totally weird it worked for what I was thinking.... Now, whenever her grandchildren--ages 3 and 4, are visiting and they get bored she covers the floor with bubble wrap and they love to pop it......they dance on it, roll on it and are otherwise very amused, laughing and toying with it for a good long time and usually asking for more...they took to it--I dont know if it works all the time-but it worked for them. It wasnt that expensive about $40.00 Go ahead--Pop a few

We actually did the exact same thing -no Rfer, throw to the pitcher etc...--I stretched my post a little _ I had just read about a fan in 1903 who wanted to do away with the CFer so I wrote it that way...my bad I was reading an article by John Thorn this morning when I stumbled onTHIS TIMELINE that I found interesting on the development of the game and the rules...I dont know if they ever did play withoiut a CF but it does make reference to a D.L. Adams who invented the shortstop position in 1840. and alot ofother little tidbits. an interesting caveat: The 'rivalry' seems to stretch back at least a few hundred years this from 1857- I still favor our game ... ............ heres an engraving from 1843 for a lazy Saturday morning. The foul lines are a little spread out, there are wickets for bases, the pitcher is pitching underhand but it still looks like baseball to me.....

That seemed alittle too predictable so I tried --antichrist of baseball--instead. I got at least 10 different antichrists. Craigs gonna hafta teach a new class! Of course you know who came up first and most frequent then in order Bud Selig second "Barroid" Bonds Jay Johnstone Billy Beane the "Yankmees" (from an A's fan) Roger Clemens The Red Sox Curt Schilling George Steinbrenner that was just the first two pages. The most entertainiing article to me was the one on Jay Johnstone who proposed an independant league that would have a unique scoring innovation, Homeruns by the trailing team in the seventh inning would be worth twice the actual runs...ie a basesloaded homerun would be worth 8 runs...... :unsure: I dont know if his league ever got off the ground or not--I think Ill suggest to him dispensing with center fielders altogether as a way to increase excitement---It worked when I was 8 and not enough kids showed up

Id like to see the salaries come down and there be more parity in the league but it seems like that is going to have to be a long term goal for baseball if they even think along those line. I cant remember all that well, the strike year in the 90's their was a lot of talk of fans leaving the game and not coming back. That wasnt that long ago. MLB responded with a fullfrontal marketing and media blitz which has worked well, especially in the high media market areas like NY, who immediately took advantage of it, the Red Sox jumped on the bandwagon out of necessity and have been able to keep up. I read the figures about a week ago and MLB revenues are actually gigormously increasing every year. I hope the smaller teams that have been left in the lurch adapt their organizational philosophies and structures to go and grab themselves a piece of the pie, because the Yankees (with a new billion dollar state of the art stadium) certainly aren't going to let up, and the Red Sox in order to stay competitive with them really cant either. I think the pieces are out there for most organizations to increase their revenues, if not to mega team status, at least enough to stay mostly competive, but the same old same old business style of the 70's, 80's or 90's just isnt going to work anymore. i have said before how surprised I am that more teams dont cultivate their own TV networks, the investment isnt all that much for the returns it brings For both the Yankees and the Red Sox that is a massive revenue stream--probably equal to as much if not more than they make at the box office. -never mind doing the obvious things like increasing fan interest. Baseball, even though it is basically the same great game, is changing alot, as it always has---the business aspect which I dont care all that much for, but is necessary, is almost as much of a creative 'game' as the game on the field. I'll be hoping that things even out somehow, but the execs are going to have to be gutsy and move out of some comfort zones to do it... ...... Tom was posting as I was writing I love it....

Well of course there are more important things going on in the world. Giuliani did take a huge amount of heat in NY, for coming out for the Red Sox while campaigning in New England. Romney I dont take seriously, he's a poser, he didnt even get the years right--he plays to any crowd he is in. Giuiliani is a Yanks fan , a real one, though. Depends on the fan, I know some Nyers and some Sox fans who wouldn't think of rooting for that other team unless they were facing a team of child molesters and even then it would be questionable... I thought it was odd it was brought up in an election debate, it does show you the (stupid)face of American politics. If Rudy goes further some one will probably bring up that old flip flopper issue that they always seem to drag out every election.. ... according to todays paper the Sox offered Crisp, Lester, and two top prospects for Johan Santana, and will not offer Ellsbury or Buchholz Which is what I said on the last page--glad to hear that they are listening :) Whats next the winter meetings or GM meetings? If i were the Twins, unless some deal was just perfect. I'd probably wait until then and wave Santana around in hopes that someone would overshoot, which they might.....but I think the Red Sox have a good shot at him...unless his financial demands get too extreme-- but who knows--its all just gossip so far....

Im sure we could enjoy a game together, although I may drive you nuts I watched a video today that had newspaper articles referring to the rivalry and animosity between Boston and NY baseball fans that had reached new and unprecedented heights ---and That article was written in 1903. We come from a grand tradition.... I dont know if you saw the presidential debates the other night, with all the stuff happening in the world that needs to be straightened out ---wars, poverty, famine, disease Giuliani got called on the carpet with this huge final question... the climax... of the debate---deciding who will soon run the world...

You're lucky --Vin IS baseball, I have listened to some guys that are appallingly bad and borderline crass, not only IS Scully baseball but he exudes genuine class and dignity that the game still (and will always) need.

O yea , they are definitely there. Its tough to pin down a pattern of who is who, most that Ive seen, that are genuinely gifted (and I dont mean that in some hokey sense).... spend alot more time just doing the right thing as a natural course of their life than talking about it or worse yet dictating to you how to better your life.. and Ive found for the most part they are very unassuming, down to earth, and easily approachable with very few or no airs about them. You may never know--until you take the time to observe They may have areal Doctor's degree somewhere, an ordination (or not), maybe they are uneducated (they come in all flavors) and way off the beaten track but Ive yet to run into anyone who was the real deal who was worried or concerned about their title or somehow wanted to elevate their status above you. I'll think about it more--its hard to describe--they could be anywhere in any walk of life...

How long has he been at it? Ive heard him tell stories of announcing way back in Ebbets Field... I know for me, since my very early days, that he is so connected to the thought of baseball to me, that all I have to do is hear him utter one word in that voice, and no matter what he says my mind immediately goes toa long summer night...

amen to that. I hope he goes for a long way yet.. there is something wonderful about his rhythms, cadence easy delivery and sonority (is that even a word?) of his voice that makes listening to him always a pleasantt and enjoyable experience.. I wouldnt say that about many, if any, other announcers--even the ones I like-- He is in a class by himself. Happy Birthday...

Ive been thinking more on the license. After considering Artistic license, poetic license and dramatic license, which are colloquial terms used to denote the distortion and/ or complete ignorance of reality I think I may be a little closer to understanding just what constitues a 'Licensed' prophet. I spose as hammeroni said you have to be schooled in this, it cant come natural to become such a certifiable wackjob all on your own. To me theyare like some weird sideshow act at a circus that is mildly humorous because of its complete absurdity Its sort of unfathomable to me How on earth they get anybody to actually believe them, let alone send them money

Im not sure how many votes they get, or if they just vote for everyone who they deem worthy. I think it could be Rice and Gossage's big chance, There's not anyone that jumps out and screams he has gotta be in, like there is in most years.. I go back and forth with my thinking about the Hall, Rice had some good/ great years for his time --so did Gossage. Some of the others did too (Raines, Dawson Trammell, Murphy...)but I was in some frikkin cult during their time and lost my grip on following things except from an extreme distance... Does a few good/great years and a solid career make for the Hall of Fame? Im really not sure. Koufax didnt play long but he absolutely dominated and absolutely belongs, I expect that Pedro Martinez will be in similarly someday.. Some guys like Blyleven and Tommy John ( who I both like) almost could get in on longevity alone. they both won alot of games but werent much better than .500 pitchers....do they get rewarded for that? Its not the Hall Of Really Good, nor imo should it come to that. I guess these are things every voter has to figure out. I dont know--but when I start seeing names like Shawon Dunston and Brady Anderson on the list , I think that maybe its time to elect no one for a few years and rethink the whole process before Cooperstown starts to get too overcrowded and it becomes the Hall of The Above Average

This from Socks' link I know where to get a dog license, a drivers license, a contractors license, a massage therapists license, an electricians license and all sorts of other licenses but what state or city grants anyone a prophets license?

Gees you should have waved, I know those Kent Falls well, Im only about 30 minutes up Rt 7 from there...Its nice country that grabbed me --well about 8 years ago I guess--I just said screw it and moved here. Its all worked out well --somehow---anyway Whos goin in the Hall this year? it seems like thin class this year... HERE"S the list... The game is March 29th---I have to wonder if Wally Moon with throw out the first pitch...

Thats sort of the rules, I may even go down to a game there myself. Just do it Its still inconceivable to me that they are tearing it down and maybe even more inconceivable that MLB has the Yanks ending the season on the road---I just dont get it--- or maybe I should say --they dont get it. Its not right. Good to hear you had a good time in CT, we're not all aholes in New England :) (some of us like me give it some serious effort from time to time though ) I live in a cusp town on the Ny border that is split about 60-40 toward the Sox, but I've even run into some Dodger fans just this week--of course they are still ....ed that they left Brooklyn...some great stories about Ebbets though... have you heard The Sox and Dodgers are going to play some exhibition games in the Coliseum in March? Im wondering if they are going to set it up the old way with the screen about 250 to left with RF about 600 or 2 miles or whatever the heck it was--- Steinberg will play that to the hilt....

Yea I know that it would make sense, i told you my reasons above are totally selfish When Ellsbury came up last year and He and Pedroia were batting one two, and I thought of them doing that for years together in front of Ortiz and Ramirez the world seemed just alittle too perfect. The same thing with Buchholz, especially after his no hitter. He has absolutely brutal breaking stuff that Id love to watch up close. I know how young players go, there is always an exciting one that never quite pans out the way that you hoped but on the other hand the RedSox traded away a young Jeff Bagwell and a young Curt Schilling too. Its a tough call but probably the right one. Its sort of nice being in the catbirds seat for once and realizing that the Sox will be a really good team no matter which way they go on this.

Welcome back Hiway.. Hope that your trip was good . Did you make it out to the Stadium? Well I suppose he did his job, Ive told you all about a jillion times that there hasnt been an empty seat in Fenway for about 5 years now, he pulled in the casual fan and helped raised the revenues which helped make the team what it is and blah blah blah, but there isnt a moment in the game anymore where something isnt happening which annoys me I remember and I know you remember that beautiful sound in a ballpark between action moments--Someone more poetic than I can describe it better, but it was a wonderful buzz of fans talking, vendors hawking, maybe a breeze, probably the radio broadcast heard dimly in the background somewhere, etc. It is almost all drowned out now that marketing madness has captured MLB. Its too bad. Hopefully it will be a phase that someday the worst of it will pass. Now that he is gone,Im hoping that these two will now hit the unemployment line or maybe be consumed by flames.

I have very mixed emotions about Santana. One the one hand , who wouldnt want to watch him pitch , hopefully in his prime years? I had the great fortune of watching Pedro Martinez during his years and it was unforgetable. However, I know that the Twins are going to want the best of the young players that anyone has, or at least that would be my best guess. I have already gotten very attached to the idea of watching Jacoby Ellsbury, Clay Buchholz and Jon Lester develop and be good if not great players over the next several years. I would hate to lose that. Minnesota would probably want all of them. I dont know if it makes financial good sense either. Bucholz/Lester could win 15+ games between them next year and make total combined salaries of about $700,000, if as the article says Santana wants $25m, are those extra 4 or 5 wins really worth 24million? ..but then again imagine a pitching staff of Santana, Beckett, DiceK, Schilling and you could have one of the most dominant starting rotations in recent memory.... I dont know---to me Ellsbury and Buchholz are nearly untouchable, I dont want to see them go at all, I see too much future that I selfishly want to watch in those kids.. The Twins need a CF now with Hunter gone, , Coco and as much as I like hm Lester and maybe some other minor league talent that I havent got to attached to yet (Brandon Moss and/or Jed Lowrie0 would be all I'd offer right now. As much as it would be an amazing acquisition for the Red Sox if it happens, in a way I'd almost rather see the Yankees trade away their future (Hughes, Chamberlain and Kennedy)on him. It would seem to fit into their strategy of the last several years of going for the biggest name, highest priced players, which never has quite puts the whole package together for them. They seem to have forgotten that they won with mostly young and for the large part unproven guys in the 90's many of who came up through their system.. Who knows--its all conjecture.....He's .probably gonna end up on the Angels anyway....