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outandabout

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Everything posted by outandabout

  1. d miller, oh, sorry, was it 900 miles? Does that mean you went 900 miles to go to the auditorium but because your area was thre at a different time they wouldn't let you in?
  2. Well, I guess the first one would apply then regarding those times. :)-->
  3. How totally shallow that they wouldn't let you in! How legalistic! And how far did you travel to go there? Like there wasn't a seat for you?? No room in the big huge building paid for the believers??? Remember when they used to say HQ belonged to us? HA HA HA HA Yeah, sure it did. And when you got off the WOW field you were coming "HOME?" Home? yeah, sure, like I'm going to stay in my tent here for the rest of the year because I'm "home." Just try it. (Might get kind of cold when winter comes). I guess they're reaping what they've sowed. A big fat building with no one to put in it. "Here's the church, here's the steeple, open it up, where're all the people!!"
  4. Doesn't apply to me right now, because, as you can see, I'm posting. :D--> I'll look at the results, though. I will say that there are periods where I drop in and don't add much to anything because I just don't have much to say at that particular time.
  5. I probably would know you, then. I corresponded with Johanna a while ago, but her address changed. She's was a great lady. I'll always remember her.
  6. Well, they always told us there's no "free lunch." It might be "easier" to get paid by TWI by being at HQ, or full time on the field, but in the long run, there's a price to pay. Few marketable job skills, no retirement savings, having to jump at the commands of those above you..... All of these have been covered here before. I confess, I used to dream of how great it would be to be one of the "higher-ups" but I was "unfortunate" enough to always be cast out into the world to fend for myself. Now I look at it as a total blessing. Every struggle I had to go through to learn how to survive in "the world' only made me stronger. The people "on the field" have to learn how to trust God to get their needs met, as well as gain people skills and job skills along the way. The top of TWI glean off of those who are actually producing and sending in the fruits of their labor. When these producers see the light, they can split out and they'll be ok. They have nothing to lose. They gain their freedom and they can now take back 10% to 20% of their income! People that have been surviving off the ABS of those "on the field" have more of an adjustment to make once they break free from TWI.
  7. Un friggin believable. I'd move too to get away from that.
  8. Yeah, I never would have thought that, either, that that place would end up with almost nobody in it. How pathetic. There was really a 250 mile radius? For what? You HAD to go? How often? What if you didn't. How pathetic.
  9. Yeah, so we heard. Interesting, hmmmm? A la, Say hi to hubby! Hope we meet too someday. :)-->
  10. Off we went to the Infamous Corps Week of 1986. The first night we were there, Johnny Townsend was on the stage and he said, “You’re all probably wondering ‘What’s going on?’” I thought to myself “Huh?” I had no idea what he was talking about. There had evidently been corps meetings all over the country about the current state of the ministry since C Geer had written The Passing of the Patriarch. Its message had affected LCM deeply and had reverberated through HQ and the rest of TWI leadership. Some of this stuff had been discussed at these meetings BUT Orlando and I had been on our honeymoon when the corps in San Diego had met. Cliff had evidently overlooked updating us on what we had missed. Well, it’s TWI history what happened that Corps Week. The culmination was the dramatic appearance of C Geer, who read “The Passing of the Patriarch” out loud to the entire corps there. I remember wandering around one night, along with everyone else, in shock from seeing TWI start to fall apart. There was some unannounced pizza put out in a tent, and people were just grabbing pieces, and it was all so weird. I think I got more of an idea of what was going on by conversations I had here and there with people. That was very cathartic. People were actually TALKING about something with an honesty that I hadn’t seen in a long time. I thought at the time that this was all going to be good for TWI in the long run. I still believed in TWI but I had no clue about the depth of ungodliness, corruption and sexual immorality at the top. I thought that all this would “clear the air” and things would get better. Corps Week ended and ROA began. I woke up and heard the voice from the loudspeaker welcoming everybody to the Rock, and for some reason it really ....ed me off. It seemed so hypocritical. We were just going to go on with the ROA like nothing had happened. So ROA went on. I had trash detail like I’d had for years, and I rode around on the back of the tractor, jumping on and off collecting trash and replacing trash bags. It’s funny, but I don’t have a lot of clear memories of it all. I just know that that Corps Week was the beginning of the end for me in TWI. To me, it was the perfect opportunity for people to stop the bull$h1t, take an honest look at wrong, and fight for “The Ministry.” But it didn’t happen. I was starting to get it that maybe TWI, “God’s Ministry,” was screwed up. We went home. I found a clerical job as a temp at a company not far from home. Again I got hired permanently, and I was pretty happy there. My boss was a nice guy. We were running a little twig. A married couple and a guy named John attended regularly. But I was just going through the motions, coming home from work, dusting and vacuuming etc on the nights we had twig. And then there were twig coordinators’ meetings on Sundays. I remember being at work one day, when I realized that it was a non-twig day, and the incredible sense of relief I felt. Over a year went by....We didn’t make it to Corps Week and ROA ’87. Somewhere during all of this Papp decided that he wanted to have a San Diego Way Productions group. So he put together what became to be called the “Travellites.” Here we are practicing: Even being in a band wasn’t much fun. Those guys were good musicians but we just didn’t jell. One night we were supposed to play in Escondido up north but no one had thought to get directions. We did get there eventually, but Papp wasn’t too pleased. After awhile we were disbanded. Later on I was in another group with one of the Travellite guys, “Mock Tireknees,” and “Steve Stripp.” This one was more enjoyable because I liked singing and they were good together on their guitars. We did a jazzed-up version of Lisa Locheridge Tracy’s “Man of Galilee” and that was fun. But that one disbanded too though I don’t remember why. One Sunday, after the twig leaders’ meeting, Cliff mentioned that there was this 30-page letter that four leaders who were now out of TWI had written to the Trustees. Then Cliff surprised me by saying that he had copies if anybody wanted to read it. I was a little shocked by that, since in my Way Brain I still believed that anyone outside of the Walls of Zion had to be in the realm of the Devil, so I was too afraid to take go near that letter. Then word went out that Ralph Dubofsky was coming to town. He was evidently on the outs of TWI at that point as well. This was getting confusing to me, because some of the teachers and leaders I had thought the most of were getting fired or leaving. Ralph was one of the best teachers of the Word I had ever heard. When he taught us Romans in the corps, it was incredible. At a corps meeting, Papp read scriptures about “tailbearers” out of Proverbs, which was his indirect way of saying “Don’t go see Ralph Dubofsky.” So I didn’t. Then one day the phone rang, and it was Papp telling me that Cliff and Johanna weren’t our branch leaders anymore! They had left TWI and now Papp was our branch leader. I just told him OK, and agreed with everything he said, even though I was in shock. I can’t say how I eventually decided one day to go to Cliff’s house where he was now having an “Ex-Twi” fellowship, but I did. On the way, I was afraid that I would have an accident or something because I was daring to walk out from the safety of God’s Ministry. When I got there, there were people that I knew from TWI and they all seemed so happy. They didn’t seem guilty or like they were “walking in darkness”. I was starting to feel like Alice walking through the Looking Glass. At this point, I had an intense mental hunger to find out EVERYTHING that I had been forbidden to know. Cliff had copies of John Schoenheit’s paper on adultery, the “30 page letter”, Passing of the Patriarch and a 3-hour tape by John Lynn. I asked to borrow the tape and Cliff gave me copies of the rest. After the fellowhip, we all went out to breakfast. My former roommate, Cripp was there, and this couple that had been country coordinators in Japan. I couldn’t believe I was sitting there with all these “defectors". I was sharing things with a woman sitting next to me, who had already been out of TWI for awhile, and she said, "Oh you'll be SO happy once you leave!" If some one had said that to me a few months earlier, I would have thought they were from the pit. Later, I read the infamous “Adultery Paper” and didn’t see anything scandalous about it that I could tell. It just seemed like a good piece of biblical research confirming a truth in the Word that I already believed to be true anyway. More telling to me was the overreaction it had generated among some of the top leadership. The 30-page letter was a little too long-winded for me. There was nothing particularly shocking about that either. I know there had been a lot of talk after Corps Week '86 about how the “Trustees haven’t repented of their broken fellowhip" but since no one was being specific about what that was, I never got what people were talking about. OK, so then I started to listen to JAL’s 3-hour tape. I found it fascinating. I can’t describe what was going on in my head. I was starting to actually think my own thoughts. But I had to go to work, so I couldn’t listen to all of it, but as soon as I was off, I listened to the rest. Orlando didn’t quite understand what I was going through. He had never been all that gung-ho about TWI anyway, and he hadn’t been as indoctrinated as me, so it wasn’t as dramatic to him that we were in the process of actually leaving. For me, it was like finding out that black was white, the sky was the earth, what is ok isn’t, what I thought wasn’t ok really is... For every new “anti-TWI” thought I had, I would have an opposite thought pop up from what I’d been taught in TWI. Sometimes it was in the form of something Craig had been yelling about. I even put a line down the middle of a piece of paper and wrote down the conflicting thoughts as they went back and forth. (one side “Me,” the other side “The Way”) Then I got hold of a tape of Ralph’s meeting when he had come to San Diego, (the “forbidden” meeting with the “talebearer”). He had done a critique of Athletes of the Spirit while he was running the video. I put the audio tape of the meeting in the tape player and popped our copy of Athletes of the Spirit in our Beta video player and sat in our living room listening to Ralph’s critique while watching our AOS video. My Way Brain was getting blown away even more. Here I was, seven months pregnant and going through this turmoil, but it was a good turmoil, a process of liberation. One of my greatest realizations was that I would no longer have to be in bondage to my lifelong “commitment” to being Corps, which had been a source of misery since I'd graduated. I was starting to get it. God was God. The Word was the Word. And TWI wasn’t God, or His Word. Therefore, if I walked away from TWI, I wasn’t walking away from God or the Word! I had become friends with the other woman in our twig, and she also worked where I worked. I tried to express to her everything I was going through, but I could tell she wanted to keep her distance. And then in the middle of all this, John Lynn came to town. So I went to the meeting and there he was saying these mind-boggling things, like, TWI was “being run by devil spirits” and there were people “six feet under” because of TWI. And it was “a biblical research ministry no more.” Later we all met in Cliff’s living room and John answered actual questions like, where were certain people and who was still in and who wasn’t. Soon after that, I was sitting at lunch with some co-workers and I mentioned that there was this Biblical group that I used to be in. I knew right then that I was already out of TWI in my head. The trick was to actually get away from it. I sat on our bed and composed at letter to Papp. I said to Orlando, "This is our ticket out!! I’ll mail this to Papp and officially quit!!” He still didn’t get what I was so emotional about. So I wrote the letter and in it I said there were two main reasons why I had chosen to leave TWI. I had thought through the ABS thing, and come to the conclusion that it had been dishonest to say that the Old Testament applied to the New. I had also realized that TWI was a hierarchy but they were claiming to be a tree. Sexual immorality wasn’t the issue with me, because I had always been blissfully ignorant of that situation. At the end of the letter I said I was thankful for the Word I had learned from TWI, and do not call us. Orlando and I went to make some copies of my letter on a copier at a grocery store, and I put the original in a stamped addressed envelope to Papp. Orlando drove by a mail box and I dropped it in. I was still scared inside, but at the exact moment I dropped that letter in the mailbox, I FELT a weight lift off of me. It was more than psychological, it was like a physical weight just took off and I immediately felt lighter and freer. I unplugged the phone because I didn’t want to deal with any confrontations. I still had a few moments of fear and regret, but when I thought it through, they passed. A few days later I reconnected our phone. Nobody from TWI called. And we were out.
  11. :)-->OK, here's the rest of the story: :)--> Orlando did ask me to marry him and I did accept. We went back to Cliff to tell him the good news, and lo and behold, he was suddenly all down on the whole thing. He was being very cold and mean. It was very weird. Cliff said things like, “What will you do if you get into your sunset years and he no longer wants you because you’re so old?” Huh? Why the change? Well, at that point, our BL was no longer Bopp Heartfelt because he and his wife had gone into the Corpse. Now “Papp Potwell” had come in as Area Leader. Years later, after we had left TWI, I was told by another ex-Wayfer that Papp had wanted our ensuing marriage stopped. I had never known that at the time. But it explains the sudden change in Cliff’s attitude. (that is Cliff went to Pat, Pat got to Cliff etc etc - you know how these things went) Nevertheless, Cliff eventually gave us his blessing by the time our little meeting was over. I guess we just had to get raked over the coals first. Meanwhile at work I was with the Boss from Hell who didn't think people should ever make errors. I was under a lot of stress because one day I did make an error that I couldn't correct, got busted for it and sent to the next in-line supervisor. It all worked out okay but the stress was awful. Orlando gave me a teddy bear that day. By that time, we were engaged and I was also planning our wedding, which was to take place in June. When Valentine’s Day came along, I had so much stuff at my desk from Orlando Boss from Hell said it “looked like a gift shop.” We attended a limb meeting during this period, and they were showing the “Athletes of the Spirit” video on this huge screen while we were all milling about. Orlando asked me what Craig was doing up there dancing but I figured that in time he would understand more fully the greatness of it all. We got married in a nice Way Wedding at a gazebo at a hotel, with a reception inside. Cliff and Johanna were best man and maid of honor. Papp Potwell did the ceremony, and taught from the Word about how the wife is to be in subjection to the husband, etc. My brother-in-law (non-TWI) said, “Wow, I like that, the man really gets a good deal!” Here we are on our wedding day: (Outintexas in front row) Meanwhile, I had QUIT my job at the bank and had enough to live on for the summer. Orlando and I had moved into a one-bedroom apartment. It was in the same complex that he had been living in with his two sisters when I first met him. We ended up staying at that complex for 16 years. It had a courtyard, a pool, lots of trees and we liked it there. It became home. We went to San Francisco for our honeymoon. One of the most fun things we did was wine tasting: And we saw Alcatraz: We returned home to open our wedding gifts and start our new life. I was happy to have a home that was mine and not a way home or a WOW assignment. August arrived and it was time to go to Corps Week and ROA!!
  12. I'm not going to argue about John Lynn. Like I said, I like him, and gee he's not perfect. I don't know what's going on in his personal life. So he got divorced. So? Anyway, I don't want to argue about it. I don't want to say any more than that.
  13. Yeah, outintexas used to make hilarious "home" movies, with the help of younger brother. texas, I hope you still have those! Did you get them transferred to video. I'm in some of them. In one of them we were on our trip in the motorhome before ROA '76 and going WOW. I was pretending to sit on a cactus but I actually did! Some of them had our mom's cats in them. oh yeah, and wasn't there one where you and brother and friends are moving around on just your butts? (done with stop-action)
  14. He's an old fuddy duddy. I never grew up.
  15. You had to be a master at organization to shower at ROA, in my opinion. "Now, do I have my shampoo, my soap, my towel, my clean underware." Then you wait in line, until you get waved in by the Corps person who has the "Showers" job. Then you find your place after laying down all your possessions in a spot you hope you can find later, surrounded by everyone else's stuff. Take your sulfer shower, dry off and paw through your pile of stuff for your underware, get redressed, and make sure you're taking everything back with you. On your way back to your tent your feet immediately get covered with dust and/or mud. After ROA, the showers would be FULL of stuff left behind. Shampoos, soap, towels, underware etc. I think I recall that it would all go into the lost and found and later to Acts Fifth Ave.
  16. But as for CES and their name change, I thought that was really weird. I just didn't get the point. Now they have two names? If it was MG who pushed it through for his own reasons, well maybe that explains it. Last time I read the latest thing from them, my thought was "They're getting way too organized." Just my thought.
  17. I've always liked John. He was indirectly very instrumental in helping to pave my way out of the bondage that was TWI. He would come around to our area yearly on his itinerary and I would always go to see him. If he's got some stuff going on his personal life that he's dealing with, I just wish the best for him.
  18. Yeah, there was some broo ha ha about that scene that I had heard before I saw the movie, but it does fit. I didn't have a problem with it.
  19. If you followed the Scott Peterson case, or even if you didn't, this is a pretty good book. It's not very long. I read it in a day, but it held my interest all the way to the end. Of course the media never made it known how much Amber Frey loves God. Scott Peterson bumped into the wrong woman before he bumped off his wife. My friend lent me this book. It was a lot better than I expected.
  20. I remember you mentioned that to me, that period of "going to the beach." You jokingly said that was when you were "tripped out." You and youngest brother would sleep in, watch Twilight Zone and then go to the beach. I was so totally envious that you had had such a lovely little iterlude.
  21. I remember Jimmy Dopp. I didnt know him personally but in the 'early' TWI, he was a well-known person. I think he's mentioned in "The Way Living in Love."
  22. One time a friend of mine borrowed my towel and when she came back out, she returned the wrong friggin towel. I considered going back in there but Good Heavens but how can you, waiting in line forever, and then it would be like looking for the proverbial needle in a haystack. The towel she left in there matched my other towels and now I had this mismatched one. Wonder what happened to the poor person whose towel she took. And I wonder where my towel went.
  23. The sulfer water. I forgot about that. Oooh I can almost smell it now.
  24. That's sort of the case with us too.
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