HCW

Of course VPW saw the conflict & potential clash of egos between LCM/CG. It was inevitable. However, the BIGGEST problem I saw w/POP was that the indiscretions, the allegations against LCM & the trustees were NOT handled according to the Bible. The biggest thing I got from POP was that there were malcontents on the staff @ HQ who were trying to "do it right." I felt I was one of the "malcontents." Here we malcontents were "fighting for the Word" at HQ and CG comes riding in on his high horse saying they are doing S#$t but I'm not gonna tell you what it is. I left the WOW Auditorium that night thinking something like. "That was Chris being Chris." I was ....ed because I felt that if he was gonna tell us OF the crap he should have brought two or three witnesses who would tell us THE CRAP, itself. I felt CG's neglect to tell us WHAT they (the BOT) did was a power play on his part; ....ed me right off. I felt the BOT's response seemed somehow rehearsed. (If they had never heard of it before HOW could the say "It's all true?" I felt a more honest response would be something like, "We'll consider this and make a formal response by such and such a date." To this day I have not listened to an entire tape from his ministry. Had no desire to go to Gartmore, my desire was to run to GOD-more. (Hey, that one just fell out of the sky... .) At Corps week a year later when CG said the BOT was trying to kill such and such a person. I felt decorum demanded that person X should have said, "THEY tried to kill ME, in this way." Then have the law haul their asses away in handcuffs. Attempted murder is still a crime, isn't it? History teaches us POWER CORRUPTS; and ABSOLUTE POWER corrupts ABSOLUTELY. We, the rank & file human beings, most times interpret that to say... "Power corrupts SOME people, SOME of the time and absolute power ABSOLUTELY HAS corrupted some people ABSOLUTELY." BIG difference. The division between "them & us" seems to be an eternal thread on the tapestry of society since society began. Them, the "leadership" & us the people; or rank & file. We, the PEOPLE neglect to acknowledge the absolute simplicity of ... POWER CORRUPTS. It is the NATURE of power to corrupt human beings. Power corrupts EVERYONE, all of the time. The more power one has, the closer they come to the ABSOLUTE CORRUPTION that absolute power absolutely brings to any ONE who absolutely has ALL of the power. We sit here and eloquently tap out the tidings of three "power"-full people. (Yeah they were "full of it" all right [saved you the trouble ]!!!!!) No one would argue, as it seems indisputable, that there is corruption in that camp. Corruption directly related to that whole "quest for power" thing. My take on the whole thing is "...the love of money is the ROOT of ALL evil." When all the "schick" hit the fan TWI was a $22 million per year corporation where one could, many times, get an executive or higher level position with few to none of the professional requirements as part of their actual resume. Even the lower level positions were coveted. Regardless of your feelings about CG or POP the document had, as Linda Z wrote, some relevance. There were, as POP says "little kingdoms" all over HQ & around the country. Little kingdoms where "Power Corrupts." There were those who wanted it all or at least their pieces of it; a kingdom. The power struggle for TWI started way back in the sixties when they began seeing the fruit of some type of success. We've heard the stories, VPW's "coup," etc. There is value to posting here, but I'm concerned about some of what I read. Not for whatever legacy VPW, et al. may have left but my concern is for you, me & US today. Last night, somebody asked me something to the effect of what I thought of people's axe grinding here on GS. I felt like posting my answer here: "I think that some people with some legitimate gripes take them way too far." Regardless of what you or I may feel of LCM, VPW or CG, they are or were what they are/were. Biblically speaking, looking back on past wrongs has little value outside of providing "patience and comfort" leading to "hope." Endless axe grinding, arguably, and grudge carrying, certainly, grinds THE GRINDER and burdens with the weight of the grudge, THE CARRIER. As we examine any of 'them' we must additionally examine ourselves. Again the Bible warns that "you who pass judgement on someone else.. at whatever point you judge the other you are condemning YOURSELF, because you who pass judgement do the same things." What? Who ME? No, not I. My concern is that I think I MAY be seeing some who are condemning themselves by their view of past actions of others. Oh. I didn't do THAT, a person may say; and so easily dismiss GOD's truth from their lives. Such dismissal itself is sin in and of itself. Sin is sin is sin, although some actions carry longer term and even much greater consequences than others. "Victimless" sin is sin against self. One thing I learned from my first divorce (you'da though I learned enough! -->) when I was rightfully indignant about my wife's OBVIOUS indisputable crimes against me. I hated and felt justified, and anyone who knew of said crimes was equally indignant and full of dislike for both her and the things she did to me. The one thing I eventually, finally, learned hit me when, after years of sucessfully distancing myself from the events and subsequent pain AND even most of the consequences, somebody asked me, "Do you think you'll marry again?" The thing that hit me actually had little to do with my answer to the question. What hit me was that I didn't immediately say, "Yes, of course I will." Period. Huh? What hit me then was this: I hadn't reached a gut level, life or death, level one honesty place with myself yet. Especially so as it pertained to that particular subject. I was stuck on the legitimate hatred that resulted in the unanimous "GUILTY" verdict against my now X-wife. She hurt me; and it HURT. My further, deeper, wider self exam revealed this concept that is now on the foundational forefront of how I conduct my life. Seeing as it was SHE who hurt me and she was so obviously responsible for that, AND I was relatively guilt free... AND I honestly felt hatred, legitimately, towards her for what SHE had done.... IF I really hated what she had done, and even if I hated HER.... I WAS NOT BEING TOTALLY HONEST - - WITH MYSELF. What? How could what SHE did, and my HONEST acknowledgement of it cause ME to lack honesty? Easy. It was because I had allowed what SHE did to CHANGE ME. Where's the lack of honesty? Easy. I was married to her, honestly, and in all simplicity; because I WANTED TO BE MARRIED. I had allowed the pain I legitimately felt behind her crimes against me to CHANGE ME. I had, at times in my youth, dreamed of being married; a fine husband and father, I WANTED to be. Now, "Well at least I have a beautiful daughter." pacified me in regards to my desire to be married again. Although I feel the pains of failure in the relationship; AND in hindsight, I probably should not have married her mother, my daughter and my joy that she is too me was so BRIGHT in my life that the resplendent glare had blinded me to cracks of darkness I was nurturing in my character. I had hated to "lose" in the divorce. NO. She is now GONE from my life. Determined was I to pick up the pieces and move on.... After all living well is the best revenge, right? BUT. In its simplest form, my 'new' principle is called, figuratively ;)-->. "If I really hate the bitch, why am I allowing HER to cause ME to give up one of MY life's dreams???" Tell me why; before I met her I wanted to be married, now that I'm away from "the bitch" I don't???? Why am I considering that I might NOT want something I obviously wanted before HER. IF I NEVER GET MARRIED again........ SHE WINS. Her hatred would banish me "forever" to the world of unwedded bliss. At first I rejected that notion because the divorce, in my mind was, piously, not about 'winning.' Honestly, the ONLY reason I changed, even to doubt, wonder or THINK about if I ever wanted to be married AGAIN was because of what SHE did. I had picked up the hatred SHE owned and ALLOWED her hatred to burn away pieces and parts of my life. I felt that the only honest conclusion I could come up with at that point was, if asked my answer should be, "YES. Of course I would like to be married again." Why? The fact that I WAS married, honestly, declares that I DID want to be married. MY choice is whether or not I would let failure and someone else's hatred steal, kill, and destroy the desire I honestly owned. Secondarily. For as long as I wasn't married the X had an arguable claim that SHE was the cause. I'm concerned that WE here on GS DON'T do that. Don't let whatever hatred that was VPW, is LCM and CG to burn away any part of YOUR life. Put it down. Douse the hatred with the warm waters of the Spirit that is God; the eternal fountain of LIVING waters. BE SURE, as sure as sure can be that you are not "...condemning thyself...." I'm absolutely not a Wierwille worshipper, didn't really care much, for LCM, OR his "teachings;" never said hardly more than a casual greeting in passing to CG. My TWI experience was not all wine & roses. In fact, it almost killed me, as in DEAD, twice. Not to mention the effects of long term stress in dealing w/"wayhead." This "new principle" of mine has allowed me to honestly look at the past, prove ALL things and hold fast to the good. Their hatred, to me now, is nothing more than ashes and charred remains. Since their hatred longer effects me, I can walk through the ashes of the burnt out relationship w/TWI and pick up whatever pieces of it had enough value to survive the fire. I understand that part of what goes on on GS is supplying the "fire" to prove all things concerning relationship w/TWI. I also understand how & why some believe TWI was far from "ministry." What I DON'T fully understand is why some so vehemently seem to desire that all of us "throw away the baby with the bathwater." I know firsthand as many others do, just how BAD TWI was/is. Being truly healed, truly free, really ALL THE WAY out, to me at least, allows me to retain whatever quality I was exposed to in TWI. Even if some of that quality was modeled in the three guys on the focus in this thread. "Don't hate me cause I'm beautiful." OR. "Don't slap me. 'cause I'm not in the mood." Whichever works!

And... One more thing... You know George; Its really hard to argue against that point considering.... Y'all heard about the L.E.A.D accident? I've wondered for years what news hit the field concerning it. I was riding shotgun when it happened. For those who'd like to know, feel free to ask. Anyways.... My dear friend Rochelle Wajnb#%& was hit in the head w/ a piece of debris that sheared, I'd guess, about 30-40% of the skin from her skull. Although it was reattached and her hair eventually grew back, she was never quite the same after that. TWI paid for some, I repeat, only, some of our medical bills. Later that same year they NAZI'ed Rochelle out of the 11th Corps.... The ol' "you're not ready to graduate as Corps" WE have decided YOU will go LOA crap. Within 24hrs of her leaving the campus, she was found dead in an Emporia motel... suicide. How did they keep it out of the news? They DIDN'T TELL anybody. Not stuff like that. How many of us 11th knew about Rochelle? I found out directly from Don W. when I went to see him at the Trustee Apartment. My good friend January answered to door. (Thanks honey, you saved my life that night by doing that. I was just about to turn and walk away the moment before the door opened.) I went to see Donnie because I felt I was being unfairly "NAZI'ed" out of the Corps. I told him, honestly and sincerely that I felt strongly in my heart like "things are closing in on me" and if I left the campus then, something would happen and I'd be killed. Plus. How could I NOT BE READY, after 3 more years of "training" go BACK to a job I'd already excelled in withOUT the "training.????" He told me to sit down, January brought me something warm to drink and, he said sadly, "I believe you son." He sighed a deep long sigh then said, "I need to tell you about your friend Rochelle...." I spilled my drink.

I also realize you guys have probably had the "purging waySpeak" conversation before... some things bear repeating. There. a short one. The new guy's learning.

Gee. I hate these long posts. Hey andrea! It took quite a while...years. I felt like I should completely purge "wayspeak" from my vocabulary. For as much as I felt I was "immune" or not under the spell, or levelheaded and "clear-eyed," I had to come to grips with the reality that the terminology, expressions and the like was part of the control mechanism. I found that using the terms had an "intoxicating" effect on me - - once I stopped using them. I had developed a duality. A "Way" (innie) personality and an outie personality that I used when communicating to professionals and family members who, as I thought at the time, "just dodn't get the lingo." It is the LINGO that brainwashed us ALL. At least to some degree. For example: I just wrote, "...at least to some degree." WAYSPEAK for the same phrase would be something like.... "We were all brainwashed to the extent and in the proportion that we used wayspeak in our daily habit of language pattern." I have actually used more wayspeak here on GS on the past two weeks than I have in the past 17yrs combined. Each time I do use a term or expression it has been under great "mental guard" with my new set of precautions each placing "the red dot" on it prepared to fire at will should the expression take ONE step towards controlling me again. Huh? Hey HC? I though you present yourself as one of the "good ones?" One of the right fighters who stood against the tyranny that was/is TWI. I do. Guilty as charged. I've just grown and been healed enough to recognize precisely where I was, precisely what my culpability was or was NOT in the tyranny. That being said, I MUST acknowledge that there WAS a level of brainwashing I was under the influence of. There was a level of INSANITY that I held onto "with all my heart, soul, mind and strength." I was crazy. Even if only a little. Crazy is CRAZY. How many average Joe's would continue to live with a roomate who though you were gonna KILL him. How many would stop working so as to prove you didn't have money to pay RENT in order to "motivate" your "WOW Brothers" to "do the WOW Program." Huh???? There were "Way things" I did that I would never tell my older brother about while I was in. "Way things" I would never say while I talked to him. Why???? I knew he would tell me I was crazy to even CONSIDER doing it. I knew HE knew I was raised better. I KNEW that HE KNEW .... that I KNEW ... BETTER. But. I did it anyway. AND I hid it from him and anyone else who certainly would have gotten in my face about it in any WAY. At least anybody whose opinion I actually cared about. You could NEVER have convinced me of what I just wrote 20 years ago. Some tried. Failed. I "just KNEW THAT I KNEW THAT I KNEW" what I was doing. No. I DIDN'T know, 'gnosko' anything about SOME of what I was actually contributing so "whole heartedly" to. I was an ENABLER. WE ALL were in some way shape or form. It was a measure of mind control that caused me to stay around HQ under constant mental anguish and abuse. Thinking I was holding the line for what was right. The subconscious stress was so great that my face broke out with razorbumps so badly that the bottom part of my face where my beardline grows was very much darker than the top. I though it was "normal" because I have "sensitive skin." Now my face is all the same color. I didn't switch skincare products or shaving cream, or change my razors more often, etc. It gradually faded away. Even dealing with the intense emotional distress of divorce, bankruptcy, and custody battles for the lives of my children. Makes one go Hmmmmmmmmmmm...... It was only when I made a conscious decision to walk. I walked aWAY from The Way in every way and consciously determined that I would go back to how I talked before I associated myself with that group. God held HIS world together for aproximately 2 THOUSAND, 9 HUNDRED 61 years before I was born. HE was in CHRIST, reconciling the world unto Himself lOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOnnnnnnnnnnnngg before I was a glimmer in my dad's horny eye. (He had one drunk one and one horny one ) God doesn't NEED me. He doesn't NEED me to stand FOR Him or HIS Word. He doesn't need ME to move His Word over HIS World. God LOVES me. He would LOVE for me to KNOW his Word so I can come to KNOW Him, as MY Daddy. He sent His SON to SAVE me. The more I cone to KNOW HIS Word, the more I LOVE Him. I see Him more and more as MY Daddy. My Daddy LOVES ME. He would love IT if I told you what He did for ME. BECAUSE. He did the same for YOU. IF you KNEW that you would love HIM too. AND. You would love ME too, for telling you. And. We TWO would love HIM too... together. That is ALL he wants from ME and YOU. Clearing wayspeak from my head was the most vital component in clearing my head to really be ABLE to SEE the Word of God. I found myself engaging the first word in a wayspeak phrase and disengaging my brain. I would "slide through" the expression like the old kid's game, "Chutes & Ladders." ... Poof! I'd be on the other side of the chute, somewhere else, wherever that particular chute took me. All that goes to say... I would venture a guess that: IF you still use wayspeak; their terms, expressions, "wayWords," even the meter of the cadence of the pattern of your thoughts - - all of it....EVEN the manner in which you engage or disengage from the sharings you read here... To the extent and in the proportion wayspeak is a part of your life TWI still controls you. SO. How long did it take? I view my involvement time w/TWI sorta like an alcholic. I've seen others here on GS make consistent references to the "alcholic pattern." TOTALLY agree, totally similar emotional state of being. How long did it take? Am I dead yet?

Thanks Oakspear. No. I haven't read it...yet. Read exerpts though. If he served w/RB I can probably tell part of his story, never having met him. RB, IMO, was part of a new generation of chosen, golden boys, fast trackers, at the head of the pack. I think he was WC7, which the general line on them was that they were "the Best" Corps group to date. I don't think I had ever met a 7th WC person that I didn't like, until RB. He seemed like a snake to me, and he wore those slick leather cowboy boots... ugh. Creeped me out. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ I'm thinking it was a pretty easy call for me. There really wasn't any greatness or in-depth spiritual perception required for me to see I was in over my head. "Imagine my delight" at waking (I'm a very light sleeper) up in the deep dark black dead quiet of night with my "WOW brother" sitting up on his bed staring at me with his "game face" on. I think the "reality" struck me that the dark angry looking figure sitting accross the room was not just a "WOW Brother." He was a very angry and strong guy, who had he wished, could have awakened me with a very heavy blow to the head. "It was heavy, he aint my BROTHER!" (my age shows. --> catch the reference?) During that year, God firmly stamped it right smack in the middle of my forehead that the WHOLE WAY MINISTRY had was equally inexperienced as I, to care for Jessee & Eric. In all of the more than 85 ministries of TWI there was NOTHING to take care of people who had actual, real psychological needs. VPW was like, minister to them, cast their spirits, out; then love them with the love of God THAT'll heal them. LCM was oblivious; tyring so desparately to be the "world class athlete" he just KNEW he was. What was it the guy said during the presedential debate... "I knew world class athletes. LCM you are NO world class athletes." Really. In high school I watched our guys (as a freshman on the bench) chase Tony Dorsett around the field for almost 200 yards while he single handedly routed our highly touted team. Played against Dan Marino too. It took four of us to sack him at times. He'd still get the ball the ball to receivers with a BUNCH of us hangin' all over him. It was a pretty clear comparison playin' flag football w/LCM @ HQ. He (LCM) nazi'ed us even then. He ALWAYS had to be steady quarterback, for BOTH teams. We put up with it cause we wanted to play ball & had more pure fun, more actual competition when he wasn't there. HE wanted to call all the plays, some of which were pretty hokey. I don't think he quite grasped the concept that when you were on defense you'd have a pretty damn good idea what play he was gonna call.... seeing as he'd just tried the same play (that failed) when you were just on offense. I digress.... Anyway, it seemed to me like admitting that people would need real psychotherapy sorta flew in the face of what TWI believed about healing. I'm sure you guys have been nazi'ed regarding health/injury issues, I know I have. It was as if admitting one had a problem was tantamount to some sort of 'godly' failure. It isn't and wasn't.

Ok. After this, I'm REALLY going to bed. I really wish you hadn't said that. Professional writers all know that "the writer is nothing without his editor." VPW never actually wrote the PFAL book. It was "written" by staff writers and editors from the transcript of the film class. "Editorial" simply edited it and changed the sense from spoken to "written" form. VP's daughter Karen M. was his personal editor. She actually "wrote" the books from VP's notes, teaching tape transcripts and other stuff he wrote. Not at all unusual in the publishing world. Therefore. If the spoken class was not "God Breathed," nor was the written book. I, yes ME, I actually laid out the vast majority of VPW's magazine articles for the last ten years of his life. Occasionally I would suggest rewrites of paragraphs or actually scrap whole sentences to get them to fit in the available space. WE, the publications staff, told writers how much room they had (in terms of word count) for their articles. If somebody turned in too many words, we would hack the article to bits. I seem to remember that a certain "LindaZ" who posts on GS was nicknamed, "The Hatchet!" She was an excellent senior editor with a great disdain for verbosity. Our editorial staff trained our contributing writers on how to write for a magazine and would stand firm when writers tried to pull the "God Breathed" crap on us. If GOD was breathin' it He woulda breathed it so it would fit! God INSPIRED, maybe, but "Theo Pneustos?" No way. VPW taught that God Breathed was reserved for the scriptures, PERIOD. Way Publications, in the time frame you mentioned, Mike, had some very high standards,"in the day." "God Inspired Professionals" was the goal. There's nothing more to talk about on the VPW told me tip. I don't remember hearing or reading ONCE where VP claimed HIS works were anything "God Breathed." I remember him saying his stuff wasn't even necessarily "new." PFAL even said that "God would teach me the Word as it hadn't been taught for centuries...." Centuries old stuff. Not NEW, God Breathed revelation. Now. Its bedtime.

Huh? I was about to go to bed. My head is swelling so much so, I can't sleep. Its now so heavy that its fallen over & I can't get up! They don't need me. Mike. I think you're a nice guy. If you truly view me as a superstar heavy hitter.... Man. Please. Get a new If you truly believe that VPW believed PFAL to be "God Breathed," submit ONE piece of evidence to support that assertion... or should I say ASSUMPTION? While developing your strateegeries on this topic, consider this: 1. I'm not taking sides. I don't think the folks you listed, your adversaries, are taking me at my "superstar heavyhitter word." (Hey. I guy can dream right? Its only been about "12 minutes.") I think they recognize the validity of someone who actually spoke to the guy about the stuff. 2. I haven't drawn any "final" conclusions on the plagiarism nor the sex issues. I certainly haven't concluded that VPW was... What I have said is that a person's faults don't necessarily negate their accomplishments... as a general principle. I feel that if a person is gonna take a stand on an issue, they should consider facts, as many as are available on said issue. (Isn't it great that we all sound so smart?) I weigh in on a conversation when I feel I have something substantial to add. I can't predict which subjects I will weigh in on or when, so how can you? All of your adversaries on this subject and others you view as "Mike haters" are presenting substantive information in support of their position. I'm forced to respect both it and them. I've had folks flat out refute some of my ideas and others, straight up, "school me" on stuff; which is cool. Please do not draw any conclusions about me that I have not drawn. I can't respect that. 3. I don't read all my posts either. Jus don't take myself that seriously. 4. What's a "diverted argument strategy?"

...It was. It DID happen A LOT. I'm thinking now that people being thrust into leadership roles they were not prepared for was more the norm than the exception. Even in "the old days" speak so fondly of. My interim Corps year was my second year as a WOW. This time I was the Corps Nazi a$$hole; albeit doggedly determined NOT to be. I was sent to New Albany Indiana, which was about as different from my homeland of Pittsburgh, PA as could be. The southern drawl was a different language to me altogether. I couldn't even uuuhhhndaa staaahhhhnnnn wuuuut folks wuz saaaaayyuun! :o--> My three WOW brothers were: Eric; who was SO physically abused by his father, who would backhand him about the head, so often and badly that he sloched to his right and would hardly move his mouth when he talked. Dave; a tall, blonde, blue eyed, rugged, carpenter type, whose life story was kinda like a country western song. Then there was Jesse; a handsome softspoken ex-military guy. Jesse was CONVINCED that I was a CIA plant in the WOW program assigned by the Army to watch him and assinate him in his sleep. When I would be talking with one of the other two Jesse would hear voices in his head that, regardless of what was actually being said, he'd hear stuff like... "Tonite's the night. I'm gonna off Jesse in his sleep." Seriously. He'd hear stuff like that then use his softspoken demeanor to gently confront me and try to get me to admit it. Of course I denied saying whatever, but he'd say that I was just using my CIA training to be really good at twisting stuff. Eric was almost 30 and had never worked a day in his life. No discernable people skills. I got him an interview to work @ KFC. Gave him a ride & he refused to walk through a door the manager was holding open. Eric wound up leaving the field, wouldn't get a job. We wound up calling Dave "Van Man." He moved out of our apartment and lived in his van in our parking lot (or wherever he decided to park on a particular day). He figured that was wise cause Jesse just might decide to off one of, or all of us as WE slept before I got to him. Jesse was real quiet. Wouldn't go witnessing or do most of the WOW stuff. He would just kinda sit back & watch me all the time. This is no sh##. No exaggeration. No artist's license to make it sound more interesting. After the first couple of months our "numbers" were not that great. More like "non-existent." We had been the first family in the region to put together a PFAL class but those people kinda faded away, except for April, who became Dave's girlfriend. After being called on the carpet at our Limb Meeting by our Region Coordinator; a slick, up and coming Corps Nazi, Robert (last name starts w/B, rhymes with "felt"). I went home and wrote Robert a long heartfelt "help me!" letter explaining how my "WOW Brothers" team; Eric was an abused child and couldn't speak to strangers, Jesse heard voices saying I was out to asassinate him in his sleep, and Dave, the only sane one, was living in his VAN!!! When I recieved Robert's reply letter (after three loooong weeks) I was excited thinking the Corps "calvary" was about to ride over the horizon and HELP! Robert told me that if I were a better leader, my people wouldn't have such problems and he was gonna recommend that I don't go back in residence because I "just was not ready" and therefore UNQUALIFIED to be a Corps grad because I could get these guys to BE WOW's! They were CLINICAL (at least Jesse & Eric). There was NO WAY I was qualified to help them. I learned to sleep w/one eye open that year, though. --> I think that was one of the biggest miscalculations VPW made in the ministry. He pushed and pushed that people should go WOW and Corps BEFORE college. He even went so far as to say the he felt going to college might be a "cop out" for some who were afraid to go out on the field. People were constantly put into positions they had absolutely NO training or experience for. I would have had to be Dr. Phil to deal w/MY wow family! After that "WOW!" year... hell yeah I was "afraid" to go out on the field!

Yo Oldie; You crack me up. Not only that. My MOM was black too. I once said that to someone (a caucasian friend) who still had some residual racism, not yet flushed out. When I said, "My MOM was..." their eyes bugged out like, "She WAS, Oh mY!" I just looked at 'em. We had a "moment." I think that flushed that last bit (or maybe MOST of it) out. What up y'all.

Yo. Pull up Mike, PULL UP!!!!!!!! I'm already on record here on greaseSpot saying that VPW was kinda like a grandfather to me. I've said how I used to live right next door to him, visit w/ him & Mrs. on more than a few starlit nights in the courtyard, worked on "his" staff for the better part of a decade, etc. Shared meals w/ the guy, was one of few people he would just throw the keys to his Lincoln to and say move it, I drove him around when he was there for Ambassador One weekends, helped him clean his garage on Saturdays, etc. That being said. What I did concerning VPW that pertains to this thread is that I was senior designer in the publications department that produced his books, articles, letters, everything he publicly published. I was even authorized to sign his name (in his handwriting) when he as not available and something required a his signature (don't get this twisted folks; it happens all the time in big corporations). Most pertinent to this discussion was that I was part of the historical staff. As such I sat w/him, Mrs. and others who "were there" and "who knew" the "heart of the ministry." Al that goes to say, in the most verbose way: THERE IS NOTHING "GOD BREATHED" ABOUT PFAL. Hate to say I told you so, but HE told ME so. PFAL was never intended to be anything more than a compliation of foundational materials to help guide a person through the first steps in their relationship with JESUS CHRIST, who IS, the way, the truth and the life. Noone comes to the FATHER, but my him. Jesus. Jesus' teachings, not VPW's. VPW said at least a million times through the years that what HE had done was only the first steps. Once we who came after him did OUR OWN research in the scriptures, when WE found where HE, VPW had erred; he/we (the ministry) would "CHANGE OUR THINKING ACCORDINGLY." Suffice it to say at this point Mike. You seem to be a nice, well meaning guy; as long as you continue on this PFAL is "theo Pneustos" you are 100% wrong. Dead wrong. Not right. not close. not even in the ball park.

Ooops! Hit the wrong button, twice I guess. One thing I really find disturbing is how some folks who appear to be VPW haters follow the VPhatred tip just as blindly and vigorously as some followed the "ministry" they now speak so vehemently against. Not disturbed cause I wanna defend VPW. Guilty is guilty. His guilt or lack thereof is not determined by my approval nor is it lessened by my defense thereof. Grill the man's memory if you feel you must and are willing to carry the hot coals in your own mind and life to do so. The image I unsucessfully tried to post is a page from the official "Way Corps brochure." The page has The Way Corps poem on it. I had read the other day where someone said somthing to the effect of, "...we were told it was original to VPW & TWI..." They posted the original author as being "Henry Van Dyke." TWI's OFFICIAL, printed publication of the poem, which had to have initialed by VPW and LCM before we published it contained this on the page: "Adapted from the fourth stanza of Spirit of the Everlasting Boy: Ode to the 100th Anniversary of the Lawrenceville School by Henry Van Dyke." The Way Corps Poem: Plagurism? Hypocracy? Again. I'm not posting this to defend VPW. But. While we make posts illucidating the situation, perhaps somebody should shed some light on the fact that some of you are being led, STILL. In ways that are ultimately detremental to yourself. White SUPREMACIST! Yo. I'm black. I spent many hours through the years privately or in small groups w/VPW. I shared many meals w/him. If he was a closet skinhead OR a Jew-hater. I'd know. You can smell that kinda stuff on a person, just like smelling a f@&t.

So profound Shaz. I usually have Dr. Phil on for background noise when I'm working @ home. If I had a dollar for everytime he says to someone, "Do you wanna be right, or do you want to fix this..." I wouldn't need to work. So many people forsake all in the name of "right." Part of the human condition, I guess. Root cause.... SATAN. Shaz hits the mark again. So many folks stayed around the ministry, HQ and apparently even went into the Corps to effect positive change, from within, myself included. Speaking for myself, after VPW died, I felt that SOMEBODY needed to stay around who had some idea of the "heart of the ministry." I/we actually thought "they" would listen to the Word, reason, and even common sense and treat God's people like the treasures you/we are. I think this kinda goes partly towards the "why did we put up with it?" question. I think people had a real hunger to "do" and "be" right. BUT. After reading your stories (BTW - - THANK YOU for sharing, this is a great discussion) it seems to me like the "blame compass" keeps pointing back to LCM. Craig was the poster boy for the "chosen" as has been mentioned up the thread. There were many guys from the first few Corps groups who were able to coordinate the Corps, Which originally, if memory serves was a one year assignment like ever other Corps assignment. Craig influenced the process to keep himself in the top spot. He knew in his heart there were others better... people modeled that behavior. "I'M doing this because it's ME." Originally, there were NO Corps on staff at HQ. The more Corps came to work there, the worse things got. I was 21 when I came on staff and there was no way I was gonna tell Milford B*w*n, old enough to be my Dad, how to live or what he should do. Craig, to me always seemed a little too attached to his football career. It was pretty obvious to me that he felt he never really got the opportunity to show what he could do. He was angry about his lack of playing time. I believe he felt he was a Pro Bowl calibre player who was treated unfairly. That effected his performance, etc. he never got to play. He rode the bench in the Orange Bowl and it really burned him. Does it make sense to you guys that his behavior through the years reflects that he was definitely gonna do it HIS way. He was gonna do whatever it took to get the reins then run it as he saw fit, IN YOUR FACE!!!!! I mean, it makes no sense in any business sorta way that one would make such a wholescale abandonment of the things that built the business from basically nothing to a $22mil per year "machine" in about 10-15 years. It seems to me that his attitude was the poison that spread thru the Corps. When it became clear that the faithful to the "old ways" would NOT follow HIM, not God, HIM - (oooh. that's scary just thinkin' bout it ) there was basically nobody left to say, "Stick your reproof where it doesn't shine. How far he fell makes one wonder if he was EVER actually born again. David, of the Bible, wasn't when he stooped so low as to kill. There are some scriptures that really make me wonder. There is a BIG difference between a good man making horrible decisions and a bad man behaving horribly. Can ANYONE tell me of ONE good, original thing that Craig added to TWI, the Corps or otherwise?

I'm thinking kinda like the old computer term: "GIGO." "Garbage In - Garbage Out." Computer programming "old-timers" say that when you put garbage info into a computer you get garbage out. I'm thinking the same goes for The Way Corps. If someone was an a$$hole coming in they more than likely came out that way. Good people coming in were more than likely good people coming out. Linda Z & I got to observe several Corps groups come & go through HQ. There was often talk like, "My favorite group was _________." and Those _______ number, man, the whole lot of 'em seemed like jerks." Same coordinators, same program, different results. While we're swapping nazi stories.... One of my favorite things I hated about Corps people was the one where new interim corps or new corps grads would come on staff as dept. or section coordinators. One time in particular, we were in a meeting and this new "leader" was riding sombody's rear about some "procedure." Of course the one being ridden was standing for the common sense way to do it. The "leader" came back with, "The Staff Handbook says we should do it like this!" (a really inefficient and downright stupid way to proceed.) Hence the argument. I chimed in and said, "We should do it (the common sense) that way." The leader went on this long diatribe about how God inspired the Staff Handbook was because it was written by such great people of God. I said. "Oh. That doesn't matter." "WHY!!" he came back, most indignantly, as if I were blaspheming from hell itself. I went on to tell him that I was in the meeting when we wrote that part of the staff handbook. At the time, we weren't sure how we should set up this particular procedure, so we just "put something in that sorta made sense, like MAYBE." Cause the changes to the handbook were due & we had to have "something." We knew that since we had never really done this particular thing on this scale, we'd have to alter the procedure once we did it for a while & found out what worked and what didn't. PLUS. new corps leader dude was misinterpreting what actually WAS in the handbook. Everybody BUT new corps dude was rolling on the floor laughing!

Un-freakin-beLEE-va-ble! Not sayin' I don't believe this crap happened. I'm sure it did. Its still unbelievable from two perspectives. FIRST. That anyone would have the unmitigated GALL to do thst stuff to people. Second that anyone would actually take it. In the future. I'm thinking that if anyone I'm associated with tells me they are selling their large beautiful home for a smaller one to serve God.... I'M telling them. YOU. Are. CRAZY. If someone tells me I'm late for being EARLY. I'm telling them, "Shut up." If someone tells me I should hit my child. Even if I WAS gonna hit one of 'em. (I have 4 who give me plenty of reasons :D-->) I wouldn't hit my kid. I'd tell them. "You'd better duck." Those people were something but they were NOT "Way Corps." I think there is a certain level of "reality" that people should live within. All those crazy terms TWI uses now. They gradually move people emotionally, inching you away from reality little by little. Then they strike. By then a person is far enough from reality they actually believe that selling a home custom built to aid in "moving the word" is The Way to enhance your ability to "move the word." That's just plain CRAZY, people. Not ugly people being stupid. CRAZY people being CRAZY. Nothing more, nothing less. I hadn't seen the TWI website. Looked through for the first time last week. Those "Singing Ladies" scared me. Seriously. It was wierd in a wierd way. Sorta hypnotic.

I had forgotten about the flight school thing, Jim. Same with most of this other stuff. Thanks. That's why I was so incensed, Jim... cause if the BOD had found some way around the IRS to have assets of the corporation become theirs personally. I'm figuring it must be illegal. Then again, I'm not a lawyer either.

If that is true (not to accuse you of not having the facts, Steve :)--> ) that HAS to be somewhat illegal. Some kind of, I can't think of the word right off hand... stealing. Oh yeah. A type of embezzlement. I know they probably crossed all their T's and dotted their legal I's about it. But. Somone oughta look into some sort of class action suit.

O'Tay! There was a time in TWI history, however, when all of the material resources of the ministry were available to "any believer." EG: TWI's Transportation Dept. at its height included two aircraft (one capable of International flight) four custom motorcoaches, about 80 to 100 cars, a couple limos, etc. We could rent any vehicle that was not in use for ministry business for personal use and pay for the gas, which we got at a reduced cost from the gaspumps @ HQ. It was as simple as signing a book out from the library. If you wrecked it TWI insurance covered your injuries and you'd just have to pay the ministry's deductable to have it fixed. There may have been a 10 cent per mile charge over a certain number of miles, if memory serves.... I once rented a really cool blacked out Checker Cab limo, split the gas cost w/ a Mark F. (ex TWI safety dept) to go on a double date w/ a couple of single staff hotties, to a drive-in movie. It was a fun, inexpensive date. The airplanes, even Ambassador One, and the Way Productions motorcoach were available for our use too. We could call Transportation & get the skinny on scheduled trips and rent them under the same principle. If one of the pilots or licenced coach drivers were available and willing you could rent the vehicle for the cost of fuel. It was also considerate to compensate the pilot or driver for your trip. I remember Eric K., an avid skier on staff, put together a skiing trip vacation in Crested Butte, Colorado. The plan was to fly in Ambassador One to Colorado & have Camp Gunnison staff pick us up from the airport. We were to stay in some of the empty rooms/ cabins or dorm rooms w/ extra bunks at Camp Gunnison. Then we'd rent available vehicles from CG and make the 20 minute drive to some of the best skiing in the US. It was gonna cost somewhere around $300. (again as memory serves) per person for transportation, lodging and meals to fly roundtrip in a private corporate jet from Ohio to Colorado for a few days of skiing. Lift tickets and equipment rental were extra. He scheduled the vaction when A1 was scheduled to fly, I think, to Texas, for scheduled maintenance. You could also hitchhike a ride on the planes or coach for their regularly scheduled trips if there was a seat available. People came in off the field occasionally and flew all over the place. I rode on the coach once to go to St. Louis to pick up a Datsun 280Z I was buying from a Corps brother. They were on their way to Emporia, I hopped out in StL. Speaking of Camp Gunnison. It would be my guess that they're hanging on to it for all their worth because it is really the most "valuable," if not monitarily - in terms of "wantability." (Hey. If TWI can make up words & terms, so can I! ) Gunnison is much more wantable, IMHO, than anything else TWI owns. Were it me, I'd give up HQ before Gunnison. Who wants a farm?

Not to insult anybody.... But isn't it clear that TWI only exists now as a cash cow to the "leadership" and those who get whatever little piece of the "abundant sharing" pie? Gone are the beautiful Limb Homes in every state. The airplanes, campus locales, 800 member staff, thousands of Corps as core leadership, gone. I'm not wastin' my time to itemize all that is gone. Fact remains. What's gone, aint there no more. Gone is even the lofty, altruistic "Word Over the World" goal, changed to having whateveer they have left to "Prevail." "Prevail." More like hold onto what stuff we have left. Reminds me of Stevie Wonder's song lyrics, "Livin' just enough, just enough... for the Ci-tay." Rosalie knows. She knows precisely what she is and is not doing. She knows all they are doing is "living just enough for the city." As long as they have enough followers to pay the bills & line their pockets so they can keep playing. They will play. At least in the old days.... Even if some thinks all TWI ever was building was a mind control cult. At least we actully built something. Prevail............ what a freak-in' copout. makes a person wanna spew. Hurl. Toss cookies. Throw yer lunch. got any more???????????

Speaking as an 11th Corps grad. The term Nazi Corps is somewhat new to me. I hadn't seem much of the behavior I've seen described here. Most of the nazi-like behavior I saw & experienced was directed at other Corps; heavy handed "leadership" trying to force people to bow to their will or populate their mini kingdoms is what I saw. I would add to the discussion that those of us Corps who didn't leave voluntarily were thrown out. Myself included. I came into The Way Corps because I wanted to develop my leadership skills and be like the interim 5th, 6th, 7th and even 8th Corps in terms of the leadership qualities they exhibited. I wanted, within myself to personify The Way Corps poem; particularly the part that said: "... equipped believers, ambassadors strong and wise, Who teach because they love the teacher's task. And find their richest prize in minds that open, And in hearts that ask." I would dare to say that most of us who left were ones who wanted to live that ideal also. I can't emphasize THIS point enough.... THEY THREW ME OUT. Maybe I was just insubordinate. Well. I DID get into a lot of arguments about the way we did stuff. Like the time I went ballistic over a Way Magazine cover I was doing. Any of you remember the one that had these shiny gold letters that said, "THE WORD OF GOD IS THE WILL OF GOD" on a blue background??? What was the argument? I went ballistic over that? Why? MY original, approved, design had an open Bible behind the big gold letters. They ordered me to take the Bible out of the illustration. "We don't need the Bible in the illustration, it takes away from the words, 'The WORD of God is The WILL of God." is what they said. I went ballistic. We argued. I REFUSED to take it out. They wanted me to paint over top of the Bible that was already done. They didn't care if I missed the production deadline, "Just take it out." they said. I said, flat out, "NO. As long as I work here and have breath in my body... I will NEVER take the BIBLE out of ANYTHING we do." Since I wouldn't do it, they had the printer take the Bible out in prepress. I also refused to manage that part of it as I usualy did when I did a cover. I told them I didn't care how well it was or wsan't done, what they were doing was WRONG, and I wouldn't be a part of it. Later, they took ME, and basically everyone LIKE me out of EVERYTHING they do. I know you've heard this a thousand times before, but those NAZI CORPS types were not "really" Corps. At least to me and many others who tried our best to BE our best for GOD's people." Unfortunately, however, it appears the NAZI thinking started at "the root" and grew out from there. For what its worth. Please accept my heartfelt apology for any wrong purpetrated by anyone in the thane of The Corps. There was a time when the green name tag meant something good. I was told that if you ever needed anything, any help with any thing, just ask someone with a green name tag. They'll help you. From what I'm hearing, that concept has become unimaginable. Now its more like M&A the green taggers. Do they still even use green nametags?

Reading about the past helps people in a lot of ways. Telling people to stop writing about the past is not new, historically, nor has it ever helped anyone. More than one person has told me they appreciate hearing the stuff I've written about the past. They've also encouraged me to continue. Think I mught continue. It kinda helps me too. Besides, conversing over a nice cup of coffee is one of my favorite things. Later.

Imagine what his history would be: Warmed the bench on the University of Kansas football team in the Orange Bowl. Way International from ___________ to when they trew me out. Brown nosed my way into the President slot at the height of TWI's growth. Alienated 90% of his contemporaries while presiding over the steepest decline in the ministry's history. Greatest athletic achievement: Having adultrous sex with the seed of the serpent while in training to hop around the stage in tights. Not one published book in decades of "spiritual leadership." Firmly established TWI's reputation as one of the world's most dangerous mind controlling cults. Most famous quote: "....You'll be a GreaseSpot by midnight...." consistently refuted by the lives of thousands of EX- followers who would rather be dragged naked behind a chariot than sit through him saying ANYTHING, EVER again. (Rumor has it they would purchase said chariot and provide the horses.) Never able to figure out what to call people in charge of stuff. Lost more property than ministry ever had. Available for new, start up, Godly prevailing ministry after being thrown out by prevailing insanity filled "Directors." Come one come all we'll party til the cows come home! Let's PREVAIL!!!!!!!

...BTW... Cream cheese danish with the white stripes is my fav. Thank you.

PS.... I count any of you who were hurt among the "most precious" mentioned above. We're gonna need a bigger pot....... :)-->