WordWolf

Brother Speed, you missed the point. The one doing the condemning and accusing is MJ, who accused the woman who was abused and had her children abused, and received NO help from the system. She is being accused of doing NOTHING, or not putting forth SUFFICIENT effort, or APPROPRIATE effort to try to end abuse and suffering. Despite EYEWITNESS accounts, MJ has insisted that- despite NOT HAVING BEEN THERE TO SEE HOW THINGS WERE- that those who were participants and witnesses are LIARS- claiming their testimony is false- and FOOLS-claiming they didn't do simple things which were appropriate actions to take. (The truth is that all appropriate actions to take that were possible to take were taken, and anyone who says otherwise spreads VILE LIES about others.) No-MJ is not using the vocabulary common to workers in MJ's professed "field". MJ is also absent of the tact which supposedly is present in workers in this field. In short, MJ doesn't think like a social worker, doesn't act like one, and doesn't talk like one. The natural supposition, then, is that MJ is NOT one. Actually, shame on MJ for accusing posters of lying without having the facts at hand. Shame on MJ for not admitting s/he had no idea what s/he was talking about when s/he was doing so-when more information was presented. When sufficient evidence is at hand, a prudent person changes their opinion to match the evidence. We have no proof MJ has done so. MJ certainly did notdo so HERE, where doing so would have taken little effort. Did MJ do that, or just invoke thesubject of praying for them in a display of conspicuous religion? Jimmy Swaggart cried on tv when he was "repenting" of his sins, but few people thought that was true repentance-just the appearance of same. First of all, we have no proof MJ isn't lying from Day One. Second, nobody said ALL social workers are a disgrace-they said the ones who ruined TL's life and did nothing were a disgrace-and MJ attacked TL for needing help. If that's really MJ's job. If THIS is the way s/he behaves here, I'm dubious s/he is making the world a better place ELSEWHERE. If that's meant in sincerity, yes, I agree. If it's meant in sarcasm, it's woefully misplaced, Brother.

We finally meet vpw on pg 124, and Mrs W on pg 125. The contrast between them, as well as the spin on vpw's appearance, are fascinating. I feel it's not complete without something like "and when he stepped forward, the sun shone directly on him, even at night." Mrs W. Hm. When she walks, she walks on the ground.

Rhoda weighs in. pg-88, she says she studied music in Moody Bible Institute, graduating in 1946. She grew up in a Mennonite church, but were excommunicated for violating church policy. Her father had been involved with a Bible College, and she had been on the radio-which was forbidden at the time. Harsh stuff. I wish I could confirm this story. Anyway, it turned her off churches. When she shopped her resume around, she got a letter from VP saying he needed a musician with secretarial skills. She signed on as his secretary September 28, 1947. Chimes Hour Youth Caravan was the name of vpw's radio show. It had TWO choirs. pg-90. pg-91.

Uncle Harry, giving more history. pg-79-80. You were close, but there was NO indication he was searching out deeper truths and, especially, overjoyed at finding some. What he taught then was completely different than what he taught later Fascinating. Harry seems to keep track of the money on things. He says he paid Rhoda as secretary out of his OWN pocket, and criticizes the people in Troy because they wanted to hear vpw teach, and have him over for meals, but not support his ministry financially. His part of this book ends with the final quote Dave gives a partial history of the A/V aspects. pg-82 I noticed that EVERYBODY except his brother calls him "The Doctor", not VP. If it wasn't at his directive, instituted and encouraged by him, I'll eat my keyboard. I also noticed he was calling HIMSELF 'The Teacher' as early as 1963. And yet, Dave keeps mentioning numbers after this, which he must have 'looked at'. Dave seems to think he came up with the idea of vpw on film, and sold vpw on it. Perhaps he is correct. pg-83 pg 85, he says how they priced the filming, then raised all the money IN ADVANCE of filming, and how "Doctor raised the final $11,000 himself." (He must have raised it by growing it, apparently.) page 85, we see the prices invented. We have all that on the authority of the man who never looked at numbers again. How many people besides me see contradictions from one page to the next, and in how such a high (for 1970) price for those LITTLE books was set?

"Uncle" Harry gave some interesting biographical details that help fill in some of the blanks, especially about the youngest son in the family, vp. page 77 Really, Harry? You admitted you didn't SEE him most of the time. Why wasn't he doing his chores in sight and preaching to the animals on the farm, or, you know, the other kids, people who might actually hear something of use? Maybe Dad was on to something. David was a good shepherd FIRST, then a good man of God.... Later, we'll see what vpw has to say about kids and their work ethic. pg-78, Harry again. I thought he'd been preaching for years, Harry-to the trees. Also, Lamarckianism has been thoroughly discredited. You can not inherit an interest in learning. You can ENCOURAGE it, but not pass it along from birth. Finally, Dad seems to think vpw lacked drive, but you said he DID, at least about preaching. Hm. Maybe he had drive for preaching, but neglected his chores. Harry spoke about their father's will. pg-79.

Page 37, a guy tells a story about himself in the military. Quite a coincidence. pages 43-44, we get a description of the Way Corps. page 59, someone speaks about the winter of 1967. One guy from the Print Shop offered this on page-62.

We hear denominations described on page 30. Same discussion, page-33. page 34, same discussion, has something I especially thought was worth noting.

"TW:LiL" gives an interesting quote on page 14 about some WOWs. WOWs assigned to headquarters was not common when I was around. Anyway, on to the next quote. page 29, we get our first description of "the class".

I finally got curious enough to dust off my copy of "the Way: Living in Love" by Whiteside and read it thru. There's some interesting stuff in there. I find that many warning signs are telegraphed there and so on. ======== For those of you who've never heard of it, it's a book published in 1972. It was written BY a twi insider about twi and life as an insider, at the beginning of the 1970s, and published by twi. As such, any reasonable person would consider it a lengthy commercial. No dissent from twi would have been PERMITTED to have been published, and no dissent would have been CONSIDERED by an innie. The perspective of the writer reflects the thinking of insiders at the time-not a fair and objective reporting of the facts. It includes many quotes from people-especially vpw. For all intents and purposes, it should be evident that the quotes from him IN the book are officially endorsed BY him as accurate. I'd like to post some of the quotes, and discuss where they relate to each other, the facts as currently known, and other comments made by vpw. ============== Please feel free to post quotes directly FROM vpw from other sources, as well as quotes from the Mrs W book.

I always heard it as "take that girl", too. In fact, the first time I looked it up, I was surprised the line wasn't "Do I take that girl?" Strange dream indeed..... ====== Ok, next song. Remember, the TITLE and the artist, not just the artist. The younger folks should have an edge on this one... "But there are several other very important differences between human beings and animals that you should know about. I'd appreciate your input." "Yes I'm Siskel, yes I'm Ebert and you're getting two thumbs up."

I USED to say "I was glad I got in, and glad I got out." However, I've seen what damage was wrought by them in God's name. I've seen the complete twisting of people's minds to the point that they're 180-degrees removed from Godly action, and claim they're doing the right thing. In short, the shrill screaming of "how dare you complain it was less than perfect" has convinced me that there was a lot MORE damage-much of it psychological and PERMANENT-than I previously thought.

The second one was popular enough-I was listening to it on the radio approximately 24 hours ago.... Apparently, there's been some covers of this song (Michael Hutchence of INXS in "Barb Wire"????) and some disagreement over some of the lyrics (like the muttered side-comments) and whether it's "take that pearl" or "dig that girl" or something else. But everyone seems to agree that this song isn't called "Hall of the Mountain King", it's "Spill the Wine", and the version I heard was either by "War", or Eric Burdon of "the Animals" fame. Me, I STILL can't make out all the lyrics, and I tried again yesterday. :)-->

Allan, was it your intention to unite all the posters by having them all agree that you're an idiot? You're looking like the kind of guy who gets hate-mail from the Amish.

Characteristic, Allan. I can't tell if this post was mostly offensive, mostly careless or mostly ignorant. Probably all of the above. In Proverbs, it says that even a fool appears wise when he shuts up. You might consider appearing wise for a few days. You probably WON'T, but you might consider it.

Correct, of course. As you may have noticed, I deliberately picked lines NOT from the book. The first one was from the character nicknamed "Bem" by some fans ("Black Enigmatic Man"). He just showed up out of nowhere and got a bunch of lines. One joke was that Bem was the HBP and wouldn't WE all be surprised? So, your turn.

Yes, and we STILL don't know where it is now. "You'll pay for this! You and your bloody chicken!"

"WordWolf" came back 50/50, which, I think, won't surprise some of the people around here.

New movie, then.... "It's like trying to catch smoke. It's like trying to catch smoke with your bare hands."

Oh, right. We spent a week on this. It's UHF.

Well, that THEY'RE teaching it IS new to you and me, but for all I know, they may have been teaching it for years.

Oakspear, I believe you're right on the money. I shouldn't have gotten defensive with my SIT beliefs. I am actually open to hearing more. Of course, along with the info. Goey provided I also am examining JE Stiles and BG Leonard books, folks that don't have the same negative baggage as VP. Practically the same stuff but just in case some get turned off by VP... Anyway, this thread is helping me re-examine my beliefs, which is a good thing. :)--> Great! Let us know what you find!

Forgive us if not everyone just believes you on that.

You were answered already. In this thread alone, there's multiple postson pages 6 & 7. It doesn't endear you to others to keep asking the same questions over and over IF THEY HAVE BEEN ANSWERED. That means either A) You disrespect the posters and their posts when they DO answer B) You are unable AND unwilling to understand "what is written". This can be overcome with effort-you are not undertaking that effort. C) You disbelieve the posts-thus calling the posters liars. It surprises you that you people don't play your game? They can read his posts NOW and find out EXACTLY what he believes, as can you. They just can't label them BEFORE reading. This means they have to THINK FOR THEMSELVES. This is not exactly polite discourse. You've been told several times that the proper term is "wiccan", and the terms "wiccan" and "witch" are not synonymous-some people are one OR the other, but not BOTH. Even stated wiccans (who did EXACTLY what you asked) are STILL not answering "good enough" for you-you're claiming they "don't want it known" although they presented their label. You responded to that label by insulting them further- demonstrating you lack the maturity to use labels properly. That having been said, why SHOULD anyone cooperate with you? Sometimes people cooperate with me out of politeness, sometimes because I've earned their respect. You've strained politeness, and earned little respect from anyone except vpw apologists. See why some people cooperate with ME and not YOU? (I also ask a lot less.) I just wonder what else (some) of you are 'hiding' ??

Oakspear responded to "..but the Ford never explained Henry" by saying Bravo, Oakspear.

You know, I knew a guy who had one of those. He was a self-proclaimed psychic. Like vpw, he'd lost the use of one eye. So he, you know, had a glass eye. And a crystal ball. He seemed to think one compensated for the other.