WordWolf

I'm willing to give HCW the benefit of the doubt and judge his question a fair one. If he PERSONALLY did not remember anything of a vicious or abusive nature, either A) he wasn't present when it happened B) he misinterpreted what he saw C) it didn't happen He asked for more information. He wanted to know what he didn't see. He's not been here for years, and may not have seen the threads where it's been outlined. So, I say, let's give him sufficient information to make an informed opinion. ===== Now, those RealAudio clips ARE highly informative. http://www.greasespotcafe.com/waydale/main/real.html The clip ChasUFarley mentioned is the 928K clip. A lot of twi's OWN documents can be found here: http://www.greasespotcafe.com/waydale/main/way-generated.htm Notes on some of their meetings can be found here: http://www.greasespotcafe.com/waydale/main/corpsnotes.html A number of topical articles on twi's policies, practices and statements can be found here: http://www.greasespotcafe.com/waydale/main/editorial.html Here's a newspaper article that includes some quotes where you can see the end results of twi's despicable teachings: http://www.ardemgaz.com/prev/way/11.html ==== This should provide some answers to some persistent questions.

I got curious and checked. I never even saw PART of this movie. Might be true of a lot of people here, maybe. Might give one last quote and one more day.

Ben Affleck Dogma George Carlin

He can't be referring to the FIRST one, since that fellow was not FROM the Bronx, did not move TO the Bronx, and has not, AFAIK, returned TO the Bronx since then even for pizza or a Yankees game. The reason you're thinking of him at all is that he spent a corps interim year in the Bronx. (And has a shirt from the Bronx believers commemorating this, saying "Corps Interim Year" on it, complete with the year.) That guy was in NYC for several months, but was NOT in NYC as of 1989, certainly, and thus, definitely not in 1991. In 1989, he was given a staff assignment at a root locale. Further, he never thought of himself as a New Yorker. When he saw a sign listing the dates for "Bronx Week" he once joked about some of the events that might be taking place that week-competitive events like mugging and hubcap-stealing. So, that leaves him the second guy, maybe.

I figured the Blues Brothers quote was too easy. (Too many people here saw that movie!)

"For a lot less money, you can get BG Leonard's class, ... " According to their website [which politely asks us not to link back to them without their permission] Full Bible Course: (two weeks in residence) Christ The Rock - a 23 tape audio set $115 The Water In The Bottle (the godhead) - a 24 tape audio set, $120 and book “The Water In The Bottle - the god head” $15 Healing Made Plain - a 20 tape audio set $110 and book ‘Healing Made Plain’ $20 Gospel Of Grace – a 15 tape set $100 and book ‘Gospel Of Grace’ $12 Foundations - a 30 tape set $130 and book ‘Foundations’ $25 and other accompanying books: The Everlasting Covenant $14 Gifts Of The Spirit $25 Positive Prayer $19 Church Government $12 Homiletics And Pastoral Theology $12 Holocaust $20 Unless my ‘adder’ is broken asunder that totals $749 I think that $749 is slightly more than $500. :-) PS I really did have that text very nicely formatted, GS' server messes up the whole formatting thing. Your "adder" is broken asunder. I contextualized Paradiseden's comment- involving $500 and PFAL- to refer to $500 in current USA dollars (let me know if you see it differently) and PFAL FOUNDATIONAL CLASS, not ALL THREE (let me know if you see it differently.) So, "Foundations" plus "the Everlasting Covenant" plus "Gifts of the Spirit" plus "Positive Prayer" plus "Church Government" plus "Homiletics and Pastoral Theology" plus "Holocaust"- ASSUMING ALL THOSE BOOKS ARE NECESSARY FOR A FOUNDATIONAL LEVEL- (and taking it as a given that your numbers are accurate) is $130 25 14 25 19 12 12 20 ==== 257 (checks twice.) ------------------- Paradiseden: "I would make a $500 donation to obtain a copy of the PFAL class on DVD or VHS." WordWolf: "For a lot less money, you can get BG Leonard's class." Leaving aside that it's still not "very closely held", $749 may be more than $500, but, since we're not comparing $500 versus BG Leonard's equivalent of all three levels of PFAL, just the highest figure for comparison against the Foundational class, $500 is approximately twice $257. ($257 + $257 is $ 514.) This, of course, is more than $40, but $40 never gave you the ability to retake the class at will. It's like the lawyerish "You never BOUGHT our software. You bought a license to USE our software. We still own the software and offer no guarantees it actually works or will continue to do so" that computer users find utterly dishonest when referring to computers. This is why the supposed guarantee to retake "the class" anywhere, anytime is currently MEANINGLESS- besides being dependent upon space during IDEAL circumstances, it's impossible since they chose to stop running it, and are insistent they're under no legal requirement to continue to do so with their implied guarantee that "being able to take it anytime" means it will continue to be offered.

I hate Illinois Nazis.

Ok, that's Aladdin! :)-->

Leonardo di Caprio Romeo + Juliet Claire Danes

Thanks, Oldiesman. You've finally provided evidence sufficient for me to believe you really lived/live on a different planet than me. As of lcm's "line-in-the-sand/draw-the-line-in-89", the five boroughs of New York City deserted twi en masse. That includes all the outlying counties as well. As of 1990, the Bronx had about 2 families remain, with the heaviest "spiritual heavyweights" being INTERMEDIATE-class grads. Anyone resembling a "giant", "heavyweight", or a "MEDIUMWEIGHT" had left. Those remaining, relatively speaking, were of NEGLIGIBLE skill. (That's going from interacting with them.) The heaviest weight left in the Bronx was referred to as "annoying" in the most complimentary references to him. (He MIGHT have been an Advanced class grad, MAYBE.) I include him when I count "negligible skill", also. Let me put it another way. If I had stayed and been in the Bronx, I would have been about the heaviest-hitter they had remaining. If you can honestly view anyone IN, in the Bronx as of 1991, as a "GIANT", then you operate using either a vocabulary or a worldview that barely intersects my own. What's next-saying that when they walked, the earth shook? They may have been good folks and not evil-those I knew, I would say that of- but they lacked CONVICTION (else they would have followed their conscience rather than stay with the familiar) INDEPENDENCE (when I left, I said I was leaving alone if nobody else was leaving) or SKILL WITH SCRIPTURES (else they would have seen the "mark and avoid" verse lcm claimed applied here did no such thing.)

"I want to know God's thoughts....all else is details." -Albert Einstein.

Dmiller, I take it the moral of this story then is: "Truth is truth even when someone in twi proclaims it."

I don't but other GSC'ers have taken his classes. It's easy to find in a Google search, so I hardly think of it in the same category as the clandestine pfal classes-or the equivalent classes derived from pfal run by the splinter organizations. (BTW, those classes are derived from pfal which was derived from BG Leonard's class, so I think people who want to take THOSE classes should look into Leonard's as well.)

Remo is one part "secret government agent", one part Sci-Fi, one part martial arts, and one part spoofing issues in society. Here's a quick intro to the series: Newark cop Remo Williams was framed for a crime and sentenced to the electric chair. He awoke with a new face and was told that CURE, a government agency designed to work outside the law to uphold the law, had orchestrated that to make him its enforcement arm. They hired Chiun as his main instructor. Chiun is the master of Sinanju (the only living one until Remo gets there.) Sinanju is the one martial art that's the secret original of all martial arts. Masters of sinanju seem to skirt the laws of physics and exceed the human body's potential in reaching its "real" full potential. Remo's adventures all fall into 2 categories. The first is the missions he is sent on for CURE, by Harold Smith, its sole administrator. (Smith works covertly, passing tips to police and government agencies most of the time, and only assigns Remo when conventional means can't solve a problem.) The second category of adventures Remo gets into are the result of his new responsibilities as a Master/Student of Sinanju. Chiun rarely discusses it, but he's concerned that an ancient Sinanju prophecy regarding a Master of Sinanju and Shiva the Destroyer will be fulfilled in Remo. ("I am Shiva the Destroyer, Death the Shatterer of Worlds.") That should be everything you really need to know to jump in to the series. (There's more stuff on CURE and Sinanju.) == There's HUNDREDS of books in the series. The names of the original writers are Warren Murphy and Richard Ben-Sapir. I think the current ones are being ghost-written. I can probably recommend several books in the series, but really, you can jump in anywhere. If you can get something before book 100 or so, so much the better. Frankly, I think it took at least 30-40 books before Murphy and Sapir hit their stride. (So, start AFTER book 50, say.) At least 1/2 the books spoof some current issue or problem in society or in the news. Websites for more info: http://www.internationalhero.co.uk/r/remo.htm (overview of character and series) http://www.sinanju.com/ http://www.destroyerclub.com/ http://www.sinanju.net/ I think #65, "Lost Yesterday", might appeal to you. This is the one where Remo deals with the "POWERESSENCE" movement (a spoof of Dianetics and L.Ron Hubbard). :D--> Looks like Sinanju.net has a quick overview of a lot of them, so you can look them over and decide what you want. Just remember it's light fiction, a pleasant diversion, or you'll be disappointed. Myself, I love the scene in 117 where Remo takes out Todd Grautski, the Collablaster (he mailbombs college students) while he's in jail, and takes out Kershaw Ferngard, the LIRR Killer at the same time because it's convenient. (Think a minute and you'll know who they spoofed.) Remo doesn't like BEING the Destroyer, but he occasionally enjoys moments (usually not officially assigned to him) when he takes out someone who really deserved it. Oh, and not my fault if you get sucked into the series. If you're buying fewer than one in ten, you don't have a "problem". :)-->

Ok, found the previous discussion on Dungeons & Dragons. Supposedly, the twi legend was that the game was "made by one of the Corps to gain better understanding of the spiritual world- then the idea was stolen." Zixar gave the following information in reply: Blackmoor was a famous supplement for the 1st edition D&D. So, Dave Arneson WAS one of the guys who DID do work on the original. However, the name ANY old-school player of D&D (basic or Advanced/AD&D) remembers is Gary Gygax. A number of the developers' names were snuck into the names of things in AD&D, such as the Chariot of Sustarre (a chariot of fire) and the Apparatus of Kwalish (a minisub). Since Arneson's name did not appear in that fashion, I'm suspicious of any claims he was THE big guy in developing the game. D&D was not developed in one afternoon by 2 guys with a big bottle of Mountain Dew and some dice. Tabletop generals had been playing all sorts of vaguely similar games for a long time. (In its own way, it's similar to "Risk" and "Stratego".) One board-game of that type involved movements of medieval armies. Rules were developed for THAT game, and it was known as "Chainmail." Further developments and improvements on "Chainmail" (which was itself an expansion of certain tabletopped games) resulted in 1st Edition D & D. I'd say further that most people who played it more than once played "AD&D", which was the "Advanced" game based on 1st Edition D&D. Dave Arneson worked on 1st Edition D & D and made significant contributions to it. Calling him "THE inventor" of the game, as you can see, is, at best, only slightly true. He's neither the "first" person who worked on it, nor the one who worked on it most, nor was there only ONE person at any stage. It's like claiming Henry Ford was "THE inventor of the automobile".

One of the newspaper articles has him claiming twi always keeps its mindless drones informed on everything. He said this without his tongue snapping off its roller, or his nose growing like Pinocchio.

Zixar and I got into a running debate over this. It's around here somewhere. Dungeons and Dragons was always Gary Gygax's baby and I NEVER heard of him taking it. I completely forget the substance of Zixar's replies, but they're around here SOMEWHERE....

For a lot less money, you can get BG Leonard's class, of which pfal was a bad xerox without any toner. It even includes Henry Belocco, Maggie Muggins and Johnny Jumpup.

You didn't tell us what promise was given you, which was confirmed with the Ft Lauderdale snow, nor what inanimate object (like gas pumps) you were unable to see due to whiteout.

(Nuts. I was all set to start posting more quotes from Hot Shots Part Deux until someone got it.)

Outandabout:

If I remember correctly, "before" can also be translated as "against". "Before the LORD" having the same meaning as the contemporary term "in the LORD's face." (This is completely different in meaning from when David danced before the LORD as a gesture of humility and praise before God.) ==== If we aren't meant to eat animals, why are they made of meat?"- Remo Williams, one of the Destroyer books. "PETA-People Eating Tasty Animals"

Thanks for the info. I keep forgetting. No, wrong guess. I'll give the others a few more hours before posting another quote.

Since he didn't post one, here's one... " ..Tojo, my fellow Americans, and our millions of illegal aliens. It seems like only yesterday that I was strafing so many of your homes. Here I am today, begging you not to make such good cars. " [Made a slight correction, but the essence of the quote was intact.]

X-Men Patrick Stewart Dune