WordWolf

With the Hawaiian greeting, I HAVE to go with "Hawaii Five-Oh", or Hawaii the 50th state. Mahalo aloha, or something like that.

See, this reminds me of the quotes you guys have posted from lcm's wap class, when he just invented connections between things that had no connections, and kept going from there. Seems someone confused "Babylon"-a country, an empire, etc with "Babel" as in "the Tower of Babel"- from which we get confused speech as "babble". Then they taught ck this, and he of course just memorized this without checking if it was correct. There is no connection between Babylon and Babel, nor Babylon and Baby, the woman in the Dirty Dancing movie. Similar-sounding names don't make them synonymous. Babylon never meant confusion-whether political or otherwise. They had enough organization to run an empire, which takes some doing. One of their leaders, Hammurabi, is famous to this day for expanding and codifying the existing laws of the time, and inscribing them where all citizens could read them- the Code of Hammurabi. I'm sure ck is unfamiliar with the Code of Hammurabi, despite some comparisons made between penalties under the Mosaic Law and the Hammurabic Code, observed by people like Bullinger in the Companion Bible. Poor education makes one prone to making mistakes like this. Babylon has had meanings involving empires and government, but not "confusion." That would be "Babel." Didn't need to try-the error leapt out at me. Plus relying on your observations of the GSC is not what most observers would consider "wise." And having confidence in God is a good thing. However, there is no LAW of Believing, and as stated in the Blue Book, it's completely incorrect. We've had non-confusing discussions on it a number of times. If you looked, you'd find some, but since you've taken the lazy way out, you won't.

What? Oh, no!!!!!!

The Most Right Reverend G. Gordon Godfrey is signalling me that he needs a break- no, wait-ANOTHER message, Most Right? "I cannot cease when Da Lawd has a message, I MUST speak! Potato, you need not concern yourself-you are not becoming more like your parents! And that wardrobe thing is hardly worthy of fretting over. However, you must be VERY careful when driving or riding in a car the next few weeks! I have seen a horse throwing its rider to the ground and stomping on them, and the interpretation is that there will be a car accident soon! We don't want to see you hurt, dear one! Be very careful!" *goes backstage* Looks like the MRR GGG needs a break.

Rascal, wait, he's got one for you, too! "Oh, Rascal... I see some sort of difficulty with a family member. No matter what, remember that they still love you. That health issue that's concerning you: God will deliver you from it in due time. Be steadfast and of a good courage. You can relax concerning money. He has said that-so long as you plan carefully- all will be well. You might wish to make a few career changes, however. Things could use a bit of a shot-in-the-arm. He is proud of you for all the personal growth you've done in the last few years. He is pleased with you." *goes back to his seat*

No, wait, he's got another message! *crawls back to the microphone* "I was stricken with a powerful message from God Almighty! He was warning that scoffers will come, as in the days of Noah! They will claim that my messages are not truly of Him who has sent them! They will try to turn you away from my message! Do not turn away from the messages of God Almighty- for the alternative is the outer darkness of ignorance, where there is no direction, and those in ignorance seek to drag you down to their level of ignorance! Pay no attention to them! Only in perfect obedience to His Will is safety! You must follow Him without question! And I will continue to give you His messages, of course!"

Raf, The Most Reverend is signalling me that you have a long, successful future as an extrapersonal prophet. Or something. Wait-he's signalling again. He's pointing to Belle. Most Reverend, has God sent you a message for her? "He has indeed! Oh, Belle, he is sending me a warning for you! I see betrayal! People close to you have taken advantage of you! Oh, dear Belle! You have suffered for your basic honesty! You have been offered opportunities that you have had offered to you in the past have had to be surrendered because you refused to take advantage of others! You have refused the temptations of filthy lucre! On the bright side is your hunger for knowledge. You like to read books and articles to improve your mind. In fact, if you're not already in some sort of personal service business, helping people, you should be. You must be-I see you helping people in an office. You have a deep, deep capacity for understanding people's problems and you can sympathize with them. But you are firm when confronted with obstinacy or outright stupidity. Your sense of justice is quite strong." *breaks down crying* I think we'll need to give MRR GGG a few minutes here. And a glass of water.

The Most Reverend G. Gordon Godfrey, are you getting a message for Raf? "I am indeed!" *steps down and places his hands over Raf* "The LORD, He is showing me something-He is showing me your past. Yes, you have always been a sensitive person, in tune with events around you. You chose well for a career, didn't you? When you were younger, you were different from other people that you knew. No, you did NOT fit in. You have always been a little on the outside of things. Your intuition is strong. Yes, you have always been a bit sensitive to God's Will in your life. You have occasionally dreamed of things before they happened, or at least had a strong sense of 'deja vu' under certain circumstances. In fact, you YOURSELF might have the calling of an extrapersonal prophet! You are also a caring and honest person, too much so at times. You've had difficulty in letting people get to know the real you. When you finally do let someone inside, you keep him or her close to you for a long time. In fact, right this minute, there is someone that you are close to that you are concerned about right now. Fear not. You worry too much. You can best help this person by continuing to be a positive influence in their life. Remain constant in prayer and remain ready to bless them. God Almighty has SPOKEN!" "Oh, and don't forget, I've prepared a DVD on hearing God's Will in your life. You can buy it at the door when you leave."

Step Right Up, Folks, and be the first one on your block to get your own Personal Prophecy! The first thing we need is the "right" personal prophet. Let's see... I introduce Rhea, the Medium! *stereotyped gypsy woman enters and does an elaborate salaam* Well done, Medium Rhea! However, in this PARTICULAR crowd, you don't have the "right" look, the look that they will accept. So, scram. *leaves* So, I introduce the Most Right Reverent G.Gordon Godfrey! *WASP enters with perfectly-ironed suit, and Brylcreemed hair* Perfect! We have the look, now we need the messages! Now, when practicing "curious arts", this process begins with what is called a "cold reading" or a "cold-read". That's when a person claims to use some supernatural power to divine a message, but instead uses their skill at studying people to figure out what the subject wants to hear, and then tells it to them. Next, we will need to package the message properly. MRR GGG will demonstrate. *steps forward, eyes clenched, face toward heaven, enraptured* *raises holy hands* "Yes, I see you reading this right this minute-God has shown me this. You have doubts about His messages that He is delivering to you via my ministry. Therefore, he has bidden me to give you this PERSONAL message, this message DIRECTLY to you from GOD ALMIGHTY, in which I am only a humble messenger. Here is the message. The Spirit of the LORD is upon me. He has anointed me with his message to you. At this hour, the LORD wishes you to know how He has a PERSONAL interest in your life-yes, YOUR life. He has followed you through ALL your days, and will now speak to YOU. He wishes to tell you that He is aware that some of your aspirations tend to be pretty unrealistic. He sees you, and knows that at times you are extroverted, affable, sociable, while at other times you are introverted, wary and reserved. The LORD sees that, and this is as it should be. Further, The LORD has seen your disappointments and broken trusts of the past. They have made you cautious in revealing yourself to others. You take pride in your ability to think for yourself, and do not accept others' opinions without satisfactory proof. As to satisfaction, you prefer a certain amount of change and variety, and become dissatisfied when hemmed in by restrictions and limitations. At times you have serious doubts as to whether you have made the right decision or done the right thing. Fear not. When you follow His will, which I will reveal to you, you will ALWAYS make the right decisions. You need no longer be worried on the inside, maintaining your control on the outside. Now, as to your personal life, your sexual adjustment has presented some problems for you. This is nothing you need concern yourself about unduly. While you have some personality weaknesses, you are generally able to compensate for them. Remember that in your weakness, His strength is made perfect. You have a great deal of unused capacity which you have not turned to your advantage. He is aware of this, and will present you opportunities to do so at the appointed hour. Be vigilant. You have a tendency to be critical of yourself. You have a strong need for other people to like you and for them to admire you. Neither of these should concern you, for The LORD, He sees you and accepts you, and as long as you follow His instructions-which He will give you through me, you will always please Him." Well, done, Most Right Reverend! Now then, you've seen his personal prophecy to you who's reading this right now. Are you convinced now? How else would he have learned all that about you if God hadn't revealed it to him? Ok, who will step up to receive a personal prophecy face-to-face from him?

So, in short, Belle, you're saying that twi insinuated itself into your personal life and marriage, and that twi and its practices and doctrines were the reasons for your divorce, since you wouldn't just blindly follow them, but your husband did, even when they badmouthed you... ....and you see a similarity in this and how the other divorce we are discussing fell out, correct? That Elizabeth was placed in a position where following her conscience resulted in CES/STFI insinuating themselves into her personal life and marriage, and invented and magnified problems- like inventing these so-called "personal prophecies"- specifically to either intimidate her into silence (forcing conformity), or to convince JAL that God Almighty has decided he should divorce, correct? Is that what you're saying?

Well, it's believed (with reason) among the ex-twi community that Jesus Christ had an earthly ministry of about a year, and it had a specific purpose with a specific goal. Contrast that with the apostles he chose, and the disciples who follwed him (about 120 at first) including Paul whom he chose personally, who had years to put things into practice. That's not to say that studying how Jesus did things when here is without merit- FAR FROM IT. However, it's easier to find examples of practice in Acts, to find recommendations or reproof in the Epistles, so chalk that down partly to practicality, and partly to laziness. A separate issue is the disdain for the Gospels inculcated by vpw, which penetrated deep into the twi mentality, and has affected all the twi survivors and their teachings, to greater or lesser degrees. (Some have made concerted efforts to overcome that, many have not.) So, those are reasons. They may not all be GOOD reasons, but there you go.

Oh, the part addressed to Mark was really nice and heartfelt. The part where he blew us off-that showed his heart as well, but not in a manner I'd call "great".... Caught that too, did you? But labelling us provides the excuse to skip the dialogue, and just release letters that just happen to appear here inexplicably... I addressed this above, and I hope you caught it.... I AM glad he said something-that I agree with... This bore repeating. Seems when someone took him up on his word here, his actions have NOT matched his words.

This is a letter (position paper) from John Lynn. Posted with permission. As I see it, this is JAL managing to write a reply to the GSC without changing his position of"I don't reply to the GSC." "Oh, this is information I want to get out publickly, and you should ask God before releasing it in any format." I detect a distinct "wink-wink" in that. Either JAL wrote this with the express purpose of seeing it appear here, or he didn't. A) If JAL wrote this with the express purpose of seeing it appear here, he did so with the little disclaimers at the beginning and the end saying "I don't communicate with people on the GSC" while writing a response he expected to be communicated with the people on the GSC. This doesn't strike me as particularly HONEST and without ARTIFICE. If I was paying money to CES/STFI, I'd question why leadership would feel the need to be intentionally less than honest in their dealings with me or anyone else. Does God sanction dishonest dealings with the family? How about when they're not in OUR ORGANIZATION-does it become sanctioned then? B) If JAL did NOT write this knowing that it would appear in THE single biggest avenue of communication where the CES/STFI people are getting information about the inner workings of their own group and the sole venue for discussing it (and personally, I think both of THOSE are important points in and of themselves) then he demonstrated a lack of understanding that I think makes him unsuited to leading a group in anything more detailed than a song. "Oh, I had no idea it would end up at the GSC when I wrote it." Give me a break. I find it hardly credible he's that obtuse. (Others may disagree with me, and simply think he was HONEST, but LACK VISION.) ================== And here's the part that's directed directly to us. But not by name. Because he's not talking to us. He's just using a megaphone to carry on a conversation right near us. Let's look at this a bit. "A brief p.s. to critics of Spirit & Truth Fellowship:" Translation: 'This is to the GSC, whose only purpose in here is to attack us with critical statements.' Or, in other words, 'the GSC has nothing positive to offer in this discussion, which we've been forced to have largely because of them opening up communication we were trying to close.' "Given the way that documents such as this somehow wind up on the Internet, " Translation: 'I don't write this with the INTENT it ends up on the GSC, but it might SOMEHOW end up there anyway. SOMEHOW.' Or, in other words, 'I write this with no plans to see it on the GSC, but I'll address them anyway in case it "somehow" ends up there.' Honest? What do you guys think? "let me say a few things to our detractors who will use this current situation in STF to say “I told you so,” take potshots at us, and magnify our flaws above the good we are doing for people." Translation: 'Let me make it clear that discussion at the GSC does nothing but magnify our flaws, and especially take cheap shots at us.' Or, in other words, 'You guys have nothing to offer here other than complaints.' "First, God bless you, I love you." Translation: 'Since saying negative things about you would detract from my image that I'm a heckuva nice guy, I'll follow up my initial disguised shot at you all by saying something pious.' It reminds me of a complaint I saw once about a poster on one messageboard. At the end of lengthy posts talking down to all other Christians, they posted their signature, "God bless you." People found that hypocritical at the time. How genuine THIS is, I leave to each reader to decide. Me, I do not think it is 100% false, but I find the evidence makes accepting this as 100% to be unsupportable. "Second, be sure you know enough truth about the issues to make a rational judgment." Translation: 'I'm going to state the obvious-know the truth before making any decisions, so as to demonstrate I'm a reasonable man. Of course, I hardly wanted anyone to HEAR the truth on any of this, but that's not important right now.' Personally, I find the timing of this statement rather convenient. It's a good idea in general, but at this moment, I see it going somewhere. "Third, get close enough to the nucleus of STF leadership to see their hearts before you impugn them." Translation: 'Stop criticizing us as making bad decisions or ungodly decisions or harmful decisions until you get to know us PERSONALLY over an EXTENDED period of time.' Meant to quell discussion by the majority of people, it's as sensible as saying we can't ever discuss Paul the Apostle since none of us know him personally-only by his writings (and one side-comment from Peter, whom we don't know personally either.) Knowing "their hearts" on a subject may help explain WHY they make a boneheaded decision, but is irrelevant to whether or not a decision IS boneheaded, which is one of the main things we're discussing here. I also find it ironic that harmful talk of people, called "personal prophecy", was sometimes given to people who the speaker did NOT know, and that was fine for years, but to say so is "impugning" the speaker. I might consider there to be an element of hypocrisy present. " Fourth, take an honest look at what we teach from the Word about whatever subjects are pertinent to this matter, like prophecy. Prophecy is prophecy, and to criticize “personal prophecy” as unbiblical, in and of itself, is contrary to Scripture. We have a book on Prophecy that deals with this subject in depth from the Word, which you can get from www.stfonline.org." Translation: 'Our doctrine is correct no matter what you say. 'Personal prophecy' has ALWAYS been correct, and we will continue to defend it as true no matter what. Our position on 'personal prophecy' is sound doctrine. Oh, and buy our book.' I never heard the leadership apologize for Momentus, or admit it was a bad idea or harmful to the brethren. It was just quietly dropped, and ANY inquiries were stifled with the famous "talking evil" party line. Now 'personal prophecy' is being defended with fervor. Leadership seems to find it approaching impossible to admit to the possibility of making bad decisions as a whole. Considering what's on the table now, that strikes me as mildly ironic. "In that vein, the reason I remain totally committed to Spirit and Truth Fellowship International is because I can find no one else with the “package” we have to offer, and I know the true heart with which we present it, as well as the liberating impact it has had on people around the world during the past 20 years." Translation: 'Be loyal to the ministry that taught you The Word. If not for us, you'd wander in darkness without any accurate Word.' Fine, that's a SLIGHT exaggeration. But it's only a small step from here to there. Plus, it says that the people who were HARMED over the past 20 years are an acceptable consequence for defending 'the ministry', since this thing seems to ONLY have positive results on people. "You will have to judge for yourself whether what we teach is sound doctrine, and whether we practice it in love." Doesn't this contradict where he JUST DECLARED 'personal prophecy' was sound doctrine? "But you cannot do that from afar. I encourage you to dig into our work, and I exhort you to “stay tuned” and see if the hand of God is on us. Watch and see where He takes this ministry in the days ahead. I do hope that among the millions whose lives we hope to touch, we will be able to bless you, the only you God has." Translation: 'You can't judge our doctrine by just reading it and comparing it to Scripture- you will need to interact with us for months in detail, and buy our stuff, before making any judgements. Did I forget to mention you're a fabulous human being?' I'm getting whiplash! First I was scum for even DISCUSSING error, then whether or not it's error is up to me, then I'm a great guy! "As to what is flying around cyberspace about me and my personal life, my email is jalces@aol.com and my home phone is 317-849-5707." Translation:'I only dialogue with people in private, so I can control the discussion.' " If you know me and care about me, I’ll be glad to communicate with you." Naturally, I remain the final arbiter as to whether or not you know me and care about me, and reserve the right to refuse private discussion with you entirely. " I will not, however, dialogue with anonymous people who lack the love and courage to identify themselves in interacting with me." Translation: 'And those people who use screen-names, they're scum and have nothing to offer. The only reasons they can maintain anonymity are because they lack love and courage.' Gee, wasn't I a great guy a few sentences ago? One might think that JAL was exercising the tactic known as "poisoning the well", attempting to label a source of information so that its genuine merits would be ignored.

Correct! That first quote and last long exchange was from the episode "KITT vs KARR", when the Knight Industries Two Thousand met his evil predecessor, the Knight Automated Roving Robot. The second one included the name of the inventor. Go, George!

"Remember Zeno and that immovable object thing? We're about to find out that answer." "Your lives mean nothing to me!" "What the hell was that?" "A Pontiac!" "Whats all this?!....looks like Darth Vader's bathroom!" "I bet you're tall and dark and handsome." "I'm definitely dark and handsome.I'm only tall when I'm climbing a steep incline." ""You are about as much fun as a divorce, which is not a bad idea!" "I want custody of me! " "I mean, you're a regular - real thing. Not just something out of a nightmare, like you looked last night." "Nothing has changed since last night." "Oh, yeah. That's easy for you to say. Wh-Where did you come from, anyway? And how did you get in that building?" "That edifice was the laboratory... where I was first activated... and where I was also... deactivated." "Deactivated? You mean somebody turned you off?" "My creator, Wilton Knight. He brought me into the world and then turned on me." "Aww. Take it easy. Take it easy. My old man - same way." "Yeah. You can't count on nobody 'cept me and Tony." "Interesting. I will enter that information in my databanks. I am indebted to both of you. You have reactivated me. How may I serve you?" "Serve us? What do you mean, serve us?" "I have checked my data on basic human desires. Therefore, I understand your needs." "Come on." "You wish to eat?" "Well, yeah." "You wish to drink?" "Yeah." "You wish to reproduce?" "Yeah." "Which one first?" "How about a couple - couple of eggs, sunny side up?" "I have no eggs. Perhaps you can direct me to a chicken." "Ah, what are you? A comedian? "

"Remember Zeno and that immovable object thing? We're about to find out that answer." "Your lives mean nothing to me!" "What the hell was that?" "A Pontiac!" "Whats all this?!....looks like Darth Vader's bathroom!" "I bet you're tall and dark and handsome." "I'm definitely dark and handsome."

My favourite scene like that was when BA watched them, switched milk with Murdock, watched Murdock fall asleep, drank Murdock's milk, laughing, then fell asleep as Murdock got back up....

It would be nice to hear from everyone. However, they are well aware of this discussion, and obviously have elected not to participate at this time-not even to issue a press release. (This may of course change at any time.) So, the refusal to make a response is IN ITSELF a response. They prefer to keep their position NON-SPECIFIC, nebulous. They prefer to keep their position OPEN TO INTERPRETATION. The prefer to have people SPECULATE as to their position. That in itself is an answer.

Congrats and congrats! (Plus the guts to admit to the karaoke...)

If you were a teenager when it was airing, you missed a lot. It was a fun action show with some McGuyvering elements (they often improvised very effective technology from what was at hand), and they fired guns and rockets and all kinds of stuff, and managed to stop their pursuit without even one casualty to them, the military, or the episode's villains. George Peppard was Hannibal Smith, who was a disguise expert, & tactician. "I love it when a plan comes together." Mr T was BA "Bad Attitude" Baracus, strongman, driver, and technician. He never wanted to fly. Dwight Schultz was HM "Howling Mad" Murdock, pilot and presumably insane resident of a VA Hospital, and the reason BA hated to fly. Dirk Benedict was Templeton Peck "Faceman", con artist and technician. They had a few different people, not from their original team, who joined as fifth members during the run of the show.

On a different subject entirely, I read a different Christian (Tim LaHaye addressing a pre-Tribulation Rapture) mention this gambit. He considered it a particularly cheap ploy: to claim that noted proponents for one position made a deathbed conversion to the opposite position, known only to one person, and never anyone close to that. He gave an example where one theologian was claimed to have changed his belief in one position, and the only proof was an off-hand comment supposedly made to a near-total stranger, years before he died, whereas he actually continued to teach his PREVIOUS position for several more years, and even his family heard him to hold it til his death. It's an old gambit, to claim soneone SECRETLY held a position different from one he publickly has held, and there is no documentary evidence for, to have him support your position from his grave.

We can't agree that half were. All Kenyon's books were NOT. All Bullinger's books were NOT. "Are the Dead Alive Now?" was from books like ""The Rich Man and Lazarus: An Intermediate State?" and "Saul and the Witch at Endor: Did the Dead Rise at Her Bidding?", complete with the question format. THOSE were SURELY known to vpw-he read ALL Bullinger's stuff. But they were left out when he saw to it the Companion Bible was in the bookstore. Stiles: the casual references to him say NOTHING of the complete transfer of the contents of Stiles' book into "vpw's book", which doesn't even name him ONCE. Further, the early editions of "vpw's book" say a man taught vpw, and later ones say he learned it all without a teacher. Finally, the ONLY reference vpw made to LEONARD was buried in one book and said the man was "not good with The Word", which is a GUARANTEE that twi people will have no interest in him. This was a deliberate lie, as Mrs W later pointed out that he taught them plenty of "Word", and that the "original pfal" class was Leonard's class with vpw's name on it, NEVER MENTIONING LEONARD. Why take Stiles' name off Stiles' book and put your own instead? Why bind 2 books of Bullinger together, strip his name, and put your own instead? Why take Leonard's name off Leonard's class, and put your own instead? INTENT.... INTENT.... (edited to correct the name "Leonard".)

No, that's BA Baracus from the "A-Team." They always had to trick him to get on a plane, usually by drugging him, occasionally by hypnosis ("Eclipse!") or something else.

Sniper got the target with one bullet at range! Sheriff Bart replies to a whispered suggestion from Miss Lilly Von Shtupp with that line. Go, Ca Dreaming!

Correct! Descent PART ONE. Troi got to say the dangerous "I've found something" line and not die (unlike the old redshirts of ST:TOS), Picard revisits his old "Locutus of Borg" name when interrogating a Borg (unsuccessfully), and Data has a poker game on the holodeck with Albert Einstein, Sir Isaac Newton, and Stephen Hawking. Stephen Hawking becomes the only person to play HIMSELF on an episode of ST, AND wins a poker hand against Albert Einstein. :) Go, Raf!