WordWolf

Here's how the quotes fell. "Out of the tree of life, I just picked me a plum You came along and everything started to hum Still it’s a real good bet, the best is yet to come The best is yet to come, and babe won’t that be fine You think you’ve seen the sun, but you ain’t seen it shine" Sisko, at the end of the episode. "Looking good, as usual, dollface." "I'm glad you like what you see." "I only wish I could see more." "They say good things come to those who wait." "Who are 'they' and how much of you have they seen?" "I never kiss and tell." "I bet you don't." Kira and "Frankie Eyes," mobster. "Tonight everyone's a winner." Sisko, providing an emergency distraction by throwing money into the air and getting the crowd to go crazy grabbing it. "It's a 'jack-in-the-box.'" Felix's 'jack-in-the-box' program was the source of all the trouble. "It's not the same thing..." "It is to me. This is my life, remember? I don't run at the first sign of trouble." "No one's asking you to run. We're just asking you to stay out of sight for a few days while we come up with a plan." They asked Vic to lay low while they sought a solution. "I don't look good in buckskin." Very beginning, when Miles and Julian invited Vic to their Alamo holoprogram. "You believe this guy?" "No manners." "Were you born in a barn or something?" "Is this gentleman a friend of yours?" "We know each other." Frankie Eyes and Cicci arrive. "Does it matter? You like going there. I don't. Let's leave it at that." "I was only asking..." "And I gave you my answer." "There are times when I just can't figure you out." "Isn't that part of the attraction?" "Believe that if you want to." Sisko, not explaining to Cassidy why he doesn't like Vic's. "Don't take it personally. He thought he was doing me a favor... you know, by not letting things get boring." "I thought that was my job." "And you're great at it. You know we luv ya." Complaining about Felix' jack-in-the-box. "I don't miss a trick." "You sound very sure of yourself." "Doubt is for losers." "You're quite a philosopher." "I'm thinking of writing a book." "Have you got a title?" "Maybe you can help me think one up." "My talents lie in other directions." "Good title. Mind if I use it? "I'd say you've already paid for it." Frankie Eyes and Kira. "Whatever you decide to do, Chief, count me in. I owe Vic. I thought losing my leg was the end of my Starfleet career. He taught me otherwise." "He changed my life, too. And Odo's." Nog and Kira, volunteering. "I'm telling you, Morn..... there's something going on in Vic's that we don't know about." Quark, seeing the senior staff stalk past him. "Look... this is not about Vic Fontaine." "Then what's your problem?" "You want to know? I'll tell you. It's Las Vegas, nineteen sixty- two! That's my problem..... ...In nineteen sixty-two, brown people weren't made to feel very welcome there.... ...Oh, sure they could be performers or janitors, but customers? Never." "Maybe it was like that in the real Vegas, but that's not how it is at Vic's. I've never felt uncomfortable there -- and neither has Jake." "But don't you see, that's the lie. In nineteen sixty-two, the Civil Rights movement was still in its infancy. It wasn't an easy time for our people and I don't want to pretend that it was." "Baby -- I know Vic's isn't a totally accurate representation of how things were. But it isn't meant to be. It shows the way things could've been. The way they should've been." "We can't ignore the truth about the past." "Going to Vic's isn't going to make us forget who we are or where we came from. What it does is remind us that we're no longer bound by any limitations---except the ones we impose on ourselves." Sisko and Cassidy discussing history vs learning from it.

I was hoping for a bit more description, but I'll take it. Yes, this is "Bada-Bing, Bada-Bang." The end of the episode is when SISKO sings the song. The song's a little symbolic of what Cassidy said about their potential not being bound by limitations. The scene when the senior staff stalks through Quark's, all in formal wear, which prompts Quark to note SOMETHING's up, stayed with a lot of fans. I can still hear the music that played as they walked in. :) The episode referenced both Nog, and Odo and Kira, owing Vic. Go, George!

I've always told you, Mike, I do my best to portray you ACCURATELY, whether or not I agree with you. To be fair, I think I've portrayed you FAR more ACCURATELY than you've portrayed me, but I don't let that stop me from doing my best to be honest.

Thing is, remember, a conman has to be CONVINCING. If a conman really wants to do a successful con, he has to convince HIMSELF it's true. I think vpw worked so hard at his con for so long, that he genuinely thought that whatever he thought, said or did was the RIGHT thing, and just constructed rationalizations afterward-if at all. I believe what someone said-that, as his hours dwindled to their final few, that he really was trying to figure out where what he did was less than perfect- and was unable to see anything present itself.... I think THIS is what happened. It was ALWAYS about vpw, remember. With him getting older, and considering retirement (one way or another), he thought that he could hand down the entire package to some of his genetic offspring, sustaining a vpw DYNASTY, wrought from the Incredible Things he, all by himself, had done.

Wait-it gets SICKER. Later, we have people-who post on this messageboard- who can read all this and INSIST that-since nobody pointed a weapon at her- that this wasn't COERCION. She was escorted BODILY from where she was, all the way into the doctor's office. The entire time, she's told how God Almighty REQUIRES her to do this, and it's not a big deal. When she REFUSES the first time, they PHYSICALLY ESCORT HER BACK and DEMAND she comply. Can anyone of sound mind still say that isn't coercion? Read that aloud to anyone who's never heard of vpw and ask them how much "choice" the person had.

For someone who never likes to hear comments like that about the posts of others, this was a childish insult to throw at someone who knew vpw on a MUCH more personal basis than you ever did, who interacted with him a LOT more than you ever did. In case anyone missed it, I'm letting Mike's assertions stand out. The twi inner circle were the best God could do, people-wise, in 2000 years, according to Mike. There it is again. Later, we'll get the story that the pfal books that these people worked on are NOW THE Word of God, a sort-of Bible 2.0, superior to any printed Bible for communicating THE Truths of God Almighty. It has REPLACED the printed Bibles as the communication of God. Mike's referring to one of the last teachings vpw did. I shall summarize what he said, very simply. A) There's no real truth out among other Christians. B) The greatest thing to do is to serve people. C) The greatest thing to serve people is God's Word, via twigs and pfal classes and twi functions. D) The greatest preparation to do that is to study the pfal books and classes. This whole "the pfal books are greater than anything that ANY Christians have EVER done and replaced the Bible" stuff is unique to Mike and a bare handful of people. Mike's throwing this in to drum up interest in it, to see if anyone else will "buy" what he's selling. This IS a commercial. Mike wants to convince people that HIS answers are THE Answers of GOD ALMIGHTY.

"Out of the tree of life, I just picked me a plum You came along and everything started to hum Still it’s a real good bet, the best is yet to come The best is yet to come, and babe won’t that be fine You think you’ve seen the sun, but you ain’t seen it shine" "Looking good, as usual, dollface." "I'm glad you like what you see." "I only wish I could see more." "They say good things come to those who wait." "Who are 'they' and how much of you have they seen?" "I never kiss and tell." "I bet you don't." "Tonight everyone's a winner." "It's a 'jack-in-the-box.'" "It's not the same thing..." "It is to me. This is my life, remember? I don't run at the first sign of trouble." "No one's asking you to run. We're just asking you to stay out of sight for a few days while we come up with a plan." "I don't look good in buckskin." "You believe this guy?" "No manners." "Were you born in a barn or something?" "Is this gentleman a friend of yours?" "We know each other." "Does it matter? You like going there. I don't. Let's leave it at that." "I was only asking..." "And I gave you my answer." "There are times when I just can't figure you out." "Isn't that part of the attraction?" "Believe that if you want to." "Don't take it personally. He thought he was doing me a favor... you know, by not letting things get boring." "I thought that was my job." "And you're great at it. You know we luv ya." "I don't miss a trick." "You sound very sure of yourself." "Doubt is for losers." "You're quite a philosopher." "I'm thinking of writing a book." "Have you got a title?" "Maybe you can help me think one up." "My talents lie in other directions." "Good title. Mind if I use it? "I'd say you've already paid for it." "Whatever you decide to do, Chief, count me in. I owe Vic. I thought losing my leg was the end of my Starfleet career. He taught me otherwise." "He changed my life, too. And Odo's." "I'm telling you, Morn..... there's something going on in Vic's that we don't know about." "Look... this is not about Vic Fontaine." "Then what's your problem?" "You want to know? I'll tell you. It's Las Vegas, nineteen sixty- two! That's my problem..... ...In nineteen sixty-two, brown people weren't made to feel very welcome there.... ...Oh, sure they could be performers or janitors, but customers? Never." "Maybe it was like that in the real Vegas, but that's not how it is at Vic's. I've never felt uncomfortable there -- and neither has Jake." "But don't you see, that's the lie. In nineteen sixty-two, the Civil Rights movement was still in its infancy. It wasn't an easy time for our people and I don't want to pretend that it was." "Baby -- I know Vic's isn't a totally accurate representation of how things were. But it isn't meant to be. It shows the way things could've been. The way they should've been." "We can't ignore the truth about the past." "Going to Vic's isn't going to make us forget who we are or where we came from. What it does is remind us that we're no longer bound by any limitations---except the ones we impose on ourselves."

No, it isn't. It REFERRED to that episode....

"Out of the tree of life, I just picked me a plum You came along and everything started to hum Still it’s a real good bet, the best is yet to come The best is yet to come, and babe won’t that be fine You think you’ve seen the sun, but you ain’t seen it shine" "Looking good, as usual, dollface." "I'm glad you like what you see." "I only wish I could see more." "They say good things come to those who wait." "Who are 'they' and how much of you have they seen?" "I never kiss and tell." "I bet you don't." "Tonight everyone's a winner." "It's a 'jack-in-the-box.'" "It's not the same thing..." "It is to me. This is my life, remember? I don't run at the first sign of trouble." "No one's asking you to run. We're just asking you to stay out of sight for a few days while we come up with a plan." "I don't look good in buckskin." "You believe this guy?" "No manners." "Were you born in a barn or something?" "Is this gentleman a friend of yours?" "We know each other." "Does it matter? You like going there. I don't. Let's leave it at that." "I was only asking..." "And I gave you my answer." "There are times when I just can't figure you out." "Isn't that part of the attraction?" "Believe that if you want to." "Don't take it personally. He thought he was doing me a favor... you know, by not letting things get boring." "I thought that was my job." "And you're great at it. You know we luv ya." "I don't miss a trick." "You sound very sure of yourself." "Doubt is for losers." "You're quite a philosopher." "I'm thinking of writing a book." "Have you got a title?" "Maybe you can help me think one up." "My talents lie in other directions." "Good title. Mind if I use it? "I'd say you've already paid for it." "Whatever you decide to do, Chief, count me in. I owe Vic. I thought losing my leg was the end of my Starfleet career. He taught me otherwise." "He changed my life, too. And Odo's."

[WordWolf replies in boldface.]

Well, if one wants a Bible that has the closest relation to the texts into English, the New Revised Standard is #1, with the New American Standard Bible, and the Revised Standard, then coming up the rear's the Contemporary English and the New International. If one wants a Bible that has the italics, there's the King James, the New King James, and the New American Standard Bible. If one wants a Bible that translates the same word into the same word more often, then that strength has been criticized of the New American Standard Bible. In short, the New American Standard Bible is about the best Bible one can find in English. It's one of the very best for general usage, and for italics fans, it is far, far better than the KJV and NKJV. However, some people have chosen the KJV, and they will stay with it no matter what, just as some others chose the NIV and will stay with it no matter what. That's a shame, since both can easily find Bibles that would serve them better (The NRSV over the NIV, the NASB over the KJV.)

It's sounding vaguely familiar. I don't have the name yet.

With all the brochures and recommendations that anyone who COULD, SHOULD 1) take the Advanced class 2) go wow 3) go corps Most ESPECIALLY "go corps", why was there ONE set of truths (the brochures) and ANOTHER set of truths (hearsay). What kind of program documents ONE thing, and relies on THE RUMOR MILL to get the REAL story out to applicants? Is this how HONEST programs are run? Is this INTEGRITY?

"Out of the tree of life, I just picked me a plum You came along and everything started to hum Still it’s a real good bet, the best is yet to come The best is yet to come, and babe won’t that be fine You think you’ve seen the sun, but you ain’t seen it shine" "Looking good, as usual, dollface." "I'm glad you like what you see." "I only wish I could see more." "They say good things come to those who wait." "Who are 'they' and how much of you have they seen?" "I never kiss and tell." "I bet you don't." "Tonight everyone's a winner." "It's a 'jack-in-the-box.'" "It's not the same thing..." "It is to me. This is my life, remember? I don't run at the first sign of trouble." "No one's asking you to run. We're just asking you to stay out of sight for a few days while we come up with a plan." "I don't look good in buckskin." "You believe this guy?" "No manners." "Were you born in a barn or something?" "Is this gentleman a friend of yours?" "We know each other." "Does it matter? You like going there. I don't. Let's leave it at that." "I was only asking..." "And I gave you my answer." "There are times when I just can't figure you out." "Isn't that part of the attraction?" "Believe that if you want to." "Don't take it personally. He thought he was doing me a favor... you know, by not letting things get boring." "I thought that was my job." "And you're great at it. You know we luv ya." "I don't miss a trick." "You sound very sure of yourself." "Doubt is for losers." "You're quite a philosopher." "I'm thinking of writing a book." "Have you got a title?" "Maybe you can help me think one up." "My talents lie in other directions." "Good title. Mind if I use it? "I'd say you've already paid for it."

They were serving him BETTER BEFORE their participation in twi. Distorting what I said doesn't change what I said-it just shows you're either unable or unwilling to read it and understand it. MOST posters have no difficulty with that. Ever wonder why you do, so often?

I've noticed that this supposedly thorough process is the one that has resulted in you putting forth that vpw had "an OVERabundance of brains and brawn", that he was "OVERgifted", and that "where he walked, the earth shook." It's also the same process that has led you to conclude that the pfal books are more "God's Word" than any modern Bible is. It's also the same process that led you to claim-and NOT joking- that "When JC returns, he will be holding a copy of the Orange Book and teaching you from it." (The first time I read that, my immediate response was "Ok, he has a sense of humor, at least." But you later clarified you were "very serious" about that, and had "seen him many times this way myself." ========= If a computer program is designed to perform numerical calculations- it's a calculator- and this program ends up resulting in incorrect calculations- the numbers are wrong- then, no matter how excellent the program sounds, it is a FLAWED PROGRAM and an ERROR. I'm NOT going to use it to perform what it's designed to do- it leads to false conclusions and is thus PROVEN FALSE.

I think she's entitled "to play the victim card" if you've already played the "I'm going to be a d1ck card" and deliberately distorted the meaning of what she said, and kept on doing it.

Or even just of God! How far would the House of Acts have reached- H33fn3r, D00p, Fug1t, the others- if they'd continued their work unto God without anyone convincing them to leave the BEST cause (serving God) to serve a supposedly GOOD cause (serving someone who claims to serve God)?

"A scorpion once requested a favor from a camel. The scorpion wanted to cross a deep river but could not find any way to do so. Seeing a camel nearby, the scorpion approached him and asked the camel to carry him across. The camel refused, saying, “You will sting me.”"No, no. I am an ethical scorpion. I promise I won’t sting you.” The camel agreed and, taking the scorpion on his hump, began crossing the river. Halfway across, the scorpion suddenly stung the camel. “Why did you do that?” the camel asked. “Now we will both die.” “What can I say?” the scorpion replied. “It’s my nature.”" ======== "A man was walking along a dusty path. He came upon an injured snake which asked for his help. The man replied, "I'd love to help you but you are a snake and everyone knows that a snake cannot be trusted. If I help you I fear that once you are better you will bring great harm upon me." The snake assured him that he would not do so and would be forever grateful.The man against his better judgment decided he would help the snake. He cared for him and nourished him back to health. Each day he would bring food to the snake and they would share time together. One day the man came to the snake who was now fully recovered and upon approaching him to provide food, the snake attacked him with a deadly and death assured bite. The man looked upon the snake and asked "But why? I helped you, I nourished you, I trusted you. Why did you do this terrible thing to me?" The snake replied "But my foolish man, you knew I was a snake when you picked me up!"

Let's check the timeline..... "In 1948, vpw was issued a "Doctorate" from Pikes Peak Seminary, an organization lacking accreditation and formal classes (among other things.)" "According to his published memorial, Bishop KC Pillai took PFAL in 1954, and began teaching a class on"Orientalisms of the Bible". (Pillai also wrote 3 small books: "Light Through an Eastern Window" and Volumes I and II of "Orientalisms of the Bible.") According to the memorial in 1985, 1955 was the year they officially chartered "the Way". In 1955, JP was born. 2 months later, VPW left JP with family for the next year or so, and took his wife and eldest son on a tour of the mission fields in India, on the Evangelical and Reformed Church's dime.(1955-1957) (Per TW:LIL) He was irritated that he's reminded he is not officially designated as a spokesman or investigator of theirs. According to his account in TW:LIL, he there met Bishop KC Pillai, whom he later invited to teach. " Supposed "Doctorate". 1948. Tour of India, 1955-1956, or 1955-1957, depending on the source (TW:LiL or twi's memorial of vpw.)

Actually, his account had an entirely different thrust, one that made HIM, HIM PERSONALLY, a big-shot. Supposedly the ONLY man who had engaged such a tour with his whole family.... (making one son a "next-door-neighbor", I suppose, since he was NOT on the tour, and vpw said he took his "WHOLE" family.... Supposedly, the only Christian to be asked to address the Jain Convention... Supposedly, welcomed everywhere BECAUSE HE WAS UNAFFILIATED and just wanted to teach the Bible, when actually it was his AFFILIATION he relied on to get ANY invites and respect.... The upshot is, vpw and Mrs W end up giving DRAMATICALLY DIFFERENT ACCOUNTS of the same events. Naturally, you're going to pretend they don't, or claim vpw's was pre-eminent. Or change the subject and pretend you don't.

As far as Oldies was concerned, only part of the last sentence mattered.... "TWI sucked our lives, our youth, our finances, and our opportunities away...at 35 we wake up and realize that we have squat to show for all of those years of diligent service." As far as Oldies was concerned, only part of a sentence mattered... "I don't blame twi for anything." Notice how the post BEGAN by pointing out the utter DIShonesty and lack of mutual respect is involved in the MISrepresentation of other people by clipping parts of sentences out of the context they needed. Sometimes, if one is honest, one CAN find a short quote whose meaning does not change when pulled from its context. In both of these cases, that's not the case-as everyone except Oldies can see. How honest is this? This honest: Psalm 14:1 "There is no God" ======= Can someone take true words, and selectively distort their meaning until they become a lie? Matthew 4:5-6 "5Then the devil taketh him up into the holy city, and setteth him on a pinnacle of the temple, 6And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone." The devil quoted true words-Scripture- and selectively distorted their meaning until they became a lie. ==== Seems to me one key towards remaining a vpw supporter even AFTER learning that his supposed unique connection to God was simply large-scale plagiarism, and his supposed stance as a man of God concealed a man who conspired to treat women of God as merchandise, making elaborate plans to select some as "better" victims, separate them out, assemble a place to victimize them, an elaborate -and STANDARDIZED- script for victimizing them, the elaborate "exit" strategy that kept some silent, and victimized those who WOULD speak further by ostracizing them and silencing them, plus the absence of conscience it would take to even seriously consider any of this..... is, in turn, to follow vpw's own teachings and shut off one's OWN conscience. Once you can manage that, the cries for help from the victims are easy to ignore, the blood on vpw's hands washes away with a little soap and water, and his lies and utter fraud can just be ignored. It's the SAME absence of conscience that allows one to deliberately take honest words and twist them into a lie. Someone like this, when faced with someone hurt, victimized, and feeling no way out, could easily push them back to be ground up by the machinery of the exploitation machine. I thank my God I can't deceive like that. For many people, twi WAS like this. I was too much a maverick at heart, too much an idealist, to stick around when they started to try to pull those in my direction. I did a hard analysis of what was at hq, and coming from lcm's mouth, and the mouths of those he selected to speak, and found it was far from what I joined twi for. So I left.

"Out of the tree of life, I just picked me a plum You came along and everything started to hum Still it’s a real good bet, the best is yet to come The best is yet to come, and babe won’t that be fine You think you’ve seen the sun, but you ain’t seen it shine" "Looking good, as usual, dollface." "I'm glad you like what you see." "I only wish I could see more." "They say good things come to those who wait." "Who are 'they' and how much of you have they seen?" "I never kiss and tell." "I bet you don't." "Tonight everyone's a winner." "It's a 'jack-in-the-box.'" "It's not the same thing..." "It is to me. This is my life, remember? I don't run at the first sign of trouble." "No one's asking you to run. We're just asking you to stay out of sight for a few days while we come up with a plan." "I don't look good in buckskin." "You believe this guy?" "No manners." "Were you born in a barn or something?" "Is this gentleman a friend of yours?" "We know each other." "Does it matter? You like going there. I don't. Let's leave it at that." "I was only asking..." "And I gave you my answer." "There are times when I just can't figure you out." "Isn't that part of the attraction?" "Believe that if you want to." "Don't take it personally. He thought he was doing me a favor... you know, by not letting things get boring." "I thought that was my job." "And you're great at it. You know we luv ya."

"Space Oddity", by David Bowie. Was he talking about a real astronaut, or someone on a drug trip? We will never know for sure.....

Hey! In high school, there was this bookstore that had a few video games in it up on Jerome Avenue, right by the Concourse!