WordWolf

Just to clear things up and avoid misunderstanding your position.... Do you think it's possible to forgive those despicable people for what they did, and still discuss what they did, warn others to avoid the same trap, and discuss what happened to help others understand why they had to leave or were kicked out? Or does your definition of "forgiveness" mean we would be forbidden to discuss any of that, and accept that if anyone wants to wander into twi nowadays, it's wrong for us to tell them what they're getting into? It's possible you mean either position, and there's some assumptions about what you mean taking place.

First of all, I think Paw and Dan's advice have the correct information and solution in them. Second of all, I agree with Dan-if you look at the same page under Firefox and there's no problem, it's OBVIOUSLY in your IE settings that the problem lies. Third of all, it never hurts to have good programs clean out the pc. I forget if you have the usual programs, but I always recommend, besides a firewall and antivirus (you can get good, free ones of both and I'm sure you have one of each), there's SpywareBlaster Spybot:Search and Destroy AdAware. There's also decent Registry cleaners like Clean My Registry. I'm sure you already downloaded all the updates to Windows that are security-related, when they were released or soon after that.

I know that sometimes teenagers were shown it, under the age of 18. I'm not aware of anyone pre-teen being shown it.

That's it- "the Pegasus", both the ship and the episode. My first comment was -what, when a ship ends up missing, it's always "the Pegasus!" That's because the old Battlestar Galactica's missing Battlestar was the Pegasus, and this ship was the Pegasus, and both turned up later. Yes, this episode featured Admiral Pressman and Riker talking over the mutiny on the ship when the thing looked like the experiments were going to blow up the ship (which it did-because the current tech couldn't safeguard the process, although the Enterprise-D's modern tech could), and Pressman's comments about the Riker he knew-who was a young ensign on the Pegasus, and a memorable exchange between Picard and a Romulan captain, both lying through their teeth, both knowing they were both lying. (I quoted most of the exchange.) I also think that Picard should have been reprimanded severely for his "solution"- unstead of just moving off at impulse speeds at the end of the episode, and letting the Romulans wonder what happened, and guarding NOTHING of value, he had to announce to them exactly what happened and confirm all their suspicions. (Ultimately, all they had were suspicions until that moment.) I'm sure the blatant proof of the violation of the Treaty of Algeron was NOT welcome by the Federation's diplomats.

I think it's VERY interesting that 2 people in the Bible are called "the son of perdition" (or "the son of ruin" depending on your translator), and that's Judas Iscariot, and the man of sins, spoken of as yet to come, who opposes and exalts himself above God and all that is worshipped, so that he sits in the holy of holies, and puts forth that he HIMSELF is God.

What, no Sister Mary Elephant?

"Captain Picard Day is one of the children's favorite school activities. They look forward to it all year." "How long have you had the beard?" "About four years. I think I just got tired of hearing how 'young' I looked." "What was it that Lieutenant Boylen used to call you?" " 'Ensign Babyface.' " "We are conducting a survey of gaseous anomalies." "How interesting. So are we. Perhaps we could combine our efforts and share our findings." "I doubt our objectives are... compatible." "You are probably right." "This has been a most pleasant conversation... but we must return to our research." " Then I won't keep you." "You know... I still think about what happened... about that last day." "So do I. It's not the kind of thing you just forget about." "Do you ever... wonder whether we did the right thing?" "Never. It was a tragedy, yes. But it wasn't your fault and it wasn't mine. What we were doing was for the good of the Federation. We can't blame ourselves because the others couldn't see that." "I know... but maybe we went about it the wrong way." "Well, this time we may have a chance to do it the right way." "You want to try again?" "It's not just me." "The Chief of Starfleet Security has personally assured me of her complete support." "Admiral Raner... ? How many other people know about this?" "Not many. And it's up to us to make sure it stays that way. Raner gave me written orders for you. You'll find them coded in the Enterprise computer. You've been instructed not to reveal the true nature of our mission to anyone, not even Captain Picard. Don't worry... it won't be like it was twelve years ago. This time, no one's going to stop us."" "Frankly, I've always felt it was more important for an officer to trust his captain's judgment. In a crisis, there's no time for explanations... orders have to be obeyed without question or lives may be lost." "I am aware of that, Admiral." "Of course you are. I guess this mission has brought up some... old ghosts for me. You know what it's like to lose a ship... you're always wondering if there was something else you should have done... something you missed." "Twelve years ago, I needed an officer I could count on in a crisis... someone who would support and obey my decisions without question... someone willing to trust my judgment... that someone was Wil Riker... and without his loyalty, none of us would have survived." "We have a chance here to change the balance of power in this quadrant." "Mutiny... on a Federation starship. It's shocking -- no, it's unthinkable. And yet you've never mentioned it." No, sir." " 'The Judge Advocate also believes that the surviving officers are deliberately withholding vital information from this inquiry. Further investigation is recommended.' But there was no further investigation... the file was classified and quietly buried."

II Peter 2:19-22

"Captain Picard Day is one of the children's favorite school activities. They look forward to it all year." "How long have you had the beard?" "About four years. I think I just got tired of hearing how 'young' I looked." "What was it that Lieutenant Boylen used to call you?" " 'Ensign Babyface.' " "We are conducting a survey of gaseous anomalies." "How interesting. So are we. Perhaps we could combine our efforts and share our findings." "I doubt our objectives are... compatible." "You are probably right." "This has been a most pleasant conversation... but we must return to our research." " Then I won't keep you." "You know... I still think about what happened... about that last day." "So do I. It's not the kind of thing you just forget about." "Do you ever... wonder whether we did the right thing?" "Never. It was a tragedy, yes. But it wasn't your fault and it wasn't mine. What we were doing was for the good of the Federation. We can't blame ourselves because the others couldn't see that." "I know... but maybe we went about it the wrong way." "Well, this time we may have a chance to do it the right way." "You want to try again?" "It's not just me." "The Chief of Starfleet Security has personally assured me of her complete support." "Admiral Raner... ? How many other people know about this?" "Not many. And it's up to us to make sure it stays that way. Raner gave me written orders for you. You'll find them coded in the Enterprise computer. You've been instructed not to reveal the true nature of our mission to anyone, not even Captain Picard. Don't worry... it won't be like it was twelve years ago. This time, no one's going to stop us."" "Frankly, I've always felt it was more important for an officer to trust his captain's judgment. In a crisis, there's no time for explanations... orders have to be obeyed without question or lives may be lost." "I am aware of that, Admiral." "Of course you are. I guess this mission has brought up some... old ghosts for me. You know what it's like to lose a ship... you're always wondering if there was something else you should have done... something you missed." "Twelve years ago, I needed an officer I could count on in a crisis... someone who would support and obey my decisions without question... someone willing to trust my judgment... that someone was Wil Riker... and without his loyalty, none of us would have survived."

"Captain Picard Day is one of the children's favorite school activities. They look forward to it all year." "How long have you had the beard?" "About four years. I think I just got tired of hearing how 'young' I looked." "What was it that Lieutenant Boylen used to call you?" " 'Ensign Babyface.' " "We are conducting a survey of gaseous anomalies." "How interesting. So are we. Perhaps we could combine our efforts and share our findings." "I doubt our objectives are... compatible." "You are probably right." "This has been a most pleasant conversation... but we must return to our research." " Then I won't keep you." "You know... I still think about what happened... about that last day." "So do I. It's not the kind of thing you just forget about." "Do you ever... wonder whether we did the right thing?" "Never. It was a tragedy, yes. But it wasn't your fault and it wasn't mine. What we were doing was for the good of the Federation. We can't blame ourselves because the others couldn't see that." "I know... but maybe we went about it the wrong way." "Well, this time we may have a chance to do it the right way." "You want to try again?" "It's not just me." "The Chief of Starfleet Security has personally assured me of her complete support." "Admiral Raner... ? How many other people know about this?" "Not many. And it's up to us to make sure it stays that way. Raner gave me written orders for you. You'll find them coded in the Enterprise computer. You've been instructed not to reveal the true nature of our mission to anyone, not even Captain Picard. Don't worry... it won't be like it was twelve years ago. This time, no one's going to stop us.""

Thanks kindly. Thanks especially for not putting the exact date up- I hate giving my personal identifiers to all of cyberspace. :) I've made as few posts like that. Not here, but I've made them... "Wolfie-fans?" I have fans? *falls over laughing* To quote Hamlet, on fortune's cap I am not the very button, neither the sole of her shoe. (Things haven't been thrilling, but they haven't blown chunks either.) I can say, however, this past year, for me, was a distinct improvement. And of course, thank you to everyone I didn't have a snappy comeback for (Belle, Jeff, RainbowsGirl, bfh, Ham, T-Bone, act2, frank, PurpleDays, doojable, watebuffalo). And thanks to all have thought nicely for me but didn't post.

"Captain Picard Day is one of the children's favorite school activities. They look forward to it all year." "How long have you had the beard?" "About four years. I think I just got tired of hearing how 'young' I looked." "What was it that Lieutenant Boylen used to call you?" " 'Ensign Babyface.' " "We are conducting a survey of gaseous anomalies." "How interesting. So are we. Perhaps we could combine our efforts and share our findings." "I doubt our objectives are... compatible." "You are probably right."

I didn't hear it in twi, or from twi people. However, I did hear it from someone on psychiatric medication.

Thanks for your indulgence. I like the Animals, and I don't know how I confused them for the Stones. I can't find a notation saying the Stones did a cover, so apparently I confused them. No, this was a non-spoof song by a "serious" band, and you've definitely heard of the band. No. I looked up the lyrics to that song, and the counting isn't there. It would be VERY odd for a Spanish-speaking singer to have changed the count like that. It's an English group, better known in the English-speaking world than Selena, and, AFAIK, all the members are still alive.

Let's see if anyone's checking in who would know this: "Uno, dos, tres, catorce" (Yes, that's Spanish for "1,2,3, 14.")

I know some posters have said they believe his evil deeds proceeded from a hatred (or possibly fear-for hatred often springs from fear) of women. I disagree. (Of course, I could be wrong.) I think that he had a lot of deadness in his heart- towards other people. He felt a whole lot of NOTHING to them. That's why he was a "pastor" who never PASTORED his old congregation, and never wanted to bother with people when they had problems, and seemed completely unprepared when they were dumped in his lap. We know ("vp and me") that he had NO IDEA what to do when someone came up needing psychiatric attention and had an acute episode when at hq-he panicked and asked Harry what to do. And that incident made no impression on him, because later incidents when MORE people had psychiatric incidents at hq STILL saw no plan of action- other than vpw SENDING THE PERSON HOME ON A BUS. They got there A WEEK LATER. (Anyone wonder what happened to them all through that trip?) There was no contingency for incidents in the field, either-except SEND THEM HOME. Pontius Pilate showed more conscience about people than vpw showed for people he had accepted responsibility for. When there were reports of people badly injured on LEAD, or women raped on LEAD because they were hitch-hiking (which was a requirement for LEAD, and was the direct cause of them getting raped), vpw never expressed the idea that they could change the program. He pointed out that a woman could be raped anywhere- then proceeded to require hitch-hiking. The few times he seemed to show compassion either made for great staged moments- like when the woman was brought to him at the podium after she'd been kidnapped for deprogramming (but we didn't hear about her after that) or rarer still, times when his personal involvement was minimal- like when he agreed to cover the cost of someone's remaining corps sponsorship. (Mind you, it was unusual he'd give up money, but perhaps in this case, he thought it was a wise investment in what he wanted.) In short, I believe he viewed other people as THINGS- and things, you don't get all emotional about. He used the people and discarded them, as if they were things. And taught lcm to do the same. I believe that he thought the only person that mattered was HIMSELF, and that without exception-not his wife, not his children. That's why whenever his WHIMS were thwarted, he never stopped to consider the points of view of others, but instead could explode into anger the moment it pleased him to do so.

"Misunderstood", by the Rolling Stones. I'm pretty sure they did one version of the song.

I think I've read that last sentence before. Where? Nathaniel Hawthorne???

So you're aware that hurts delivered by others can be lasting ones. However, the anger at vpw, lcm and others here range from the PERSONAL (as in "he looked me in the eye as he ruined my life") to the offended ("he ruined their lives without a moment's hesitation") to the chagrined ("everything he said about himself was a lie") and so on. Most of us are convinced that vpw should have served hard time in jail for the felonies he brilliantly concealed. Most of us are convinced that lcm was taught by vpw to do the same things, but lcm was tricked into thinking they were right to do, and wasn't aware they were wrong, so he wasn't so elaborate in covering his tracks, and was caught. It can be shown beyond REASONABLE doubts-and it has been-that vpw's image of himself was wholly constructed, "his" "unique" teachings were more than 90% lifted directly from a handful of other Christians, and when he was "original", he was generally inferior in material to the original authors. vpw made up doctrines that permitted himself to indulge in vices, and sin all he wanted, and say it was all right. Anyone who looked like they were going to tell someone was kicked out FAST and their reputation RUINED so that they were cut off from everyone. Small wonder that a few people committed suicide when kicked out of twi. I'm not even hitting all the main topics. Let me know if you need pointing to them. Many of us are still Christians, and consider vpw to have been a faker, a charlatan, who copied the work of legitimate Christians and at points served God IN SPITE of being a worker of iniquity and setting himself up as Lord over God's heritage. (I'm in there somewhere.) Many of us were burned badly, and have looked in other directions for answers, and have found answers that they believe serve them better than the ones they got in twi. Considering they're not committing the same crimes vpw did, I'd say their answers are at least morally superior to his answers. Oh-and those of us who are still Christians often conclude that a relationship with God isn't as heavily dependent upon either daily Bible study or SIT as we were taught. Feel free to look around and catch up. Or not, as it suits you. The GSC allows for free thinking, unlike twi.

"Uno, dos, one, two, tres, quatro"

What if I wasted all your time-time? "Just What I Needed", by the Cars.

He was a member of the Legion of Doom! Oddly enough, Green Lantern's ring energy seemed to be effective against Sinestro's ring. He also popped up once out of the air, saying GL couldn't find him because he was hiding in the anti-matter universe of Qward. As if it was that easy to go back and forth. BTW, there's a GL Corps and a Sinestro Corps now, and Alpha Lanterns, which seem to be based loosely on Alex Ross' Kingdom Come GL. I wish this Kingdom Come worship would end. The story was different, but the closer you look at it, the more some glaring deficiences become obvious. I liked the story before all the hooplah.

"How long have you had the beard?" "About four years. I think I just got tired of hearing how 'young' I looked." "We are conducting a survey of gaseous anomalies." "How interesting. So are we." You've guys have been in the zone lately, so I think this might do it....

I know that-as early as the end of the 1960s, when he met D**p and H33fn3r, vpw had rationalized that orgies were accepted by God, because D**p reported that vpw had offered his rationalization for them to D**p, who wasn't buying it. If there were orgies, I would have no idea-I wasn't where or when I could have found out about it. All I know is that vpw was cool with them-according to vpw, and according to vpw, God didn't think they were "BEST", but made them "AVAILABLE."

Well, it was definitely a big one for vpw, we know that. He described a video of two women- and a DOG- to students in the CFS class, and those he didn't describe it to, he SHOWED THE VIDEO. I don't buy this "he had to show them a video of two women having sex with a dog so they knew what was out there" excuse. Frankly, he said more than I needed to know just when he DESCRIBED it. I know what women look like. I know what a dog looks like. I know what sex looks like. Just tell me the components, I know enough about what's on the video, thank you. And he was AMUSED describing it. My brain was screaming "WHY ARE YOU TELLING ME THIS?" at the time. We had different attitudes towards this subject, it appears. I don't know if vpw bought videos when he visited San Francisco, during his "House of Acts"/Haight-Ashbury tour. J1m D**p said vpw visited "adult" video stores there at the time. That's PROBABLY when he got the video I just mentioned, but I'm speculating. Now that my head isn't screaming about vpw describing a video about 2 women and a dog, I can actually ask myself what should have been some obvious questions. Why was there no corresponding story about a video of two MEN and a dog? Obviously, one fit what he wanted to say, but the other one didn't. And either ONE is condemned by Scripture, or NEITHER is, logically. But, yes, it was NOT about God or Scripture- unless that "god" was "vpw's lusts" or that "scripture" was "vpw gets to do whatever he wants". It indeed WAS about power, and the women were DISPOSABLE to him.