CM

I infered no such thing-nor this- That is a question. It is not Jesus Christ's exclusive domain to ask questions or talk without someone understanding or not understanding what was said. And once again it's a question.

1It is not expedient for me doubtless to glory. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord. 2I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the third heaven. 3And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) 4How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter. 5Of such an one will I glory: yet of myself I will not glory, but in mine infirmities. 6For though I would desire to glory, I shall not be a fool; for I will say the truth: but now I forbear, lest any man should think of me above that which he seeth me to be, or that he heareth of me. 7And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure. 8For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me. 9And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me. 10Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ’s sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.

20According to my earnest expectation and my hope, that in nothing I shall be ashamed, but that with all boldness, as always, so now also Christ shall be magnified in my body, whether it be by life, or by death. 21For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain. 22But if I live in the flesh, this is the fruit of my labour: yet what I shall choose I wot not. 23For I am in a strait betwixt two, having a desire to depart, and to be with Christ; which is far better: 24Nevertheless to abide in the flesh is more needful for you. 25And having this confidence, I know that I shall abide and continue with you all for your furtherance and joy of faith; 26That your rejoicing may be more abundant in Jesus Christ for me by my coming to you again. i don't think this is talking of physical death but something like being in the spirit

Just because you Goey do not understand that don't make it nonsense just nonsense to you if you want to stay not understanding fine you aren't asking any questions just ride off with that kind of comment... is that your Jesus Christ? and btw- didn't he say many things that many didn't understand?

in other words it's the understanding of salvation that is the question to one there is one understanding to another there is another and then to look at these understandings and consider them in light of our own understanding would be comparing spiritual with spiritual and quite possibly open up some new understanding of Jesus Christ instead of the same old same old being fried to death on one side

Goey, "what it commonly means to millions of Christians. " wouldn't this rule out many who do believe but are not in this category? i don't think there is a common understanding of Jesus Christ all walks of life -jews islam budhists christians and more have understanding whether or not they see it as "Jesus Christ" is irrelevant

Goey, as usual i don't put everything i mean into a post and it comes out rather harsh so i apologize for that certainly there are many things outside of ourselves to learn from

i'm not trying to put down learning from books they do help just saying there is more then that

i think people want something outside of themselves and say this is what God says so they can escape actually believing something for real-so get something and call it infallable-pff-their ain't no such thing that you go to and say look this is what it says and this is why there is only one absolute and that is the understanding that changes there is absolutely PEOPLE who think and live and grow and speak so many want to narrow down their god to a set of books so they don't have to think thinking outside the box-ha- where do you think that came from? so limit the unlimited by declaring the word of god-what a bunch of crap that's a stumbling block and stopsign to seeing the true riches of Christ

and that's the thing ain't it allan to see the revelation of Jesus Christ a closed book to most opened when lived and seen and the new heavens and earth Jesus Christ opened the door Now who dares to freely think about spirit which opens the things that God has prepared it's already there, waiting to be seen

9 was there in acts 2 but 1 was the catalyst the rest progressed as they progressed

that's vague perhaps knowing and learning what did and didn't take root rooting out what we know needs to be keeping the basics of logic and reason freedom to think is paramount rather generic but everyone is different personally i tossed it all from twi whatever was good i figured would stick with me after tossing it i had to face what was left in my head to see it's source and it's reasoning took it apart and dissembled it and looked at it from outside of it

that first paragraph sounds like the Lord trying the reigns Bagpipes

you guys are gettin' deep on me here! :) If you can't change your mind, are you sure you still have one? I thought that would go well with this thread. Some down home country style thinkin'

kind of a love to love thing... eros a progreessive being agape a progressive being one pushes and the other too sort of pushing each other along which one is God? both...lol.... just cause it may not be seen that's the way it is thanks for that and Life which i could never repay nor did you require it don't know really what color i'm in haha....just enjoying the ride i think

Good to hear from you Zixar

too literal here i think think of the figurative of Acts and Matthew which btw Matthew is coming under much scrutiny lately but one thing for sure and is more important then Judas Go to the source, Christ within it matters not what Judas did afterwards really what matters is what we do

Jesus had to die he became sin he did sin his flesh body and spirit had to die death is transformation into another comforter Danny does this help with the difference between the God of the old testament and the God of the new? Jesus completed the transformation of death to life for all the serpent was the source of death Jesus ended this by what he did the serpent was an angel of God Now who is Jesus? the Day Star-the Angel of light good post templelady Hi Mark, it will take more then my input to put this all together and probably some time and some different thinking

technically it does not say Judas commited suicide this is held as a common belief but is it really that?

and how is so many made "righteous' to speak the words of the unseen god and how is it that satan the serpent has been killed by the life and DEATH of Jesus is it not his life that was sacrificed for us? who's life got the problem rolling in the first place in the sweat of thy face it says to till the garden rooting out the thorns and thistles finding the way of the tree of life that has always been within never leaving or forsaking us and when Jesus died what died with him?

considering the source of understanding and wisdom from above is the key for what was Jesus the Christ to do but to end the transgression and how was this accomlished Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy

We are to fear God-nothing else unto the pure all things are pure illusions of what is real are not the truth

ckm-why do you talk about love and carry so much hate for others? let me clue you in on something-pfal and twi is a hate group and class it may not have started that way prior to the 1960's but it was after that and is still today

lol! Bramble!!! i have mike on ignore so whatever he says the answer is 74

mike "if God has something to say to me, He is Big enough to tell me Himself" VPW PFAL stick that in your nut and crunch it