CM

Since you bumped this one up i'll try to help def. i got a little time. people will pay for their sin but not in the way you may think Jesus died for all somewhere in every person's life there is some good. it will not go un noticed by God there is room for all in the new heavans and earth Lazarus and the Rich Man- are these people or figurative for something else a literal hell yes and where is this place People who have fought against God their whole lives, will be forced to believe what's left after hell wouldn't be able to deny it Was it fair for the 70,000 men to die when David sinned? Yes and Jesus died for them too when Moses never got there he got there they must pay for eternity-where do you get this? and what does. riddles and parables rhyme and reason black and white or many colors? new HEAVEN and EARTH the price for sin has been paid when we get to the checkout line it might just clear up so why live a good life now? you don't know where your place will be in the new heaven and earth where do you want it? people will suffer loss for their sins but then we will see a new receipt this old place will be forgotten

which in wayworld translates to any believer could have sex with any believer-just renew your mind i was there from 1980 and saw this thinking And I'd like to second what you said for Belle, HCW

Yeah HCW, man I feel for ya'. And all that went through this stuff. One of the problems with twi is they ENCOURAGE divorce. Subtly if not just straight out telling you to leave your wife or husband. Bastards. They tryed to break us up. Get one of us alone and talk about how the other was doing or not doing the word. They love to break up marriages. It's like they won something. Pretty sick.

1999 How we left- As a twig/fellowship coor. We weren't doing too bad. But we had to be at everything which was not right. My family was suffering for it. Both my wife and I saw this. Plus the leaders meetings with the bc were a pain. Then our fellowship got so small that we were given the option to quit running it or continue. We quit. Eventually we ended up in the bc's fellowship. My kids hated it. My wife quit going. So I had to think of why for my kids and my wife. It wasn't too hard to figure out. No love, no life, no true fellowship, no truth. So I called the bc on a Sunday afternoon (i knew where they would be-hq-didn't want to talk to them personally) and said that we were taking a break from twi for a while. He tried calling for three days, but I just let my machine answer. Then he had one of the other people in the fellowship call. I talked to him. By then I had gotten some info off the internet and from J.S. at CFF from a phone call to him. So I unloaded on this guy and told him what I knew. He couldn't handle it and insisted that we should come back. We didn't. That's our story, the short version. Others are different. I expect families at hq would have a much harder time leaving. btw-we don't go to any group's fellowships, all i go to is the internet.

nah i didn't take it personally thanks for the reply and the friend part too :)-->

It's interesting to note that love is used more in the new testament then the old. So much has been given to us in the new testament that love has to be the balance to it all. Otherwise we would fall prey to many other things that are mentioned in the new testament. Lindy I believe you will see love even bigger then you do now one day. I see what you are saying though. "Of course when our kids don't obey, we still love them, but more importantly for this discussion, they still love us. Love does not equal obedience!" Amen, man. Even while we were yet sinners Jesus died for us. God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son. Love is the factor, the motivation here. God loved us first. Still does.

HCW I think every case is different in ways we don't see. I wouldn't advise anyone to leave their marriage without trying a few other things first. Like talking about it for one. I'm no professional but saving the marriage and family would be top priority to me. Tough Love- My wife has gotten tough with me when I was drinking too much beer. But she talked to me and poured on the tenderness. There wasn't even much voice raising. It was tough to handle but she got through my thick head. I could see what she was saying and it was true. It was killing me and our marriage. I don't even drink beer much at all anymore. Getting tough with love is pouring on the tenderness and saying what needs to be said. Not booting anyone out the door. That shouldn't even cross your mind untill you've tryed some other things first. imo oldies quickly goes to expelling the other person. No tenderness, no talking, no nothing. No love at all.

Perhaps when I used the phrase "beating on", this could have triggered your response to me. I'll rephrase- I've got nothing more to say about this person. I'm done with him and he is out of my life.

Go for it Groucho-I got no problem with you saying what you said. I'm just done with it. If someone was to ask me about him in person then I would have some things to say. I just thought that I could make a point that you can be done with it. ok? speak on...

sheesh learning a lot here is this it Danny? http://www.papyrology.ox.ac.uk/index.html

or like this http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/

We are very overprotective of our kids. Which is a good thing I think. Our kids know it too and we've told them that this is just the way it is-you have "overprotective" parents. And they accept it. It's not fear - it's just doing everything possible to stop a bad thing happening.

Some things I've learned about this since working at a school. #1 Listen to what is said-listen for key words like kill and related words coming out of their mouths. #2 Consider any past experiences a person has gone through such as hallucinations, hearing voices that tell them to do things. And thoughts of people being after them. #3 Tell someone about it! Either the parents or the Principal or the police or all three.

Yeah Danny, Something like this site would be cool http://www.loc.gov/exhibits/scrolls/ A pretty good example of how it could be done.

Some can beat that lust without prison though. I've seen it happen. It's a crime to mess with kids like that. And should always be.

a prison class preferably...

There is that book that Mrs. W. had done. It covers 1916-1961. Has some interesting stuff in it. I'm not much into beating on the guy anymore. It's a shame that things went the way they did. Some may still need to unload though-I understand.

lol...no...cause I know they won't be.. I'm sure you're just saying this for others benefit though getting to know you a little bit song

7 wow! Yeah that makes sense. "greater maturity shown" I've had to tell them to just drop the subject though at times. Sometimes they both just hold to their own opinions and don't let the other one bother em about their different opinion. yeah a lot like us who are all grown up now, or are we...lol I do learn a lot from them too though.

Considerate and kind. That's the general rule here at my house. When they get way off of it i step in and straighten em out a little.

lol...yeah-i only have 2 how many you have rascal? Sometimes what they argue about is just them growing. If i have a simple solution i'll tell em and end the thing quickly. And deeper solutions i can come up with sometimes. Sometimes i just let em go and they figure it out for themselves. They never get violent just argue.

Are there some websites that we can go to and view some of these findings Danny? You seem very well informed on these things. And know of a lot about these other writings. Just wondering cause I don't know much about em at all. I'm just your basic kjv person. Need to spread my wings a bit. I always look forward to what you post on these things. It helps me see things in a different light.

I've been using this as a filter to determine truth from error for some time now. Plus a few other things. But I believe it's one common denominator to evaluate. A loving Father who loves His kids. Overall God started this with Adam. His father was God. That make us his kids. Would a father do things that some religions propound? I look at my life as a father to my kids and think of what I want for them. Would I beat the hell out of them? No. I want the best for them even though they don't see it as clearly as I do. If they rebel against my words, I just try to get them back to common sense and love. With as much reason, love and logic that I can come up with. And they do respond to it. And change their thinking. Sometimes I raise my voice. I have told them of what would happen if they do not change though. Just by my limited experiences in life. If I use enough logic and common sense with love they do see it. Any feed back is appreciated.

don't know if anyone said this but there was always fear of being confronted on whatever you were thinking even if you were right on with what was taught and saw that what was taught was not being practiced

a little more smurfette... receive him not into your house so many times "house" refers to the mind it's the temple of the Lord just a little different look...