CoolWaters

Raf, I agree wholeheartedly. I'm sorry for not making that more clear. I'm not dissing John S in any way...or at least I'm not trying to.

With all due respect to John S...it doesn't take a brainiac to figure out that the bible says adultery is wrong. It doesn't take a bold person to come out with a paper about it, either. Sheesh, there are some state governments that still recognize adultery as a valid reason for divorce. I'm not saying that I think it was a thing about being a disgruntled employee. I think that it was a statement on the fact that John S tried to work within the system of twi by writing a "research paper" that he probably felt would measure up to twi's standards and get some attention and get things taken care of and cleaned up. I'm with mj on this one thing, though... Many, many of us tried to "bring things to light" in twi...like pedophilia being wrong...and where is our following? LOL ;)-->

Mike, I have been thinking and studying and praying and listening to other teachers and thinking about your post ever since you posted it...even dreamed about it. It may make logical sense to many, however there is one flaw that hit me like a ton of bricks... Your post seems to say that being saved is a partial thing...that only spirit is "saved". I dunno, dude...it's like the god that can only "save" spirit is a partial god...

Todd, Dude. Whoa. Um, yeah...what you said...that's it exactly.

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! That explains a whole lot of stuff I just went through with an offshoot. Did you learn this from PFAL, Mike? Or where? I could never figure out why twi was so works oriented.

You guys have got this pretty darned good! How nice! I'm learning that when the bible says he gives us the desires of our heart, it doesn't mean he's a sugar daddy...it means that the desires of our heart become what he puts there. It's something along the lines of the new man. My hubs says I get obsessed about things until they get done or I obey or things change. I used to think that was bad...a personality flaw. But I was almost always right. How could it have been bad? Now I'm learning that it's that quickening spirit working in me. (Of course, I had myself checked out for OCD, too. ;)--> ) The spirit also works with me in dreams and visions. I am almost always prepared for the death of a friend or family member. I "see" (in my mind's eye) things that have happened or are going to happen. It's all very personal...you know what motivates you...so you know how the spirit works within you. :)-->

"Saved from what?!?!?!?" was the thing I screamed out to whoever was listening. Death? Who cares? After some of the things in life I've lived with, death isn't a big threat. Eternal damnation? Thanks, but I'm just about to earn the T-shirt. Sickness? Poverty? Fear? Bondage? Nope, nope, nope and nope. These things are a reality now regardless of the "being saved" status. For 2 years I had no answer to the question. Then my granddaughter's life was turned upside down when her father was arrested on 3 felony counts of rape of a minor under 14 and 2 felony counts of indecent sexual liberties with a minor under 14. It became very clear that it's not always saved from something...it's often saved for something. There's nobody better than me in this whole world to help my granddaughter through right now. (That's not arrogance...that's knowing at least part of what I was saved for...) Just some personal thoughts on the subject. :)-->

It's good to know you went to the doc's. I am lifting you up in supplications for peace of mind and body. :D-->

Yep...easier to do...easier to receive. :D--> Guess what? I got some more smileys up today... And I think you'll like them... Try this link.

Dovie, As Pawtucket has said, it's probably not coming from you... But the way you send out your emails gives many people everybody's email address... So if one of those people gets a virus in their system from a completely different group than yours, then everybody in your group gets it, too. The best way to avoid this is to put your own email address in the "To" line and put everybody else's in the "BCC" line. This way nobody gets anybody else's email address in their system... So nobody can accidentally pass a virus around the group.

The endless strife such things cause. What a huge stumbling block...sigh...

So what did you all think about last Friday's episode?

Hubby and I watched this movie with a "Huh?" look on our faces the whole time. We laughed a whole lot, but never really got it. But who cares? It was a good evening! :D-->

Well how about that, OM...we've come to a place where we might actually agree...and may actually be getting along. :D--> Luvs ya! ;)-->

:D--> TYVM. Good to see you, too. :D-->

dovey... I have many, many emoticons available. Peruse around in these areas: feyaurora.com/images/emoticonsabcde feyaurora.com/images/emoticonsfghij feyaurora.com/images/emoticonsklmno feyaurora.com/images/emoticonspqrst feyaurora.com/images/emoticonuvwxyz Also, if you find a smiley you want, let me know and I'll grab it for you. And...some of your emails have been stopped by my virus scanner...and some have slipped by but had something in them...and I've experienced getting email responses from myself...with the only commonality in any of these things being your address...so I've had to block your address from coming through. Sorry. Anyway, just post here or in a PT if you see a smiley you want.

Oh boy...I'm biting here...and may bite off more than I can chew... For me (and not speaking for anybody else here), sex is a difficult topic to discuss on an open forum. Especially with the focus of the forum being to expose twi. My first "up close and personal" experience with twi was haiving my "leadership" introduce me to 3somes. I was 16yo. From then on, twi was about sex in some form or another. The situation that got me and my family marked as "seed boys" was when I tried to put a stop to the children's fellowship that was a cover for a pedophile ring. So, talking sex on an extwi board has a whole lot of stuff in it for me. No way in all of the universe would I ever in a million years talk openly about my sex life on this board. Not because of any problems or lack with the board...but because it can go over the edge too quickly for me.

OM, As that statement stands alone, I concur. What is the followup teaching to this? In twi the followup to similar statements was to lead people to "name it and claim it" mentality...with no consideration for service to God. How does one declare one's faith? By having a better home, a better job, a fatter bank account, never being sick? These are things that are not always in our control...regardless of our believing. If one is serving God, one will declare one's faith even in the midst of need, sickness, being abased. In twi, this was not possible because to rejoice in God even in such conditions, one was considered deluded because one was obviously "not believing". Is the followup teaching that one's faith is revealed in one's circumstances? If so, it's not godly...and cannot lead to godliness. ********************** Out, Kewl!

See what I get for trying to use a liar's words? Thanks, WW, for correcting me...both on that little "story" and on the spelling of the town. ;)--> My point is now missed...sigh...but what I was trying to say is that no man knows how the spirit works in another's life...and trying to pin it down only divides.

There's no doubt that believing what is said in the bible is a requirement. However, twi taught that believing in the bible is an action word...a verb...something that one must do...a difference between faith and believing... Romans 10:9 clearly states, "...believe in thy heart...." The prophet had to believe that God was going to make the sun stand still. Did the prophet have to do anything to make the sun stand still? No. God did that. Did it stand still because the prophet believed? No. It is clearly stated, "And there was no day like that before it or after it, that the LORD hearkened unto the voice of a man: for the LORD fought for Israel." [Joshua 10:14 KJV] It was not of Joshua's doing. It was of the Lord's doing. So what did Joshua have to believe? He had to believe that the Lord was with him as stated in v 8. God is not a credit card or a geenie in a lamp that one can whip out and wish upon. God is sovereign. It is His decision what does and does not happen. TWI taught that to receive anything from God one must, Know what is available, How to receive it, What to do with it once one has it, Get one's needs and wants parallel, and Remember that God's willingness equals his ability and his ability equals his willingness. It's like a magic formula or spell: if you get it all correct, then, voila!, God has to do it. It's as if one is one's own lord with a god in one's pocket to prove it. It's all backwards...no service to the will of God...no trusting in God's timing...no understanding that God has a plan and that he will bring one through to his plan...that he is the author and finisher of one's faith... It's all up to one to decide...not up to God. As long as anybody is teaching this twi standard, nobody is truly being led into a relationship with God having Jesus as Lord...but is being led into the same error as twi...the works and standards of men. All these things people are talking about here that are signs of being a twi spinoff...they are all about the performance of a person...not about service to God.

Perhaps I should have refined what I was saying a bit... Believing=receiving as taught by twi is erroneous. It shifts the focus to what a person believes and away from what work God is doing in one's life. There are many things that come to pass regardless of anyone's believing...but because God set them in order...and it takes God to set them out of order. Did the sun stand still because the prophet believed it would? If you say yes, then you are putting the focus on the prophet. If you say no, but because God told the prophet it would and God followed up, then you are putting the focus on God. See?

And that, my friends, is the rest of the story. Well said, rascal.

I love the Puddle Jumper! I love the space gate! I love Sheppard! I love Weir! I love the Wraith! This show just tickles my fantasy bone to no end. Add this to SG-1 with O'Neill in command... Well my scifi itch is being scratched real good! LOL ;)-->

This would be ideal, OM. The problem with this, however, is that many of the offshoots have not discarded the all of the errors simply because what is error to one is sound doctrine to another. My personal experiences with offshoots has been that there is one glaring error that they keep in some form or another: believing=receiving. As long as that error is kept, then there is no way that any form of godliness can be promoted in anyone's life...because it's no longer about god, but about believing.

can't.....help.....myself.....especially.....with.....Oak.....joining.....in..... ;)--> Tee hee....maybe not to you....tee hee. ;)--> And who says Jesus was not at least half spirit? Just because the spirit descended upon him like a dove when he was baptized does not mean that it was the first time spirit was with him...nor does it mean that it was The Spirit coming to him for the first time. It means what it says it means: a confirmation that Jesus was the beloved Son in whom The Spirit was well pleased. As for who is Jesus... He is certainly spirt now. That's what the "new body" is. There are no biblical requirements to believe anything particular about Jesus besides that he is Lord and that God raised him from the dead. Virgin conception or birth (oh, let's don't go down that path, please...!) is of no importance to becoming born again. It's not even a requirement to believe that Jesus is/was the son of God...or that he paid a sin debt for anybody. In fact, disputing these things tend to lead one away from ever knowing Jesus in truth. Example: TWI. Does anybody remember the VP story on the America Awakes album about Jubapor? Where the man outside VP's train came for healing but stated succinctly that he did not believe in Jesus? The man got healed. I mean, seriously, who was it people believed in before there was a Jesus? In whose name did the prophets heal? And is Jesus the only name by which this person/godling (love that, btw lol) is or has been known? So no man comes to the Father but by Jesus. How does one come to Jesus? How does one come to the Mother?