Sunesis

Igotout, I actually had permission to go to Woodstock. Me and my two best friends were going with one of my friend's older sister who was 18. She was five years older than us. Her boyfriend Robert had gone up a couple of weeks earlier to get the sound set up and was one of the soundmen during the concert. We were packed and ready to go Friday evening, were going to drive up Saturday morning, get there by noon. Friday evening Robert called and told her not to come up, it was a mess, we'd never get in and he'd never find us. We were bummed!! But, my other friends who went were all sick for about two weeks afterward and it wasn't an enjoyable experience for them. Too young to really enjoy it (at 13 and 14). I was glad I didn't go. I was happy just watching the movie. Plus, we used to go on weekends to the East Village and hang with the hippies in Tompkins Square Park. All of NY was hit hard by the hippie scene. But getting back to music, there were terrific bands of that psychedelic era, Cream, Janis, Jimi, the Airplane, many of them I still listen to to this day. I am also one of the rare people in my age group who has kept "current." I still think Metallica, who I've seen several times, is one of the best bands in the world. You must see them live to really understand their appeal. When I lived in NYC in the '80s and '90s I went to alot of the huge concerts either by taking the bus to the Meadowlands or the subway a few blocks to Madison Square Garden. I caught up for lost time. Saw Monsters of Rock tour - all the top metal bands toured together, Van Halen, Alice in Chains, Prince, Annie Stewart - and others. Although, the '80s rock was very technical and you had the shredder guitarists, that no average kid could ever hope to play like, so that laid the groundwork for Nirvana. Total backlash. Kids could write simple, easy songs again. Then grunge died and now you have nu-metal - the caliber of musicianship is just horrendous - super simple dropped tunings where you can play a chord with just an index finger. There is some truly out there stuff I would never let a child, or early teenager listen to. It makes the heavy bands of the '80s like Judas Priest look like kids. But now, kids are getting tired of one finger dropped tuning just heavy rythymic stuff with no melody and you are now see a resurgance of "garage bands." Like the Vines, the Hives, etc. They are going back to the sounds of the '60s and '70s - very beatle and Stones influenced songs with melody. I recently joined a new band, its a rock dance band, we do Alanis Morrissette, some punk, some Stones, Blondie, ZZ Top, etc. I've been either playing jazz/fusion or blues during the last 10 years and forgot, on a musical level how much fun it is to just rock out - making a loud joyful noise. I had thought I was too old for that sort of stuff. As far as being a Christian, I figure, my job as a musician is to bless those people, make them forget about their day jobs and idiot bosses and have fun. When I look up and see people jumping up and down on tables 'cause the music has taken them to another place and they've had a great time and talk about it with their friends for the next few days, I've done my job. TWI used to be afraid performers would get inflated egos. I think that was VP projecting his own attitude. He had the inflated ego and so assumed that everyone else did too. What he did not understand is that there is a joy in being able to play - just for yourself. I'll come home from work and go play for an hour and my batteries are recharged. Or sometimes you'll have such an incredible rehearsal, you're high for the next week and can't wait to do it again. Sometimes the chemistry in a group is amazing - magic and you just can't explain it to people. As musicians say, its a disease, once you have it, you'll never lose it. I would say to any ex-TWIer, pull that horn, or guitar or drums, or whatever and play. Go to local jams, when you're confident, after you've scoped it out, sign up and play a set. You'll meet new people and have a great time. Most jammers are our age, 40s and 50s so you'll fit right in. Enough for now.

Ted, I think Stevie was probably the most talented, along with Pressed Down in all of Way Prod. But, as for guitar players, Socks was my hero. He was so nice to me and was my favorite guitarist. He had that black Les Paul - help me here Socks, I'm going to say it was a Custom, possibly Standard, but pretty sure a Custom. Also, Paul Virgilio was very tapped into the youth sound. His album was great - he even had Carlos Santana on it. He was excellent. It seemed to me, anyone really good who got too popular among the people was somehow hassled and kind of forced out. They just kind of dissappeared. You know, a few times I got yelled at for practicing too loudly up in the back rooms of Kenyon when no one was around. I found it interesting that some top leadership would tell me I should put it down, but then I'd do the dance band shows and different top leaders and their wives, especially the wives for some reason, would tell me how much they enjoyed watching me play. It was double mixed messages.

I've read this thread with interest. I was one of the few female "rock" guitarists in TWI. Or, I really thing, the only one. For some reason TWI always tried to squelch that in me. I also grew up with the 60s and 70s rock, loved Clapton and Cream, the Airplane, Iron Butterfly, etc. I still love rock, metal, grunge, etc. to this day. I had played in cover bands in high school, got in the Word and really wanted to do something with Way Productions. But, girls shouldn't play electric guitar don't ya know. I then spent two years at Berklee College of Music in Boston. I was finally allowed to play when I went in the corps. We had a dance band, run by our elder 5th corps. We needed dance songs, since no one had any, I wrote much of the material we did. On my interim year, I played in a band with a believer and we did local clubs - made extra money, until leadership got wind of it - I had to quit. Back in residence, I coordinated the dance band. Then on staff, I played in the Emporia staff dance band. We had a kick-*** band. Some of us wanted to play out locally, but no, that wasn't allowed. Then, I started getting great pressure from top leadership to quit, sell your guitars, God has other things in store for you.... blah, blah, blah. Well, like an idiot I finally caved in. Some of those guitars are worth literally thousands today. The owner of the Emporia guitar shop was so alarmed I was selling them. I lied and told him I needed money for a motorcycle. He offered to loan me the money for the motorcyle! God, I wish I had listened to him. But no... I had to sacrifice for God - God had other things in store. So, I didn't play for a couple of years. Then at H.Q. they needed someone for a country band. I hate country (sorry Ted), but I was picked. Then we lost the bass player so now, I've never played bass, but now I'm it. Thank God I know theory well and was able to pick it up quickly. But I couldn't stand that band and twice tried to quit. Poor Ted had to talk me into staying and even VP had a talk with me. While on staff at HQ, I had an idea for a big band. So on my own I organized me, David Bailey, some horns and we just went and had a rehearsal at the cultural center. Didn't ask permission, just did it. Had a great time. Way Prod. got wind of it and then wanted to turn it into some soft muzak thing. I was disgusted. I mean, couldn't we do something just for f**in' fun? Finally, VP moved onto other bands and our little country band broke up - phew - I vowed after that never to do another Way prod. thing again. The thing that also bugged me, was that because I am female, Way prod always wanted me to wear a dress, sometimes the long evening gowns, when I played. That was one thing I stuck to my guns on - no way was I going to do that. I am a rocker dammit - we don't wear dresses onstage rocking out - was that dorky or what. I wore pantsuits. O.k., so now I leave staff and go onto the field in NYC. I basically haven't played seriously in a few years. I have no guitar, no amp. My first two years there (I was still in TWI) I went through great soul searching - would it be ok with God if I played again? In year two, we moved to the East Village. There was a little club, the only blues club in Manhattan at that time, and they had a Sunday afternoon jam. I would go to those. Finally, I went to a pawn shop and bought a cheap electric. My playing was rusty, but I started jamming. I was stunned because "natural man" loved my playing. After a year of it, and getting to know a lot of local musicians, I figured, well, I think God doesn't mind. I bought a better guitar and started auditioning for some local rock bands. I realized that with my years of not playing and being in the corp, then 5 years of staff, I had really missed out musically - I mean Eddie VanHalen, Randy Rhodes, George Lynch of Dokken, Yngwie Malmsteen, Satriani, Vai, etc. - all these incredible guitarists of the era - I had a lot to catch up on. So, I sat down and for about three months shredded, listened to the albums, got the tab books, figured out modes and what the heck they were doing and made it my own. After that I played steadily in NYC. Met and partied with the guys in Anthrax and Metallica, hung out with Debbie Harry of Blondie, met Sting, etc. I played in hard core thrash and speed metal bands - I had a f**in' blast - made up in my thirties what I should have been doing in my teens and 20s while in TWI. Now, I am older an mellower. But in my town I play in a 9 piece jazz, fusion, latin type band with horns, extra percussion, etc. (Moxie) - I am lead guitar - we do all the huge outdoor festivals here during the summer and clubs. My other band is a blues band. I am lead guitar. We play local clubs. In both of those bands I am the only guitar. I also just recently joined a punk, hard rock band, everything from Courtney Love and Hole, to Green Day, etc. I am having a blast. Granted some music, like death metal, I would not allow a child to listen to. But metal (Metallica, etc.) does have an incredible feel, is not easy to play, and has its own beauty. I imagine I will love my rock n'roll till the day I meet the Lord. We had so many good musicians in the ministry with fabulous talent who were just wasted by TWI. Its a shame. I saw a show recently on U2. They are all (except one) born again Christians. They got in a little TWI like group in Ireland when they had just formed. They were kids. The group told them to quit the band and do things for God. They finally sat down with each other and decided no, they would continue. I wish we had had that much brains to do the same when we were young. I still think people like Stevie Kay Louis and others were fabulous. They could have had successful careers. I now have many guitars and amps. I watch VH-1 and MTV, I keep up and I do what I love to do, whether its for people live, or by myself playing in my living room. Well, just thought I'd share, sorry if its too long winded.

Well don't look at me for an ensample excath! I will only lead you down the pathways to hell and heavy nu-metal music bands and Jack Daniels, cool cars and Harley-Davidson motorcycles! Our house would be a party house with people coming and going as they please, everyone doing what they wanted and letting God inspire them, and no rules. Uh-uh, don't look at me for an ensample.

Boy, I remember that. I have no idea where I am in that picture and tried to find myself but can't, oh well. Thanks for posting that.

My dear Rev. Turtle, me thinks you never quite got over your Oedipus complex like you were supposed to around the age of 2 or 3. You aren't supposed to be wanting your mommy at this age my dear man. O.k., maybe you can keep your complex and project it onto older women, but, sorry dear, the object of your desire which you have fixated on makes me gag - couldn't you have chosen someone else? How about, hmmm... Julie Christie! she's still pretty hot and is the age of your (ugh) beloved, or Jaqueline Bisset, or Marilyn Monroe, Farrah Fawcett - get my drift?

Oh my God!! Excath, the sheep - I was laughing so hard I had to leave my work area and wander down the hall. That's one of the funniest things I've seen in a long time. You're right - Rivenbarks hair is lopsided - must be some kind of counterfiet in Divine Design (is that what the hairdressing dept. was called?? I forget). That kind of sums up the wonderful LEAD experience, doesn't it?

Prochaine, don't feel bad, I was on staff at Emporia and PL hated just about everyone - you were not alone. We had our run in the first week she arrived there. My brother, 12th corps, summed it up best when he said, she was one of the most neurotic people he'd ever worked with. PL was always on the lookout for homos, male and female. But, I also knew she was miserable being at Emporia, did not want to be a corps coordinator, was following John. She just was truly unhappy and took it out on people. She made up some terrible things about me and told DM a bunch of bull. Unfortunately, DM believed it, but that's another story. But Pat made up stuff about a lot of people - outrageous stuff, plus accused innocent kids of devil possesion, etc. - I was amazed when someone on my job crew would come back in tears telling me about a meeting with PL that was so off the wall, so I really wasn't too surprised to hear the ignorant, made up stuff she said about me. I even told DM, one day you will realize this lady is off her rocker. To keep her life happy, PL would also pick a studly young male from the corps and have a "relationship" with him. I always wondered how she could be having her affair right under JAL's nose, and JAL seemed to care less - just oblivious. It was then I realized they must have an open marriage. PL basically had only a couple of people she felt comfortable hanging out with - and they too were pieces of work. PL was just never really fulfilled, was frustrated and couldn't wait to leave Emporia. I do hope she is happy now though. I still think she was a good person who was just terribly angry and unhappy and there was no where for her to go - she was truly trapped. Now that I am older, it is pretty obvious what she was going through. I noted her favorite song was "Don't Fence Me In." Very appropriate.

I didn't know VP had resumed showing the doggie video. I know they did stop for awhile after the corps got so upset. What was the "homemade" video he showed? I don't think he ever showed us that one. I recall thinking at the time VP was showing it because he enjoyed it. I think if you go to a porn shop you would go to what turns you on. I don't think those videos were coincidence. VP had a side I think most of us never saw.

Well, the sad thing about Rochelle's suicide is her brother was really the only relative she had. They had fled Russia. I don't remember if her father had deserted them, but I know he wasn't in the picture and Rochelle had grown up with a mom who had been in and out of institutions. It was a terrible home situation. So, TWI was literally the only family she had. Leadership knew this. Its on their hands. As far as the porno videos, VPW had, when he showed them, especially the doggie one, I wondered the same thing - what was the MOG doing with this trash? He enjoyed it. He enjoyed watching the kids' expressions too I think. I remember when I was on staff at Emporia and they showed it to the, I think it was 12th corps. 11th or 12th. That was the last time he ever showed it. They were very, very vocal in their disgust, berated JAL, and no explanation the leadership gave did any good. The corps weren't buying it. They were very angry, many of them sickened. I was very glad to see them do this and I think the leadership was kind of surprised.

You know, you guys should quit making me laugh out loud here at work! Each corps had its own devil spirit - we made friends with ours! LOL. Well, did you ever think it was ours, the 7th corps, and we bequeathed it to you as a lasting spiritual gift? Huh????? Yanagowasakamakata(sic) - yes, the early corps actually had individuals and you could be yourself, play jokes, break rules, etc. My personal motto was, "its easier to get forgivenss than to get permission." That nugget of wisdom, taught to me by an elder third corps woman, when I told her I wanted to do something but was not allowed, she just looked at me and said those simple words and told me to be off. These words kept me in good stead throughout my corps years and even up until this day. Although, I must admit, I rarely ever got caught, so never had to ask for forgiveness. I taught this to many of my younger corps as we were, oh, breaking into the snack shop for a late night snack, sneaking off grounds to imbibe, etc.

I was very close to Rochelle, in fact she called me the night before she left H.Q. Rochelle was in her last year in-residence when she committed suicide after leaving H.Q. I was on staff at H.Q. at that time. Anyone who knew Rochelle knew she had a history of attempted suicide and suicidal tendencies. She was very open about this to those who knew her. JAL had not wanted her to come back after her interim year, they felt she needed a little more time to "mature." Rochelle insisted. When they went out lightbearers, Rochelle had gone with another believer to see a fortune teller, she had tremendous guilt about this when she came back, we discussed it. She also had the pressure of her research paper, which was not going well. She was also through all of this, in great pain and was on constant painkillers for her neck and other injuries suffered in the accident. She would also feel guilty that she was not living up to the standards of the corps. I spent hours with her. Oddly enough, before she died, she seemed very at peace. She said God had been showing her a lot about the Hope. Then, she got thrown out of the Corps - it was a shot out of the blue, very quick and fast. They decided LOA would be best for her. She was devasted. I do not know the specific reasons why. She was supposed to leave, I think on a Monday morning or something after seeing the leadership (MF). She was very good friends with another guy from Emporia who was also leaving and going LOA. Not wanting to suffer the embarrassment and humiliation of staying, she left with him. Now the rest I know because I asked him personally, he knew how close we were and so told me the whole story. Rochelle was going LOA and was to drive to her brother's house in Connecticut where he was a leader there. Anyway, Rochelle was young, cute and loved cute guys - i.e., a normal young girl. She offered to take the corps guy to Indiana. I think she didn't want to be alone just then. They stayed at the limb home a few days while he made arrangements to get to Kansas. She was very depressed during this time and the limb people were not very nice to her and wanted her to hit the road. In a state of depression she leaves. She makes it to my town, Columbus, Ohio. That's as far as she got. My father called me after seeing the article in the Columbus Dispatch of her suicide in the motel. I drive past that place every day to and from work now - room 34. Anyway, her brother called me at H.Q. and gave me the news. We talked. It seems Rochelle had quite a few pain pills, was alone in the hotel room and decided to do end her life. She killed herself with her painkiller pills. She was found on the floor of the hotel room. After her death, the Trustees lied and said she had been entertaining a guy there. Anything to smear her name. She had been alone. After Al called I went to see MF, the corps coordinator. I was furious. I asked how, knowing her history - or that he should have known - they could have just let her go like that? Or how could they not call the limb home and make sure someone was with her or have her brother come get her? Its a long lonely ride from Indiana to Connecticut on your own in that state of mind. MF was annoyed at me, how dare I butt in. I asked how he could have let this happen. He said it wasn't his fault and didn't seem to particularly care. I then told him that he had her blood and death on his hands. I still believe that to this day - he in particular. Plus any other leadership who made this decision and those in Indiana. He was not a happy camper after that. I'm surprised I wasn't thrown off staff. It still boggles my mind they just got rid of her, no follow up. MF said she disobeyed because she was supposed to wait and leave later. Right, like this young girl, in depression and suffering the humiliation of leaving her corps, is going to stick around for more BS verbal abuse from the leadership. I would have left too. People don't understand if you were corps, the total humiliation of not "cutting it." Keep that in mind. But for those to try to smear her good name, memory and life, especially with perverted sex rumors or that she was sexually loose or promiscuous, keep in mind these are lies - lies started by the Trustees, one in particular. As far as I know she was never with VPW, if she was, it would have been just one more thing to push her over the edge. But, she was a sweet young woman, who I believe if had been handled with love and compassion instead of hardness and cruelty would still be here today.

Mj, also I forgot to say, many people just leave the food bowl with food in it all day. I put new Eukanuba in the bowl in the morning. Izzy grazes when he wants. But because its always there - they don't gorge themselves like animals will if they only get fed once or twice a day. They just eat when hungry. Izzy, after three years of this is still skinny and muscular.

Mj, they are hiding it for later. My kitty hides his toys. Of course, they have short term memories and forget where they hid it! Its amazing what I find in and under stuff when I clean. I too went to get my bag of catfood and had the pellets gush onto the floor. Izzy and gotten in and chewed the corner of the bottom off. You may have to consider locking the catfood storage shelf.

I started my little guy as a kitten on Eukanuba kitten chicken flavor. As he got older I mixed in the Eukanuba adult and he successfully switched over. I also sometimes put a little Purina One on top, or Meow Mix, just for something different. His teeth are in excellent condition - no sugar. Since he is a long hair (he was fluffy as a kitten and never lost it - part angora - very handsome - black with a little grey on the belly) he gets hairballs - boy does he get hairballs. Hartz makes a great hairball medicine. Its like a vaseline. Izzy likes the malt flavored. It comes in a tube. You put an inch on your finger twice a week. Its important to do this because it lubricates their throats so the hair comes up easily, like on the first or second try. They can damage their esophagus if its dry trying to get fur up and out. Its a preventative thing. I highly recommend it. I agree about dry food only. He's had excellent digestion and elimation - never any problems. Check out the Eukanuba food.

Well, you're right about that. A nickel was about the most I ever had in my pocket in-res and on staff.

As your elder 7th corps, I am delighted to be here. You guys are much funnier than our corps was. Yes, I adored Puffy. I used to make Gary draw them during corps meetings. Then, when he was graduated and on staff I still made him draw them during looooooooooonnnnnnnnnnnggggggggggg meetings. Puffy had all but been forgotten by then and I had to keep him alive. We snickered through many a long meeting. I am no good at puns. I bet I know some of you. I'll be keeping tabs on this thread. If something is out of whack, it is my duty as elder to lovingly reprove you. Oh wait, I haven't been in TWI in years - even when I was in I was a "partier" - not a reprover. I encourage everyone to party.

Petrock, no I don't. I'm not affiliated with any splinter groups. I don't think I've ever run into anyone from the "old days" except a still in 9th corps guy who was working at the bagel shop in my building. I'd buy a bagel from him on the way to the office. Kinda sad seeing this very bright intelligent guy pushing bagels years later.

Well, I'm here! In the Columbus area.

Proud to be, and always will be first in my heart, a New Yorker. Born in Bronxville, NY, grew up in Rye, then Larchmont, with Manhattan as my playground - yes, spent many days and weekends in the Village during the "hippie days." Went to Mamaroneck High, Class of '72. Got in TWI at 15 in 1970, took Piffle in '71. Family moved to Columbus, Ohio in '71 - bummer - I thought my world was ending. But connected with believers in Ohio. Did WOW, corps, on staff at H.Q & Emporia, blah, blah. Missed NYC very much. Fled H.Q. staff and moved back and spent 10 years in NYC. I still have family and friends there and still visit. NY is the greatest!

Thanks for bringing this thread back again - I think this is one of the greatest threads that was ever on Waydale or Greasespot. What a time it was. We did love God didn't we? I still do. We were so young and naive, but loved God. I am so thankful I lived in the time of a true revival and outpouring of God's spirit like that. Why did we stay? As one poster stated, we kept trying to perpetuate the "revival," kept trying to keep it going - as if VPW, or us were the ones responsible for it - not God. Revivals come and go. If we do have another one in this country, this time the Glory will be to God, and not the man who happens to be at the helm at the time. Anyway, some of these memories almost bring tears to my eyes - very moving. Hopefully all the new "outies" will be blessed by this.

Well, I was in from age 15 in 1970, to age 33 in '88. That's 18 years. I know its not as long as our wonderful winner Hope, but at the time, it was over half of my life. It sure seemed like a long time to me!

I also think, since we stifled so much of the working of the spirit in us, I think many times the compassion, anger and other things we feel, the feelings of empathy for total strangers are also Christ's feelings working in us. Since we're out of the bondage of TWI, he can work in us to feel what he feels for people.

Bowtwi - what an amazing, sick thing you went through. I hope many people still in can read this and have their eyes opened. Thank you for sharing. How are you doing after all of this, and how is your son - hopefully no adverse effects. But we know false accusations are from the adversary - this tells the real story about those in charge. To go after and slander innocent people who love God. I hope you're doing well.

Chris Geer is a very sadistic, mysogonistic man. I have seen him first hand rip someone to shreds, and enjoy it, eventually hissing at the person. He is also paranoid. But, sadistic is the word I would use that describes him best. Radar, you would probably know the dates of the special clergy meeting, but when Chris had them in the BRC, in front of the whole audience, he pulled out his .45 that he carried and put on the shelf in the podium. Here's a man so afraid, he thinks his clergy will kill him, plus, it was used to intimidate anyone who maybe, might want to differ with him. What I have never understood is why the clergy didn't tell him to shove it, but I guess with a crazy guy with a .45, wisdom says, that's not the place to bring it up. When we had POP read to us at corps week, I was appalled that those of us in the tent were surrounded by armed "safety" people. Mrs. Wierwille was right, Chris was the deciver. He played games. He'd drop a bombshell and then run to Gartmore. He instigated shockwaves, and instead of being there to be part of the solution and mess, he himself, singlehandedly created, he ran, and expected everyone to come running to him. I always wondered why LCM didn't just tell him to buzz off right then and there. Why was everyone so afraid of, and so respectful of Geer? All of us in his corps knew what a hard, cold man he was. But, VPW loved him. I can only imagine what Geer and LCM must have on each other.