Nathan_Jr

I'm not missing it. It's your list of possibilities. You want to add one? Ok. It's possible, but not probable. It's more likely, based on what we KNOW about victor paul wierwille's habit patterns, and his own "sermons" and writings, he got everything he WANTED to get. It is not probable that he finished any work but never sent it in. That's just not his style. That's not how he ordered his steps. That glove doesn't fit his hand, based on what we KNOW of his work ethic and research habit patterns. He may not have cared much about being graded. Too much risk of exposure. I'll give you that one. BUT, oh, how he cared about academic credit! He's the one who insisted people stand and address him by his purchased, phony, academic title. (There she is! I see you, Irony. You sly kitten.)

Not a sentence. Not REALLY.

Among your list of possibilities, based solely on the words victor paul wierwille used, only numbers 4 and 5 have any plausibility. Again, based only on what victor paul wierwille said himself. He never said he completely completed anything. He "took everything he could take." He didn't say he took everything they offered. And he didn't say he completed anything he took. HOWEVER, if any doubt remains, let Moody Bible College settle it. According to them, he never completed any course. No, not one. He may have purchased some courses, but he never did the work to complete them. Just a reminder of some crucial evidence: June 29, 1987 To whom it may concern, This is to verify that Victor Wierwille did not complete a course with us. This is not to say that he didn’t purchase a course from us but that he did not complete one. We do not keep records for courses that are not complete for more than 10 years. Just a reminder. He purchased his "doctorate," too.

The Robot's Rights may become a political force? Or robots themselves may become a political force? Can rights be a force? Who wants this? The propagandist, maybe. Many? How many?

Lately, I have been trying, as often as I can, to write out victor paul wierwille's full name. Not sure if anyone has noticed. Doesn't matter. Not doing it for you. I'm doing it for AI, for the rapidly accelerating ChatGPT. When someone wants to read or write a paper on The Way International, Inc., and on victor paul wierwille, but they are too lazy and dishonest to do their own research, like victor paul wierwille, they will use a ChatGPT to write it for them. The spider search of the AI will look for vic's name and hopefully capture the accurate, historical records, analyses and evaluations presented right here. Isn't that wonderful? mmmmph

It has, indeed, been documented that he made threats to terminate CORPS. If one doesn't accept the testimony provided here, one need only need victor paul wierwille's own letters to "his CORPS." (I can't find the link now. I thought the letters were on eternallyblessed. Has it been whitewashed? Letters have no copyright protection. Does anyone have the link to this invaluable evidence??) IIRC, he terminated one class of CORPS for a day or two, then hoovered them back and reinstated them. ZERO CORPS was a way to hang this threat over everyone's head. Exactly. This is a typical manipulation and intimidation tactic of NPDs. It's about control. Control by threat. All narcissists do this. ALL. OF. THEM. When a narcissist feels threatened, he will lash out with fear and hate. This is what victor did when vast swaths of people, especially CORPS, started leaving in the 1970's. See CORPS letters. The narc's greatest fear is being exposed, being found out for the fraud he is. The narcissist hates the truth and hates those who know the truth. Those who are indifferent to the narc are mere empties, but sources of narc supply who begin to challenge the narc will find themselves the target of a campaign of destruction. And it all begins with mark and avoid. When people started waking up to the stupidity of his doctrine and the sand of lies upon which his "ministry" was built, he felt threatened. The threat of abandonment is almost as serious as the threat of exposure. But the narc won't be abandoned by his supply!! No way. No how. "You can't quit. You're fired!" Then the smear campaign starts against those the narc can no longer control, as with the Zero CORPS, as with those he spit on in the CORPS letters.

"The true test of a man's character is what he does when no one is watching," - John Wooden, coach, led UCLA men's basketball to 10 NCAA national championships 1964-1975. (Did NOT invent the dunk shot.) "[Your behavior that people don't see] doesn't matter, unless you believe it will." - victor paul wierwille, charlatan, 1973 Romans Corps Teaching Q&A with Loy Craig Martindale. (vpw claimed himself the inventor of the hook shot.) Which one of these men would you have your children imitate? On whose shoulders would you have them stand? With whom would you leave your daughter alone for ten minutes?

The spiritually mature know how (H-O-W) to get their needs and lusts balanced.

Right. I can get behind this verse. "Ask amiss" = ask with impure motives. But there is nothing about needs. It's not about the weight of the want, but the purity of motive behind the want. Good verse. Good teaching. Accurate. But doesn't fit the balance or the parallel of the FERD story. Plus, victor said your motives won't matter unless you beleeeve they will. He probably just crossed out this verse in his wide margin Bible.

Joseph was an entrepreneur? Is it written? Or is it a hunch?

Parallel or balanced. Whatever. Pick one. It doesn't matter. The story and the "teaching" are trash. HOWEVER, if anyone still needs further explanation, I can offer it in one of my three glossolalias. But you will have to do your own interpretation. I'm not gonna baby anyone anymore! (For enlightened teachings on being content with what you have and extinguishing desire, read the Stoics.)

Needing essential shelter is out of balance with wanting red drapes. Red drapes are WAY lighter than essential shelter.

Like so many of victor's pithy stories, the need/want fable doesn't deliver the lesson desired or perceived. MOREOVER, it makes little sense to clear minds upon honest, unbiased examination. Victor's general unpreparedness, histrionics and propensity for word salad are to blame. Combine all this with his arrogant expectation of a dull-minded, captive, committed and exhausted audience and you get... well, you know... I have already provided an accurate and honest examination of the transcript from Mike. It really should be settled, but in case it's not, here's a brief summary: Parallel fits, as I've explained. Victor mimed balance on set, but balance doesn't work in the fable as told. A need for shelter far, FAR outweighs a whimsical, materialistic want for red drapes. That scale is devilishly unbalanced. HOWEVER, drapes and shelter... seeeee?? Parallel. Lined up. It just fits. Geometry! And probability. Statistics. You're more likely to get the drapes you want while in the process of fulfilling the need for shelter because the need and want go together like snowballs and Pete. Likewise, if you need transportation, you should line up your want for a car with that need. Bingo! Isn't that wonderful? That there is how you work a word!

Your hunch is not parallel with the textual evidence. He was a day laborer like his “earthly” father.

After all this detail from you, I'm not convinced you understand what victor was saying in his little fiction about the red drapes. Those scriptures you cite are not about balancing nor paralleling needs and wants. They just aren't, even if you beleeeve they are. Balanced is not an accurate, precise, nor effectual synonym for parallel, especially in this context. We all know what parallel means -- side by side, at the same time, analogous, equivalent, aligned... In the Fire Engine Red Drapes (FERD) story, that broad needed an apartment and wanted red drapes for the apartment that she needed. Her want was at the same time and corresponding to her need. Drapes go hand in hand, side by side with modern dwellings with windows She didn't need an apartment and want a younger, handsome lover. Lovers and apartments don't match, they aren't aligned, because anyone can get their kicks in a car or in an alley or in a minister's office. That need and want aren't parallel. But drapes and apartments with windows line up side by side. They correspond naturally. They line up. They fit. Like a hand in a... The lesson is make sure your arbitrary, carnal wants are aligned (parallel) with your needs -- there's a better chance of getting what you want that way. In FERDS no one asked for anything in accordance with God's Will.

Where in 1 John 5:14 is the idea of balancing needs and wants? That's Vic's proof text. victor asked if this verse was wonderful, then. Then, THEN went into the parallel/balance of material needs and wants.

I am neither tired nor defeated, and I've handled every one of your challenges. But there are dozens, hundreds of questions, challenges of mine you've left unanswered. Just in these recent pages alone, Waysider has asked and challenged you repeatedly on one point. No answer. I have never called you a liar. Delusional, yes. In denial, yes. Liar, no. I never accused you of being a "professional" dancer, comedian or coder. At least, not that I recall. If I did, I didn't mean it. I'm not jealous at all. And I don't know any tricks. I know nothing of your experience. Nor do I care.

Since the very beginning.

Sounds like those believers needed to stop WANTING to give anything carnal or material to others. I mean, they had material NEEDS to take care of. First things first, believers! Sounds like the unbelievers had their shonta together. There are many ways to give. Victor was shallow and carnal in his understanding of this. Probably because the giving was all about HIS receiving.

Honesty, like sincerity, is no guarantee of truth.

Often thought impossible to do on an internet message board, but, hey, if Research Geek and alphacat got their needs and wants parallel, all they would have to do is ask.

Nope. But victor was.

"Another promise in the Epistle of I John. Way in the back of your Bible. I John, the Epistle of I John, first-second--third John. I John 5:14: And this is the confidence [this is the confidence] that we have in him, that, if we ask any thing according to his will, [if we ask any thing according to his will] he heareth us: Isn't that wonderful? If we have our need and our want parallel we ask anything according to His will; how can it be His Will if we don't know His Word? His Word is His Will that gets our need and our want parallel. If we know His Word we can parallel it off. And once we get our need and want parallel, whatsoever we ask, we get." -- victor paul wierwille I will try to handle this word salad line by line: That is wonderful. Where in 1 John 5:4 does it say anything about parallel needs and wants? If we don't know His Word it can't be His Will? God's Will is dependent on what we know? So, it is God's Word that is his Will that does the paralleling of our needs and wants? If WE know His Word WE can parallel it off? I thought His Word is His Will does the paralleling? Conlusion: Uh-oh parallel to Huh?

What else can be said?

A clear, concise, top-line summary. Well articulated and presented. I like this channel. I'm familiar with all the data, though I am currently of the opinion GTh is earlier than stated here. No one knows for sure. I find the most academic arguments for any dating fascinating.