mj412

mike just how many lifetimes do you have?? I think you spew the arrogant of pfal and your religion after a lifetime of studying that and now a lifetime dedicated to physics??? ever here of a thing called fresh air??/ sounds like an awful lot of education for a window washer... hmmm could it be issues of interpersonal relationships holding you back??? ya think???

wordwolf well said I think I talk to much lol. I never assume deliverence you as Rottie says in another post we can be disappointed in thinking God will answer prayer and then not understand the big picture of what life is here... The idea that we walk around as mighty men and women of God casting out the evil of this world is enticing and why many cling to pfal . I submit knowing Jesus as The Lord is so much more than that, as a servant more good is to be done than playing around with what has the right to be here and now meaning natural man and demons. I believe the focus is the redemption of what Jesus accomplished and the HOPE of His return and Life eternal. The bible states the Kingdom is the answer to everything not today . Christians get caught up in the quick fix of this world and expect it from God as well.. I do not think He looks at our life in terms of the temporary flesh we give to His Son to help now.. Again it comes down to the grace idea. We didnt earn anything Jesus Christ is the KING not us.. and His kingdom is still being built it is not finished HIS WORK is finished not ours. Demons can and do have a right to play with Gods people because we use them to live here until we are perfect in Christ. to me this is not difficult to understand nor does it make people "evil" workers that God doesnt Love . He loves us so much He gave of His Son. See??? it isnt about us as much as twi wants us to think it is, it just isnt. Well the fact Jesus loves us to such a capacity it is. yet the power is in the Lord not our flesh or our education of what Gods bible may say. does jesus love someone who gets healed more? no. then why some and not another? The devil plays here, that is why, and it is a very personal relationship with the Lord each person is a unquie child of God that has work to do to be His best for HIM. some can and do work on this more than others, but this does not give them more power or grace . So the idea of heirarchy is crap as well in other words oo I knew a clergy He had the power of God!!! CRAP I say we are called to do work , by God if we chose to do it we do. If we do not we do not it makes no differece on who God is or isnt to our life , He wants us to be perfect! Jesus speaks a great deal more on loving one another than any type of deliverence and often times it was not even His followers He healed . It was to show us the power of God, so we can understand the idea of Him being a KIng of that power. I know I believe God gave Him the authority to be King over us only and the "war of spirits is not the focus till the very end.. when death will be destroyed. He has always said it is Love that conquers evil not some special zapping power . When someone cares about me and truly loves me I listen more alot more than a bravodo of destruction that many twi and off shoot people claim as power from God. What good does that do to say well big freaking deal a demon is here surprized ?? of course they are they rule this freaking place and have every right to determine the course of events, for me I try to listen to "a better way". but .... it isnt easy for me or Jesus Christ that is why we need the Love of God towards one another. I believe that and the hope is the only path to peace. But instead I see His followers sitting at the table trying to decide who is best and by what means, today. The same as it was when He was here in the flesh . it doesnt surprize me that Jesus knows us so well we are in a very limited space thinking and doing what we have always done. He does know how to fix everything we just do not want it done His way. His way isnt what He would chose either ya know this is why I have such a tender heart towards Jesus and can and do consider Him so precious to my life, He does know what this world is like, what being human is like , what obeying God is like for us. It is not easy( life here and now) He makes it easy with His love. not perfect but worth it. well I bought the program so long ago I just do not want to live a day without His ability to show me how to cope anymore. I also believe in life here after so I hope for better days with Him to come. When I get nervous for the return and sick of waiting to live a life without demons or problems I remember He waits for me longer and still loves us. also our children. How sweet is that?? I had an experience where I realized He does know our pain, but we will never know His completely because he was innocent from birth, and He does love and care for us and always will.

that whole body soul and spirit thing got twisted in the way . The big cram down my throat was the verse No condemation for those in the spirt of christ thing. Well let me tell you the next EXCUSe was well the devil goes after the ones working for the Lord . Mike has taken this position as well I think it is crap. So you have the power of God now the devil will force you to do evil things , because your working for HIm but there is no condemation in Christ Jesus ..so do not worry or think about it That is the philosphy of TWI!!!! Think about it!!! it truly was taught that way whenever issue were metioned. I absolutly believe christians can and do get possessed by devil spirits and NOT because demons like to attack them anymore than anything eles but because they begin to play the first sin all over again and begin to knowing better than God for their life and lose the humility of Christ and the cross He asks us to bear as His heirs. Satan plays hard ball and entices with beauty and huge power , listen he would have been out of business from the very beginning if he didnt have the ability to attract people. God has a plan to end this game but in the process I need to learn over and over what we are fighting for and if it is the "good" then I must learn to be "good" as God defines life to be. Clearly satans and his demons have power over the flesh of man.. that is why I say it is a choice and not neccesarily one I would chose for my life this knowing Jesus as Lord. A lord is one who tells me, it is a wonderful thing that He can consider us friends out of love but that does not in the least upsurp His authority on Earth or in the Kingdom some day. God had one begotten Son and it was Jesus and He EARNED it by dying . for us. truly that is a Love I am incapable of. none of has died obeying God . We can feel good and die for someone but was it Gods will or our own doing ? A choice of our flesh? Jesus christ the man didnt want to die at all and begged for another as metioned earlier. The bottom line of the story we have no chance of being the messiah due to the whole story of redemption etc. the only reason I can trust Jesus is because He is the only one who has proven Himself to be right all the time forever. the rest of us were born into sin, which brings up a nawing question about the God and the birth of Jesus christ NONE of us had a mom who claims to have had the experience Mary did in conceiving Jesus.. So we are sinner born into the world with a choice to accept Jesus as Lord or not, Jesus as Lord does not make us able to obey we need a ton of work and deliverence and the ability to learn right from wrong and CHOSE the correct way.. Using twi terms I look at it like this now Body and soul are the same thing and God can and does work within these . An animal has only body yet God did use animals in the bible stories ok the soul is the same and God does use "natural man to further his causes . so does satan and demons . spirit is itself a spirit can be a good spirit or a bad spirit but it is the same just a spirit that can come and go ... God is Spirit , but we do not know God we know the Spirit of Jesus Christ who is one with God a place we can not be , a relationship that He is working out for us someday we can notnow "know God" or be his only beloved Son becase we still have alot of sin nature born into us. Jesus did alot for us by listening and doing more than any of us could ever. but God created us so He will and does perform in the manner of loving us in the world we live in that is now dominated by satan and his workers. He (GOD THE FATHER) tells and loves Jesus Christ how it needs to be done and the Christ of mankind is in the spirit we recognize as we grow into a relationship of making Him Lord. God wants all men to be saved. Fleshy men are sinners as we all seem to be born of men not from God as Jesus was, this does not make us evil as twi liked to twist it. Just what we are as the bible states .. Now a person can be full blown possessed , yet the "flesh has a particular life within that it must play out its work in , and a person can also have a spirit of Christ within and It will at times chill out the spirit of evil . I have heard people say Christ cleans us from sin yeah sure He does, but never completly till the return of His body till then the flesh and possibly devil spirits that house there as well live until we die in the flesh. All knees must bow to Jesus christ but who on this earth has the perfect will of God all the time? no one it isnt possible today that is why it is called grace becase we play in all three areanas and hope so mightly for the end of the time when satan would not even be a factor and the flesh will be gone. that is our only hope.. People begin to think spirit are more than they are as steve states... It is true the more I recognize jesus christ the more I get the chance to speak to evil spirits or just spirits not of God the Father.. some are just laughable to me now they are so common in our culture and allowed to run rampant. sure they will leave while I am talking to them if I tell them to but without the power of God the "flesh looks rather bewildered without them and blames the confusion on me or illness or something.. lol If a person has prayed for deliverence and is ready to submit to the Power of God it takes to "renew your mind to what He determines is good then by all means it happens they can and will leave for good I have seen it happen and let me say the Love that person has for me is never ending and I give the glory to God Almighty . I do not EVER consider Me to be the one casting out devils it is truly the power of God and the fact I have made Jesus my Lord that it can happen.. But mostly devil spiritis just play with my head hurt my feelings make me angry. I long for fellowship with other strong christians who have sound minds on a daily base because ds are freaking draining and exhausting to have to live with . but we have to now and that is why I seek the Lord as much as I can for my life, to not be one who is so draining and using and destructive. But I can be and I lay my head in shame as a "friend who knows The FRIEND and Lord of us all walks in the room and I thank God I remember what we are doing here once again. on the good side does not mean I like it it is just the way it is. Sometimes I dam well enjoy sin . It is easier now to submit and realize I must obey HIS WILL , because I have become more accustomed to being with Jesus than being without HIM and I am a bit of a wreck without Him and so many freaking recognize the difference in me I give up. really. He will never leave or forsake me that I am very very certain of. We all all just waiting for it to be over , and the kingdom to be built, in the meantime I believe all I can do is love as much as I can and wait till He shows up to tell me what to do next . Such is my Lord.

Does all evil behaviour come from a demon??? I believe it does, as God said what He created was good and the devil is able to kill steal and destroy... YET... We say "that is an evil person" when talking about a person who murdered who did some horrible act yet we are not all capable of these behaviours and then sometimes we can for the "good " for example God ordered His people to kill the enemy etc. so it has to be a thinking thing as you state Steve. murder is sin but not al murder is sin if you go by the bible standards .. so it may not be the devil or a demon but it could be a demon ... I think it is spiritual in a mind thinking areana as well .. "THEY opened their mind to it"" remember that?? I was taught we can open our mind to thoughts that invite evil behaviour to generate within then once allowed to operate as a thinking part it is impossible to ask those thought to leave , (more come back to the house) if the person enjoys the behaviour and its rewards. What we allow may be from birth , and I suppose a medical link can be noted as in the imbalance , again it may be an evil spirit but handed down from previous generations and not willing to leave a person alone geneticly it may have a huge physical stronghold.. ( like the bible states your fathers sins are handed down at times) I think God can heal these situations but it would be very difficult for a person to recognize the problem without expert advice and care in the physical matters of what is wrong in the flesh , what the demon has destroyed etc. Damage is done to unborn children by demons , damage can be done in the mental realm as well it does not always mean the person is possessed with a demon it to me means destruction has happened some where in the genetic makeup of that persons family and carried on down.. Behaviours are interesting to me, because we assume all folks can see that is wrong but we do not do we honestly not when it comes to Gods standards, and how many times does denial play along??? Something we tolerated growing up may be very much a knowing demon we can be comfortable with , such as alcohol or drug abuse, yet to others it is not tolerated and fought off and not to be tolerated in the least. We often do not recognize demons untill another person can not put up with what we seem to be comfortable with and that is why the bible is needed to set the standard against evil and good. Frankly I do think we would know the difference satan has a beautiful contenence that is appearing wonderful or in the least not a problem when we can not see the illusions he generates. I have dealt with a demon and I did ask him to leave the person alone and it point blank told me he didnt have to leave, although I believe the power of God could have done it , it didnt leave because the person living with it enjoyed the rewards of its power. this person knew he had a demon and had grown so accustomed to the behaviour it gnerated within him he was not sure he wanted to live without the pleasure . the demon knew it and stayed. God warned me if I pushed the matter any further it would leave and be allowed to come back seven times worse for the person and those he was destroying with his power. I didnt play around . I learned we do have alot of say when it comes to demons but they also have the ability to manipulate how people think. the choice is up to the person whether deliverence is possible and if they can not chose to live without its position in their life it must stay. sometimes they cause so much physical damage or even mental damage the person is not healthy enough to chose to fight them .. Myexample was a christian man very very well read in the bible so I am not so sure education or instruction helps either. But I know I can hold them back from hurting me ,to me this was a miricle.from God to me. I have spoken to devil spirits and that one had a stronghold of power within my life , but he had the right to do what he was doing from the person who thought what he was doing was ok.. But not in My life because I didnt ok the behaviour , yet it meant getting rid of the person as well in this case.. I actualy saw this freak come and go and recognized it . I asked the person why he didnt want to have it leave and he sounded very righteous in his reason it should stay , I think this is the case with many demons and I think this is the reason we are asked to get together with one another and not forsake one another so when thoughts begin to creep in they can not get a foot hold to the point people become comfortable with them.

Can I jump in here ?? Steve what you write about demons is what I think as well and the manner in which twi used those titles are very wrong... Recently I heard a man who is still believing all of pfal as a life source explain to me why he lied and cheated and went nuts.... He said "Well it was devil spirits".. Like it had nothing what so ever to do with what actions he actualy did ".. He knew what he did was wrong and hurt people alot yet somehow this guy managed to sit in fornt of my face and say "well this area has alot of demons always has so they manipulated the situation". I said they??? I would use the word YOU!! No because they take over your mind and change the way you see things and the way you hear things, ... Like these demons were in a play all by themselves this guy went on like he knew what happened and yet somhow those devil spirts were totaly responsible for it!!!! that is when I knew twi was a cult and was a twisted way of thinking of never ever taking responsibility for your own actions just blame the devil spirts ya know??? thanks

you said just because something is printed on a computer screen , even a printed book or three isnt the final word on the subject . you take years sifting through these things ok good now listen to yourself. and just do it.

well Mike your wrote : on some low ebbs in two years you HAD to fight off ds attacks like this a hundred times in one day... from who ? your best friends... um mike read that your friends do not like you or what you think your best friends . what kind of life do you live? that is pathetic. lonely much ?

no mike I do not pretend I am Jesus christ like you do, so i can t imagine nearly like you can.

look at that last paragraphs of mikes. In caps is says NO ONE ELES thought dr.s teaching was worth anything or they didnt know anything about it etc... then He out and out says it was in caps again 'PROFOUND" OK does this sound like Mike believes He is the answer? the one and only and profound at that??/ Mike thinks he is a saviour , and the one and only with the truth out of obedience to dr. read it and weep people. is this a humble person able to teach others??/ he thinks he is God replacing his God vpw...

deut is not written to the us . but rather for our learning remember??? we are not under the law.. now now mikey be careful cant use that one can you? Jesus Christ said He is the only teacher we need.. the holy spirit is what guides us you fool ,not your orange book... that is instructs not struts mike. lol.

all nine all the time??? lol which number that KILLED him from cancer??? or had him sexualy abuse.. but most important what a cute little wordy phrase MIKE what chapter and verse did you learn that IN??? not a pfal book which bible verse says we need to learn these things HMMM?// to be instructed exactly . no it isnt in there it says Jesus christ is the only teacher we need now doesnt it that we need no man to teach us... God enabled a jackass to speak to a man seems HE is still in business. did you two read pfal together??/

was that the red thread in the bible ??? I always wondered what that was and by god there it is. oh happy day oh happy day lol

he has a plan

clearly??? mike the only thing that is clear about you is your ability to twist and warp into your own realm .

You s.o.b Jesus Christ is your big brother !!!! On equal terms right ? He just happens to be a little older right ??? I mean now you are just like Him ... burn you bastard and you will, satan has always believed he was on equal terms with God and Jesus christ and wanted to be Him as well. keep trying mike it is written clearly were your god is going . temporary bastard. see to me He is a Saviour of Mankind. The ONLY BELOVED OF GOD> HE IS Sinnless, He always obeyed. you are not even related dude . that is the reason twi went to H*ll because people began thinking they were the Christ. Want to be Lord much dude?? im done.

so you not leaving ? .... I suggest you learn how to control your urges to suppress the truth about pfal, and twi. so here is a challenge for ya Mike without anger. describe who Jesus Christ is to you with out using a quote from vpw, or the pfal class ....

We have gone full circle and your an idiot , for keeping it going... God rescues His people in SPITE OF THE *******S INVOLVED... See that is why the Lord Jesus Christ is so fabulous He knows what people can be trusted none is his estimation . none take you mind off what you think your doing and look at the majesty of How He thinks . Im glad I am not the Lord of this people I tell ya , If your were so hurt in the verbal tradition Mike why do you want to keep selling it???? no where eles to go hmmm??? Try prayer for a start.

I do believe you even know Jesus christ beyond pfal Mike, so I decline any discussion with you. I take your lead and talk at you not with you . that is how you talk Mike, at people , you never consider anything but your own agenda in pfal. your blinded and arrogant and ignorant of bible verses unless they come from vpw lips.

So I will fit in here with your thinking about whatever is lovely and good and never ugly or sinnful . The big difference between me and you Mike is I know the Lord Jesus Christ and He loves His people and He hears them. do you think the guy foaming at the mouth had a nice phrase of poetry streaming from his lips? those pigs were just screaming when the devils hit them... Or the whore they tried to stone was a bit jaded by street speak? That martha was a bit of a bitchy one , when she was exhausted from the work . I bet judas was a mild manner soul with a soft vioce as He demanded something be done for the kingdom right now ! not. Jesus loves honesty in His people... He died for it . God never lies ever. your twist the bible to suit your liking Mike.

thats sounds just like so many would say to a child who says something happened sexualy with an adult...or even to another adult child protectives is a new idea in America you know and still not very good at the root cause of abuse. It isnt just those with the capacity to harm an innocent person it is those unwillingly to hear of it . "Do not ever say that". "your wrong" "we do not talk about those things in this house" "who ever told you that is talking from the devil" "shut up" "how can you say such a thing about someone we love so very much?" "it doesnt matter do not tell anyone eles". 'it will be ok just keep it in the family. " we love one another " "think of all the trouble it would cause , just forget about it and move on" "he/she didnt mean to hurt you, Im sure you did something to provoke it". Mike you have heard these words or words like them . abuse breeds shame . a shame so powerful it does not allow you to speak anymore , the memory doesnt fade it goes to a diferent place , a place of great pain and allows you to express your feelings in the same manner you were so wrongly taught and never allowed to say hurt you. it breeds denial it never happened at all if no one metions it again. It never happened to you, then you may never have repeated the same behaviour if you can deny it happened if you can deny it hurt you than it never can hurt the one you abuse. that is sexual abuse , the crime is in being silent, the very victims who are never heard are the ones who either die or repeat offending in a behaviour they know as the only honest source of love they have ever known. Rape from a friend goes the same way, you lose by talking,your self resect, you lose your friends your community it appears to be easier to just not metion it and pretend it was not all that wrong . it effects your whole life in a very negative way... it never goes away, you base your decisions on how and what happened. You join a cult that has a lock box and feel you have found the one who understands you ... Mike did vpw abuse you sexualy? I have read some great authors I really admire yet i have never had such strong feelings as you do for vpw. sexual victims need to speak . they are the only defense agaist the crime of silence. no one is guilty of wrong if they didnt know of it are they ??? so just shut up and do not drag me into a mess.. many will tell you to shut up go away call you a whore or a rumor monger, I should think it is those who can not speak or or who lost the ability to say anything that need to hear it the most. please allow them to be heard. allow them to know it can be said and shame will be useless. for everyone. it is the only way to stop abuse. the only way. Mike you do not want to hear about the sexual abuse from vpw, so you try to silence those who speak on it by redirecting it back to pfal. How many people can be silenced with that here? again. mike it isnt going to work.

well that worked karmicdebt, thank you .

no words can be found to express my feelings

Rafael that is why I metioned it to help Mike make it available and to know he does have support out there in cyber space. but he took it the wrong away and said I was squelching him again or something hmmm. why cant we all just get along ?

Ex who is the pooprophet?? thank you for posting a link I am unable to do that for some reason on these replies.. Mike is a little upset with me for a moment , because he wanted to be the one with the new data you know but so sorry Mike just like vpw, someone ele smakes the data available which you just copy to here with your own slant...wishing no one would notice... I know you have to do what your mind is trained to do in his steps and all. Ex do indeed share at that site! maybe in the quote from vpw section I was thinking you may have some good ones too.

Zixar your right that would allow vpw to be correct and all knowing till he died .. a man of God. a man God told everything to ....... In fact He did tell vpw just what was happening. God loved him so much He let vpw know that not only was he to die at a young age from a cancer he believed was caused by the lighting from the taping of the pfal classs , but that the whole idea of his was to be destroyed and the cult he had would be revealed as a lie on the internet..that his work would come to nothing but a sorrid affair and great scandal. I believe God did talk to vpw. VPW just didnt like what God told him..and blamed people for his problems the very ones who worshiped him instead of the one true God. Vpw set it up to be a god, it worked, for a minute as God is a very patient Source of Power and all knowing then He gets jealous and we learn.... People can not destroy Gods work . God can stop people who destroy His work. amen