mj412

I think that is what it takes a vacation away from the people who influence your life in as many areas as possible. Ya know if a person doesnt go to church for a few weeks the congregation may call to see if they are ok but for the most part most are happy they can enjoy a time away with the family or other life stuff and welcome them back as old friends when they can return . but not twi it is like so evil if you do not go, like all of a sudden your plotting the end of the world in a secret closet or something .. it became almost pure hysteria paranoid group that I could do nothing but laugh at . I just do not want to LOVE someone with that much fear and doubt towards one another anymore. Also the conversations where so dull and boring for me, I was tired of talking about nothing but twi the ministry and one another, I would try to talk about subjects I enjoyed in life and quickly realized most had forgotten how to enjoy anything at all in life of interest outside of the ministry and could not even have everyday conversations much less happines or joy in living without hooking on to what Ohio or the LC was doing. in defense when could they have a life really , between classes and traveling and answering to leaders and trying to raise their children and working full time what time was left to have a life? much less enjoy it? it is sad really .

oakspear please feel free to untwist the panties that may be stuck in your butt. Im certain Roy is capable of answering for his own self: and may not need your IM Holier than thou but I will take care of you,(and fix them!) because of your so much the better if not more mouthy (Is the correct term bold?)one to stand in the gap with your all powerful leadership stand which assumes to speak for all whether they ask for it or not. imagine that.

I was Marked in a scandal that the LC did not want known and I still thank God he did mark and avoid me. I was very sad at the time but it actualy changed my life for the better in many ways by forcing me to face life alone. As I was graduating from college a twig began on my street, an old friend I knew from a decade before in the way. I went with an open mind and again brought some friends with me , But I was different. It was the early 90's and my life was so great and I was so happy ... my children were older and able to see and hear the things going on and began to point blank ask me why and I had to come up with honest answers to explain some of the crazy reason the leaders where suffering so much in their personal family life. I could easily tell a leader no I cant do that or no I do not want to take that class... and I felt zero guilt. Most of all it was truly the witness of the local leadership and how very miserable their day by day livng appeared to be . After being gone for a decade I could see they really had lost the ability to chose for their life and the amount of compromise and the cost it had on their life. In short I pitied them , no longer did I believe they knew a better life or had something I would want for my own or my children. I saw them panic really trip out over very small issues in life that every person faces.. everything was an attack from satan and they seemed almost proud of the fact they were miserable and complaining most of the time. not just the fellowship leaders the Limb leaders often appeared in a state of either frenzy or morbid depression . When I was asked if I was going to attend the rock in 95 and I laughed as I said "NO!" because the thought of camping with my kids in 90 degree heat and the drive and the time was not a good choice for me and she seemed sure I was going to go straight to hell for it I knew we had little in common anymore and just never went back to read from the books with them again. both of those families were then M@A and suffered a great deal in the next year and it saddened me greatly. Both have since became ordained and one pastors a large church in another state and the other still struggles trying to find a group that accepts them and is involved in an offshoot. I do not think all will recover when they leave or get thrown out.

how do I sat for awhile?

Welll Geo I fought growing up as long as I could, so far so good. grown ups tend to stop having fun and have strange ideas such as blaming and hate. my invisable friends are much kinder than the ones i see in my face at times for sure .

I keep thinking about the phrase "if Im wrong then". If Im wrong about believing the bible to be a true story of Gods people and His will for all then I lose nothing but some time spent looking at some printed words in a bible. If your wrong and Jesus is going to return to reign as the King of King and destroy our enimies then it could be bad for you so I read. Im not saying that as a threat of some sort it is how I think about the subject of to believe or not. playing it safe I guess. I need a Lord in my life now I need to know I have a friend that has a powerful love and concern for me. prayer is my most intimate conversation in all of my days. If you can not "get that" I do understand because I do not know how ayone can survive with any peace without Jesus as Lord. but plenty do everyday. When good things happen I rejoice when bad things happen I cling to the only hope I know that better days are coming. If IM wrong then...

YES! and Im very glad it did . the way is responsible for making the bible a book of integrity for me, I will forever look at my life by what the bible speaks as a standard to me. It is indeed the personal ideas and thoughts about what the bible may say and what some man or women thinks it means or what God told only them it means I am bolting away from . which the way taught me to do as well, although I do not believe that was their intent heh . I believe the Holy spirit does speak to each of of personaly and I mean to say a key word in that statement is each PERSON is able to listen to God as an individual and procede as they deem needed. I am not keen on these words of prophecy to change peoples life myself. no trust in why would my God tell you and not me and what is up IF i cant hear him and He needs another person to what bully me into hearing the truth for my life? can not think that way. do not plan too either . If I thought I should do something and I read for myself the bible clearly states I should not, I would not do it. I get fuzzy on what I should do sometimes and that is where I have learned to live in faith for the Lord to guide me in my ignorance for living. I do not debate the bible anymore, if I truly believe I know what the bible says on a matter and someone points blanks asks me or makes a statement to the contary (and they are friends and we are engaging in conversation) I will defend what I know as truth and declare it as truth from the bible. I will not change my mind even if someone disagrees. But I can agree to disagree. I do not teach the bible tho, I try to live it which is difficult enough for me.

some guy who brags he has not needed a new tooth brush in five years is Gods blessing, tells you going to this class is much more important than finishing any other plan you may have for your life. and you believe him. you might be in a cult.

I look at my relationships and I am happy. um we are all nuts really in a sense . friendships to me are about being able to share me and relating. recently an old neighbor became a widow , I telephoned her for sympathy and every since then we have had this relationship. At first I think it was because she was adjusting to be alone then I realized i must be getting something to stay in . I was able to hear my loss in her , I never had a vioce to speak my hurt and here she was complaining and hurting and claiming not to be able to do what she had to do she would openly say she was frightened and unhappy. she would call crying on the phone ya know, and I would try to say it is alright but she said to me WHY WHY do you think it will be ok, why do you not hurt? how do you be so strong and never crack ??? so in my face so constant so real so raw. Till one day I realize Im a liar and she was right and she was healing me so much more than I ever could help her get over the loss of her husband. I never really hurt for her , she taught me how to be able to hurt for myself and get better. friends are an amazing thing , how they come in your life and change everything if you let them love you. Recently my boss called me in the office with a scream and a yell and slammed the door. man I tell ya people get to know me if I let them. I know he saw my hurt I have laying on my back. ( I seldom if ever speak of my problems to others) in fact I pray to not burden others with my problems often. So he said what he said and he spoke to the point I could not look at him I closed my eyes and just kept saying I will I will... wow how do people do that? "friends" (my boss???) that rip open your thoughts without any private information or details? I think it is love I think it is holy I think it is Jesus christ himself . the body of christ can not be denied. I am older now and I laugh often , I like me , I think Im ok and I think everyone eles is ok too . On most days I think the whole world is my friend waiting for what we have to share with one another. I get over the top emotional sometimes so I need strong individuals that can take a scream or two and realize I probably will get over it. my children particularly my older daughters grap my heart , they allow me to be me and know me( not neccesarily agree with me) they are very protective and I trust their love to the point I submit to them and their thoughts easily. My sons now they are just fun I enjoy them and I enjoy hearing about their life and what they are doing , dreams and stuff. I consider everyone a friend really , and when I need help these strange connections take place that I may judge and consider unworthy untill I take the time to understand the reason the connection is there in the first place and it is very often because of something I am struggling with in my own life. ----------------an issue I do not want to face , a judgement, a hurt I am in denial about and then these looney toons I think I am so much better than put it on the table and I have to stare at it or deal with it and become a better human being more able to communicate and love fully. I think people are fun and a riot. See I do like me and I really think if I have anything to offer this world so does every other person. I remember when I was and am and most probably will be agin a person of judgement or critical of another when faced with *******s and I thank God I am not like in that mood for that momnet , so Im learning to be patient with folks and myself. or I walk scream and yell and get the h2ll away from them. I have had so much change and loss in my life , that all I can say about people is I need them to survive another day or life isnt worth living.

vickles what a sweet post. I truly admire what you said and wish I could be more like that in my thinking: but I relate more to what Bramble said if Im honest. "dont want people to know deeply personal things about me". that is just honest. I donot know why I pull back, well the M@A thing blew my mind and it may have left a scar that cant go away. I want people to know me, BUT I guess I know the big cost and that is the power of having it all go away because someone said I was not good enough anymore. stayed with me I guess. friends friend friends??? We thought we were saving the world for Gods sake... tish tish my head is bowed and shaking . once bit twice shy I guess. vickles you write like you can risk alot still, I sometimes wish I still could but clearly know I often do not . the cost was high for me, but on the other hand to invest in relationships and desire intimte friends I think it may be needed. I do have some but it takes quite a while for me to get there now and always always in the back of my mind I have a guard up that says if it goes bad it does and you will not suffer to much for it again.

Im sorry if this stings but I believe it is significant. The word and nothing but the word , um yeah no kidding , like education, common sense , and just plain thinking decisions through . God is God like the mafia or something so do not worry. I saw alot of pure ignorance in twi. People floating like fools trusting God for them to tell them to take responsibility for their familys welfare, for their health, or even to get a job. I went to college after I was marked, and I was so surprised to find out gee in the "other world" people succeed and are happy and healthy and can even love one another with a true love!!! honestly I was surprised . It took years for me to realize God is so much bigger than the organization from Ohio and those who demanded my loyalty and obedience. it was a cult. twisted man twisted. so now I am kind of anti cult to the point that if unity and trust and gentle consideration of one another with forgivness is involved well I AM UNCOMFORTABLE!!!!!! go figure. haha Another thing I noticed about this cult head recovery is LEADERSHIP has turned into a problem at times.... I obey easily and quickly bosses are impressed etc. UNTILL I trip out and flip on them (twi flashback of the cost of my life and pure resentment) . Im ok really do not worry about me , when my vioce pitches and I raise my arms to an extreme when I feel like Im being controlled again... no damage here . GEEEEEZ does anyone eles understand? I have a boss right now a man who is very disciplined and was in the military so he can handle my crap from the cult(so far) but it has cost me jobs and friendships in the past. Schwaigers that is a fantastic post ! although I am not intimidated by education or money , I do tend to hang and speak more clearly with those who have the same income level as me... (poor lol) interesting note, I think more than twi his a factor in this . I think Im a loser who is a winner !!!1 I really do , im laughing here because this thread put some serious stuff together for me , I do know myself and Im middle age then something happens and I notice a part of me I no longer like and change myself... sometimes when this happens and it isnt an easy process the relationships I may have may need to be less than for me to grow or move on in my life. I have changed alot in my life and I think it is natural that my relationships have changed as well. some like I said have always stayed but some are gone now . I have had friendships that have lasted as short as a few weeks and thirty years later they are still with me, haughting my life with a lesson or a love that I can not shake in my mind. but I no longer "see" the actual people.

this forum has helped me trust people more actualy. In an amazing way it has taught me to read what Im thinking... in a sense it helps me understand my own thoughts so I can be more confident in "face to face" stuff. It is less risky than in your face stuff cause I am not invested in a day by day situation like a neighbor or a co-worker would be. Yet it works for communication in areas I can get in trouble with on "the outside" . sometimes I do not understand where people are coming from , why they would think that way this forum helps me get the idea of the why or how someone my think differently which helps alot. friendships and trust wow Im a single girl always have been really and in a world full of couples and unions I at times feel I do not know where I belong...as I get older of course less single friends stick around without more important commintments... so I recognize this area of my life , but I have some dear friends that for the life of me I can not figure out why I love these people, hahaha but honestly . god does and has sent people into my life and we have formed relationships I have some friends from I was a teen I still live in the same area... trust???? I do not know if it was twi that taught me not to trust but it sure gave me some good excuses not to try... Jesus says he does not trust man because he knows what is in them but I can not stretch that to living a life without intimate realtionships that have meaning and trust. I think I kind of live knowing I will make mistakes and disappoint those I love and forgive myself and so if my relationships end up in trouble I can forgive as well. At times I have chose to move on because I can not give or get what I want from a friend any longer and it is just to much work for the relationship to continue when life is to short. but I appreciate the time spent. right now Im in a thing where my feelings are using my better judgements for my own self. If I really saw myself in this relationship without these "friendship" blinders I would say "what the he// are you doing all this for?" I must be lonely I do not know but I have decided to wait and play it out to see where or how rough this is going to be, it is a very intense thing. Is it worth it?> well like Tom Strange says I want to do something rather than have a regret... my best friends are my kids and my parents tho.. I trust them and God . that is about it tho.

I agree with Grizzy. Maybe you need to remember your personal feelings do not play into what the courts may decide in your case. You feel strongly for a reason. everyone does in court that is how people end up in the mess ! the courts are not set up for a righteous cause or even a right and wrong decision , many get away with much "wrong", in court. The reason lawyers are hated is because a skilled lawyer is well trained to manipulate the so called "facts" and evidence of a case to appear in any manner they think will prevail in the case. fair play does not count , skill does and wins the day. I do not believe for a second TWI would take on this if they doubted the strength of their position and have been assured of a positive outcome. You on the other hand Pat sound like a man who wants justice from a very corrupt organization . think about it they amassed millions of dollars without a breath for feelings about the small guy or what is right or wrong moraly do ya think they will fail themselves now? maybe you should think again. The courts do not invest in time and place for all the emotions you think should be included in just why your right and they may be wrong . Yes you may win I believe that is possible , but I also think it is possible they may win .

The other day I spoke with my son . quite grown now. I realized I was talking to a man , a sweet tender man. The conversation struck me so deep as i realized the shift in what I once knew as a boy with his face in a spoonful of mashed potato's with a toothless grin, to this incredible thinking working strong good looking protective respectful sweet man. He was doing his dishes and cleaning up his beautiful new home, when I stopped in for a surprise vist. I thought wow I did do something right in my life as I wispered good bye to a very impressive guy with a peck on the cheek and a hug and it is enough.

well as we were chatting the room threw me out and said I didnt have permission . When I checked the my space it said I had permission but the room will not let me in now.

yes I agree. My friends have not all left and probably never will, my question is why would they invest in the class and the twi for me as a friend and now betray me and consider me a lesser because I have left?

laleo wow that as beautiful . I tell you that was beautiul. I will not get into particulars of why your so correct as it would give out to much information on the internet . Yet suffice to say your on the money and I speak from personal experience of my own and others .... woman suffer alot when they give babies up and we feel they are so brave and the hero's . for what ? to really mourn untill and if a connection is made with their child again? Yet few want to address the actual betrayal aspect of adoption and as you so wonderful put it the missing part of the parent . both the child and the parent ave often suffered life long pain and hurt and wonder. ideas change for a good reason . What has changed is honesty in our culture the stigma of giving a baby up or not having children is gone . Before people didnt know the children where never told ... ever. if they where adopted or if somone had given up a child it was secret never revealed... anyone have grammas out there ask them about how a pregnancy was handled even 50 years ago ... what changed folks mind was the suffering and the loss of those children and the parents who grew to realize the impact of the loss and sought to change this situation in life so others do not have to have such pain and mental issues that last a life time. thank God for those brave pioneers who said this is not how anyone should have to live out life. I believe it will happen again with these children of homosexuals when enough find enough footing and strength in numbers to say enough is enough. thank you for your beautiful post.

Self actualization is a term used to describe a healthy adult. It defines itself and is the top level of mental health, the fact is a very small percent of humans reach this level of understanding in life . very few... The word brainwash is the subsitute for the word Influence, and again alllows the thinker to avoid responsibility for "self" . To actualy be a "self" is independent and our culture fosters interdependence and co-dependence out of fear of losing relationships. Which is a genuine possibility but not nearly as BAD as an outcome as many think or fear . it is the only way we can change our influences and grow more into self!!! As a christian this model of health is completely on bibical rightness if used and applied as a science !!!! To find a common base of mankind to relate to we need to find actual self which incorporates the idea of influences and genuine choices for the greater good of self . The rest of your life is a trick and will end up in disappointment and confused wonder of what happened there. Indeed some influences are so masked we may not understand where that thought process comes from until we study and educate and find a more correct influence to explain. For me it has been Jesus Christ and His revelationto the world at large. for others with self actualization peace may be generated by some different inspiration. The point is self is society and society and culture mix the "selfs" within . Many do not reach understanding or knowledge self actualization due to negative infulences and refusal to address responsibility to make the changes needed to find enlightenment . That is why the mental health field is massive and will never end in its influences as solutions! whew !

http://religiousmovements.lib.virginia.edu/cesnur/cowan.html this link will tell you why the author of this study believes sites like Greasespot work .

I hear you too Geo. I do some of the homopathic stuff and as I said I am not sick. and I think if I was ever sick I would go to a diferent song and dance real quick. That being said I have had good luck with the homopathic route herbs are studied and grown Geo it is a SCIENCE and a Big one at that. Studies have been amass.. Europe funds alot of testing forhomoepathic stuff. the stuff I metioned on this thread for ear aches... Yes controlled testing with scientific results. I read alot and I study and I ask those I know who may have tried it or read experts . The internet is full of information about chemicals and herbs and studies. it isnt just a guru or a witch spell or a a friend told a friend it is a science . it can be foolish as well asis abuse of prescribtive medicine in the states. You can buy this stuff as remedies here in the states and it takes alot of testing to get anything on the shelf in America.

Im having game stress withdraw problems . I want another game!!!! man I am a cult head I admit it... something with a cheat sheet would be good! haha

When I went in to play agin and clicked continue it put me in the basement level to start hmm ....cool

I did it !!!!!! Ya know I took the six numbers and punched them in and guessed on the other two or sumthing and I looked and the red wall went down !!!! I signed the guest book they said more levels are on the way! thank you I realized in this thread I am a B@tch when I do not get it right on my terms... and I did it!! this is good thank Cool Waters for this. I think . Wow Im impressed my kid thinks Im nuts for all the time I spent this week doing this but I am feeling proud now wow it doesnt take much does it? love mj412

it does not look for mj412 in the game at all #1 problem is the # on the wall ok the most I can see at a time IF ISHUT every other room light off is 6 old cheap screen I own does not have proper contrast and I may be blind so then I get the game icon involved because they coer half the numbers well hey Im a quick study so I was able to make the strip of icons go away still only six numbers but im in the game!!!! ... so i head off to the other room and the basement in dark clicking for the light switch word on the wall not so much of a hassle right??? well it seems the rule is IF you switch the icon away from the six not eight number that mj412 was on her hand and knees on the floor with her hands cupped around the area on the screen to see. it also switches off the words that come across the screen that tells you what you clicking!!!! for example SWITCH!!!!!!! HEY NOW this is a challenge ! somthing bad happened it may have been a rage thing I do not know anymore but I clicked the x in the corner and stopped the insanity for a moment. Im a disgrace. But if I try again of course I can look forward to taking the risk of cutting the wrong wire in the puter in the basement YEAH by the way thank you flow7 after I found that out the hard way as well . but the cats litter box may need scooping about right now and it sounds like more fun... bad gamer mj412 bad bad I know I know the end of this will be the one and the only moon and stars for me for sure now..

oh Steve that was so good!!!! I cut the wires and the d@m lights went out and I cant see a thing good night im done love mj412