Rocky

Myth ≠ falsehood I think you probably realize it.

We disagree. Or, I disagree with you on this. Frankly, I look at pretty much the entire bible as myth and not as literal, factual, rational "truth." So, taking some of the recorded mythology in the bible and expressing your (private) interpretation thereof is IMO, constructing additional myth.

I appreciate how you phrased it.

Ah HA! I don't frequent that forum... or even go there infrequently. I looked and didn't see any threads about books anyway. I recently started making note cards like Ryan Holiday does. I use 5 by 8 index cards. I will use them for reference when writing books or essays (like my blog). I get many of my books from public libraries and don't highlight or underline in them. With kindle books I put in my own kindle library, I highlight copiously. If you'd like to discuss any books in particular and want to start threads in that Movies, Music, Books, and Art FORUM (I mistakenly said thread the first time), that's a wonderful idea. However, if you do, please send me a PM and I'll check it out.

Then contrast this idea with Kierkegaard's " Both ideas are incredibly powerful. We, at GSC (most of us anyway, with exceptions for Mike and others like him) are dedicated to understanding the life experiences we lived under twi/wierwille/martindale etc rule. I also am dedicated to the necessary work of imagining my future and planting trees my grandchildren will be blessed to sit under the shade thereof and contemplate their futures.

To me, the symbolism is they are suggesting to people they should return to foggy mind times.

What you actually seem to be doing is constructing MYTH. There is no rational or biblical basis for either question as I see it. I commend your imagination but not your communications skills or biblical understanding or rational analysis skills, or even your self-awareness. The only basis for what you propose is what you conjure between your ears. If you (or any other reader on this thread were to) want to understand the history and role of MYTH over the course of humankind's dominion over the earth, I recommend A Short History of Myth by Karen Armstrong. Ms Armstrong is a former Catholic nun and writes exquisitely about human understanding of God (and gods) and spiritual ideas through the millennia. In a prologue to A Short History..., "Myths are universal and timeless stories that reflect and shape our lives--they explore our desires, our fears, our longings, and provide narratives that remind us what it means to be human." Myth predates and co-exists with Hebrew, Islam, and Christian understanding of life. My life experience and travels (abroad) exposed me to Catholic traditions which were adopted by various local communities and incorporated into church practice by Catholic practitioners.

Might you possibly have meant the thread in the About the Way forum on Shedding Waybrain: Antifragility?

Books forum?

I disagree with your conclusion as a blanket statement. For many, in practice, it seems to apply. Not to me, however. And it doesn't have to apply to anyone else who doesn't want it to.

That's kinda what I was trying to assert. Discussions, even when including one or more arguments, should not necessarily be about winning. Rather, about expanding our understanding and imagination about the possibilities. I appreciate your thoughtfulness, Raf.

It seems you answered a different question than I did. Sure, for each individual it takes that person to think for his or her self. Even so, cults are a social phenomenon. The question I answered was about the sociological aspects that caused the unraveling of twi as related to gsc. I don't believe either answer is incorrect.

It took, IMO, two things. 1) The Al**ns having an air tight claim and that they were willing to air it publicly (Waydale) and in court. and 2) Memoir written by someone like Kris Skedgel. There were others who sued, but those specific events blew the doors clean off the secrecy. People gossiped about twi sexual norms long before those two events, but it became very real with documentation. However, there has been plenty of worldwide publicity on cults and sexual problems with authoritarian organizations other than twi over the last couple of decades.

There's no new thing under the sun, at least in terms of group conduct and norms. If the pancake house (sorry, prayer hop) is authoritarian and has no safe guards, there will be sexual abuse somewhere in the mix. Of course, IHOP will dismissively refuse to validate any related concerns. It took decades before Wierwille's debauchery became widely known.

What YOU did NOT do is qualify your incomplete attempt to effectively communicate your point until after someone called you on it.

No, but I read the book by Jeff Sharlet with that title... which is why I didn't watch the movie.

I would be surprised if this particular point has not been thoroughly litigated already. That's a wonderful rhetorical question. (Therefore, I'll not look it up at this time)

I'm confident (as a former accountant) if twi WANTED to take care of Dorothea, medically and financially, they could have gotten around it.

Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards. - Soren Kierkegaard I wonder if, during his life, he ever read enough of Kierkegaard to have grasped this reality?

Wierwille's problem (in contemporary American culture and religious history) is not simply the ubiquity of the internet, but also the immensely immense growth of social and psychological scientific knowledge and understanding over the last two millennia. Not to mention how many people can read and write because of the proliferation of public education (worldwide).

I concur.

Was that why they were so SAD you see? Isn't it amazing to still, after all these years, find a memetic expression from Wierwille and the PFLAP class so easily retrieved?

I'm uncomfortable seeing a post like this (which seems obviously copied from somewhere) without the source citation provided. Thankfully, finding it for this one was easy. http://whatdoesthebiblesay.weebly.com/18-characteristics-of-a-pharisee.html