Rocky

I am not a crook! -- Richard Nixon

Plenty of female HUMANS shout during sex also. I don't have any studies to cite, but can report anecdotal evidence of same. :)

Pretty much... yeah.

However, it's looking like the NLWest is still going to have strong pitching for the 2008 campaign.

Yeah... THAT's the one that counts, IMO... THAT is when spring starts.

That's pretty much how I look at this thread also.! :)

HEY! I heard THAT!

Schilling to Clemens: prove it! Clemens told to prove innocence or return awards Thu Dec 20, 12:23 PM ET NEW YORK (Reuters) - Boston Red Sox pitcher Curt Schilling has called on Roger Clemens to give up four of his Cy Young Awards if he cannot clear his name after allegations in the Mitchell report that he used steroids. While Clemens has denied allegations detailed by former Sen. George Mitchell's report into doping in Major League Baseball, Schilling wrote in his blog (38pitches.com) that he believes Clemens must take legal action to prove his innocence.continued...

Do you mean other than -- I don't believe him?

As do I.

Well, A-Rod last night, to me, when he answered THE question, looked like he was lying... but no way to really tell. However, the images of him taking swings in his custom made, home batting cage... well, the images alone were so-so... BUT with the SOUND?! That crack of the bat clearly lent credibility to everything he said in the interview. So, MY take is this -- IF with diligent testing, he always comes up with negative results... and if his performance doesn't take a nose dive, then A-Rod's off the hook completely. Clemens, well, NO way I'm believing him. Petitte... probably did what he had to do (this weekend, I mean). Everybody looking for (calculating) ways to minimize the damage. Petitte's will probably work. A-Rod's will probably work. No way am I believing Clemens... he just flat out denied any use. And THAT has to be bull hockey.

Yes... I'm aware of the big trading day the Dbacks had yesterday. I mentioned it on this thread, btw. Byrnes DID do good... and having traded Valverde, is NOT being criticized locally for doing so... THAT, IMO, is a very significant indicator of the incredible job he did yesterday. I'm pleased to see that the Dbacks got Qualls from Houston. He gave the Dbacks fits everytime he came in a game against us.

To my knowledge, this situation (notably, regarding A-Rod) is NOT related to "our legal system."

Apparently, enough people thought so that A-Rod felt compelled to come out and flat out deny steroids use. And didn't use the kind of language that Bonds did. A-Rod apparently said "I have never used steroids!"

When I think of Roger Clemens, I think of the bozo that threw the spear end of a broken bat at what's his name... the catcher... Mike Piazza.

Well... that's the point I was trying to make -- that to really take any serious action against anyone in particular, you'll need much stronger evidence than is noted in the Mitchell report. And the union AIN'T gonna make it easy to do that.

Yeah... Tom, what ARE you saying? Yes, Petitte was trying to speed up the elbow healing... but what about Clemons?

I don't know anything about Petitte (other than the Dbacks beat him in the 2001 WS) and I don't know what Clemens is saying... but I'd bet Clemens is lying, no matter what he's saying. I've felt for a long time that he's got a cheaters' mentality. :blink: And the Dbacks picked up Dan Haren today! An excellent move, IMO.

And, especially for the sake of teenagers now and in the decades to come... make major examples of the cost of using... in every way that cost can be portrayed.

I like those ideas. Yet, I don't think background checks on "clubbies" will put a stop to anything. Tracking packages, however, could be helpful... but I'm thinking that guys with lots of spending money and mischief on their minds can find plenty of ways around that too... can you say "Mailboxes, Etc."?

I hope you're right on that.

If Fehr has his way, this WILL be all for naught. That's more or less what I expected. Hiway... it won't be nearly as bad for the named players as you suspect... One day of weeping and gnashing of teeth and a life time of sweeping (under rugs). And I don't know what Selig's going to be able to do... that could have simply been first day bluster... the union's going to go to bat for any of them that face any repercussions from the league... and that alone WILL obscure the issues. BUT... IF they do blood testing, then we can say they will have made progress. The most significant thing that needed (still needs) to get addressed is the cultural impact on youth wanting to develop themselves into professional athletes. THAT youths feel they can and should do steroids has got to change.

Was that Dizzy Dean (not to be confused with Howard! ) and guys who played in that era? btw, Mr. Corked Bat (Sammy), though not mentioned in the report, is thought to be a steroid user, I think...?

What the report does is use the names of guys they had somebody provide evidence on. Like with Dbacks' Alex Cabrera... it doesn't say "he used steroids" but does say that the team intercepted a package, told Cabrera the package had gotten lost, sent the contents to the DEA for analysis, and this is what they found in the package. But before the DEA could report, Cabrera was playing in Japan, so they didn't bother asking the union for permission to test him. It seems there's a lot of that kind of thing. Which boils down to circumstantial evidence against individuals, but so many incidents that the case is made that the entire culture of MLB is saturated with steroids. btw, I took a nap... so, I didn't listen to Bud or Donald.

That was my initial reaction to seeing Pujols name... he's supposed to be one of the good guys... however, he did have a hard time last season... perhaps due to coming off of steroids. I'm not sure Giamatti would have been able to do any different than what we've seen. Fay Vincent, wasn't he forced out to make room for Selig? I read last night in the NYTimes that Vincent had wanted to try to do something about steroids... I'll be very interested in what he might have to say in the next days...