hiway29

I had no idea Living in Love was removed from the bookstore …. In my memory, it is a perfect piece of cult indoctrination ,painting this idealistic picture of the early years of vpw and life on the farm. I don’t see why theyd want to bury it. I was gone by the ‘fog years’, and certainly by the regime of hate and absolute control lcm it became. Was this part of the ‘old winecaskets’ , ‘cleaning house’, and all that? What a place !

The snow on gas pumps was recorded in minute detail from vp’s lips to elena whitesides book, the Way Living in Love, which of course you’re aware of. I consider that book sanctioned material. That is almost a textbook on how to think, act, and talk like a seasoned wayfer.

I worked for Disney studios for 25 years...after my twig leader days, so it doesn't really count. I recently found out that a coworker for many years was in the way....shockingly still considers himself to be... but the topic never came up in the years we worked together...I 'discovered' the info in an odd FB manner....I think not knowing spared me a lot of dynamics I was better off without. At any rate..I wasn't Goofy..but drew him an awful lot.

Just for the record...the 7Up ad is not real. There are photoshop artists that can recreate, change, produce things that look authentic...like an old 7 UP ad. More now than ever, don't believe everything you see.

In answer to the question of whether it was my choice to not leave the WOW field for my Grandmother's funeral. In retrospect, they would have probably (maybe ?, I dunno) allowed me to go ...but the commitment had been so drummed into my head, on a daily basis, that I did not press the matter.I'm sure it would not have been simple or with any kind of caring. I certainly told the corps dude I was living with about it, and wrestled with it. That's why I feel shame and remorse..... I should have just gone, and it is a reflection of not only the power the way had over me, but clearly a dysfunctional mind that was confused and needed healing....which is why I got involved in the thing in the first place. Whatever dysfunctional tendencies I may be forever stuck with now....I can hardly imagine how far gone I was to allow that situation to play out like it did.

It hit me like a ton of bricks not long ago. I think I was in a form of denial for decades. I was a WOW in California in '76. My Grandmother in CT passed away that year and I didn't go to her funeral because I was 'committed' to not leave the area. How could I have possibly done that ? Just thinking of it fills me with shame and remorse.

there is this by mark frontczak...but you're probablt thinking of something else

It was stated that after 1980 there was no tent devoted to believers arts and crafts. There was a 'word in culture' tent through the early 80's where artists and crafts people sold stuff. I spent roa 83, and 84 in that tent pushing 'Glad magazine' and greeting cards . I recall a push back in'85, where the sentiment changed to 'why should our people be making a profit off of the believers' and it was shut down, which effectively drove us out of business, as who else was going to buy the thing.

I was at an open meeting in the auditorium in '86, before the fall, and Craig was yelling that we should quit reading newspapers. He literally said "I'll tell you what to think ".

Infoabsorption, you may be thinking of the house in Sidney, Ohio. The church in New Bremen was set up for theatrical or music productions, and I don't think there was much room to hang paintings. The Sidney house had a lot of art from various way artists , as well as curious items including the window frame through which vp supposedly watched it snow.

My memory is that the 'cultural center' was in New Bremen. I was showing my parents around the area, and my mother was surprised that the way owned that church building. She said she was a bridesmaid at a wedding there in the 40's, and relished being able to look through the place. I question myself though, as DWBH would know more than me.

I donated

Not sure why I am commenting, as I have nothing new, but over the years since being out, I get moments of clarity on things that I always knew. All of these classes laid a groundwork for what we were supposed to believe and how we were to act. Any hint of thought or behavior that didn't jibe with those primers were alarm signals and justification to reprimand, yell at, devalue, criticize and find some existing 'fault' that needed to be corrected , until you were back to parroting the 'word' taught in the classes at all times. After several years of reproof sessions for various crimes, it dawned on me that I could avoid much of it be keeping my mouth shut, cleaning my room, and appearing to be onboard with any and every thing the way did. At one point, I was coordinating a twig, running a way home, class 'instructor', and bookstore manager for the state all at the same time. Thankfully I resisted going into the corps, largely because deep down I knew I would never live up to that standard 24 hours a day, and had no desire to live in a compound. All those classes created a core group of otherwise 'regular' people who had been indoctrinated with just enough way think to make independent goals and actions extremely difficult.

and anything 'earthly' was wrong.... in our thinking or environment....as I'm thinking about in the context of wayspeak and conditioning, 'earthly family' is a total insult and dismissal of our families, parents, siblings.

does nova's copy mean you don't need me to dig out mine , excorpsartist ?

does this mean I don't need to dig out my copy ?

I read it early on in my way life in '75. I was thankful for a look at HQ and way history, as the farm and the day to day workings of the place were a mystery . I had no reason to think I was being lied to, though it was clear from page one that the purpose of the book was to present everything about the way in a positive light. There was no way this all happened in one day, and I got that the interviews and events had been consolidated and arranged for specific reasons, but that didn't cause me to think it was anything but an accurate depiction of life at HQ. I do recall being surprised and questioning the snow, and even then tried to not completely reject it. We all went through a period when we honestly believed the way was genuine and that they would not blatantly lie about such things. I wouldn't have devoted the next eleven years of my life to an organization thatI thought was operating like that. I did laugh at the part where a guy in a bar asks Elena about HQ, and if they sit around and bs about the Bible all day. In my experience that's exactly what went on there, based on the many pages of interviews taking up the first half of the book. I thought the book an entertaining piece of positive propaganda.....which is a far cry from my reaction when i re read it in the 80's when it all hit the fan. I wondered how i could have been so gullible and easily swayed....but of course I had learned a few things since then.

I worked on AOS, animating the amoeba devil. I was working in st Marys with T#yl#r Ov*rbey on a thing called Glad magazine, when he got drafted to do it. We painted hundreds of animation cels, and filmed it in his living room. This was based on lcm's directive that the adversary should be shapeless and without form. I thought it a strange production in many ways, but admit I enjoyed the music and dancing more than some of the endless teachings in the auditorium. I did get a kick out of seeing the Catwoman suit with our silly amoeba shapes on it.

The lovely dog video was not part of the video class I took in '77, but in '81 I was somehow living in St Marys, and was at a 'local fellowships' meeting they decided to do one night at HQ.Unless my memory is faulty, it was not an advanced class, or leaders meeting, and certainly not a corps meeting. For forgotten reasons, they pulled out the dog sex tape to show the good people of St Marys and New Bremen. Reactions ranged from audible gasps to the usual stunned silence so as not to be perceived as taking issue with anything done at HQ.

I still feel ill when I recall how they soaked people to build that auditorium.I was in CT where we had an area meeting with Joyful Noise traveling through, pushing for the building fund. A couple of impassioned songs by Claudette had a woman who I was 'working with, just starting the class, not a penny to her name, emptied out her wallet that night for the place. I so wanted to tell her not to do it, and still feel guilty that I didn't.

I was painting a mural for the new Knoxville school gym on the day VPW died. A cowboy on horseback by the words Ranger Country.I thought then, and even more so later, that it felt good to do something for the community, besides providing customers for Adolphs. While passing through Ohio in 2003, I stopped by the school out of curiosity. The custodian showed me that the mural was still there. They had recently repainted the gym , but painted around the mural. I have no idea if it is still there. Adolphs had closed down , and I was immediately followed by security as I slowly drove past the fountain of stagnant waters.

Thanks for the reply, DWBH. I wasn't insulted. I've respected your insight , honesty, and genuineness for a long ,long time, and appreciated the no bs information. Thanks for understanding where I was at.I may be his friend, but if he's guilty of all this, and it sure seems likely, I agree that jail time is only part of the deserved kickback.

Thank you for that response,DWBH. I would not take issue with one word. If it sounds like I'm excusing Fr&;$czak , or lessening what he's done, it's not my intent. I was surprised when he contacted me, not knowing what agenda he had, and debated whether I should make the call. I lost a lot of respect for him years ago when I learned about Barnard. It was until fairly recently that I learned about his daughter being one of his maidens. That trumped everything if it was true, but I am so removed and not aware of what went down there, thatI admit that part of me hoped that wasn't true. I mean that's insane , abusive, perverted , behavior- how the hell could any parent do that. i guess it was easier for me thousands of miles away physically, and even farther away from cult living, to think that there MAY be more to it than the rumors I'd heard. As I said, I like Mark, and it was difficult for me to put those pieces together. I was not looking forward to calling him, knowing what I know. I admit I was mostly concerned with hidden agendas and motives on his part. The timing with Barnard being in the news seemed too convenient. Not knowing for certain about a lot of the crap he's swimming in, I thought it best to keep it at a nice to chat old friend level. I was frankly more concerned that he may be looking to use me in some fashion, than feeling like I should call him out on all that's gone down. In looking up old friends, he did say he was going to meet with Charlie Qu&; llen, the guy from bless patrol who married him. Not sure if that means anything to anyone. I don't know if he looks at greasespot. being a security guy you'd think he would......if so he certainly knows who hiway29 is now. I admit I tiptoed and danced around some real issues. I appreciate the cold water in my face, DWBH.

I did call Fr$/&czak this weekend, following up on my earlier post here. I was almost certain he was looking for a financial donation to aid Barnard, but was surprised and pleased when he didn't ask for anything. He wouldn't say much about that situation , stating that in the middle of the trials and all, he is not talking specifics. I suspect he's deep in crap , and likely to be called upon as a possible witness, hostile or otherwise. He did say his family has been going through incredible stress and pressures the last few years, but I held myself back from saying what the f did you expect . I did ask him to plainly tell me where he was at right now. He said he and Jean are no longer following Barnard, that they just want to move on in life. I suspect it's not as simple as that, and that his involvement was much more than casual, and that the realities of the mess are way beyond anything he could foresee. I would guess that he was fine with Barnard for reasons I'll never fathom, but when the real world came knocking and told them it's not ok for A cult leader to have a harem of maidens, that the heat got turned up too high. Taking the talk at face value, He said he was wanting to reconnect with some old friends after too long, and he said nothing that made me think he had any other agenda. I like Mark, and it disappoints me that an intelligent , giving, guy could be so gullible,but i hold out hope .

So I get an email yesterday from M#rk Fr&*^z*k, who was (is?) one of Barnards right hand men. I was good friends with M#rk back in the 80's. I learned he was involved with Barnard when he called me twelve years ago with a plea to help the 'camp' out financially, and thought the place just another odd off shoot ex way club. That's the last I heard from M8rk until this email yesterday. According to a greasespotter who had much inner involvement with Barnard, The Fr&%$#cz*&s gave their daughter over to Victor as one of his 'maidens'. The F's moved to Washington I'm assuming with Victor, before Victor vamoosed to Brazil. So right on the heels of reading the above article, stating that followers are trying to raise money to free their master, I get this 'hey old friend, long time no talk, give me a call as soon as you can", email. While there is zero possibility that I'll be giving any money, I am considering how to handle this. I will call M2rk, out of respect to past friendship. It will be interesting to see how long it takes to hit me up, and the tactics used. I would love to report that he was just missing me and wanted to catch up, but I haven't been that naive for years. Part of me wants to get in his face and demand to know what the F he's doing, especially concerning his daughter, but my head really hurts after I bang it against a brick wall. We'll see-