Belle

I know that Oakspear and I both presented our research and observations to our leadership that went absolutely nowhere. Granted, it contradicted established TWI doctrine and both of us were considered "problem children" in our respective branches. My ex submitted some very well thought out - researched and documented information to the Right Rev. Moneyhands and never heard a peep back from him on it. And my ex was one of Moynihan's golden boys. He was crushed that Moneyhands never got back with him on it even after V asked him about it several times. In fact, after these things, our local leadership told us that he had submitted research to hq that was ignored and would never be acknowledged because "that's how they are". I countered that it was hypocritical and wrong for them to be like that, but they continued to justify and excuse the behavior. *sigh* You (rhetorical) either continue sitting in vomit allowing a group like that to tell you what to do and what to think or you learn to think on your own which will lead you to a cleaner pasture. LOL! That was pathetic and utterly twisted. Has everyone seen the brilliant debt research information presented by Chris Jordan? It's fabulous - precisely follows TWI's rules for research and clearly shows how wrong the TWI doctrine and teachings on debt are. I think the link to it may be here at the cafe, if not, I have a copy of it on the home computer.

This popped up on my TWI alerts..... I know the building is old, but don't recall hearing any haunting stories, especially nothing about a wall bleeding oil..... Here's the link and the Rome City / TWI information is about halfway down with pictures. Anyone have any stories, experiences or whatnot while you were there?

Awesome!! HAPPY ANNIVERSARY!! Paw, thanks ever so much for keeping the doors open to this safe haven! And thanks for letting me keep my gum under the counter. MStar, the daffodils are beautiful. :)

Welcome Karwin! Pushing New Zealand? Not sure I understand what that means?

Others have come to see the hypocrisy of TWI and their personal beliefs when trying to defend them here. Hopefully that's what's going on with shiftthis. :) Remember Jerry came on here defending PFAL and, thanks to reasonable discussions, debates and study he came to see how foul TWI teachings are. It's painfully obvious to those of us who have gone through the enlightenment process and come to terms with the 'holier than thou' attitude we were conditioned to have while in TWI that those teachings are still promoted in TWI. The twisting of words, severe condemnation of not just homosexuals but also refusal to accept those who won't "do the word"..... All while acting as though everyone in TWI is perfect and does everything TWI teaches..... not scripture, but TWI legalism. It's tough to realize that TWI teachings aren't all that accurate and that the behavior within the walls of TWI is not what God would be proud of. I'm ashamed of how I treated folks when I thought the way shiftthis does.

Out, no, life isn't sweet because when bad things happen in TWI it's due to the adversary attacking their arse for being such good little wayfers. 'Course if the almighty leadership were doing a better job of "standing in the gap"...... Shellon, I'm going to Mississippi in a couple of weeks. I could make a stop and have a "come to Jesus" meeting with someone if'n ya want. I sure want! What b.s.! How the heck minds get so twisted as to send crap like that to someone, I'll never understand. I don't understand how I could have thought that way for way too many years. Definitely spiritual abuse. Definitely proof that TWI has not changed one iota. Still abusive, manipulative, judgmental and everything else that's the antithesis of what they claim to stand for.

Why the NYT felt it necessary to mention this bit of information, I don't know, but thought it interesting that they mentioned the cult status. Here is the whole article.

Just to clarify.... Princeton Theological Seminary..... not to be confused with THE Princeton University.

Yeppers. Well said. That was one thing that helped me leave after I realized I didn't really have a marriage if my husband would choose TWI over me should I leave TWI. Nice... really nice awakening. I knew I didn't have any real friends since I'd abandoned all of them when getting involved with TWI and "we don't have friends when it comes to the word".... I do have a very loving and supportive family, so that helped, but they don't live here so it was difficult but I had the cafe and the wonderful friends I've made here. That was priceless in terms of support and helping me maintain some sort of sanity. Life is SOOOO MUCH BETTER now! I so wish I could hug those folks and tell them the pain, fear and uncertainty of adjusting to living your own life is absolutely worth it!

"The devil you know....." Fear.... they have nothing - no savings, no security, no support, no pride, no skills without massive amounts of spin..... no freedom, no ability to think for themselves, no guts to stand up for themselves. Leaving after having TWI dictate every aspect of your life for so long is certainly a scary prospect for long time staffers. It takes work to leave and it IS an unknown life.... easier to just sit in the dark and wish you could leave.

Welcome! You're among friends and those who understand where you're coming from. :) You'll find lots of support and answers here.

They are certainly masters of spin. Wouldn't, though, anyone in the area know his true background? And, hopefully, avoid using his services? Really pathetic. Makes me wonder how many jobs my ex is working up there trying to make up for lack of any savings and retirement. He gave up so much in the way of a promising career down here to work security at the compound.

I remember hearing vee pee recite it and I do think it was on the All Aboard album and remember thinking it was such a sad tale. Truly ironic given the pain and scars he and TWI have inflicted on folks.

(((((Radar))))) I'm with Bow and Radar. I love spending time with J & HR! And can vouch for the fact that they definitely know how to throw a party. Hope and I had a blast when she came to stay with me for the Green Day concert here in Orlando. This site (GSpot) is about The Way International. I just don't get why so many of you are obsessed with what others are doing while enjoying life the way that makes them happy and has absolutely NOTHING to do with you and your life. <_<

FYI - In case you live in the area: Blood Drive at TWI

I second Waysider, Dear One. :wub: My brother was unable to make it home for our Christmas celebration the week before because his business has been very slow and they got a job that had to be completed by Christmas. We were sorry to miss his visit, but happy that his company was able to land a nice job. I'm thankful, too, for my job and that the recession hasn't affected me as badly as it seems to have so many others. So, I'm glad that you have a job and two strong legs to work on. :B)

Love, Love, Loved WayDale and got so much help from the folks there. I miss so many of them, but understand that we sometimes move on to the point where we don't need or have time for sites like this anymore. :) I also have life long friends I've made there and here and, for that, I am eternally thankful to Paul and Paw. We've had great times here, too! WayDale was new, it was the first of it's kind - with apologies to trancechat which was more of a minefield from what I hear. It is also the first place many of us learned of the dark underbelly of TWI and the immense abuse, lies, corruption and pure evil that went beyond our wildest dreams. GSpot carries the torch rather nicely and I've enjoyed building my gum collection under the counter here. :wub:

Sorry I missed it, Paw!! Hope this is the beginning of your best year yet!

:wacko: Y'all put your ketchup in the fridge? :blink: Ewwwww..... My fridge does NOT have ketchup but it does have jars of mayo, mustard, tamari, pickles, olives and about a dozen half used salad dressings of various kinds that I no longer know what's good or not. Some wilted spinach, eggs, tea, shrooms, leftover steak and that's about it. I cleaned out most schtuff before heading out of town for Turkey Day. Freezer: Batteries, cranberries, Tandoor Chef Palak Paneer, Kofta Curry, bananas, chicken strips, chopped spinach, a couple of things so freezer burned I'm not sure what they once were.

I found the rest of it: Nevertheless, you now strenuously object to this decision and claim that you would prefer that your mother return to a home setting. If your primary concern is truly your mother’s health and well-being, your position makes no sense. Despite your protestations to the contrary, it was a family decision to admit Mrs. Wierwille to the nursing home. The Way International had no input in the decision because it was (as it should be) a family matter. You know full well that your sister, and not Wanda, has the legal power to make the final decision affecting your mother’s health and financial matters. Without your sister’s authorization, your mother would not have been admitted to the Alzheimer’s care facility. For you to claim that your family never consented to what has happened is simply not true. Because your family has the ability to make decisions for Mrs. Wierwille, there is nothing to preclude you from having your mother discharged from the nursing home and brought into your own home. With the income provided by Social Security and The Way International’s pension plan together with Mrs. Wierwille’s assets, you could purchase 24-hour care for the foreseeable future. Of course it would be impossible to replicate all the services available in the Alzheimer’s Unit in a home setting. If you want to make some kind of point against The Way International and/or Wanda Wierwille regardless of the best interests of your mother’s quality of life and well-being, you have the ability to do so. You just need to convince your sister. The Way International cannot prevent you. THE WAY INTERNATIONAL HAS (AND WILL) FULFILL ITS “ETHICAL” OBLIGATION TO CARE FOR THE NEEDS OF MRS. WIERWILLE. Your letter criticizes The Way International’s contributions to your mother’s medical expenses and is intentionally written so as to mislead people into believing that your mother been abandoned by The Way International. I respectfully request that you consider the following facts. Dr. Wierwille fell asleep in 1985. Since that time, Don and Wanda Wierwille have taken care of all the needs of your mother with the assistance of many volunteers from The Way International. After consultation with medical experts, your family (apparently over your objection) has concluded that it is in the best interests of Mrs. Wierwille to be cared for in the Alzheimer’s Unit of the nursing home. Accordingly, Mrs. Wierwille’s needs have been and are continuing to be met. The Board of Directors’ memo to The Way Corps states that “it will not be necessary for The Way International or any member of Mrs. Wierwille’s family to use any of their assets to pay for her care.” Based on our understanding of the facts, we stand by this statement. It is interesting that your open letter does not dispute this fact. Nowhere in your letter do you state that it will be necessary for either you or other family members to contribute financial resources to cover your mother’s medical expenses. As indicated in our memo, the nursing home has confirmed that in the unlikely event a shortfall were to occur, Mrs. Wierwille will qualify for health care benefits offered by the government that will cover any shortfall. Using your words, your mother will be “seen to” for life. Your letter intentionally attempts to portray The Way International as having abandoned your mother. That is simply false and you know it. We are also shocked that you have allowed (and perhaps encouraged) friends of your mother to request contributions to a fund to defray your mother’s medical expenses. This is truly outrageous because it will be unnecessary for you or any other member of the Wierwille family to contribute to this expense. We can only speculate as to what your motivation could be for requesting money from people to defray expenses that are already covered. You also challenged the legal advice provided by our attorneys about what a charitable corporation’s obligations are under federal and Ohio law. In my letter to you of February 14, 2003 , we described that advice, encouraged you to discuss it and gave you the opportunity to discuss these legal issues directly with our attorney. Our attorney has informed us that no member of your family has ever contacted him. The Way International is an Ohio non-profit corporation, and a Section 501©(3) church under the Internal Revenue Code. Federal and Ohio laws limit the use of The Way organization’s assets. If you are unfamiliar with these laws, you should engage a competent tax lawyer to advise you on these issues. You or your attorney should feel free to consult with our attorney. If it were ever to become necessary for either you or any of your siblings to contribute to expenses attributable to your mother’s care, we would appreciate advance notice. Your mother’s care and well-being is of the utmost importance to The Way International. While we cannot (and will not) use ministry assets for such personal expenses, we will find a legal and viable solution to ensure that your mother’s needs are satisfied. However, our concern is limited to your mother’s needs, not your potential inheritance. MRS. WIERWILLE’S CARE PRIOR TO HER ADMISSION INTO THE NURSING HOME WAS THE BEST THAT COULD BE PROVIDED IN A HOME SETTING. You also insinuate that the care provided by Wanda Wierwille and her family was substandard. Needless to say, we are extremely disappointed that you would make such an attack on Wanda Wierwille, who together with your brother Don cared for your mother for the last 18 years. If you were dissatisfied with the care provided to your mother, there was nothing that would have precluded you from bringing her into your home for care. Your sister had the power of attorney to make these decisions. I assume you and she must have spent some time discussing your mother’s well-being. Because you have decided to publish our February correspondence, please review my letter which discusses the possibility of having your mother hire a nurse’s care service to provide the very assistance that you now claim she was lacking. You neither responded to my letter nor requested Wanda to engage this assistance. THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS DID NOT PORTRAY WANDA WIERWILLE AS THE SPOKESPERSON OF THE WIERWILLE FAMILY. As you noted in your open letter, there are many who love Dorothea Wierwille, including those who continue to fellowship with The Way International. Since Dr. Wierwille fell asleep in 1985, Don and Wanda Wierwille have lived with and/or cared for your mother. Based on this relationship and Wanda’s continuing fellowship with The Way International, it was entirely appropriate for her to send a letter to the Household Fellowship Coordinators advising them of Mrs. Wierwille’s condition. Nowhere in her letter (or in our letter to The Way Corps) was Wanda represented as the “spokesperson” of your family. In conclusion, we stand by our original correspondence to The Way Corps. No retraction or apology is warranted, and none will be forthcoming. However, you may wish to seriously consider both. Harve J. Platig Vice President The Way International

I can't find it here at the cafe either. Here are the first three pages of the letter. Note that the all cap, bold, centered sections are as they appear in the posted letter: Open Letter from Harve Platig to J. P. Wierwille Mr. John Paul Wierwille c/o jpwierwille.com Dear John Paul: This letter is in response to your open letter published on your website with multiple links to GreaseSpotCafe.com. Because you have chosen to communicate with The Board of Directors of The Way International through a public forum, it is appropriate for us to respond in the same forum. As you know, it is unprecedented for the Board of Directors to respond to attacks posted on the internet. However, because of the subject of the attack (i.e., the health and well being of Mrs. Wierwille, the wife of our Founding President and your mother) and the nature of the inaccuracies in your letter, the Board of Directors has determined that this public response is necessary. Let me begin by acknowledging our common ground, specifically the importance of Mrs. Wierwille to The Way International. For the same reason that you did not provide a detailed explanation of her many contributions, I will not. Her importance and contributions are so obvious and universally known among those who know her that any attempt to describe them in a letter would prove inadequate. It is Mrs. Wierwille’s historical position within our ministry that obligates us to refute your allegations and challenge your motives. We find it highly regrettable that you have converted what should have been a private family matter into a public attack against The Way International. Even more regrettable, it appears that you would put your mother’s health and well-being at risk in order to advance some personal agenda. We too are glad that Dr. Wierwille “did not see this day.” As you know, Mrs. Wierwille has been in a nursing home since September. May I remind you, that while your mother was in the hospital, the medical staff informed Wanda that your mother requires twenty-four hour professional supervision. They recommended having Mrs. Wierwille transferred to a nursing home for professional supervision and further evaluation. That evening Wanda communicated this recommendation to your sister. The next morning your sister informed Wanda that all the children were in agreement. Wanda had no reason to believe you did not approve, and since your sister is the one with the power of attorney, Wanda was obligated to follow her instructions anyway. Because it was a private family matter, The Way International did not report this event to either The Way Corps or its Household Fellowship Coordinators. Only after it was widely reported on the internet did Wanda send a letter to the Household Fellowship Coordinators. The Board sent a similar letter to The Way Corps. Without listing all of your direct and indirect attacks on The Way International and Wanda Wierwille, I will respond to the following claims that you have made: 1. You claim that you and other members of the Wierwille family opposed Mrs. Wierwille’s admission into an Alzheimer’s unit of a nearby nursing home and would prefer that she obtain 24-hour care in a home setting. 2. You claim that The Way International has breached its ethical obligation to care for the needs of Mrs. Wierwille. 3. You claim that Mrs. Wierwille’s care prior to her admission into the nursing home was substandard. 4. You claim that the Board of Directors has erroneously represented Wanda Wierwille as the spokesperson for the Wierwille family. THE ADMISSION OF MRS. WIERWILLE INTO THE NURSING HOME WAS A FAMILY DECISION. Our Letter to The Way Corps stated “Mrs. Wierwille’s children and Wanda Wierwille are in full agreement with the doctors’ recommendations that this is the best way to care for Mrs. Wierwille. After considering the advice and counsel for medical professionals, this decision was made by her family.” You disagree “with no equivocation” with this portion of our letter. We are puzzled to say the least. It is your position that the doctors’ did not recommend that the best way to care for Mrs. Wierwille was for her to receive 24-hour care at a nursing home’s Alzheimer’s Care Unit, or is it that you simply disagree with the advice of medical professionals? You make several pointed references in your letter that your mother is receiving better care at the nursing home than was available at The Way International. It was our understanding from our conversation with Wanda that your siblings and Wanda agreed with the doctors’ recommendation. Apparently, you dispute that you supported the family’s decision to obtain the best medical care for your mother, or claim that Wanda misunderstood your position. Do you really believe that it would be in your mother’s best interest to have her cared for at home? Your letter makes it clear that your mother’s condition has improved under the care of the Alzheimer’s Unit and that she is happy there. What then, is your point of claiming that you are in disagreement regarding the care of your mother? At the beginning of this letter, I noted that it appears that you would put your mother’s health and well-being at risk for some personal agenda. Let me explain the basis for my comment if it is not already obvious. Without a doubt, your mother’s health has improved since being admitted to the nursing home. Wanda Wierwille (even with professional assistance) could not duplicate the services provided at the nursing home.

The Way International Seeks to Ban Bible by Suing Jewish Group I hope they have enough money and chutzpah to put TWI in it's place.

I have no knowledge of anything about this website, much less how to answer this poor girl, but maybe one of you can figure it out:

Community Reformed Church reborn as The Way The website How long before they have to change their name yet again? And, why on earth would anyone want a name that could easily be confused with TWI?