Belle

MDVaden, your post raises more questions than it answers: 1. Why come on here and post questions if you aren't really interested in the answers and discussing the topic YOU brought up? Yeah, you're right. I suppose on landscaping forums there really aren't many families who have been raped, taken advantage of, abused or had lives ripped apart by rose bushes. Compare apples to apples, my friend and you might be surprised. Check out some other recovery forums (more than one) before you judge this one. Good for you. Despite your attempts to pigeon hole us like you learned from the great lcm, most all of us DO have other things we enjoy outside of this board. I thought you were taught that the Bible says not to compare ourselves with each other and that it isn't wise. Tsk, tsk, tsk. WOW! You mean you never go over the same topics on all the other forums you're on? I'm amazed. Is it because if someone new joins the board and asks a question that's already been answered you scold them and tell them to look in the archives? OR is it because your groups never have any new people join? If so,I wonder why that is.... I happen to belong to quite a few other forums, some health, some dog related, some just for fun.... We get the same questions all the time. The same topics come up from time to time on EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THE FORUMS. When new people come on and ask a question we gladly answer their question and discuss the topic for their benefit. It's about things we like to talk about and with people we enjoy chatting online. Sometimes the topic gets heavily discussed, other times is short, depending on the mood of those posting at that time. But we certainly never criticize someone for bringing up something that's already been discussed. I don't think I would like your groups very much since that's the case. I go in cycles posting a lot at some and just a little at other times. Like you, MDVaden, it depends on what's going on in my life. If GSpot isn't for you that's fine, but don't climb up on some high horse and judge the rest of us because we enjoy and/or come here because there are new people coming on board and there are people "in" TWI who want desparately to get out but don't want their families ripped apart. Some of us are here to help them. Some of us are here to join up with good friends we once had and lost touch with because of the M&A doctrine of TWI. You don't know us, although we'd gladly share ourselves with you, so keep your incorrect and false judgements to yourself. All you're doing is proving to us that we did the right thing by leaving TWI. That "holier than thou" mentality must get really old sometimes. Is it tiring to always have to pretend to be perfect?

That was good Lifted! LOL! TF, anxiously awaiting the co-conspirator's contribution.

:D--> I'm sure there are plenty of people who would agree that that would be the BEST way to cut them off! :D-->

Rosie would stand up in front of the lunch time captives...er...employees and, with a sad look on her face, say in her sweetest sounding voice, "Ah think we're all very sorry for that family. It's a shame that the devil is the god of this world and has so much access into the lives of people who aren't faithful to the ministry who taught them the word. We should all be prayin for that family and for that poor gull to be allowed to die. The husband is still the head of that household and we know Genesis says that they are to leave their parents and become one flesh. He has made his decision, and, if that poor gull is only body & soul, there isn't anything we can do for her. They really need the word and that's all we can do to help them. If someone doesn't want the word there is nothing we can do for them. It is hard to see unbelievers and those outside the household suffer, but that is the consequences of not being under the protection of the household."

I agree wholeheartedly with y'all! :D--> Who knows what goes on in the mind of a child? I've seen too much to think you can really predict that. Bad parents sometimes have kids who are great and wonderful despite normal teenage rebellion and good parents who have kids who go off the deep end of pushing the envelope. I really don't think you can tell. Especially if you are not intimately involved with the family and the child.

Thanks, CW! Don't be a stranger! ;)--> I hope things are well with you.

I guess the whole town knows not to mess with the Rascal family! Sounds like Aaron got a much deserved ego boost. Good for him! Congrats to the whole gang! Pat yerself on the back Pround Mama, you deserve it!

How about a deeper love for God - period? How about a deeper love for Jesus? How about a deeper love for our fellow man? How about a deeper understanding of how important family is? Why re-search what has already been taught in the ministry publications? Why not do something novel, like really research the scriptures using real authoritative scholars' research? Why not do something even more novel and start helping people and being good Samaritans? How about apologizing to people for the lives that you ruined? Thanks, Houseisarockin! They appear to be moving closer and closer to Dead Sea status. All these articles look like the standard, give give give - obey obey obey US - bring more money to us, it's your job - you OWE it to the ministry that taught you the word. (You don't owe it to God, it's all about them)

Oh, and Nandon is correct, they came out with a teaching tape summarizing their "research" by rico spaghetti but the tape was given only to the wc and none of the lowly TWIts got to hear the tape. My ex got to hear it because of my insistence that TWI follow through with what they promised. By the time he got the tape, I was already so ....ed and so "out" of TWI that I didn't give a rip. I did listen to the tape and took a bunch of notes on what he said. I thought I posted them here, but maybe not. I'll go back through my notes and see what I can find. Remember this e-mail correspondence I posted is from 2001. The tape, from what I understand, did NOT come out until 2004! So they did take more than 3 years to come up with their justification and spin on continuing to prohibit debt in any form or fashion. Meanwhile, WAYGB, if you could please look through my former posts and either e-mail me when I posted it, or just have Bob or mr. linder bring it to the front again for everyone, I sure would appreciate it. ;)-->

Just because it was distasteful doesn't mean it didn't happen. And didn't they borrow money against some gold bars to make payroll at some time? Didn't Uncle Harry finance the money required to renovate vee pee's home? There's a lot more borrowing that went on at hq than Bob is admitting to here. He did answer my dad's direct question, but he's lying by omission since Bob fully realized what my dad was getting at when he asked whether or not TWI had done the very things they were forbidding their people to do. So much for leadership by example. For the record, it is very distateful to me to have to have a mortgage to pay for a home, but I felt I needed to be working toward security in my sunset years and that I needed to be contributing toward my future and my wealth rather than someone else's. I think many people who continue to follow the policy against debt that TWI claims they don't have, will find their sunset years very distasteful because they can't afford to live even at the lowest level of comfort than they do now before retiring.

diazbro, I'm not sure off the top of my head. I believe I copied it from a link that WayferLookin posted here in 2001 or so. I've been going through some old things I copied to read later and/or chew on. I'll see if I can find it. I think this is a guy's thesis paper in college. I'll peck around and let you know what I find. I'm not trying to deny him credit; I just can't remember.

Then it's a good thing there's no ROA or we'd have to warn you to stay out of the men's showers! However, there's nothing wrong with a little trimming. ;)-->

OM, there's a paper I posted in the Doctrinal section on PFAL that I'm interested in hearing your viewpoint on.

Mr. H - I love your posts! I think your avatar looks like a girl, but I love your posts. ;)-->

Hmmmmm, interesting points Simon and Laleo. I would like to mention, though, that most of you from TWI I and the wc on here do know each other. Also, many people on here have met in person and do have relationships and friendships outside of GSpot and those friendships are not centered around TWI. I have been on a different forum for years and we have met in person from all over the US and Canada on numerous occasions. When we get together in person it's like going to a family reunion. We "talk" almost every day on the web, but hardly ever get to see each other in person. It doesn't make our friendships any more shallow or less of a friendship because the face to face value isn't there. I don't see my best friend from grade school but maybe once a year and i still consider her one of my dearest and best friends. I consider some people on here very good friends and I've yet to meet them in person, but they know things about me that very, very few people know. They know because I felt comfortable enough with our relationship to share with them. GSpot has been very valuable to my healing and I'm so glad Paw puts up with us. :D-->

I'm a 1, but like Zshot, I also relate very well to #'s 3, 5, 6,8 and 9. :D--> some of those are very similar in qualities as well.

I'd be tickled to host one in Florida! :D--> If anyone is interested in coming to me casa, please PT or e-mail me. I've added my e-mail to my profile.

END NOTES 32. Wierwille, Power for Abundant Living, pp. 154-56. 33. On the Aramaic form of Matthew's text see Bruce M. Metzger, A Textual Commentary on the Greek New Testament (United Bible Societies, 1971), p. 70; H. B. Swete, The Gospel According to Mark (London: Macmillan Co., 1905), pp. 385f.; and cf. Brown, Driver and Briggs, p. 552. Scholars transcribe the Aramaic form of mah into English as ma'. 34. Donald Guthrie, New Testament Introduction, 3rd ed. (Downers Grove, Ill.: Inter-Varsity Press, 1970), p. 60. 35. Wierwille, Jesus Christ Is Not God, p. 62. 36. Ibid., p. 63; idem, Power for Abundant Living, pp. 239, 247. 37. Wierwille, Jesus Christ Is Not God, pp. 58-59 (pp, 58-63 contain essentially the same argument as Power for Abundant Living, pp. 231-40). 38. Wierwille, Jesus Christ Is Not God, p. 61. 39. Ibid. 40. Wierwille, Power for Abundant Living, pp. 272-83. 41. Ibid., pp. 278, 280. 42. Ibid., pp. 274-75. 43. Ibid., pp. 34-35. 44. Nicoll, op. cit., p. 419; Evelyn Abbott and E. D. Mansfield, A Primer of Greek Grammar (London: Rivingtons Limited, 1963), Syntax p. 3; H. P. V. Nunn, A Short Syntax of New Testament Greek (Cambridge: Cambridge University Press, 1969), p. 43. 45. Wierwille, Power for Abundant Living, p. 283. 46. Ibid., p. 273. 47. Walter J. Cummins, Fundamentals of Greek Research (New Knoxville, 0.: American Christian Press, n.d.), p. 12, 48. Matthew 26:73. 49. Guthrie, op. cit., p. 21. 50. Webster's Unabridged Dictionary, 3rd ed., p. 779. 51. Most of the above material was gleaned from Edwin M. Yamauchi, "Greek, Hebrew, Aramaic, or Syriac?" Bibliotheca Sacra, October, 1974, pp. 320-3 1, and The Interpreter's Dictionary of the Bible, 1: 188-89, 4:754. 52. Wierwille, Power for Abundant Living, p. 167. 53. Wierwille, Receiving the Holy Spirit Today, 6th ed. (New Knoxville, 0.: American Christian Press, 1972), p. 174. 54. Ibid., pp. 174-75. 55. Wierwille, Power for Abundant Living, p. 164. 56. Lonnel E. Johnson, The Gift (New Knoxville, O: American Christian Press, n.d.), p. 5; cf Wierwille, Receiving the Holy Spirit Today, p. 192. 57. Walter J. Cummins, "The Integrity of the God-Breathed Word," The Way Magazine, May-June, 1975, p. 7. 58. The inferiority of MS 31 is evidenced by the fact that Bruce Metzger does not cite it in The Text of the New Testament. In addition, the list of miniscules (which use cursive script) systematically cited by the United Bible Societies' Greek New Testament (New York: American Bible Society, 1966, 1968), p. xvii, chosen and collated by the Institute for New Testament Textual Research of Muenster, West Germany with co-editor Kurt Aland, includes 21 other manuscripts as late or later than MS 31, but ignores MS 31 itself. Since Cummins has identified himself closely with the Institute and Dr. Aland, we marvel that he would consider MS 31 important and even essential for critical use while recognized Institute scholars reject it as such. 59. Wierwille, Power for Abundant Living, p. 123. 60. Ibid., pp. 134-35. 61. Ibid., p. 135. 62. Ibid., p. 19 1. 63. Ibid., p. 191. 64. Ibid., pp. 188-89. 65. Cummins, Fundamentals of Greek Research, pp. 16-17. 66. Wierwille, Power for Abundant Living, p. 4. 67. Zondervan's Englishmans Greek Concordance is an excellent resource for checking New Testament word use. The New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology is a very good encyclopedia of articles on New Testament word use, written by scores of recognized scholars. 68. Metzger, The Text of the New Testament, pp. 209-11. 69. Good syntaxes and lexicons are invaluable in New Testament study. Among recognized sources are Dana and Mantey's A Manual Grammar of the Greek New Testament and A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament by Arndt and Gingrich, cited above. For a full and readable discussion of the New Testament textual evidence and criticism, Metzger's The Text of the New Testament, cited above, is excellent. 70. Helpful discussions on the Aramaic are found in larger Bible dictionaries, such as Zondervan's Pictorial Encyclopedia of the Bible and Abingdon's Interpreters Dictionary of the Bible, as well as assorted dictionaries of philology, such as The Languages of the World, Ancient and Modern by Stanley Wemyss. 71. Mayer's Interpreting the Holy Scriptures supplies helpful principles of interpretation of Scripture. 72. Walter J. Cummins, "The Integrity of the God-Breathed Word," The Way Magazine, May-June, 1975, p. 7. 73. Wierwille, Jesus Christ Is Not God, p. 3. 74. Whiteside, The Way-Living in Love, p. 43. This article was originally published as part of The Integrity and Accuracy of The Way's Word by John Juedes and Douglas Morton, 1981.

Four Final Conclusions We must draw four conclusions regarding Wierwille's use of God's Word to establish his doctrines. First, his scholarship and translation ability are motivated by a preconceived theology. His corrupt interpretations do not unveil the Word, but only reinforce his preferred doctrine. Second, the methods of interpretation he uses to achieve his doctrine are not sound, but are engineered to mold the Word to fit his design, Third, his preconceived theology and unsound methodology render him virtually incapable of rightly dividing the Word of truth, Wierwille himself points out, "If my research is a wrong-dividing of God's Word, then I stand before God as an unapproved workman .73" His research repeatedly reflects a wrong dividing of God's Word and he does stand before God as an unapproved workman. Fourth, the extent of Wierwille's error invokes the question of whether he is simply misled, or if he is knowingly misleading others. While in this world we may have only partial evidence of the answer to this, the Lord will make all things known on the great day to come. How may Christians, then, accept Victor Paul Wierwille? Is he "the next man of God to rise up after Paul's death,"" as some of his followers suggest? Is he a brother, though misled in some areas? Or is he a "wolf in sheep's clothing," a false teacher with whom we must contend? Wierwille victimizes every fundamental doctrine of Christianity. Scripture itself judges the person who so violates the faith, and especially the doctrine of Christ: "Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds (11 John 9-11 )." Even if the teaching on Christ were the only doctrine Wierwille denied, we would have to reject him completely as a false teacher. To accept Wierwille's teaching in some areas but not in others is not a via)le option. First, his theological system does not allow it. His teachings are so interdependent that if one doctrine is rejected, others fall with it. More importantly, Scripture does not allow us to assent to a false teacher at all. Victor Paul Wierwille must be rejected as a false teacher. We challenge followers of Dr. Wierwille to examine objectively his teachings and use of the Word. A Greek concordance and recognized study aids, written by a wide range of scholars from many Christian persuasions, will supply valuable information. Following a restricted group, composed of Dr. Wierwille and his upper-echelon followers, does not fill the proverb's requirement that "in a multitude of counselors there is safety" (Prov. 24:6; 11: 14). Ask God for the strength and courage to leave The Way. It is difficult to leave friends, acceptance, and status and to write off countless hours of expended time and energy. Nonetheless, Jesus, the accuracy of God's Word, and the hope of eternal life demand no less. Teachers of The Way have a great responsibility to correct their present teaching. "The greater condemnation" (James 3: 1 ) awaits teachers for error they propagate. To those who cognizantly deceive, beware! There is danger of becoming "wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever" (Jude 13). Our Lord is the great and powerful God. He would not allow His people to flounder in darkness from the time of the apostles until the first Power for Abundant Living class in 1953. He has kept His people strong against the power of the evil one for centuries and will continue to do so for His glory. _______________

1. Contrived Definitions and Distinctions Foremost among these keys is Wierwille's contrived definitions of Greek words. His above-mentioned imaginative definitions of pros (with), paradise, metecho (take part), heteros and allos (other), dia (by means of) and others war against reliable lexicons and usage in the Word. Even Wierwille's "literal translations according to usage" never mention the Bible's use of given words, but are founded on his own conjecture. It is apparent that once he decides blow he will use a passage, he then contrives a supporting meaning for one of the Greek words. An unscholarly companion to Wierwille's contrived definitions is his unfounded distinctions between words, like that between allos and heteros. Rather than illuminating shades of meaning, he produces obscuring colors. Wierwille's scholarship fails not only by making erroneous word definitions and distinctions, but also by forcing word relationships. He wrongly equates such words as "with" and "foreknow" and "chosen." His inconsistency is glaring; while he attempts to distinguish between synonyms, be considers wholly different concepts identical. To support his manipulations of words, be uses an occasional English word-not to illuminate a Greek word, but to define it. He uses "isosceles" to define isos and the King James translation "took part" to define metecho. This poor linguistic methodology is like defining the KJV word "conversation" by today's American use of the word.67 2. Abusing Greek Text and Language Abuse of Greek syntax and manuscripts is the second category of Wierwille's defective methodology. His misuse is apparent in the examples discussed above: ignorance of genitives of aim, mid-sentence alterations of word meaning, the superfluous distinction between "faith" and believing," and imposed parentheses that wrongly segment biblical sections. His knowledge of Hebrew linguistic style is no better, as his misapplication of Isaiah 43:7 shows. In order to use Greek manuscripts to his full advantage, he also promotes inferior research tools and false principles of textual criticism. Glaring inconsistencies mark The Way's manipulations of Greek texts. On the one hand, The Way revises the text of John 21:19 on the basis of MS 31, claiming that this thirteenth-century manuscript was based on an earlier, "correct" text. This approach refutes Wierwille's revisions of I John 5:7, 1 Timothy 3:16, Galatians 4:6, and John 1: 18 (which he alters to deny Christ's deity). If MS 31 were based on an earlier, "correct" text, then by the same principle MSS 61, 88, 629, and 635, which support the KJV reading of I John 5:7, were also based on earlier, correct texts and should be accepted. Also by the same principle, the 26 MSS which support the KJV reading of I Timothy 3:16 were also based on earlier texts and should be accepted by The Way. There is more evidence in favor of the KJV readings of I John and I Timothy 3:16, which Wierwille rejects, than there is for his revision of John 21:19. The Way's defense of the use of a late variant supposedly based on an earlier "correct" text proves entirely untenable. Wierwille also misuses Greek texts by setting a lone good source in opposition to all other MSS (as in Gal. 4:6) and by placing a few MSS of low reliability above MSS of greater quality and number (as in John 1:18). Proper textual criticism does not scrape up any MS evidence in existence regardless of quality in order to back a preconceived interpretation, as The Way does. Instead, it delays any interpretation until the text is assured by applying proper and reliable principles of textual criticism, Proper textual criticism first weighs the external evidence, or MSS, considering their date, geographical distribution, and genealogical relationships. Second, the internal evidence of the text and of the passages themselves is examined. Here the more difficult, shorter, divergent, and less refined readings are generally favored, while taking into account the author's style and content.'" The art of textual criticism is oversimplified and abused by The Way.611 3. The Claim of Aramaic Originals Wierwille's third false key of research is his claim that the New Testament was authored in Aramaic, then translated into Greek, Some passages, such as the above-mentioned Matthew 27:46 and Hebrews 11 verses, he claims were erroneously translated, and he offers his own "accurate" translation. He also manipulates Orientalisms to his advantage, as in Philippians 2:6. He uses both "Aramaic originals" and "Orientalisms" to avoid passages that oppose his preconceived theology. Wierwille gives no concrete evidence to support his theories of Aramaic originals nor of mistranslations into Greek. At best, he argues from silence, which is the weakest of contentions. No Aramaic originals are extant, and all of the earliest New Testament manuscripts that have been recovered are in Greek, not Aramaic. The overwhelming evidence favors Greek, not Aramaic originals. Semitisms and Aramaic words found in the New Testament are not traces of Aramaic originals. Rather, they reveal the historic reality of the language Jesus most often ministered in, as well as literary fullness and the Semitic backgrounds and ways of thinking that the Jewish authors were used to. Latinisms, by comparison, are also found in the New Testament (such as Paul's praetorium and Mark's use of Roman monetary terms), but no one claims this to be evidence for Latin originals.71 4. Arbitrary Relationships Set Forth The fourth category of Wierwille's pseudo-research is his practice of relating words and concepts that have no business being together, while he ignores other relationships that clearly should be established. As explained above, he unjustifiably relates the "light" of John 1:6 to the Father, and "foreknow" to "elect" and "chosen." He also equates God's image with man's spirit and makes man's spirit a prerequisite to communication with God. A classic example of his failure to parallel related passages is his refusal to interpret the word "faith" in Habakkuk 2:4 by Paul's quotations of this verse. Sanctified common sense, combined with a fuller knowledge of Scripture and some balanced teaching on valid principles of interpretaion7l would have prevented many of these peculiarities. It is also necessary to curtail logic's tendency to manufacture presumptuous relationships and presuppositions, The most disturbing feature of The Way is not that the group respects Wierwille, but that they place his work on par with Scripture and above the Greek texts that are the Bible's basis! Cummins fully upholds Wierwille's erroneous methods of establishing the Greek texts: "Then, where there appear to be discrepancies we must compare the texts, keeping foremost in our minds the "inherent evidence" which is the evidence from the scope of the Word and the foundational research principles contained in the Power for Abundant Living Classes ." 72 The Word has been proven valid over centuries of use and attack. Wierwille, on the other hand, has repeatedly fallen short of the accuracy and integrity of God's Word.

Disposing of Death Wierwille continues to use his wide range of biblical gymnastics in his teachings on death. Among these, The Way's exposition of John 21: 18, 19 reveals their belief that there is no glory in death. Because of this view they think that, "This passage does not flow in harmony with the rest of the Word nor first century tradition."57 To solve the dilemma of the New Testament disagreeing with The Way's theology, Walter Cummins, assistant to the president, revises the text. His only "evidence" is the lone deletion of the word "death" in a marginal reading of the very late (thirteenth-century) MS 31. Not only is this single manuscript outnumbered by hundreds that maintain the word "death," but it is an unreliable source." This is an excellent example of the lengths to which The Way will go to "prove" its errant doctrines. Wierwille again misdefines a biblical word in his exegesis on a passage relating to a believer's view of death. He quotes Psalm 116:15, "Precious in the sight of the Lord is the death of His saints," and explains: "The word "precious" in the text is "costly." . . . It does not cost God anything when an unbeliever or a God-rejector dies. They have not done anything for God anyway. But if a believer died, it would be costly to God . . . because they cannot help God any after they are dead."19 This word "precious" (yaqar) throughout the Old Testament has the connotation not of expense, but of rareness, value, treasure, or prize. (Note especially I Sam. 3: 1; Isa. 13:12; Dan. 2: 11.) Three times this whole phrase, "precious in the sight of' is used. Each time it is obvious that the lives spoken of were not expensive, but were "highly valued" and so weren't flippantly destroyed (11 Kings 1: 13; 1: 14; 1 Sam. 26:21, 24). In the same way, the death of God's saints is valued and prized in His sight. He does not deal with our lives carelessly, nor does He allow the enemy to reign over us. Instead, He carefully plans and controls the death of His saints to His purposes and glory. Wierwille also comments on the "paradise" Jesus mentions in Luke 23:43, "verily I say unto thee, today shalt thou be with me in paradise," "However, this verse talks about paradise-and paradise is not heaven. . . . Paradise is always a place upon earth." This statement does not agree with 11 Corinthians 12:4. A man in Christ, Paul says, "was caught up into paradise, and heard inexpressible words, which a man is not permitted to speak." Indeed, Paul says this man was "caught up to the third heaven" (12:2). Paradise as Paul speaks of it is definitely not "a place upon earth," as Dr. Wierwille adamantly proclaims it to be. Wierwille further manipulates this text to defend his errant view of death. Following the lead of many pseudo-Christian groups such as Jehovah's Witnesses and the Holy Order of MANS, he places the comma after the word "to-day" instead of before it. His result is, "Verily, I say to you to-day, thou shalt. . . ." He then claims, "This fits with the rest of the Word of God.""' If this were true, then why does Jesus use the phrase "Verily I say to you" scores of times, while He never says, "Verily I say to you today"? Dr. Wierwille's revision is not consistent with the rest of the Word of God. Instead, we have another instance of Wierwille molding the Word to fit his theology, rather than molding his theology to fit the Word. Important to Wierwille's errant view of death is his interpretation of Hebrews 11:5, "By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that be pleased God." He interprets this to say that all, including Enoch, die and stay dead until Christ's return, "He pleased God all the time for which God so loved him that God took him from the place where Enoch's loved ones would die and put him at a place where he should not see death. Enoch did not see anyone else die, but be himself died."62 Wierwille's bizarre exegesis is incorrect on many points. He claims that "the word 'see' is anablepo, which means 'to look with one's eyes' or literally to see someone die.""' In no reputable Greek text of today, including the UBS, Nestle, and Westcott and Hort, and not even in the outdated Stephens' text of 1550 which The Way uses, is the word anablepo found in the verse; nor is it found in any of the critical notes. This reflects either an incorrect guess on Wierwille's part or a deliberate misstatement. Instead, the word is idein, an aorist form of horao. In 17 of the 40 times this word is used in the New Testament, it does not mean a physical seeing as Wierwille demands. Verse 27 of this same chapter is an example. Moses left Egypt. . . . for he endured, as seeing Him who is unseen." Wierwille cites verse 13 as proof Enoch died: "These all died...." However, he does not take into account that this verse is sandwiched in the middle of a section (vv. 6-17) dealing only with Abraham, Sarah, Isaac, and Jacob. Verse 13 refers only to these, not to Enoch and the earlier patriarchs. A look at Genesis chapter 5 is further persuasion that Enoch did not die. The entire chapter is genealogical in nature, listing 10 men, their ages at death, and children. After each one (except for Enoch and Noah) the closing phrase of the section reads, ". . . and he died." This phrase is not listed after Noah because the following chapters continue the narrative of his life, and finally record his death in Genesis 9:29. The phrase is not listed after Enoch's section because he did not die, but instead, ". . . he was not, for God took him." That is, God took him directly to Himself (contrary to Wierwille's ideas) without Enoch first physically dying. (Contrast Gen. 5:5, 8, 11, 14, 17, 20, 27, 31 with v. 24.) Wierwille is also apparently confused about the nature of death, claiming that the person's body and soul-life die together, The Bible says that when a man dies, he is dead and he stays dead until the return of Christ and the resurrection. Nobody who has died is living with the exception of the Lord Jesus Christ, whom the Bible declares God raised from the dead."' However, Scripture is witness that death is not the cessation of all life of the person, but rather a shedding of the body, Death is a "departure" or "release" from that which is only a dwelling or tabernacle as Peter expresses it (I Pet. 1:13, 15; 11 Tim 4:6). Old Testament examples of the departure (and, in one case, a re-entry) of spirits of men from their bodies include Genesis 35:18 and I Kings 17:22. For the Christian, this departure from the body means immediate presence with the Lord (11 Cor. 5:6-8; Phil. 1:21-23), and the cognizant souls/spirits of men continue for a time without their bodies (Rev. 6:9, 10; 20:4; 1 Pet. 3:18, 19; Heb. 12:23; Acts 2:27). Employing Interior Texts Wierwille and his colleagues encourage their followers unknowingly to use inferior study tools. These help to substantiate and bolster their own image as the sole competent correctors, translators, and interpreters of the Word. An excellent example of their widely used inferior tools is the Greek text of Stephens, 1550, in the Greek-English Interlinear by Berry. In Fundamentals of Greek Research, Walter Cummins explains basic textual criticism (finding the original texts of the New Testament writers by comparing varying manuscripts) and shows his readers how to correct two Greek words in Ephesians 3:9.65 However, if he had used any reputable Greek text produced in the past 80 years, such as Westcott-Hort, Nestle, and UBS, this would not have been necessary. These texts have already made the appropriate corrections in Ephesians as well as in such verses as I John 5:7 and I Timothy 3:16. The most tragic aspect of Wierwille's promotion of inferior tools is not simply the false image of himself he creates for his followers. His followers are led to accept his other self-serving and invalid "corrections" and fallacious principles of criticism because on occasion he has been correct and hy this has secured their respect. Misleading Methods In each of the major areas of theology discussed here, Wierwille has fallen short of the accuracy of God's Word. The primary reasons for his incorrect expositions of the nature and work of Jesus Christ, the nature of man, faith, the New Testament originals, "Narrative Development," and death is his inept keys or principles of interpretation. Wierwille's promise to "set before the reader the basic keys in the Word of God so that Genesis to Revelation will unfold . . ."66 falls tragically short of its goal. The biblical "keys" he uses repeatedly lock up the Word's interpretation of itself to his advantage. The results are internal confusion and gross perversion of God's Word. Wierwille's misleading and fallacious keys fall into four basic categories.

Is anyone familiar with this piece of work? I know it's long, but I would appreciate the opinions of you scholarly bunch down here in the Doctrinal section. ;)--> Deceptive Distinctions Essential to his teaching on the crucifixion and Holy Week is Wierwille's concept of "narrative development." Wierwille's expositions using "narrative development" essentially set the Gospel accounts in opposition to each other. In the process, he concludes that four men were crucified with Jesus rather than two. Claiming that malefactors and robbers are two different classes of robbers, Wierwille demands that Matthew and Mark could not be talking about the same people. If he were consistent in applying this principle, there would also have to be two Barabbases, as John 18:40 terms him a robber while Luke 23:19 and Mark 15:7 call him an insurrectionist and murderer. Other examples could be given to prove that this method, carried to any extent, reaps absurdity. Crucial to The Way's doctrine of four crucified with Jesus is a distinction between two Greek words, allos and heteros. Although both words are normally translated "other," he claims that allos means "other of varying kinds" while heteros means "other of the same kind."52 The many New Testament passages using these words show that Wierwille's definitions are incorrect. A host of passages using the word allos are made ridiculous if Wierwille's definition is used. Are a man's right and left cheeks of varying kinds (Matt. 5:39)? Was the seed of the sower of varying kinds (Matt. 13:5, 7, 8)? Were the talents the faithful servant gained of varying kinds (Matt. 25:20, 22)? Did the restored hand of a cripple vary in kind from his other hand (Mark 3:5)? Were the similar things that the Jews did actually things of varying kinds (Mark 7:8)? Obviously, Wierwille's attempted definition of allos was unknown to biblical writers. The following pairs are described by biblical writers as heteros. Are these pairs "other of the same kind" as Wierwille insists? God and money (Matt. 6:24)? Pharisees and publicans (Luke 18:20)? Sadducees and Pharisees (Acts 23:6)? Contradictory spirits and gospels (11 Cor. 11-4; Gal. 1:6)? Ages of mystery and ages of the revealed (Eph. 3:5)? The Levitical priesthood and tribe versus the Melchizedekan priesthood and the tribe of Judah (Heb. 7:11, 13, 15)? Obviously, Wierwille fabricates distinctions not known to this wide range of New Testament writers. The definition of allos and heteros that Wierwille gives in Power for Abundant Living contradict those in his later book, Receiving the Holy Spirit Today. This inconsistency emphasizes the fictitious nature of his definitions and distinctions. In explaining I Corinthians 12, his later book claims heteros "is used for another when only two are involved." By contrast, allos is used when more than two are involved .53 However, even this definition of heteros is also false. In more than three-fourths of the uses of this word in the New Testament, more than two are unquestionably involved, as a look through a Greek concordance reveals. Furthermore, his definition of heteros in the earlier book will not fit his exposition of I Corinthians 12 in the later book. His earlier definition was "other of the same kind," but he writes in Receiving the Holy Spirit Today: "Since no other person profits from the usage of believing and tongues, heteros is used because two and only two are involved, namely, God and the believer.54" If he had used the definition he is so adamant about in the earlier book, he would have to write: ". . . heteros is used because two others of the same kind are involved, namely, God and the believer." Even though Wierwille currently does not hold to this absurdity, he would be compelled to if his definitions were consistent. When we compare Wierwille's definitions for allos in the two books, we. find the same inconsistency and more unanswered questions. Why did he give up his first definition when he wrote his later book? Or why did he not begin using his second definition in John 19: 1955 '11.1 it is more accurate? Obviously, if he did, his theory of four men crucified with Christ would fall. It is evident that Wierwille fabricates definitions and makes distinctions between words at will. , In this way he molds New Testament passages to fit his preconceived interpretations and theology. Another example of unfounded distinctions between Greek words is that made between d6rea and doma. The Way's Lonnel E. Johnson rephrases Wierwille's stance: "A gift when put into action may benefit the recipient (d6rea) or it may benefit others (doma), or both the recipient and others may be benefitted through its operation (d6rema). In each case a different word is used to indicate a specific and unique aspect of the gift.56" The Way cites "the gift of Christ" of Ephesians 4:7 as "a gift which benefits the receiver." In contrast, the "gifts unto men" of 4:8 are "gifts which are of benefit to others." Upon closer examination we find that these Greek words were not so narrowly understood by the New Testament writers. Only a chapter before, Paul says that he "was made a minister, according to the gift (dorea) of God's grace which was given to me . . ", (Eph. 3:7). Contrary to The Way's definition, this gift is for the benefit of others (see also 11 Cor. 9:15). Luke 11:13, its parallel in Matthew 7: 11, and Philippians 4:17 are cases where dorna is used. Again contrary to The Way's definition, these refer to gifts which benefit the recipients. Wierwille's definitions on the surface always appear to be accurate, but any depth of analysis reveals his inaccurate assessments.

and additional information: -----Original Message----- Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2001 10:53 AM To: Belle Subject: Re: Home Stuff - too To answer your dad's question, The Way DID mortgage its Headquarters in 1974/5 for about 18 months in order to purchase The Way College of Emporia. It was most distasteful to Dr. Wierwille and the original Trustees, but they felt they needed the additional campus, saw that they would be able to pay off debt for the campus within a limited number of months, and then they aggressively worked to eliminate that debt. When the debt was paid off, Dr. Wierwille announced it to those of us on Staff at the time. Then he cut up the mortgage paper into small pieces and distributed one piece to each in-residence Way Corps person. He said that he wanted that to remind them to never mortgage our Headquarters again. Our ministry acknowledges that borrowing takes place and it is talked about in the old testament. We further acknowledge that the commerce practices and trade practices of antiquity up until today are time-tested and universally accepted. What we have taught is that the follower of the Lord Jesus Christ needs to be in a position of strength. Debt, (and your dad's point about MISMANAGEMENT OF DEBT being the main concern is well taken), is something that is universally accepted by most U.S. citizens. These people do not have the background and understanding that the district president of a bank has. That's why you have to ask questions. (You grew up in the home of a man with extensive knowledge and experience in the field, but what were you taught then about debt and mortgages? The quality of your life indicates that you were instructed on many things. Your dad is a great man and a wonderful father and father-in-law and friend. However, you are asking questions because (a) he did not teach you that information or (b) he taught you and you ignored him!) You are asking questions now and your loving dad is teaching you what he knows now! And that is good. You realize his abilities and he realizes your desire to make educated, informed decisions. The Bible clearly says that the borrower is slave to the lender and that is something that every believer must deal with when/if he enters into a debt. Regardless of what decision you make regarding a mortgage, it is clear that you are going to be an informed, confident consumer and that you will be able to count the entire cost, both spiritually and financially. Honestly, I have been thinking about this topic for over a year. I have heard equally convincing arguments from both sides--the financial advice being "enter into mortgage, it's smart," to the biblical advice being "debt in all forms is wrong." Though having a home with a mortgage seems to be preferable to some of our disciples, many desire MORE to be in the center of the will of God and are willing to await the conclusive results of the study before entering into a mortgage. There are others who did not enter into a mortgage because Craig "said" mortgages were wrong. They feel they cannot wait any longer, and they must buy now. Freedom of will is not the issue; that's a given. The best choice is the issue for me. I want to know what the Word says. I am thankful Rev. Rivenbark has assigned this project to biblically and financially knowledgeable men and women to examine and settle so that we can make the best decisions possible. I am thankful for those who patiently work the information on their own and anticipate the decision from Headquarters. Isn't it great to have the best in both "worlds"? Your dad's insight and your Father's! Love, Bob Actually, Bob, I was asking questions because everything coming out of the mouth of TWIts contradicted what my Daddy taught me. :)--> (insert an imitation of one of your sarcastic smirks here) I also, did NOT ignore my Daddy and he’ll tell you so. That’s the reason I didn’t have money problems before getting involved with your little cult. I had financed a car and WISH I had financed a house prior to becoming involved. My Daddy taught that those are considered good management of my money providing I can easily make my payments each month and I am not living beyond my means. TWI doesn’t teach that, they keep people in bondage, but you do a very good job of using the tactics mentioned in the “Manipulative People” thread.

:D--> Good title, eh? :D--> My Daddy has been in banking since he was in college. He’s been District President over banks in several states for many, many years. When the debt policy was being enforced with full strength and people were being told to sell their homes, put on probation and M&A for not doing so, I asked my dad how we could pay cash for a house since the TWIt leadership was requiring it but not providing the practical “how to” instruction. Daddy responded back saying that basically, for the average middle class American family it was impossible without years and years of savings, a little luck in the stock market, inheritance, or having equity from having already been in the process of purchasing a house. It was, of course, a very well written letter and I wish I could find it to post, but what I do have to post are Bob Moneyhand’s responses to Daddy’s comments. I’m identifying the manipulative statements as posted in the other thread I started on manipulative people. Hopefully this real life example will help the innies I’ve been communicating with identify how TWIt leadership is utilizing these tactics still today. The fox and her company have quickly adapted to being much more subtle about it, but the control is still there. Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2001 8:53 AM To: Belle Subject: Re: Home Stuff - too I am thankful for your dad's wisdom and insight. What he expresses is what our biblical men are working on.... We want to firmly establish a biblical foundation for our position that mortgages are debt, or we want to be able to definitively say, as your dad can from an economic theory, that a mortgage is not debt. By the way, we have knowledge of a couple in AL that has been saving as much as they possibly can over the last several years with the intent of buying a house. They have been keeping track of foreclosures and finally found a home that they like and could afford for CASH! It was a home worth in the neighborhood of $75-100,000 and they purchased it for $30,000. They have a minimum of immediate "fix up" to do. They are thrilled that they fought to buy a home they could "afford" with cash. Now they are in a position of strength and they, of course, don't understand why anyone would pay the "going cost" for a home over a 30-year period (the pretty standard length of current mortgages). I respect the knowledge your dad evidences in his communication. I understand it (I was a business major for two years). I understand assets and liabilities, and income and expenses. But the reason I switched to math rather than continuing in business was that I could not understand economics. It is based on the theory of supply and demand, which fluctuate with trends, etc. Mathematics is based on an unchanging standard. When the Word of God became evident to me, it too, was unchanging. (There are some biblical things that I am still working to understand, but I am patient, because I know that God knows the answers and if I stay faithful, He will fill me.) I am passing on your dad's communication to The Way of the U.S.A. so those working the Word on the subject have this input to consider. I believe it is consistent with what we have received in the past, but it is put in simple, clear, and definite terms. It is the best I have seen so far. I appreciate his honesty to qualify his limited biblical knowledge, yet to proclaim his authority from his background and career. I appreciate his clarifying that beyond the tithe, it is up to the disciplined ones to determine what to do with their income. (I would add that we do with our income what is STILL consistent with the Word and will of God, rather than just any old thing! Wisdom versus frivolity is best whether coming from a biblical or secular position, and your dad makes that very clear.) That's all I have for now. What are you all thinking regarding your dad's input? Thank you for sharing it with me. I thank God for your dad. He has been a friend of ours and a friend to our ministry. His willingness to work with you rather than to be critical is so refreshingly positive. Love, Bob P. S. It is my impression you are endeavoring to be the best possible stewards over that which you have responsibility and that you want to act with God's blessing on your life. (So do I!) I think it is great you are getting the best education you can. Take advantage of all of the resources you have! Then your decisions are based on solid, clear standards with which you believe you can live...and serve others, too. *************** Rationalization – “we’re doing the same thing your dad is doing, but we’re going to stick to the Bible, not plain common sense” Playing the Servant Role –this tactic cloaks their self-serving agendas in the guise of service to a more noble cause. By pretending to be working hard on someone else's behalf, they conceal their own ambition, desire for power, and quest for a position of dominance over others. The only master he serves is his own ambition.. Diversion – “change from the definition of debt to someone who has done what TWI wants people to do” Shaming - an effective way to foster a continued sense of personal inadequacy in the weaker party, thereby allowing an aggressor to maintain a position of dominance. “They are in a position of strength” and subtly implying that someone who doesn’t pay cash is not in a position of strength. Rhetorical comments and subtle sarcasm. Imagine how much more effective this tactic would be in person. Seduction- charming, praising, flattering or overtly supporting others in order to get them to lower their defenses and surrender their trust and loyalty. There’s something else here, I just can’t put my finger on it. And I mean besides the fact that he just admitted that he doesn’t understand economics, so how the he11 can he say something is wrong or not if he doesn’t understand it? Seduction- Again. And, not being all that familiar with my dad, he possibly didn’t realize my dad was being semi-sarcastic when he stated that he may not be an “authority” on the Bible, but that he could definitely see where he didn’t think God would consider a mortgage evil and then why from his “authoritative” position of “worldly” knowledge. My Daddy also commented that he was surprised that TWI was even trying to tell people what to do with their money. See anything I missed? This was very perturbing at the time, but I couldn’t put my finger on why I was so p1ssed nor how to respond.

Thanks! It's helped ME a lot reading over these things again. Regardless of what people think of vee pee and the "value" of what he contributed Bible-wise to their lives, he was evil. Some think he was a truly evil false prophet, but others think he was a good man making bad mistakes. Regardless, he was a bad man and so are his henchmen who still run his company and they should be cut off!